Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[meleebrawler]

I decided to investigate patch 1.11 since I haven't played Smash in 5ever and wanted to see what changed. This is the first thing I came across:

??? B Y E

Don't worry, they already fixed it with 1.1.2 which is out already.

 

[SBphiloz4]

I decided to investigate patch 1.11 since I haven't played Smash in 5ever and wanted to see what changed. This is the first thing I came across:

??? B Y E

Hate to break it to you gorl but

 

[meleebrawler]

That's pretty much it. She struggles even harder now than she already did.

Even I think she's bottom 5 now...still better than MewTwo though

I can't tell if you're just picking on a character based on hearsay, trolling or if that's honestly what you think.

 

[EODM07]

I decided to investigate patch 1.11 since I haven't played Smash in 5ever and wanted to see what changed. This is the first thing I came across:

??? B Y E

 

[JigglyZelda003]

I don't think she's bottom 5. Bottom 13, yeah. Also didn't the shield mechanic come out just like 2 weeks ago. There's more time for stuff to be discovered.

What's important though is how one fares against the best/most common characters of which there are only like 10-15. If her matchups with them just got worse who cares that we can ass out charizard or something some more, he's irrelevant


Basically if you were borderline safe pre 1.11 your safe and if you were unsafe pre 1.11 your sorta safe. It doesn't take long to yes these things on the characters that matter.

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

Hate to break it to you gorl but

Idk gorl now that I hear it's already been fixed I feel more like

 

[McKnightlíght]

actually that's crysis I only took his account because he forgot to log out yesterday

Hi tony

 

[evmaxy54]

I can't tell if you're just picking on a character based on hearsay, trolling or if that's honestly what you think.

TewMewbz is so Tr4sh LMAO

 

[McKnightlíght]

Sithlord9 we should play sometime soon! Whatever day you want to do it I'm free!

Not that day, I'm busy that day.

 

[Macchiato]

What's important though is how one fares against the best/most common characters of which there are only like 10-15. If her matchups with them just got worse who cares that we can *** out charizard or something some more, he's irrelevant


Basically if you were borderline safe pre 1.11 your safe and if you were unsafe pre 1.11 your sorta safe. It doesn't take long to yes these things on the characters that matter.

We do have decent match ups against the top tiers and high tiers.

I still believe that we can beat

I think that are even match ups heavily based on momentum

is bad but still doable

Then you have but...

Reminder that our match up spread isn't as bad as 's

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

Sithlord9 we should play sometime soon! Whatever day you want to do it I'm free!

Not that day, I'm busy that day.

Are you free on that day? Or what about that day?

 

[EODM07]

We do have decent match ups against the top tiers and high tiers.

I still believe that we can beat

I think that are even match ups heavily based on momentum

is bad but still doable

Then you have but...

Reminder that our match up spread isn't as bad as 's

Yeah, Palutena is pretty much the black sheep of Sm4sh. She has really bad MUs, and only a very few handful of even or good MUs. Funny that Lucina has more good or even MUs than her waifu. :V

I would've said that Palutena is Melee Kirby in the current meta, but that's way too harsh.

 

[McKnightlíght]

Are you free on that day? Or what about that day?

Yeah

 

[Furret]

Yeah, Palutena is pretty much the black sheep of Sm4sh. She has really bad MUs, and only a very few handful of even or good MUs. Funny that Lucina has more good or even MUs than her waifu. :V

what's funny is that you think lucina is still worth playing over marth

 

[Cress!]

what's funny is that you think lucina is still worth playing over marth

But she is!
She cannot lose, and you'll never defeat her.

 

[EODM07]

what's funny is that you think lucina is still worth playing over marth

I know.

But hey, it's because I don't really enjoy using Marth as much as Lucina. Nothing against Marth mains or the character himself, just feel like he isn't for me.

 

[Meru.]

I think Zelda is just bottom one. I am taking this character very seriously lately and my Zelda is getting better everyday, but my opinion of her is only getting worse. Her archetype is supposed to be precision but its actually hope or pray since you have to hope/pray for your sweetspots to hit/openings to get UpB/ UpB not getting DI'd out of/opponent not knowing how to DI out of Uair set-ups etc etc. Its awful how unreliable every tool she has is.

I dont think the patch hit her hard though. Lightnings kicks are safe now and Im still UpBing the same stuff I UpBd before the patch.

 

[kenniky]

what's funny is that you think lucina is still worth playing over marth

what's funny is that anyone thinks either of them are worth playing over sheik

 

[Nu~]

kenniky
That avi is adorable

 

[Rickster]

^I'll wifi if you (or anyone with a decent connection) wants?

Oh sorry, I must have gone offline right before you posted this.

I can play a bit later if you still want.

I can't tell if you're just picking on a character based on hearsay, trolling or if that's honestly what you think.

MewTwo? Yeah, I think he's worse than Zelda.

Also how is everyone getting safe Kicks on shield? I've been punished for almost every one I land, and I was hardly ever punished pre-patch.

I broke something didn't I

 

[kenniky]

kenniky
That avi is adorable

It's from the end of this oddshot: http://oddshot.tv/shot/tourneylocator-20151004184110109

 

[EODM07]

Just saw Episode 2 of One Punch Man.

It was A-MAE-ZING! <3

 

[Macchiato]

I think worst character is between and

 

[Virtue]

I think worst character is between and

Isn't Bowser a lot better than DDD? If I'm wrong, please explain. Also, Doc isn't that bad. Although widely inferior to Mario, his frame data isn't too bad. If anything the bottom 3 is between . Jigglypuff has no projectiles and poor range making it easy to wall out, situational/useless special moves and is really hurt by air dodges/nerfed shields/its incredibly light weight. King Dedede also has situational projectiles, Gordo toss is pretty lackluster due to how easy it is to knock back, and inferior throws/Oos options compared to Bowser. King Dedede has worse frame data than Bowser. Mewtwo is spot on though.

 

[evmaxy54]

I think worst character is between and

Lol Boobzer

Lol

 

[Cress!]

I WENT IN TO THE ZELDA MIIVERSE COMMUNITY. THIS IS THE FIRST THING I SEE:

OUR MESSAGE HAS SPREAD, WE MUST TAKE ACTION AND BAN•ZELDA IMMEDIATELY.

 

[Macchiato]

Isn't Bowser a lot better than DDD? If I'm wrong, please explain. Also, Doc isn't that bad. Although widely inferior to Mario, his frame data isn't too bad. If anything the bottom 3 is between . Jigglypuff has no projectiles and poor range making it easy to wall out, situational/useless special moves and is really hurt by air dodges/nerfed shields/its incredibly light weight. King Dedede also has situational projectiles, Gordo toss is pretty lackluster due to how easy it is to knock back, and inferior throws/Oos options compared to Bowser. King Dedede has worse frame data than Bowser. Mewtwo is spot on though.

Actually, Gordos do have use. Especially as frame traps and ledge traps. The part about throw options are incorrect. does have p good throws, dthrow has combos until about 80% and bthrow & uthrow can kill with rage. also has landing options unlike . The frame data, it's really just fsmash and dash attack start up. Without it, would have better frame data tbh. The range and disjoint is p insane as well, as long as how safe bair is.

I agree with your statements on , but I think is worse. He has 's range weakness but along with that, he has mobility problems, bad combo game, and a recovery MORE gimpable than . Most his moves are worse than or equal to all of 's moves other than bair and dsmash. is not outclassed as which is just another flaw.

Also LOL . Glass Canon with like just like average kill power.

 

[Furret]

King Dedede also has situational projectiles, Gordo toss is pretty lackluster due to how easy it is to knock back, and inferior throws/Oos options compared to Bowser

what? dedede gets guaranteed dthrow combos, getting just as much damage as 's command grab. only shaky part is he can't really kill with it

In reality like has **** landing, with his best option now being a fresh nair getting him a -7 at best. bowser has the same problem and that's what makes all three of these characters flawed, despite all of them having notable grab games. they can't do much a shielding opponent on the ground can't punish and all three of them don't have the airspeed to work with to escape landing traps (bowser does a have a little airspeed). I don't really care who is the worst, it's a disgusting problem for these characters to have in this game

 

[Macchiato]

what? dedede gets guaranteed dthrow combos, getting just as much damage as 's command grab. only shaky part is he can't really kill with it

In reality like has **** landing, with his best option now being a fresh nair getting him a -7 at best. bowser has the same problem and that's what makes all three of these characters flawed, despite all of them having notable grab games. they can't do much a shielding opponent on the ground can't punish and all three of them don't have the airspeed to work with to escape landing traps (bowser does a have a little airspeed). I don't really care who is the worst, it's a disgusting problem for these characters to have in this game

Actually with the multi-jumps and bair being safe, doesn't have much landing trouble. Inhale is also a mix-up.

 

[kenniky]

Jigglypuff's foxtrot is so wonky.

 

[Rickster]

So apparently you can cancel airdodges with tethers O_o

I feel like a complete noob not knowing this but oh well. This opens up some interesting options...

 

[SBphiloz4]

>talking about the worst character in the game
>does not mention

 

[Furret]

Actually with the multi-jumps and bair being safe, doesn't have much landing trouble. Inhale is also a mix-up.

ya, so is flying slam is a mix up and so is flamethrower, problem is most of these options can be reacted to, they're all slow. Landing options in smash 4 are crap, most competitive characters have a way to escape in air along with options to mix up landing. if your opponent knows where you are going to be it's not going to help.

Bair is not safe, either auto canceled as it wont hit grounded opponents or with landing lag and a good number of people can react to it coming out as it's pretty slow. I'll admit patch has helped him and I still need to play around with new patch, but I'm not really going back on his crippling landing problem. Least has the best anti roll glory tech by face planting

>talking about the worst character in the game
>does not mention

I have a hard time seeing it that way now. buffs have been nice, just need a tool for neutral

So apparently you can cancel airdodges with tethers O_o

I feel like a complete noob not knowing this but oh well. This opens up some interesting options...

99% certain it's been that way since melee

 

[evmaxy54]

So apparently you can cancel airdodges with tethers O_o

I feel like a complete noob not knowing this but oh well. This opens up some interesting options...

Yea...

#oldnewsisold

Lol

Also canceling AD with Zair upon landing isn't a good option at all because you'll get put through the 22 frames landing lag from the AD

 

[meleebrawler]

Also LOL . Glass Canon with like just like average kill power.

All these posts about how terrible Mewtwo is and here's the only real justification I find. And a half-***ed one at that.

There is nothing average about Mewtwo's KO potential. Just because he doesn't KO at WTF percentages like Bowser or Ganondorf doesn't mean he's not a glass cannon.

An usmash with really good startup, dsmash with insanely short endlag, a fast, strong forward aerial (THAT DOESN'T NEED TO BE SWEETSPOTTED btw), chargeable projectile with more knockback than Samus's, two KO throws, one of which is the absolute best at KOing vertically... the raw power behind these may not be the greatest but the wide amount of situations they cover means there really is very few where Mewtwo CAN'T KO you in some way.

To really put things into perspective... how often do you actually KO someone with Dedede, someone who ostensibly has better KO power, at percents earlier than Mewtwo can without something like a lucky fsmash/jet hammer or offstage bair?

 

[Rickster]

That's what I get for never using a tether character until now, lol.

Anyone I have a good connection with want to play? Warning: cancer characters may be used.

MY 3000TH POST WAS LEARNING ABOUT AD CANCELLING RIP

 

[meleebrawler]

That's what I get for never using a tether character until now, lol.

Anyone I have a good connection with want to play? Warning: cancer characters may be used.

MY 3000TH POST WAS LEARNING ABOUT AD CANCELLING RIP

Me?

 

[kenniky]

I find that there are some character forums that tend towards a certain attitude.

Samus, Ganon, Pit/Dark Pit, and Puff players tend to think extremely highly of their character. Zelda and Falcon mains, on the other hand, think their character is worse than they actually are.

Rosalina players fall into a weird category where they think highly of their character some of the time and badly of their character other times (mostly when talking about potential buffs)

 

[Furret]

When the pocket character comes out and works well in match up

That's what I get for never using a tether character until now, lol.

Anyone I have a good connection with want to play? Warning: cancer characters may be used.

MY 3000TH POST WAS LEARNING ABOUT AD CANCELLING RIP

All these posts about how terrible Mewtwo is and here's the only real justification I find. And a half-***ed one at that.

There is nothing average about Mewtwo's KO potential. Just because he doesn't KO at WTF percentages like Bowser or Ganondorf doesn't mean he's not a glass cannon.

An usmash with really good startup, dsmash with insanely short endlag, a fast, strong forward aerial (THAT DOESN'T NEED TO BE SWEETSPOTTED btw), chargeable projectile with more knockback than Samus's, two KO throws, one of which is the absolute best at KOing vertically... the raw power behind these may not be the greatest but the wide amount of situations they cover means there really is very few where Mewtwo CAN'T KO you in some way.

To really put things into perspective... how often do you actually KO someone with Dedede, someone who ostensibly has better KO power, at percents earlier than Mewtwo can without something like a lucky fsmash/jet hammer or offstage bair?

I'd comment but I know nothing about mewtwo

so I just keep my mouth just when convos about him happen

 

[Rickster]

Me?

Sure, we can try some matches.

NNID is ShiningNight in case you're on mobile and can't see it.