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KoRoBeNiKi

KoRoBeNiKi

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Smash Hero 33 From Brooklyn, NY
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  • professor mgw
    Sure why not i'll pick random, but if you've been picking random for a while then you should been pretty good with most chars, which im not ^^l;
    professor mgw
    Well i don't hgave a xat nor do i feel like making one atm, jkust tell mez your CP :) and wut stage you wanna start oin, it doesn't mattter to me.
    professor mgw
    ~Smash OUT!!! REMINDER: The deadline is this friday (3 days left), please get your match done by then.

    Opponent: Z'zgashi
    D
    Hey i'm up against you in "The triforce Throwdown." leave me a message on when you're available to play :)
    Ssonic
    Dont worry ill be sure to remind you on Friday in which ill be free the whole day...
    And if I played now the storm would lag me up...
    BIG time.
    Ssonic
    I feel horrible now...
    There's a huge storm thats suppose to be here for today and tomorrow...
    So please tell me its possible for you to be free on friday...?
    (I feel like im stalling... really sorry... :urg:)
    Dru2
    Alright. I'll host.
    Gimme five minutes though.

    Also, what is ur CP? mine is Brinstar. And can we go to Smashville as the Neutral?
    Ssonic
    So koro it looks like we have a match for zeldspazz's tourney.
    Just message me back whenever.
    MetalMusicMan
    In your hypothetical situation...

    I can definitely say that it wouldn't be banned (in our rule set). There would be no reason for it to be banned in the first place. Snake wouldn't dominate tournaments any more than MK does not, which isn't even that bad to begin with.

    Now, certain people may decide to ban it on their own, as they do now with other infinites... but those rules are unwarranted and arbitrary, and thus unsupported.
    MetalMusicMan
    People generally care about more "popular" characters more, yes, that is a fact.

    You seem to have missed the part where I said that we would not stop an infinite specific to MK if Snake had one, or anyone else.

    You also missed the part where I said (several times now) that there was never a ban on the infinite. EVER. We are not changing anything. It was never there to begin with.

    If the infinite was on MK, people would probably talk about it more. That doesn't mean it would get banned, or that it should. It would get the same treatment as Luigi does-- nothing at all. If he gets infinited, then he gets infinited. There is nothing else to it.

    And again, we have already had that example happen with a high-tier character-- Pikachu was discovered to be able to 0-120% chain-grab Falco roughly 1 year ago. We didn't do anything about it because there's nothing to be done about it. It just means that now we know Falco sucks against Pikachu.
    MetalMusicMan
    "then why isn't the suicide clause taken as it was?"

    I don't know what you mean by that question.


    Also, if Snake had an infinite on MK, then he would have one. There would be no reason to ban it or change it in any way. The fact that they are both high tiers is not relevant.

    Again, see my example of Falco vs Wario & Pikachu.
    MetalMusicMan
    I'm not really sure what you're asking me. If you're asking about the decision making process, it is entirely objective. We make decisions based on competition and the game as a whole, not on one character or player's specific issues with a "lame infinite", etc.

    We would not give a free buff to Falco because he has a poor vertical recovery. We would not give a free buff to Ganon because he has a poor recovery. The fact that one of those characters is "good" and the other is "bad" has no bearing on the decision making process, nor should it.

    We will not take away D3's infinite on Donkey Kong just because "it hurts Donkey Kong". We will also not take away Donkey Kong's infinite on Lucas just because it "hurts Lucas".

    That's just the way it is.
    MetalMusicMan
    No, what you do not get is that is irrelevant. And again, it was NEVER banned to begin with.

    It doesn't matter if he advances or not. If there is an infinite, and that makes him bad, then that makes him bad. If people choose to play Luigi and advance his metagame, then more power to them. Nothing wrong with that. If they don't because they don't feel it's worth it due to an infinite that makes him less than desirable, there's nothing wrong with that either.
    MetalMusicMan
    That's just it-- it doesn't matter what you think they "need to advance". It only matters what actually happens. It doesn't matter if it's Ganon v MK or Snake v Marth. If an infinite is discovered that suddenly makes a matchup much worse for a certain character, then that matchup would just be worse. There's nothing else to it.

    You can see a perfect example of this in Falco.

    Pikachu used to be an even matchup for Falco, possibly even advantaged. Then they found out about the Pikachu chaingrab and it was realized that the matchup was actually horribly in Pikachu's favor. Easily Falco's worst matchup-- nearly unplayable.

    Wario was thought lose to Falco, but then it was discovered that he could chain grab Falco from 50% to well over 100%.

    There's no reason to add special rules to ensure that Falco "develops as he should". Why? Because by not doing anything at all and allowing them to develop as they do naturally, they are already developing exactly as they should.
    MetalMusicMan
    First of all, the "90:10" or "75:25" numbers are arbitrary by definition, there is no way to objectively quantify how hard or easy a matchup is. It is impossible.

    Anyway, we are not "making a 90:10 matchup out of nothing". The matchup is as it is. If DeDeDe can infinite Luigi after 120%, then that's how it is. And you can definitely wiggle out and be perfectly safe from a running grab followup, it's not a problem.

    If you think the matchup is bad, then you shouldn't play it. It is neither my concern, the BBR's, or yours to make sure that every character has a fair matchup.

    If your character has a bad matchup, it's up to the player to deal with it or counterpick. That is the way that the game is, there's nothing else to it.

    You need to realize that we aren't "making the matchup worse" by "allowing" the infinite. We aren't "allowing" anything, we're saying that you should play the game and work around it accordingly. If a matchup is bad, it's just bad and that's that.
    MetalMusicMan
    Okay then, I thought you might actually want to have a conversation, but now you're just filling my wall up with thoughtless sarcasm. I do not appreciate that.

    It doesn't matter if a matchup is 90-10 or not. If that's what a matchup is, then that's what it is. (Pretty much none of the matchups in this game are 90-10, but that's not relevant to the point I am making.)
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