Downdraft
Smash Ace
Alright, let's rejuvenate this board. What are your impressions from this video? What are some things that you think the Zelda should have avoided doing in this matchup? What opportunities and advantages did the Fox miss?
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This Fox doesn't seem to use hitboxes...that said, at a brief look, the Zelda did very well with her punish game. Din's placement was very good as well. Would've liked to see more d-smash, and against a more frame-tight Fox, she would've lost a lot of trades or gotten punished. Lux needs to be just a hair faster on the timing. The Fox needs to learn how to Fox.Alright, let's rejuvenate this board. What are your impressions from this video? What are some things that you think the Zelda should have avoided doing in this matchup? What opportunities and advantages did the Fox miss?
I agree. Lux got away with using U-tilt quite a bit, and Sora didn't challenge Lux enough when Lux cast Din's. It was interesting to see Zelda go relatively unpunished for making high commitments. I agree that Lux's punish game was on point. He took what Sora gave him. I see many players not opting to use Zelda's Starfox slayer options in U-throw and U-smash chains.This Fox doesn't seem to use hitboxes...that said, at a brief look, the Zelda did very well with her punish game. Din's placement was very good as well. Would've liked to see more d-smash, and against a more frame-tight Fox, she would've lost a lot of trades or gotten punished. Lux needs to be just a hair faster on the timing. The Fox needs to learn how to Fox.
It's official. Zeldas are the best at naming thingsStarfox slayer
That's why its the Premature Detonation =DIt's official. Zeldas are the best at naming things
Yo Lux, nice Fox hunting. I really liked your dash dance movement, you threatened a lot of space and got to set traps safely. Even though you didn't get much off of them it was refreshing to see you performing perfect Din's Fire orbits. The technology is very new and unexplored so we need as much footage as we can get. Solid chain grabs, don't be afraid to forward/down throw tech chase at low percents. Fox seemed to be missing a lot of techs. Fewer charged forward smashes, more wave dash OoS. You could improve your OoS options overall. Like the others said this Fox needs to do more Fox things. Nair shining, shine grabbing, up air strings, drill>shine>up smash. He also didn't have a strong understanding of how Din's worked but that's how it goes.Alright, let's rejuvenate this board. What are your impressions from this video? What are some things that you think the Zelda should have avoided doing in this matchup? What opportunities and advantages did the Fox miss?
Are you looking for critique or advice, or just giving people content to view?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dysnPeeZ18A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX15rN3sB8E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCXsgXCcn98
https://youtu.be/B1L60IUtW2o
There is a few of my sets, some of them are better than others. Squirtle and falcon are definitely two of the matchups I struggle against, and there's some pretty gif worthy stuff in the marth one.
Thank you very much.
Didn't watch all of all of the sets, but good capitalization on the Marth. When he missed his DI, you punished well. Your kicks OoS are VERY good, and I wish I could get that many sweetspot kicks OoS. Against Squirtle, stop shielding so much, and consider up-b OoS as an option if you DO find yourself in heavy pressure. It does a great job at hitting shorter characters that avoid up-smash.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dysnPeeZ18A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX15rN3sB8E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCXsgXCcn98
https://youtu.be/B1L60IUtW2o
There is a few of my sets, some of them are better than others. Squirtle and falcon are definitely two of the matchups I struggle against, and there's some pretty gif worthy stuff in the marth one.
Thank you very much.
Any/all of the above. If there is any obvious ways to improve that would be best.Are you looking for critique or advice, or just giving people content to view?
Fair enough. I don't think I ever got flustered except in the set against ORLY, nor did I ever "fall apart." As far as my habits go, I noticed I teleported straight down on recoveries a lot of the time and would up smash out of teleport... because it worked a lot of the time and I didn't perceive myself getting punished for it often.I assume you are looking for advice. If not, please disregard everything in this post, and I apologize in advance if my critique comes across harshly.
Ok, after watching several of the matches, I actually started shouting at my screen. I was saying "STOP F*CKING UPSMASHING", referring to the frequency of your teleport upsmashes.
I say this because you are clearly quite capable of performing some amazing things, as I saw in your games. You had some amazing combos, tricky recoveries, you were quick in the neutral, and you had some crazy tech. In many ways, you're already fantastic. The only problems I could see were some REALLY strong habits (not strictly bad habits, but just extremely consistent ones). And unfortunately, that alone can ruin you against top players.
I found it pretty easy to predict where you were going with the teleports, though I understand Zelda's teleport better than your opponents. More importantly, however, you nearly always upsmashed out of teleport, which leaves you stationary for a very long time. This meant that your opponents didn't even need to read where you were going to land a strong punish on you as they had plenty of time to react.
I think I've said this before, but I think you're playing too fast and not thoughtfully enough. Obviously fast is good, but right now it looks like you're relying on that, and you're also acting faster than you're thinking. As for relying on it, you can see in the FoD game vs Redbeanjelly (I think?) that once you start missing some inputs you fall apart. As for acting faster than you're thinking, you can see that in some of your option choices which have absolutely no chance of hitting, like sometimes you were upsmashing on the wrong side of the stage.
You had the most trouble vs the fast characters, and I understand that it can be difficult to deal with their options as Zelda. To beat them you have to read them frequently. I don't know exactly what's going through your head so I can't tell you exactly what you're missing to do that.
One last thing: if you intend to use the transform detonation in any case where you might actually get stuck playing as Sheik, you NEED to work on your Sheik. Even if you don't intend to do that, you accidentally transformed once or twice when trying to do other inputs, and then got destroyed as Sheik.
Again, sorry if any of this comes across as harsh. You looked so dominating and capable in the games you won, but you had trouble with picking the right options in the games you lost. I think you could be a great player, but right now you're playing just the tech game well. (I do the opposite, all brain no tech, so take my advice for what you will)
Well I'm glad you kept your composure! I could have completely misinterpreted what was happening, of course. The upsmashes out of teleport worked well against the opponents you beat and very poorly against the ones you lost to. The problem was you kept doing it even when it wasn't working. That's when you needed to stop doing it.Fair enough. I don't think I ever got flustered except in the set against ORLY, nor did I ever "fall apart." As far as my habits go, I noticed I teleported straight down on recoveries a lot of the time and would up smash out of teleport... because it worked a lot of the time and I didn't perceive myself getting punished for it often.
So. I know part of my problem is playing too fast and not thinking ahead. I will admit that readily. What other things would you suggest doing as alternatives? For example, after a telecancel, what should I do instead? (I realize it's all a mixup, but what do you think are some good options?)
Don't worry about being too harsh, this is exactly what I was looking for.I took a glance at it a few hours ago. It's interesting that some activity popped up here because I actually got a video as well to share later in the week.
My biggest, number one issue is your use of upB. You seemed to use it every way you shouldn't, and no ways you should. You may think I'm being harsh, too critical, or usage of hyperbole, but I'm not. Sometimes you wouldn't even use your double jump when recovering, and just whip onto stage. You'd use it before drifting any distance, you'd use it and never go for ledge, you'd use it and not sweetspot, etc. And when you used it on stage, you either just whipped in front of him poorly, or you started it in the air, then tried to use it like you were grounded as a movement option. Grounded Farore, you'd just go in, and 10/10 times, cancel it directly or as close to as possible ontop of Deepak. No. Well, yes, but not why you think. Throw it out in neutral, but don't commit to see what he does. LUCKILY, he seemed to be super scared of it, and would shield if he couldn't punish the charge up, which made Farore->grab a good option, but he adjusted quickly, and you didn't. Just go through and see why each upB was bad. Learn to just drift on stage, and use airdodges. 9/10 times recovering, there was ZERO reason to upB. Just drift.
Second was dair. Same issue as before, almost. It seemed like you caught on that DKs hate meteors, even weak ones, but you only hit his upB with dair ONCE. Oh well. It's an OK move, but try to use other moves if you can. Depends on the situation.
Third was Din's, mostly as an edgeguard. Against DK, putting them directly on ledge is bad. His hitbox is disjointed to the sides, and he only moves sideways, which means he'll knock away the din's, and you wasted some time. With Din's, either throw it out to knock out their DJ, throw it low to prevent sweetspot, or put it on stage to cover an option. Putting it at roll-from-ledge distance is OP, because if you stand just outside of getup attack, you're guaranteed a LK, almost. Results may vary.
Someone else can/might explain more about habits and each situation, but this was all at first glance.
That's good. And it was pretty disparaging watching especially game three for that reason. It was obvious that he was learning your recovery, and punishing you for it. If you were to fix ONLY your use of upB, it could've been an easy win, no exaggerationDon't worry about being too harsh, this is exactly what I was looking for.
For the first point, it would certainly explain why I felt pretty helpless near the end of game three, when it seemed that every recovery would result in being grabbed/uair'd.
Didja want critique, ZGE?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dapE2NTRUiY (first set against Ripple (ZSS/D3))
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV_Nmc9vi_g (second set against Ripple (D3))
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKExeyOwWY0 (first set against Octo (Ness))
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4w9bCaO0aM (second set against Octo (Ness))
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dORWoU9eEOk (against Drugfreechu (Game and Watch))
If you want, sure. I know that especially against Ripple I was a bit impatient and had some really bad dash attacks. I've also never played a D3 like that either, so in the first set especially I didn't know what to expect.That's good. And it was pretty disparaging watching especially game three for that reason. It was obvious that he was learning your recovery, and punishing you for it. If you were to fix ONLY your use of upB, it could've been an easy win, no exaggeration
Didja want critique, ZGE?
.
Well, I know you know, so I'll just give a few tips judging by the first game.If you want, sure. I know that especially against Ripple I was a bit impatient and had some really bad dash attacks. I've also never played a D3 like that either, so in the first set especially I didn't know what to expect.
Your use of ribbon hit warms my heart <3 Excellent play, but stay under control. Movement was fast, but a bit messy, causing you to miss follow-ups. Don't be afraid to slow down a bitFinally got a streamed set that made it onto youtube instead dying as temporary vods lol. More to come, now that my preferred weekly is starting to upload them there. Skip to 5:50 for Zelda
https://youtu.be/Uo9vw76nqNo
"Teleport too much" is not very accurate. You teleport a ton, but I disagree that it is too much. Sometimes you have to risk the unsafe teleports for those times when you get the hard reads like you often did in this set. The reward is sometimes worth the risk.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6BDd9VaJ9M
Yo can i hear some constructive criticism? My only match on stream for the big balc.
P.S. I know i teleport too much
Everything 4tlas said. Your main issues were adapting. He was jumping out of fthrow, and punishing you with uair dsmash consistently. He also has a tether recovery, so placing a Din's at edge doesn't do anything, the better option is to run to ledge and grab. His recovery fade back mixup doesn't work on Zelda. The moment he flicks up, LK.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6BDd9VaJ9M
Yo can i hear some constructive criticism? My only match on stream for the big balc.
P.S. I know i teleport too much
I'd appreciate a link.Yeah, the board is pretty dead. We mostly use Discord now, if you want a link.
Here you go: https://discordapp.com/channels/111667667986898944/111667667986898944I'd appreciate a link.