Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[atticusfinch7]

aero's tier list is the best one so far

There was a problem fetching the tweet

You aren't wrong, but I feel like it's been a "read between the lines" sort of deal in pretty much every game's community. At low/mid level, reward matters more and risk matters less, and "easy to use" goes a lot further toward effectiveness, which is why we've seen nerfs to characters like Yoshi, Dedede, Corrin, and Zelda who aren't top tiers but are easy to steamroll with at lower levels of play.

rip din's fire

I very much disagree with Wario's placing on that list. Wario has a lot of weaknesses that keep him from being that high (namely terrible ground game and terrible kill moves outside of waft)

 

[FullMoon]

Aero's tier list is pretty agreeable for the most part.

I'm honestly surprised he placed Greninja in top 20 and above Pikachu.

Luigi tho, I think he should be in Borderline.

And lastly

RIP Pac-Man.

 

[Y2Kay]

As someone who lives in Reflex's region . . .

Wario is legit.

 

[BJN39]

I'll certainly try my best.

I believe in you <3333333

I spot our latest new moderator visitor. :^)

 

[Lavani]

I SAW THAT

 

[BJN39]

I SAW THAT

I BLAME YOU FOR NOT POSTING SOME RANDOM THING BEFOREHAND.

Edit:

Spoiler

If it matters, I am physically unable to give myself an infraction for my unjust double post.

 

[EODM07]

Now ZeRo has just started doing his own Tier List, which just like ESAM's is all opinion based. And I will say, he did rush through some of the characters, maybe due to lack of knowledge or information on them?

But anyway, here's the Top 11 he's put down in order from left to right:
, , , , , , , , , and .

This is kind of interesting that he put Ryu at #1 and even Corrin in the Top 10. I would've expected Ness to be up there due to his combo game, good edgeguarding capabilities and his back throw.

Here's the video if any of you wanna check it out:

 

[Kofu]

As someone who lives in Reflex's region . . .

Wario is legit.

I wish there were more Wario mains. I ran into one on FG a while ago that I kept losing to even though he was using Bike too often IMO. I remembered after the fact that I could grab him out of the move. Probably would have helped lol.

Anyone up for some matches?

 

[McKnightlíght]

I wish there were more Wario mains. I ran into one on FG a while ago that I kept losing to even though he was using Bike too often IMO. I remembered after the fact that I could grab him out of the move. Probably would have helped lol.

Anyone up for some matches?

Wifi Warios are terrifying. One time a played against one who repeatedly shield grabbed me out of Aether and threw me offstage. He had the timing down perfectly and would get me every time. He's the only person to ever to do it to me, or even try.

 

[Kofu]

Okay I watched Esam's video.

Of course I'm triggered by Wii Fit in bottom 7 (lol no), but what triggered me more is how he pronounced Dedede.

It's really hard to pronounce his name wrong when the announced says it when you select the character, but Esam managed to get even that wrong. "dehdehdeh" Like what is this, I'm sorry you can't hear Xander's booming voice saying "DEEDEEDEE."

In Japanese it's "daydayday," not sure if that's how ESAM is pronouncing it (can't be bothered to watch his video, waste of my time), so if that's his pronunciation it's hard to criticize him. Unlike Omni's "Rye-you."

 

[Ffamran]

Aww yeah, Smash 4 modders got Brawl Fox's voice clips working for Smash 4. Apparently, it's a bit glitchy, but it works. Mike West was fine for Star Fox 64, 64 3D, and sort of Zero. I say sort of since it seemed like he was trying too hard to not be like Smash 4 Fox, so he came off a bit off. I don't know, whenever I watched the trailers of SFZ, he sounded more generic and a bit like Kevin Miller, voice of Sly Cooper, especially in Zero's anime, The Battle Begins, but without Fox's "charm" like in 64. For Smash 4, I think he implied that he did what he was told to do, but whatever happened to the audio files or whatever lead to the mess we have in Smash 4. Fox's grunts sound fine, but his quotes sound weird. I like all of Fox's voice actors and I respect their work, but I have no idea what happened when it came to Smash 4 and Mike West's work. It's a shame since he's "the" Fox people grew up with during SF64's era. In a similar case, but not bad, Mark Lund sounds older in 64 3D, Smash 4, and Zero, but sounds younger in The Battle Begins. It's weird; I even thought Falco was voiced by Vic Mignogna when I first heard Falco talk in The Battle Begins.

One more thing Smash 4 dropped the ball on with voices is Cloud. There is... pretty much no reason at all why Cloud does not have an English voice with Steve Burton outside of budget. While new lines would be great and if budget was a major concern, they could have ripped Dissidia Cloud's voice, have the royalties or whatever go to Steve Burton, and got away with it just fine, but nope. Ironically, that's what they did with Sonic using clips from Sonic's recent games featuring Roger Craig Smith and what the modders did and they were able to get Dissidia Cloud and maybe Kingdom Hearts Cloud's voice in. It's weird since Cloud wasn't Japan-only like Marth was and Roy is. It's like... if somehow Batman was in Smash and instead of Kevin Conroy and Tessho Genda being his English and Japanese voice actors plus Batman's other voice actors for other languages that I'm not aware of -- I had to search who apparently dubbed Batman in Japanese in the animated series --, they only got one and he was the only voice for all regions. It's Batman, but it's not Batman to regions people grew up in if that makes any sense. Also, they have Brawl Ike's hit sounds. Freaking sounds like he's using a concrete cylinder to beat someone up.

Oh, and best mod ever: http://gamebanana.com/sounds/30379. Luma? Luma!? LUUUUMA!!!

Purple Marth is beautiful by the way.

Spoiler

Comes with a variant where Marth's Falchion is colored like Ragnell.

And then there's this.

Spoiler

Doesn't it just mock you?

 

[Kofu]

I got Mario & Luigi: Paper Jam a while ago and just started playing it. It's pretty fun so far. But I managed to make the game glitch out somehow. I beat an enemy with a counterattack but the game thinks it's still alive or something, since it's not exiting the "dodge" phase. I can still control the characters but nothing beyond that.

Thankfully I saved relatively recently.

 

[Rizen]

Kofu I can smash now if you want?

 

[Kofu]

Kofu I can smash now if you want?

Sure. Might not be for very long though.

 

[Rizen]

Sure. Might not be for very long though.

Okay, I made a room

 

[Kofu]

Okay, I made a room

After one more match I have to help my dad with something. It should be quick though.

 

[Cress!]

In Japanese it's "daydayday," not sure if that's how ESAM is pronouncing it (can't be bothered to watch his video, waste of my time), so if that's his pronunciation it's hard to criticize him. Unlike Omni's "Rye-you."

Nope, it doesn't sound like that. Take how you say the E in "hen" and put a D in front of it. Dehdehdeh. It's like he wanted to say Dedede correctly, but got lazy and gave up.

 

[Rizen]

Kofu okay I'll keep the room open. Can you help me practice vs Mewtwo and Samus too? I still have trouble vs Samus.

I can play other characters if you want (Zelda, Charizard, Bowser, G&W, Cloud) but Link and Ganon are my best.

 

[Kofu]

Kofu okay I'll keep the room open. Can you help me practice vs Mewtwo and Samus too? I still have trouble vs Samus.

I can play other characters if you want (Zelda, Charizard, Bowser, G&W, Cloud) but Link and Ganon are my best.

Sure. Who do you want me to use first?

I kept running into stuff there lol. You know, Link may have poor startup on average but his Smash attacks are pretty dang good. Decent startup, good range, and good KO power. Not really too laggy either.

 

[Rizen]

Sorry I got a phone call and those DC me. I'll rehost.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I forgot to tell you guys but today is gun violence awareness day.

So wear some orange if you can.

We banned guns here

I very much disagree with Wario's placing on that list. Wario has a lot of weaknesses that keep him from being that high (namely terrible ground game and terrible kill moves outside of waft)

if you're on the ground as wario then you're not playing him correctly anyway

Its hard to explain, his placing drops in 3 stock to mid tier probably, but in two stock he's borderline/high.

Aero's tier list is pretty agreeable for the most part.

I'm honestly surprised he placed Greninja in top 20 and above Pikachu.

Luigi tho, I think he should be in Borderline.

And lastly

RIP Pac-Man.

I've always thought Greninja was good. Watching iStudying and Waveguider play solidified it for me.

 

[Y2Kay]

We banned guns here

All guns are banned in Australia?

 

[wedl!!]

I'm really excited for Star vs FOE season 2.

That show's animation's so good omg

Also this:

 

[Suicidal_Donuts]

So, I was just thinking about what I was like back during elementary school and middle school...
Me: I'm not gay!
Me: *Plays Snake in Brawl and pauses mid match to shamelessly stare at his backside.*

The insecure gay kids growing up today will never know... At least they get buff Ike.

 

[Lorde]

Guns are basically nonexistent in Japan and even getting one for hunting/sporting purposes is very difficult

in 2006, they had 2 gun-related deaths for the entire year lol

 

[KuroganeHammer]

All guns are banned in Australia?

Yes, we had a massacre here back in the 90s where 35 people were shot dead so we banned possession of guns.

You need a license to hold one now.

 

[Rizen]

Kofu GGs I'm getting too tired to play. Next time I need to learn the Mewtwo MU; he flings you out in weird directions.

Yes, we had a massacre here back in the 90s where 35 people were shot dead

^That literally happens every day in the USA.

 

[Kofu]

Kofu GGs I'm getting too tired to play. Next time I need to learn the Mewtwo MU; he flings you out in weird directions.

GGs, yeah! It seemed like you were getting a little tired. I was going to have to stop soon anyway though.

Most of Mewtwo's moves are fairly straightforward for launching. The weirdest are DTilt and UTilt. They both have like a billion different hitboxes depending on what part of the tail hits you and (for UTilt) when in the move it hits you.

The horizontal disjoint on Link's DAir actively triggers me lol

 

[Y2Kay]

it's only been 5 months into 2016, and we already have 90 gun related murders in Memphis, TN.

Just last year I had lost my cousin to street violence. Over some stupid road rage too . . .

I've been wearing orange and sporting the family band to honor him. Sometimes things feel so hopeless.

 

[Rizen]

it's only been 5 months into 2016, and we already have 90 gun related murders in Memphis, TN.

Just last year I had lost my cousin to street violence. Over some stupid road rage too . . .

I've been wearing orange and sporting the family band to honor him. Sometimes things feel so hopeless.

Sorry you lost your cousin Hang in there.

 

[Lavani]

I BLAME YOU FOR NOT POSTING SOME RANDOM THING BEFOREHAND.

Unfortunately for you I didn't have anything to post about!

Until now.

what gold drop am I even missing for this
whatever it is it's unique to him because I maxed everyone else already
guessing it's toon link gold drop

The horizontal disjoint on Link's DAir actively triggers me lol

...I never realized how big the hitbox on dair was until now.

 

[Kofu]

...I never realized how big the hitbox on dair was until now.

Oh good, it's actually big. I thought you were going to say "It doesn't have that big of a disjoint git gud scrub"

I'd be curious to see how Link's and Game & Watch's DAirs compare hitbox-wise.

 

[Cress!]

Hi Mercy, you're looking terrified today.

 

[LonkQ]

Does anyone have weird things happen to them when they play Smash? My nose starts to itch the further I get in a tournament. It's really freaky.

 

[Y2Kay]

Muhammad Ali died last night.

 

[Lavani]

Oh good, it's actually big. I thought you were going to say "It doesn't have that big of a disjoint git gud scrub"

I'd be curious to see how Link's and Game & Watch's DAirs compare hitbox-wise.

I only didn't say that because I don't want to turn on the game to check characters I don't care about

G&W's reaches substantially lower, Link's has a bit more reach behind him and has a slightly bigger initial hit. The forward reach is about the same but I think G&W's is more disjointed since he holds the key in front of him instead of directly below him like Link.

though speaking of turning on my 3ds to look at G&W I found out weeks ago that usmash doesn't just make his head invuln, it also adds invuln to his torso, front arm+hand, and front foot. He's basically fully invincible aside from the foot he's standing on and the arm behind him.

 

[Kofu]

I only didn't say that because I don't want to turn on the game to check characters I don't care about

G&W's reaches substantially lower, Link's has a bit more reach behind him and has a slightly bigger initial hit. The forward reach is about the same but I think G&W's is more disjointed since he holds the key in front of him instead of directly below him like Link.

though speaking of turning on my 3ds to look at G&W I found out weeks ago that usmash doesn't just make his head invuln, it also adds invuln to his torso, front arm+hand, and front foot. He's basically fully invincible aside from the foot he's standing on and the arm behind him.

But if any portion of a hitbox touches his vulnerable parts he seems to get hit. Still that's neat stuff.

Yeah Game & Watch's DAir doesn't overlap with his hurtbox at all AFAIK. There's a glitch on the Wii U that lets you control multiple characters with one controller, and you can roll to the ledge to overlap everyone. Most aerials end with all characters getting hurt, but with Game & Watch's DAir you see the little collision spark but no one takes damage unless you land with it.

 

[Lavani]

But if any portion of a hitbox touches his vulnerable parts he seems to get hit.

ok you got me interested enough to check it out and that seems accurate. Didn't really think about it until now but it'd make a lot of sense for hurtboxes to be prioritized the same way hitboxes are. Explains a lot about why the invuln seemed inconsistent.

and since I had smash open

what the hell

 

[Kofu]

ok you got me interested enough to check it out and that seems accurate. Didn't really think about it until now but it'd make a lot of sense for hurtboxes to be prioritized the same way hitboxes are. Explains a lot about why the invuln seemed inconsistent.

and since I had smash open

what the hell

T R I G G E R E D

I'd be fine with a vertical disjoint but why it hits that far to his sides is beyond me.

Also, last comment about Game & Watch's USmash, his front foot being invincible explains why I was able to get hit with Greninja's DTilt and not be hit out of the animation when I played FullMoon.

 

[Rizen]

Dair and Uair are Link's only really deceptive moves because their 'poking' animations. He always had fat hitbubbles that extend out the sides of his sword more than Marth's to partially make up for not arching his slashes but it's rare that the visible sword doesn't touch too.

Samus is a pain to fight as Link. She has oddly specific anti-Link tools. Her heavy yet floaty nature make it so Link doesn't get guaranteed Dthrow combos, her upB has multiple weak hits that put bombs into hitstun without detonating them (like some rapid jabs), she's combo heavy and Link gets eaten by combos, and her CQC moves are similar range to Link's but much faster. Usually vs spacing characters like Marth, Link can still zone with his long grab and Zair but Samus has those too. Samus basically outclasses Link except for projectile spam and hard reads. In this MU anyway.