Meta 2015 Community Tier List Voting

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

As far as the bottom tier discussion goes I am not really certain what are the most important traits of a character. Earlier EddyBear provided the match of Kirby vs Sheik with two prominent players of the characters. What I thought was most interesting of this set was how the first match played out compared to the second match. The first match to me showed that once Kirby "got in" on Sheik Kirby had some ways of keeping Sheik in a bad spot. At the ledge, off stage, combos, etc. However, in the 2nd set (before Zelda came out) it seemed to show that Kirby has very poor methods of trying to "get in" as Kirby was pretty much doing chip damage.

Therefore, with the rest of bottom tier it feels like all of these characters have ways of performing combos on variety of the cast. But, the biggest hurdle is how to initiate those punishes and combos that lead to taking stocks. That might be the most important part in-deciding placement. While Pichu has pretty much the traits used by Falcon/Fox/Marth in terms of ground mobility with DD and say SH Nair Kirby seems to have a different method of dealing with things.

I am curious how good crouching really is against grabs from a variety of the cast.

 

[PK Illuminati]

@Scaremonger
dude rip get called immature 4 stocked

 

[keymanb]

@Scaremonger Rest in RIP bud

 

[zeldasmash]

Top


High


High- Middle


Middle


Low


Bottom

 

[blargh257]

It's time to corrupt the knowledge pool with my inexperience!
A+

A

A-

B

C

D

F

 

[Dire Creeper]

TOP


HIGH


MID


LOW

 

[Spaghetti Sammy]

DOC FOR S TIER
DOC FOR S TIER
DOC FOR S TIER
MAKE IT OFFICIAL NERD
S:
F-: EVERYONE ELSE IN THE GAME

 

[Woohoo982]

S Tier

A Tier

B Tier

C Tier

F Tier

 

[EddyBearr]

S Tier(Always viable)


A Tier(mostly viable)


B Tier(sometimes viable)


F Tier(viable? heck naw)

Can you explain having Peach be in A tier as opposed to S tier? Or Pikachu being above Falcon? Or Samus being the worst A tier?

 

[vaP3L0rD?]

Personally
S Tier
1- Fox
2- Marth
3- Falco/Shiek
5- Puff
A Tier
6- Peach
7- IC
8- Falcon
9- Pikachu
10- YL
11- Doc
12- Ganon
B Tier
13- Samus
14- Yoshi
15- Lugi
16- Link
17- DK
C Tier
18- Mario
19- Zelda
20- Roy
21- G&W
F Tier
22- Pichu
23- Mewtwo
24- Ness
25- Kirby
26- Bowser

 

[Oskurito]

S
1. Fox
2. Falco

A
3. Marth
4. Sheik
5. Peach
6. Jigglypuff
7. Ice Climbers
8. Captain Falcon

B
9. Samus
10. Pikachu
11 .Yoshi
12. Luigi
13. Dr. Mario
14. Ganondorf

C.
15. Mario
16. Young Link
17. Link
18. Donkey Kong
19. Game & Watch

D.
20. Mewtwo
21. Ness
22. Roy

F.
23. Kirby
24. Bowser
25. Zelda
26. Pichu

 

[Woohoo982]

Can you explain having Peach be in A tier as opposed to S tier? Or Pikachu being above Falcon? Or Samus being the worst A tier?

I was considering Peach in S, but then I was like "eh, don't want to overcool the s tier"
Pikachu is always > Falcon
Samus is kinda good, but not as good as other a tiers.

 

[Spaghetti Sammy]

I may as well throw in my 2 cents and not do what I got a warning for
S+ (You can win the big money)

S (Can win big name tournaments)
(#DocForSTier)
A (Can do very well in big tournaments and win more local tournaments)

B (Needs some determination to do well)

F- (Don't use these guys, you can win locals but that's about it)

H (Why did they make this guy so big, slow, and garbage I don't know how the hell DJNintendo does it)


Can Doc just please be S tier already, you guys have seen Shroomed, no other A tier character has gone that far in that environment.

 

[ShortcutButton]

"Once again there will be two lists compiled. One will be all of the votes, the other will be restricted to players who are either ranked on the MIOM top 100 or rated top 50 by SmashBoards Rankings."

I shall be in the former category. I am inexperienced, my tier list is bad, many grains of salt shall be took.

A Tier


A- Tier


B Tier


F Tier


A and A- can both compete in tourneys at the same level, but there needed to be a split. B and F are self explanatory.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

is guy so big, slow, and garbage I don't know how the hell DJNintendo does it)

Long live gimpyfish

 

[Wreckarooni]

Long live gimpyfish

The Gimpyfish combo is still the best combo, it consists of 1 hit - Bowser's F-smash. Very technical.

As for using bowser...

David the Bowser Guy does it
Eikelmann does it (he actually switched to Bowser from Ganon in a tournament to get a win a GF)
Iori did it
Gimpyfish still does it

It's not just DJ Nintendo. In fact Bowser has more representation and results than like 7 of the low tiers that people place above him. Bowser is bad, but Pichu for instance is always placed way too high on inexperienced player's tier lists.

 

[SSB Ohhh]

S Tier:









A Tier:









B+ Tier:











B Tier:









B- Tier:





C Tier:





D Tier:





F Tier:

 

[Sir Bubbles]

I was considering Peach in S, but then I was like "eh, don't want to overcool the s tier"
Pikachu is always > Falcon
Samus is kinda good, but not as good as other a tiers.

What makes you think Pika is better than Falcon? Personally I think Falcon is QUITE better than Pika for a lot of reasons.

With all the success that Armada was having with Peach before he switched mains, Peach's placement here is kind of confusing. Samus as well consider she's had far more success than Mario and Ganon.

 

[Loup]

S
A+
A
B
B-
C Taj's
D Everybody else's
F

I still don't agree with people's opinion that >, because while Marth technically has an easier matchup against , a good reaction based , can do extremely well also, while still having the stupid match-up spread Sheik has against everybody else in the cast.

 

[Spaghetti Sammy]

Long live gimpyfish

I imagine I would do pretty well too against a Marth that didn't know what the C-Stick does :^)

 

[CAUP]

S Tier
Fox

A Tier
Marth
Falco
Sheik

B Tier
Peach
Jigglypuff
Ice Climbers
Captain Falcon

C Tier
Samus
Pikachu

D Tier
Yoshi
Luigi
Doctor Mario

E Tier
Young Link
Ganondorf
Mario
Link
Donkey Kong

F Tier
Game&Watch
Pichu
MewTwo
Kirby
Roy
Ness
Bowser
Zelda

 

[J.P]

I imagine I would do pretty well too against a Marth that didn't know what the C-Stick does :^)

Based on your poor posts I doubt that you have ever competitive Melee.
Also I'm not making a tier list because I don't have enough knowledge/ experience but I want to say 3 things:
1. People are overrating Puff
2. People are underrating Bower
3. People are overrating Doc

 

[Wreckarooni]

Based on your poor posts I doubt that you have ever competitive Melee.
Also I'm not making a tier list because I don't have enough knowledge/ experience but I want to say 3 things:
1. People are overrating Puff
2. People are underrating Bower
3. People are overrating Doc

Jack Bower?

And nah no one's underrating Puff, she has it ezpz against pretty much everyone including the top tiers.

 

[Comet7]

Bowser is the slowest character in the game and has awful frame data. He has up b OoS but that should only ever hit if somebody does something stupid on his shield. His get up attack is good too, but you just need to stay out of its range. He also has trouble killing and can be gimped... He should never win neutral becauseof how slow he is... Bowser players deserve medals for putting up with this.

Tbh I've never played a Bowser, but I'm not completely ignorant about him frame-wise and don't believe it should be particularly hard to determine his crippling faults and evaluate how severe they are (extremely). Just look at stuff like Unknown vs. DJ and how Bowser just can't do anything. (That set specifically may have only been on a twitch vod that would be deleted by now)

P.S.: his 8 frame jumpsquat is disgusting

 

[Spaghetti Sammy]

3. People are overrating Doc

Meanwhile in the thread:
S
A The rest of the S tier
B
F

I mean c'mon you gotta agree

 

[DeepDish]

Based on your poor posts I doubt that you have ever competitive Melee.
Also I'm not making a tier list because I don't have enough knowledge/ experience but I want to say 3 things:
1. People are overrating Puff
2. People are underrating Bower
3. People are overrating Doc

I'm a bit biased I suppose, but I think Doc is fairly underrated in the current meta just cause Shroomed switched.

Shroomed still managed to do very well during that Sheik gauntlet back at Apex 2012 WITHOUT the chain grab. He beat KK, Overtriforce and lost to M2K. He played each of those sets back to back to back against some of the best Sheiks in the world. Sheik is popularly seen as Doc's worst matchup and he made it work.

While Shroomed was great, he didn't use all of Doc's tools.

Some things Shroomed never really did with Doc:
- cape in the neutral or cape shenanigans in general, not including edge guarding
- d-tilt reverse edge guards
- safe up-b escapes
- using up-b in general to finish combos
- up-b cancels
- chain throw DI traps
- full hop, fast fall n-air edge guards

That's just a few things off the top of my head. Doc, while not in the top 9 characters by any means, is still an under developed character.

 

[FallofBrawl]

 

[Sir Tundra]

S.
A.
B.
C.
D.


Edit:
+2 Strong player base with notable players like Wobbles, Fly aminta, and Nintendude. Very deadly grab game, great neutral game, great ground movement with the second best wavedash in the game, and deadly kill setups.
-2 Before anyone freaks out let me explain.. The reason why I put peach in the bottom of the top 8 is that peach doesn't have very good tourney results compared to most of the top 8 since armada basically mains fox now and the most notable peach main now is MacD who even then got 17th at apex
+1 The luigi playerbase is slowly growing strong in the meta with strong players like eddie mexico and abate. Luigi also has the best wavedash in the game as well as great combos.
+2 has a strong playerbase with players such as bizzaro flame and Kage
-2 Although doc has among one of the best grab games in melee. Doc really relies on reads to get anything done, Doc also has horrendus mu's against marth and peach, and the playerbase has shruken with the departure of the once great doc main shroomed becoming a sheik main
-1 Small playerbase and has trouble getting KO's. However mario does have great gimping tools as well as having a great recovery
+1 : Great projectiles and combos similar to young link although he has an easier time killing. However Link suffers from a bad recovery and a smaller playerbase compared to his younger self
-1 Has to work very hard because of his huge hurtbox

 

[Golden Rainbow]

It's time to corrupt the knowledge pool with my inexperience!

S tier: , , , ,
Classic top 5, nothing to say here. But I'll put them separated, since the passage of time has done nothing but solidify them as the only characters you can use if you're aiming for a spot with the gods.

A+ tier: , , , ,
These are the ones that are right behind the S tier. Lots of representation in the form of top players, good results, and solid characters, but their mistake is not being good enough to be in the top 5.

A tier: , , , , , ,
I was a bit hesitant on putting Luigi ahead of so many characters, but he has a lot of excellent loyal players. Yoshi kind of skyrocketed compared to the 2013 tier list, but after the advent of aMSa, everyone's seeing the unexplored potential of Yoshi now, so I don't think that's undeserved. Doc is at a weird spot for me - his biggest competitive representation was Shroomed without a doubt, and he almost dropped the character entirely. I do think he's better than Ganondorf, only slightly. I'll put Young Link over Link for the sake of voting, but I think it's a tie. Nothing really special to declare for Mario, though. I just don't think he's as good as the characters above and doesn't have as much representation either.

B tier: , , , ,
From what I have seen, DK has vastly more representation and results than any other character I have put here - but I don't think it's enough to give him a spot along the A tiers. The rest in B tier are almost equal, save for Roy, which I put on top for being a worse clone of the S tier Marth. Sorry, Sethlon.

F tier: , , , ,
I feel kinda bad putting them at an F tier, since they are not absolutely awful - but they don't really have any shot at top 16. Really don't think Zelda/Shiek tag team is a thing, but it's certainly better than using strictly Zelda, so I decided to note it. And I really don't want to commentate about the bottom tiers, since I can't recall any positive things they hold.

So, yes, I'm done. Sorry for forcing you to scroll through this small piece of Melee inexperience, but you're a true warrior if you have actually read this to the end.

Edit: added Peach, forgot about her somehow.

 

[Sir Tundra]

S tier: , , , ,
Classic top 5, nothing to say here. But I'll put them separated, since the passage of time has done nothing but solidify them as the only characters you can use if you're aiming for a spot with the gods.

A+ tier: , , ,
These are the ones that are right behind the S tier. Lots of representation in the form of top players, good results, and solid characters, but their mistake is not being good enough to be in the top 5.

A tier: , , , , , ,
I was a bit hesitant on putting Luigi ahead of so many characters, but he has a lot of excellent loyal players. Yoshi kind of skyrocketed compared to the 2013 tier list, but after the advent of aMSa, everyone's seeing the unexplored potential of Yoshi now, so I don't think that's undeserved. Doc is at a weird spot for me - his biggest competitive representation was Shroomed without a doubt, and he almost dropped the character entirely. I do think he's better than Ganondorf, only slightly. I'll put Young Link over Link for the sake of voting, but I think it's a tie. Nothing really special to declare for Mario, though. I just don't think he's as good as the characters above and doesn't have as much representation either.

B tier: , , , ,
From what I have seen, DK has vastly more representation and results than any other character I have put here - but I don't think it's enough to give him a spot along the A tiers. The rest in B tier are almost equal, save for Roy, which I put on top for being a worse clone of the S tier Marth. Sorry, Sethlon.

F tier: , , , ,
I feel kinda bad putting them at an F tier, since they are not absolutely awful - but they don't really have any shot at top 16. Really don't think Zelda/Shiek tag team is a thing, but it's certainly better than using strictly Zelda, so I decided to note it. And I really don't want to commentate about the bottom tiers, since I can't recall any positive things they hold.

So, yes, I'm done. Sorry for forcing you to scroll through this small piece of Melee inexperience, but you're a true warrior if you have actually read this to the end.

I think you forgot to add in peach in your list.. otherwise this is a pretty good summary you got going on here

 

[Woohoo982]

Why do people think Kirby is the worst? He has SOMETHING going for him, if it's just one thing.
I've been seeing Zelda as worst, and I can agree. She has nothing at all. Other low tiers have something- Pichu's speed,Kirby bair, G&W's 9, Bowser's raw, unadulterated power, Ness's projectiles- but what does Zelda have? Outside of a transformation into sheik, she has nothing, and even then, if a Zelda transforms into Sheik, that Zelda is staying sheik until he(the player) wants to sandbag.

 

[Golden Rainbow]

I think you forgot to add in peach in your list.. otherwise this is a pretty good summary you got going on here

Wow, I completely forgot her. Thank you.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Zelda is relatively heavy and floaty which means she passively escapes most combos (eg, fox uthrow uair, falcon dthrow knee). She also has lightning kicks that are quick, ranged, and are KO moves. Her fsmash and dsmash are extremely good tools as well. On top of that, she has one of the best shields in the game, and probably the best shield-to-hurtbox ratio out of the cast.

As a defensive character, she is actually fairly good. Cosmo has shown that if you can work around her slow run speed and control the center of stage, she is more than capable of winning most matchups. It is a lot harder to fight a defensive Zelda than virtually any other character in the bottom 5-10 at least.

 

[thegrovylekid]

In reality, every bottom tier has something unique they can bring to the table.

Pichu: Speed, Surprising Power, amazing Nair.

Bowser: Power, Up-B out of shield

Zelda: Lightning Kicks, Down B

Ness: Projectiles, Damage racking with PK Fire

Kirby: Fair, Up tilt, Bair, Crouch

 

[Dire Creeper]

In reality, every bottom tier has something unique they can bring to the table.

Pichu: Speed, Surprising Power, amazing Nair.

Bowser: Power, Up-B out of shield

Zelda: Lightning Kicks, Down B

Ness: Projectiles, Damage racking with PK Fire

Kirby: Fair, Up tilt, Bair, Crouch

Pichu also has a pretty great grab game despite his short grab range and really good recovery along with Zelda.

 

[kancon1]

I'll make a list just because I see some things I don't agree with, such as people overrating doc.

S: Fox, Marth, Falco, Sheik
A+: Jigglypuff, Captain Falcon, Peach, ICs, Pikachu
A: Luigi, Yoshi, Samus, Mario, Doctor Mario, Ganondorf
B: Young Link, Link, DK, Roy, Game and Watch, Zelda
F: Ness, Mewtwo, Pichu, Bowser, Kirby

Doc has a few stronger attacks, a wider cape, and a better projectile, but Mario has a meteor smash, a better recovery, and up b walljump. Mario is better but has less rep imo

Falcon is underrated. His movement alone gives him a lot of potential and a Falcon that throws out safe hitboxes can be very annoying.

Ganon is overrated. He is slow and combo food. What gives him good results is his ability to get into your head and his extremely loyal players.

 

[Laudandus]

I'm a bit biased I suppose, but I think Doc is fairly underrated in the current meta just cause Shroomed switched.

Shroomed still managed to do very well during that Sheik gauntlet back at Apex 2012 WITHOUT the chain grab. He beat KK, Overtriforce and lost to M2K. He played each of those sets back to back to back against some of the best Sheiks in the world. Sheik is popularly seen as Doc's worst matchup and he made it work.

While Shroomed was great, he didn't use all of Doc's tools.

Some things Shroomed never really did with Doc:
- cape in the neutral or cape shenanigans in general, not including edge guarding
- d-tilt reverse edge guards
- safe up-b escapes
- using up-b in general to finish combos
- up-b cancels
- chain throw DI traps
- full hop, fast fall n-air edge guards

That's just a few things off the top of my head. Doc, while not in the top 9 characters by any means, is still an under developed character.

Sheik is not at all Doc's worst matchup, not even close. Doc can chain grab Sheik, he can crouch cancel Sheik, it's just not his worst. She beats him for sure, but I think he has a harder time with Marth, Fox, Falco, Falcon, and Peach.

 

[DeepDish]

Sheik is not at all Doc's worst matchup, not even close. Doc can chain grab Sheik, he can crouch cancel Sheik, it's just not his worst. She beats him for sure, but I think he has a harder time with Marth, Fox, Falco, Falcon, and Peach.

Sheik is popularly seen as Doc's worst matchup and he made it work.

I didn't say I think it's his worst matchup. I said most people see it as his worst matchup. All of those matchups are winnable btw. None of them are as unfavourable as some other characters' matchups are against those characters.

 

[MEnKIRBZ]

S+
Fox
Falco
Marth
S
Puff
Peach
Sheik
S-
Falcon
ICS
A+
Pikachu
Ganondorf
Yoshi
Samus
A
Luigi
Doc mariomario
A-
Mario
Yl
B
Link
D
Dk
G&w
Zelda
Roy
F
Mewtwo
Pichu
Ness
Bowser
Kirby

Fox: 20xx

Falco: combo abilities are vast and has good MUs across the board

Marth: IMO better then falco vs a fox, but I believe falco is slightly better

Puff: best punish move in the game by far

Peach: armada

Sheik: IMO the most annoying character in the game

Falcon: underrated and underdeveloped

ICS: wobble

Pikachu: quick and has good gimmicks and best upsmash

Ganondorf: slow, but punishes hard

Yoshi: amsa

Samus: annoying arsenal of projectiles

Luigi: dat wavedash doe

Doc mario: pills4days and good smashes and cape

Mario: doc but slightly worse

Young link: good mu against puff and bombs and arrows to annoy the hell outta everybody

Link: yl but worse

Dk: powerful but waay too slow and bad recovery

G&w: he's dumb

Zelda: janky hitbox...that's it

Roy: marth, but shorter, dumber, slower, etc.

Mewtwo: mew2king doesn't play mewtwo anymore for a reason

Pichu: has ok moves that damage him/herself

Ness: slow moves that aren't even good and terrible recovery

Bowser: too slow

Kirby: has backair and bthrow, one of which sds with the opponent

 

[RRoulette]

3. People are overrating Doc

why would people overrate the Doc, she is an inspiration to children imo