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Meta 2015 Community Tier List Voting

NS23

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 4, 2015
Messages
237
Location
Massachusetts
Slippi.gg
SLOK#533
S:
1) :foxmelee: - Fox
2) :falcomelee: - Falco
3) :marthmelee: - Marth
4) :sheikmelee: - Sheik
5) :peachmelee: - Peach
6) :jigglypuffmelee: - Jigglypuff
- -
7) :icsmelee: - Ice Climbers
8) :falconmelee: - Captain Falcon

A:
9) :pikachumelee: - Pikachu
10) :luigimelee: - Luigi
11) :yoshimelee: - Yoshi
12) :samusmelee: - Samus

B:
13) :ganondorfmelee: - Ganondorf
14) :drmario: - Doctor Mario
15) :mariomelee: - Mario
16) :younglinkmelee: - Young Link

C:
17) :linkmelee: - Link
18) :dkmelee: - Donkey Kong

F:
19) :roymelee: - Roy
20) :zeldamelee: - Zelda
21) :nessmelee: - Ness
22) :gawmelee: - Mr. Game and Watch
23) :pichumelee: - Pichu
24) :mewtwomelee: - Mewtwo
25) :bowsermelee: - Bowser
26) :kirbymelee: - Kirby
 
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-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
Puff better vs sheik, bodies peach.

Peach bodies IC's, sliiiiiiiiiightly better vs spacies.

They are really close. Ignoring armada and hbox, just theorycrafting, I'd give it to puff imo. But I'm essentially not submitting a list bc I can't decide between those 2.
 

tsm2k420XX

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
35
Location
DFW
I've only been playing for 2 months, so I'm probably not that accurate, but I've been watching melee since evo 2013.
(20XX)
1.:foxmelee:
(S tier)
2.:marthmelee:
3.:falcomelee:
4.:sheikmelee:
5.:peachmelee:
(A tier)
6.:jigglypuffmelee:
7.:falconmelee:
8.:icsmelee:
9.:pikachumelee:
(B tier)
10.:samusmelee:
11.:drmario:
12.:ganondorfmelee:
13.:luigimelee:
14.:yoshimelee:
(C tier)
15.:younglinkmelee:
16.:mariomelee:
17.:dkmelee:
18.:linkmelee:
(D tier)
19.:pichumelee:
20.:gawmelee:
21.:mewtwomelee:
(F tier)
22.:zeldamelee:
23.:roymelee:
24.:zeldamelee:
25.:bowsermelee:
26.:kirbymelee:
Critique away, I'm not confident with my mid placements.
 

pichuplayer

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
230
Location
saffron city
I've only been playing for 2 months, so I'm probably not that accurate, but I've been watching melee since evo 2013.
(20XX)
1.:foxmelee:
(S tier)
2.:marthmelee:
3.:falcomelee:
4.:sheikmelee:
5.:peachmelee:
(A tier)
6.:jigglypuffmelee:
7.:falconmelee:
8.:icsmelee:
9.:pikachumelee:
(B tier)
10.:samusmelee:
11.:drmario:
12.:ganondorfmelee:
13.:luigimelee:
14.:yoshimelee:
(C tier)
15.:younglinkmelee:
16.:mariomelee:
17.:dkmelee:
18.:linkmelee:
(D tier)
19.:pichumelee:
20.:gawmelee:
21.:mewtwomelee:
(F tier)
22.:zeldamelee:
23.:roymelee:
24.:zeldamelee:
25.:bowsermelee:
26.:kirbymelee:
Critique away, I'm not confident with my mid placements.
this might be one of the most stable lists i've seen good job!
 

1MachGO

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 18, 2013
Messages
807
I agree with most of this, especially the comment about her reliance on her opponent making errors. But I still think that ICs and Pikachu are worse because they have most of the flaws that Samus has and more.
Hm, I'm not so sure about that last point. Pikachu's short hop, ledge options, and OoS options make him more well rounded than Samus on principle. But we'll probably have to agree to disagree.
 
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ChivalRuse

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
8,413
Location
College Park, MD
What Samus lacks in the ability to rush low SH aerials, she makes up in her strong boxing game, which Pikachu lacks. Remember that Pikachu has a terrible shield, gets combo'd harder than Samus, and is lighter. Their weaknesses kind of offset each other in a discussion of their overall tier viability.
 

valakmtnsmash4

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 27, 2015
Messages
707
Location
Three sage summit
NNID
yathshiv
I've only been playing for 2 months, so I'm probably not that accurate, but I've been watching melee since evo 2013.
(20XX)
1.:foxmelee:
(S tier)
2.:marthmelee:
3.:falcomelee:
4.:sheikmelee:
5.:peachmelee:
(A tier)
6.:jigglypuffmelee:
7.:falconmelee:
8.:icsmelee:
9.:pikachumelee:
(B tier)
10.:samusmelee:
11.:drmario:
12.:ganondorfmelee:
13.:luigimelee:
14.:yoshimelee:
(C tier)
15.:younglinkmelee:
16.:mariomelee:
17.:dkmelee:
18.:linkmelee:
(D tier)
19.:pichumelee:
20.:gawmelee:
21.:mewtwomelee:
(F tier)
22.:zeldamelee:
23.:roymelee:
24.:zeldamelee:
25.:bowsermelee:
26.:kirbymelee:
Critique away, I'm not confident with my mid placements.
This is a very accurate tier list, but I feel that luigi and yoshi should be higher than doc and Ganon. Doc lost its best main, and ganondorf hasn't been doing to well lately in tourneys, while luigi is doing very well, same as yoshi
 

1MachGO

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 18, 2013
Messages
807
What Samus lacks in the ability to rush low SH aerials, she makes up in her strong boxing game, which Pikachu lacks. Remember that Pikachu has a terrible shield, gets combo'd harder than Samus, and is lighter. Their weaknesses kind of offset each other in a discussion of their overall tier viability.
But its not like Pikachu is devoid of ground pokes or defensive options like his dtilt and dsmash. To me, the more important thing is that at least Pikachu can respond to shields in a conventional manner (grab) and bait with his dash dance.

And again, thats the issue with Samus, there are plenty of situations where she can have anything from bad options to virtually none such as not being able to grab airborne opponents, being vulnerable to juggles, lacking options in shield, etc. Pikachu is far more consistent.
 
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@MeleeHell

Smash Rookie
Joined
Oct 5, 2014
Messages
20
Location
Melee Hell
Melee Hell 20XX Tier List:


SS: Fox
S: Bowser
(large gap)
A: IC's, Falco, Marth
B: Puff, Zelda, Peach, Samus, Pikachu
C: Donkey Kong, Yoshi, Doc, Luigi,



*Characters not mentioned are considered irrelevant or unplayable
 
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NS23

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 4, 2015
Messages
237
Location
Massachusetts
Slippi.gg
SLOK#533
Melee Hell 20XX Tier List:


SS: Fox
S: Bowser
(large gap)
A: IC's, Falco, Marth
B: Puff, Zelda, Peach, Samus, Pikachu
C: Donkey Kong, Yoshi, Doc, Luigi,



*Characters not mentioned are considered irrelevant or unplayable
Bowser S tier?
 

Fortress | Sveet

▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
Joined
Dec 21, 2005
Messages
16,260
Location
Northern IL
Thanks to everyone who voted this summer! I really appreciate all the efforts people put into this. We have not gotten the top level votes that I wished for, but nonetheless the list will be created. Unfortunately some things are going on in my personal life, so it may be a few weeks before I can begin sifting through the data. Please stay patient :)
 

ChivalRuse

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
8,413
Location
College Park, MD
I wouldn't put Pikachu's tilts on the same level as Samus's. Samus's d-tilt has more range than it looks like and true combos into lots of moves depending on DI. Samus's f-tilt is like the second best one in the game, and her u-tilt is amazing for what it does. Also, Samus has a much better crouch cancel (in terms of how high she can do it). And an unexpected cc down smash on a fast faller can spell doom immediately.

Although Samus does not have the ability to rush with aerials like Pikachu does, she has very solid aerials with good range and priority.

I would also argue that Samus is an easier character to play than Pikachu, not necessarily execution-wise, but just mentally. Pikachu is pretty stress-inducing.
 
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Plunder

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 12, 2015
Messages
862
Location
Port Royal
NNID
1337-7734-8008
My predictions if the votes and weighting is sensible -


1.:foxmelee:
2.:marthmelee: :falcomelee: I consider Falco and Marth tied for the 2-3 spot
3.:falcomelee: :marthmelee:
4.:peachmelee:
5.:sheikmelee:
6.:jigglypuffmelee:
7.:falconmelee:
8.:icsmelee:
9. :pikachumelee: Personally I'd put Pika above ICs (and in some cases above Falcon). Yes it's only Axe, but he places higher more often where it counts and has beaten more Gods using Pikachu. Wobbling makes Melee look lame so i'm biased. Pikachu also doesn't have as many near unwinnable high tier MUs it would seem.
10.:samusmelee:
11.:drmario: No rep recently, but consistent high placings for a while.
12 :yoshimelee:
13.:luigimelee:
14.:ganondorfmelee:
15.:mariomelee: Many would argue Mario be higher, that's not a hill I find worth dying on so I wouldn't argue.
(C tier)
16.:younglinkmelee:
17.:linkmelee: In reality Link actually has the priority, weight, and range (incl. grab) to have better overall MUs. YL is very niche, but most would put him above Link.
18.:dkmelee:
(Not really viable, some notable wins and placings though)
19.:gawmelee:
20.:zeldamelee:
21.:mewtwomelee:
(Really the characters below here are all tied for dead last, Mewtwo should probably be in here. You could write a novel disputing these placements and order....it doesn't matter, not worth the time or discussion. In the right hands and in the right MUs they can seem viable but no....)
22.:nessmelee:
23.:roymelee:
24.:kirbymelee:
25.:pichumelee:
26.:bowsermelee:
 

tsm2k420XX

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
35
Location
DFW
My predictions if the votes and weighting is sensible -


1.:foxmelee:
2.:marthmelee: :falcomelee: I consider Falco and Marth tied for the 2-3 spot
3.:falcomelee: :marthmelee:
4.:peachmelee:
5.:sheikmelee:
6.:jigglypuffmelee:
7.:falconmelee:
8.:icsmelee:
9. :pikachumelee: Personally I'd put Pika above ICs (and in some cases above Falcon). Yes it's only Axe, but he places higher more often where it counts and has beaten more Gods using Pikachu. Wobbling makes Melee look lame so i'm biased. Pikachu also doesn't have as many near unwinnable high tier MUs it would seem.
10.:samusmelee:
11.:drmario: No rep recently, but consistent high placings for a while.
12 :yoshimelee:
13.:luigimelee:
14.:ganondorfmelee:
15.:mariomelee: Many would argue Mario be higher, that's not a hill I find worth dying on so I wouldn't argue.
(C tier)
16.:younglinkmelee:
17.:linkmelee: In reality Link actually has the priority, weight, and range (incl. grab) to have better overall MUs. YL is very niche, but most would put him above Link.
18.:dkmelee:
(Not really viable, some notable wins and placings though)
19.:gawmelee:
20.:zeldamelee:
21.:mewtwomelee:
(Really the characters below here are all tied for dead last, Mewtwo should probably be in here. You could write a novel disputing these placements and order....it doesn't matter, not worth the time or discussion. In the right hands and in the right MUs they can seem viable but no....)
22.:nessmelee:
23.:roymelee:
24.:kirbymelee:
25.:pichumelee:
26.:bowsermelee:
I like your list! But there's one thing that's 100% wrong.
:pichumelee: should be higher lmao
 

Plunder

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 12, 2015
Messages
862
Location
Port Royal
NNID
1337-7734-8008
I like your list! But there's one thing that's 100% wrong.
:pichumelee: should be higher lmao
Eh like I said in the description of 22-26 they are all tied for 26. So technically he's dead last.

Pichu is only good against bad players and his speed actually doesn't amount to anything (except punishes), he can't even contend with top tiers let alone low or mid tiers like Ganon and Link. His range nullifies his speed, and his masochism secures his dead last placing. He does have a decent Grab game like Pikachu (slightly better grab range) but he also is the perfect weight and fall speed to be combo food and dies very VERY early. He's get CG'ed a lot, and his tech roll is hilariously bad.

Again not even worth talking about but there's the facts.
 

1MachGO

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 18, 2013
Messages
807
I wouldn't put Pikachu's tilts on the same level as Samus's. Samus's d-tilt has more range than it looks like and true combos into lots of moves depending on DI. Samus's f-tilt is like the second best one in the game, and her u-tilt is amazing for what it does. Also, Samus has a much better crouch cancel (in terms of how high she can do it). And an unexpected cc down smash on a fast faller can spell doom immediately.

Although Samus does not have the ability to rush with aerials like Pikachu does, she has very solid aerials with good range and priority.

I would also argue that Samus is an easier character to play than Pikachu, not necessarily execution-wise, but just mentally. Pikachu is pretty stress-inducing.
I never implied Pikachu's tilt game was as good as Samus's. I am simply pointing out that he has legit ground options in neutral whereas Samus, for all intents and purposes, doesn't have any legit aerial approaches.

And Samus being easier than Pikachu doesn't really matter in this situation because Samus is easier than plenty of characters. What matters is the potential that character possesses at high and top level. It seems pretty evident that Samus is more limited because, again, she is a character that relies on attrition and opponent error. Not being able to interact with the opponent on equal footing seems more frustrating at that level than having to dash dance with Pikachu. I am sure its why Plup quit her for Sheik whereas Axe still sees Pikachu's potential.
 

tsm2k420XX

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
35
Location
DFW
Eh like I said in the description of 22-26 they are all tied for 26. So technically he's dead last.

Pichu is only good against bad players and his speed actually doesn't amount to anything (except punishes), he can't even contend with top tiers let alone low or mid tiers like Ganon and Link. His range nullifies his speed, and his masochism secures his dead last placing. He does have a decent Grab game like Pikachu (slightly better grab range) but he also is the perfect weight and fall speed to be combo food and dies very VERY early. He's get CG'ed a lot, and his tech roll is hilariously bad.

Again not even worth talking about but there's the facts.
m2k beat axe with pichu sooooooooooooooooooooooo
 

Plunder

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 12, 2015
Messages
862
Location
Port Royal
NNID
1337-7734-8008
in 20XX terms, bowser is the second best character, by a large margin.

if you think this is "b8" or a joke you should go back to project M or whatever other casual game you came from ;)
I play Clayfighter 63 1/3 thank you very much Embarrass

m2k beat axe with pichu sooooooooooooooooooooooo
Eikelmann beat M2K's Pichu soooooooo

Mang0's Kirby beat Alex 19 and Lucky's Foxes soooooooooo

Allow me to re-iterate my stance on this....it will never be worth talking about. Pichu will never even make it to the top 32 in bracket at any large major ever. So there is literally no point in discussing the details of his placement on a tier list especially when it's 1-2 spots when there is NO-ONE MAINING him or placing IN BRACKET with him. That's a super duper waste of everyone's time. As would be arguing the order of any non-viable character.
 
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-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
I'm pretty sure Plup still uses Samus for spacies. The MU is better than Sheik and Pika vs spacies.
BRUH.

Sheik has all the tools. At top level there is no comparison.

Leffen wasn't ready for the best Samus in the world at Evo. That's the only thing you should take home from that set.
 
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-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
Of course Sheik>>>>>>Samus. All I said was Samus has a better MU vs spacies than Sheik does. There is much more evidence than the Leffen vs Plup EVO set.
I'm aware. I'm talking about vs spacies lol.

Are you really going to compare videos of top level samus/fox vs sheik/fox?
 
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