You get no Sympathy in a "Fire Emblem Discussion"

[IsmaR]

Seriously, I'd take Owain over Thajra.

#notEvenKidding

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Spoiler

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

I am personally an advocate of using alternate costumes to include similar characters. I was thinking I would have a Lucina costume for Marth and an Ike costume for Chrom. I haven't played any Fire Emblem games, so I defer to this thread's posters on the accuracy of these comparisons. If you were going to try to fit in Chrom or Lucina while keeping Marth and Ike by using alternate costumes, how would you do it?

 

[Morbi]

I am personally an advocate of using alternate costumes to include similar characters. I was thinking I would have a Lucina costume for Marth and an Ike costume for Chrom. I haven't played any Fire Emblem games, so I defer to this thread's posters on the accuracy of these comparisons. If you were going to try to fit in Chrom or Lucina while keeping Marth and Ike by using alternate costumes, how would you do it?

You mean a Chrom costume for Ike? Seeing as Ike is the veteran and everything.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

I don't really care which one is the default, but I think they should advertise Chrom more to get new FE fans.

 

[•Col•]

I don't really care which one is the default, but I think they should advertise Chrom more to get new FE fans.

You realize adding ANY FE character in Smash 4 would equally be promoting the FE series, right(not just Chrom)? As long as they're interesting at least. Heck I can think of plenty other characters that could represent the FE series better than him, such as a character that shows off the FE weapon triangle system.

If you mean advertising FE13 specifically then..... No. Chrom wouldn't get in Smash 4 to advertise FE13. Wouldn't make much sense in trying to advertise a game that's 1-2 years old(at least) on Smash 4's release, would it? Especially when new FE games should start popping up around them, like the SMT x FE game.

Also, alternate costumes for characters will most likely never happen in any Smash game(in terms of putting two completely different characters like Marth/Roy or Ike/Chrom over a signle character). It just really feels like Sakurai wouldn't go for that sort of thing.

Like, if there was a character in Smash that could be easily replaced by another without the moveset changing whatsoever.... To me that just says the moveset in completely unoriginal in that it has no peculiarities to that particular character... So unoriginal and ordinary in fact, that I don't think Sakurai would've ever include such a character in a Smash game in the first place.

Clones obviously don't count because that's an after-the-fact thought, like, "Oh, we have some extra time on the game, so I might as well add in these clones". If you'd go with that then, and say it'd be nice for Chrom to get in as a clone of, or even replace Ike, then I'd understand. But having them be exactly the same and simply have it be a cosmetic difference? Then no.

 

[jaytalks]

I disagree with alternate costumes because that would mean they would be fighting contrary to their nature in the actual games. Lucina fights much differently than Marth does and Chrom fights completely differently than Ike. Alternate costume characters would take away from why those characters should be in the game in the first. And I believe Sakurai is opposed to those so I don't think we will see them.

The more I think about, the more I keep wondering why people want FE reps to reflect the weapons triangle. FE reps should be the series' protagonists, and most of them wield swords. That's just FE. If Smash chooses another sword wielder, that's because that's what FE is giving to Smash. Every FE game has had at least one sword user as a protagonist. So I don't see how Chrom, Lyn, or any other sword user would be a poor reflection of the series. Don't blame Chrom. Don't blame FE or IS. Blame this pop culture trope: HeroesPreferSwords.

The weapons triangle, removed from the strategic element of Fire Emblem, is just another weapon for an FE character to wield. Unless there was some way to reflect that strategic element in Smash, there would be no way to show non-FE fans what it really is. I don't anticipate us getting Hector and Ephraim (along with Ike and/or Marth), so regardless the weapon triangle would probably be incomplete. However, it would be a nice nod in a character like Anna or Robin to wield all three weapons. But that wouldn't be the weapons triangle. That would be Anna or Robin switching weapons, like Pit or Link does.

Smash doesn't and shouldn't advertise other games. If anything, the characters in the game should advertise for Smash. Now, we can all differ in the amount of difference that any FE character can make in terms of sales, but that doesn't change the fact that characters getting people to buy the game is one of Sakurai's previous factors. I do think the best selling Fire Emblem and the one that has actually moved consoles might have the characters best suited for this task.

I do however believe that any new reps should reflection the previous and/or current video game generation of Smash, as Smash does for just about every other active series. Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon content usually are derived from their most recent games. So I think Chrom, Robin, Lucina, and Micaiah are best for the newcomers for this game. Any combinations of those would be fine.

The lack of Micaiah support considering people's concerns really surprises me. She missed the cut off for last game (roster was finalized in 2006, her game came out in 2007). She would be the most unique main character the series could offer (she doesn't wield a physical weapon other than her tome, nor does she wield a sword), and she differs in her appearance to every other FE main character. There's no rule that each rep needs to be from a different location. Pokemon had three Kanto pokemon reps last game, so I don't think there would be a problem.

 

[BluePikmin11]

One reason why I hate alt. costumes.

 

[FlareHabanero]

I'm pretty sure characters making people want to play the game has to do with more from the prospective of gameplay and diversity. Because if it was only characters people knew about, then holy hell the developers crashed and burned multiple times already.

 

[New_Dumal]

I really want some "no-sword" user in SSB4...
Micaiah seems the most valuable choice (last FE in consoles) if Chrom was added too ... but I know it won't happen.
All my hope is to mantain Ike for his debut in Wii and Chrom for his debut in 3DS...
But then 3 swordman heroes with blue hair... So boring?

 

[FlareHabanero]

People are pretty much crying foul on Chrom and Lucina because they won't provide anything and will cause redundancies.

Don't care if they supposedly fight differently, Super Smash Bros. plays by different rules over the source material in question.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

You realize adding ANY FE character in Smash 4 would equally be promoting the FE series, right(not just Chrom)? As long as they're interesting at least. Heck I can think of plenty other characters that could represent the FE series better than him, such as a character that shows off the FE weapon triangle system.

If you mean advertising FE13 specifically then..... No. Chrom wouldn't get in Smash 4 to advertise FE13. Wouldn't make much sense in trying to advertise a game that's 1-2 years old(at least) on Smash 4's release, would it? Especially when new FE games should start popping up around them, like the SMT x FE game.

You misinterpreted my post. I was saying that Smash should advertise having Chrom to attract FE13 players. I didn't say anything at all about trying to increase sales of any FE games.

Also, alternate costumes for characters will most likely never happen in any Smash game(in terms of putting two completely different characters like Marth/Roy or Ike/Chrom over a signle character). It just really feels like Sakurai wouldn't go for that sort of thing.

Like, if there was a character in Smash that could be easily replaced by another without the moveset changing whatsoever.... To me that just says the moveset in completely unoriginal in that it has no peculiarities to that particular character... So unoriginal and ordinary in fact, that I don't think Sakurai would've ever include such a character in a Smash game in the first place.

Clones obviously don't count because that's an after-the-fact thought, like, "Oh, we have some extra time on the game, so I might as well add in these clones". If you'd go with that then, and say it'd be nice for Chrom to get in as a clone of, or even replace Ike, then I'd understand. But having them be exactly the same and simply have it be a cosmetic difference? Then no.

Except for the fact that there are fans of the characters because of things other than the uniqueness of their movesets.

 

[volbound1700]

I disagree with alternate costumes because that would mean they would be fighting contrary to their nature in the actual games. Lucina fights much differently than Marth does and Chrom fights completely differently than Ike. Alternate costume characters would take away from why those characters should be in the game in the first. And I believe Sakurai is opposed to those so I don't think we will see them.

The more I think about, the more I keep wondering why people want FE reps to reflect the weapons triangle. FE reps should be the series' protagonists, and most of them wield swords. That's just FE. If Smash chooses another sword wielder, that's because that's what FE is giving to Smash. Every FE game has had at least one sword user as a protagonist. So I don't see how Chrom, Lyn, or any other sword user would be a poor reflection of the series. Don't blame Chrom. Don't blame FE or IS. Blame this pop culture trope: HeroesPreferSwords.

The weapons triangle, removed from the strategic element of Fire Emblem, is just another weapon for an FE character to wield. Unless there was some way to reflect that strategic element in Smash, there would be no way to show non-FE fans what it really is. I don't anticipate us getting Hector and Ephraim (along with Ike and/or Marth), so regardless the weapon triangle would probably be incomplete. However, it would be a nice nod in a character like Anna or Robin to wield all three weapons. But that wouldn't be the weapons triangle. That would be Anna or Robin switching weapons, like Pit or Link does.

Smash doesn't and shouldn't advertise other games. If anything, the characters in the game should advertise for Smash. Now, we can all differ in the amount of difference that any FE character can make in terms of sales, but that doesn't change the fact that characters getting people to buy the game is one of Sakurai's previous factors. I do think the best selling Fire Emblem and the one that has actually moved consoles might have the characters best suited for this task.

I do however believe that any new reps should reflection the previous and/or current video game generation of Smash, as Smash does for just about every other active series. Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon content usually are derived from their most recent games. So I think Chrom, Robin, Lucina, and Micaiah are best for the newcomers for this game. Any combinations of those would be fine.

The lack of Micaiah support considering people's concerns really surprises me. She missed the cut off for last game (roster was finalized in 2006, her game came out in 2007). She would be the most unique main character the series could offer (she doesn't wield a physical weapon other than her tome, nor does she wield a sword), and she differs in her appearance to every other FE main character. There's no rule that each rep needs to be from a different location. Pokemon had three Kanto pokemon reps last game, so I don't think there would be a problem.

Agree it would be nice to see a mage or even an axe or spear welder.

 

[jaytalks]

People are pretty much crying foul on Chrom and Lucina because they won't provide anything and will cause redundancies.

Don't care if they supposedly fight differently, Super Smash Bros. plays by different rules over the source material in question.

People who cry foul will still buy the game. And that won't stop FE characters from the most played characters. Ike is most played characters in Brawl overall. People who whine on message boards aren't Sakurai's audience.

And Smash very closely has followed all the styles of the FE characters. FE characters usually have only a few attacks for to Smash to reference, but they do reference them very well.
Marth's Moves - History Behind Brawl
Ike's Moves - History Behind Brawl
Even the clone Roy has a far amount of referencing
Roy's Moves - History Behind Melee

Let's also remember Marth comes from a different time with much poorer graphics, but there is still a fair amount of referencing to his game in his attacks. And even other games in the series! But Ike, a more recent character, has all his special attacks coming from his game, along with a few other moves.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Keep falling back onto Ike I see, keep imagining that it's the exact situation that Chrom is going through and it will lead to the exact same situation of being a very fun fan favorite. Even though, if you've actually payed attention, it's not the same situation. Chrom does not have a cult status in terms of popularity based around the quality of both the character and the game of origin, that title more belongs to Shulk this time around. Chrom is not going to be an extremely popular character that everyone adores, he's going to be a very big base breaker. Both Fire Emblem and Super Smash Bros. fans would rather have something else to talk about. A vocal minority is not going to change the fact that the idea of Chrom is generally loathed.

 

[Opossum]

A vocal minority is not going to change the fact that the idea of Chrom is generally loathed.

I'm not trying to start a huge debate, but I honestly don't get this. It seems reversed, as in, the Chrom loathers are more the vocal minority, with the majority taking a positive/neutral stance. This kind of shows in the polls, wherein Chrom is still below Roy in Smash popularity, but still continually makes the Top 10 in terms of want. Shortie's poll (which spanned multiple sites) and Rate Their Chances, as examples, show this. Honestly, this place is the only place I've seen that Chrom has a rather strong hate-base.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I think he means once we get Chrom in Smash Bros., the people who wanted Chrom will generally be bored of him once they play as him.

 

[FlareHabanero]

But nobody bothers to talk about Chrom, it's always linking back to the sales of Fire Emblem: Awakening and it being the latest hot thing, which is a really weak argument. The best passion comes from the character in question, without that it's just empty words and promises. Hence why there is such a deception between polls and comments.

 

[•Col•]

I think he means once we get Chrom in Smash Bros., the people who wanted Chrom will generally be bored of him once they play as him.

I don't think the supporters will be bored per se... Moreso that by the time Smash 5 rolls around, the majority of them would be supporting the (new) most recent lord, as long as said lord looks cool (or pretty, if they're female) and their game sold well.

 

[volbound1700]

I got a novel idea, how about Titania. She is bad. She uses axe (different). She rides a horse (different). Or what about Oscar or Gatrie. Someone that doesn't use a sword.

A laguz maybe neat as well.

 

[jaytalks]

Keep falling back onto Ike I see, keep imagining that it's the exact situation that Chrom is going through and it will lead to the exact same situation of being a very fun fan favorite. Even though, if you've actually payed attention, it's not the same situation. Chrom does not have a cult status in terms of popularity based around the quality of both the character and the game of origin, that title more belongs to Shulk this time around. Chrom is not going to be an extremely popular character that everyone adores, he's going to be a very big base breaker. Both Fire Emblem and Super Smash Bros. fans would rather have something else to talk about. A vocal minority is not going to change the fact that the idea of Chrom is generally loathed.

There isn't really the data supported that Chrom is loathed by the majority, as stated by Opposum. if Chrom is a fun character to play as, he will be a popular character. But neither you, nor I, nor anyone on this board knows how he will play. Regardless, Ike is proof that the silent majority (as Sakurai has previously stated is his intended audience) isn't tired of blued haired swordsman as the "vocal minority" (i.e. you) among Smashboards would lead you to believe.

I wouldn't compare Shulk and Ike. Completely different franchise. Completely different reasons for getting in. With Ike, Sakurai was looking for an FE rep and IS suggested. With Shulk, it all depends is if Xenoblade is a Nintendo franchise, as opposed to one and done game (which X appears to indicat). And then how does Shulk stack up as a Nintendo all star. Fan support has had and will have very little to do with either character getting in.

If you are talking about raw popularity among the Fire Emblem community, I think Lucina is comparable to Ike in terms of her popularity with the FE fanbase. She's actually probably more popular and does have the same staying power as other lords like Marth and Ike (among those who have played her game). And she's the most popular character from Awakening I would guess. Chrom gets a bad shake among the FE community because he's the second most interesting lord, much like Hector and Eliwood in FE7. And as much as people here would not want you to believe, Awakening has been the best critically received game in the series international history. Among fans, it's among the top games in the series, maybe ranking behind only FE9 in popularity. An informal rating on SF put FE13 just behind FE9 as the top games in the series.

Fire Emblem: Awakening has 92 on metacritic, the same score as Xenoblade. So let's dispel this notion right that FE13 isn't a well received game. Among users it's a 9.2 on metacritic, and it's similar on other user sites. It's the best received international FE game in the series history. Now you can say anecdotally that you don't like it, or that a few hardcore FE fans you talked to didn't like it, but all that is just that: anecdotal. On every level within the sphere of gaming reviews, FE13 has gotten great reviews.

And again, whining fans on Smashboards will still buy the game. I don't see why that will matter to Sakurai. He's doing the game for Brawl's silent majority.

But nobody bothers to talk about Chrom, it's always linking back to the sales of Fire Emblem: Awakening and it being the latest hot thing, which is a really weak argument. The best passion comes from the character in question, without that it's just empty words and promises. Hence why there is such a deception between polls and comments.

Here's the thing: The sales are the metrics to prove that an FE13 character has the most ability to get people buy the game. Now who would you prefer as a character from that game? That all depends on which character you like most in the game in question. Or who offers the best chance of providing a moveset that you like. It's the same with just about every other series. Why do people want Toad? Waluigi? Bowser Jr? The reason people choose that character over others in the series is usually one of those two reasons. If you think that there is no passion behind the support for the character, there are over a thousand posts and over 30 pages that suggest otherwise.

But our reasoning does not match Sakurai's reasoning for selecting a character. But if we are talking about who is most likely? Well, we look at the data we've got. And that points to whoever is the main character from Awakening. There's a difference between likelihood and want. But from everything I've seen on this site, there is a fair amount that he does relatively well on both accounts with Smashers here.

I got a novel idea, how about Titania. She is bad. She uses axe (different). She rides a horse (different). Or what about Oscar or Gatrie. Someone that doesn't use a sword.

A laguz maybe neat as well.

Considering their role in the series, I think a Manakete representative would serve the series well. Namely, I would recommend Tiki.

I think there is merit to the next FE rep either being a recurring character or one of the series main protagonists.

 

[FlareHabanero]

tl;dr

Sales sales sales sales sales.

Something about Chorm, but ignore that and focus on sales. Also, a bunch of lying just to disguise the anal devastation.

FOR ****S SAKE JUST TALK ABOUT CHROM WITHOUT BRINGING UP FIRE EMBLEM: AWAKENING, YES WE GET IT THAT GAME HAS CRITICAL AND FINANCIAL SUCCESS NOW STOP WITH THAT CRAP IT'S NOT GOING TO MAGICALLY DESTROY EVERY CRITICISM. THIS IS WHY I REALLY ****ING HATE CHROM, HE'S CLINGING ONTO NOTHING BUT BEING RECENT AND EVERYONE TREATS IT LIKE IT'S THE ONLY IMPORTANT THING AND EVERYTHING ELSE DOESN'T MATTER.

YES SOMETHIN' IS BUGGIN' ME.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

u mad bro?

 

[Jaedrik]

I certainly do not agree with the sentiment that Chrom was the cause of all those great sales, it is merely a correlation, not a causation, the same will not happen to Smash just because Chrom gets in, and as nobody can predict the future, nobody can say, without any reasonable doubt, that "if Chrom gets in instead of (insert any other FE character here), Smash 4 will have a billion more sales," and in fact, I declare that the game would have more sales with Anna or Tiki instead of Chrom. Chrom is only about 1/3rd of the story in Awakening anyways, not that that really matters, nya ha ha!
Oh wait, you guys remember this line? Most of you seemed to agree with it back then: It is the most silly thing in the universe (I am just the epitome of hyperbole) to support a character just because they're likely, while disregarding another because they're, either real or perceived, unlikely.

u mad bro?

He even admitted he was mad, bro. Truth be told I'm pretty mad too, er, I think?

At last, I'm going to have to agree with Habanero, I've not seen much arguing for Chrom at all that is not a failed attempt at apologetics with the contenders, avoiding the issue that the people who don't like him want to talk about, and is anything outside of arguing for Chrom's likelihood. If you guys are going to convince me, I want you to convince me that he's a good character and a good choice for Smash representation, not that he would rake in sales (which is a doubtful claim at best), that's what this ground war is about, converting the hearts and minds of the men here on Smashboard, because there is very little likelihood Sakurai is basing his decisions on us.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

tl;dr

Sales sales sales sales sales.

Something about Chorm, but ignore that and focus on sales. Also, a bunch of lying just to disguise the anal devastation.

FOR ****S SAKE JUST TALK ABOUT CHROM WITHOUT BRINGING UP FIRE EMBLEM: AWAKENING, YES WE GET IT THAT GAME HAS CRITICAL AND FINANCIAL SUCCESS NOW STOP WITH THAT CRAP IT'S NOT GOING TO MAGICALLY DESTROY EVERY CRITICISM. THIS IS WHY I REALLY ****ING HATE CHROM, HE'S CLINGING ONTO NOTHING BUT BEING RECENT AND EVERYONE TREATS IT LIKE IT'S THE ONLY IMPORTANT THING AND EVERYTHING ELSE DOESN'T MATTER.

YES SOMETHIN' IS BUGGIN' ME.

two problems with what you just said.
1. Chroms about as bland as every other FE lord. If you praise Ike, Marth or Roy while condemning Chrom, you have a huge problem with hypocrisy.
2. Not talking about FE:A when talking about chrom is a pretty bad idea. We don't apply that logic with other characters. We don't say, lets talk about Pit, but leave the actual games out of this.

 

[jaytalks]

FOR ****S SAKE JUST TALK ABOUT CHROM WITHOUT BRINGING UP FIRE EMBLEM: AWAKENING, YES WE GET IT THAT GAME HAS CRITICAL AND FINANCIAL SUCCESS NOW STOP WITH THAT CRAP IT'S NOT GOING TO MAGICALLY DESTROY EVERY CRITICISM. THIS IS WHY I REALLY ****ING HATE CHROM, HE'S CLINGING ONTO NOTHING BUT BEING RECENT AND EVERYONE TREATS IT LIKE IT'S THE ONLY IMPORTANT THING AND EVERYTHING ELSE DOESN'T MATTER.

YES SOMETHIN' IS BUGGIN' ME.

I've admitted on several occasions that I'm not a Chrom supporter or advocate. I don't personally like the character in the grand scheme of things, or even in the context of Awakening. So I usually don't defend him that regard because it's not something I'm really that big on. As I've said, if we are talking about likelihood, the sales and the game's success are merited in discussion. And I was in fact separately defending your contention that there was a disparity in quality that made Awakening incomparable to Path of Radiance (in the Ike comparison scenario). It's popular and well received game. Putting that aside...

I can understand why people like Chrom. It really isn't that hard to. First of all, the western FE fanbase tends to favor utility over design in terms of lord popularity. Chrom is a really effective unit, usually in the S Class in any tier lists. Secondly, Chrom has a great unique design, like many of the characters in Fire Emblem Awakening. I'll do my best to explain it in terms of art.

1) His color scheme is perfect. The dark blue tone matches with the white. And the colors repeat themselves through out the piece. The gloves match his calves. The hilt matches his sheath. The white cape goes with the white straps. And there is of course, the fact his hair matches the blue in his outfit.
2) His design also reflects his personality, which was Yusuke Kozaki's intended goals. His left side represents order. The order he must retain when he becomes Exalt (as his sister dies rather unexpectedly). It's a dignified look, with the sleeve fully covering his arm. His right arm is bare and uncontrolled, matching his actual personality. He is stated as "the person most likely to break things." He appears also to be clumsy
3) His design match his role as Shepherd. As a prince (and later Exalt), there is a certain air of nobility to him. But his right arm is unprotected, in the same way that he takes a risk in protecting his kingdom as a Shephed.
4) Capes are cool. If you don't like capes, then you don't deserve to have them.

His personality is very rooted in the do-gooder shounen manga protagonist, similar to Naruto and Goku. I can understand if you don't like these types of personality, but there are people that do. Just like there are people that prefer Superman (pre-New 52 and MoS) to Batman (who convinced everybody to like him with body armor and a raspy voice). Or Captain America to Iron Man.

His sword style, as presented in the cutscenes, is very cool. It's a mixture of the samurai style that Lucina uses, along with the european influences that most other lords have used.

Not to mention he possesses the super power of being able to make his cape move in the wind, even if there isn't any wind present.

Many people argue for him simply because they like his game. Which is the same for me and Shulk, in all honesty. I find Shulk the eighth most interesting cast member in his own game. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. But I did present an argument that wasn't based on sales.

I certainly do not agree with the sentiment that Chrom was the cause of all those great sales, it is merely a correlation, not a causation, the same will not happen to Smash just because Chrom gets in, and as nobody can predict the future, nobody can say, without any reasonable doubt, that "if Chrom gets in instead of (insert any other FE character here), Smash 4 will have a billion more sales," and in fact, I declare that the game would have more sales with Anna or Tiki instead of Chrom. Chrom is only about 1/3rd of the story in Awakening anyways, not that that really matters, nya ha ha!/quote]
Of course we can't statistically prove anything. Neither can Sakurai when he adds the characters. There isn't even any evidence when the games come out, due to the multitude of characters in the game. I'm not arguing that he will cause those sales, but out of the FE characters available, he has the strong ability to do so. Like most Awakening reps (Lucina, Robin).

 

[Opossum]

Now I agree with most of what you said, but...

4) Capes are cool. If you don't like capes, then you don't deserve to have them.
.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

2. Not talking about FE:A when talking about chrom is a pretty bad idea. We don't apply that logic with other characters. We don't say, lets talk about Pit, but leave the actual games out of this.

We talk about their games, yes, but usually only with regards to what sort of abilities they might take from them. I don't really hear any Palutena supporters saying that Uprising selling really well makes Palutena inevitable.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

We talk about their games, yes, but usually only with regards to what sort of abilities they might take from them. I don't really hear any Palutena supporters saying that Uprising selling really well makes Palutena inevitable.

Lets say we received word that Link's final smash was going to change. I suggest that its going to be using the phantom hourglass to stop time while somebody else suggests using the ocarina of time to stop time. OoT would probably get more support/ be more probable because popular games in a given franchise have a demand of representation. Those popular games have way more influence over how the character appears than the minor ones.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Lets say we received word that Link's final smash was going to change. I suggest that its going to be using the phantom hourglass to stop time while somebody else suggests using the ocarina of time to stop time. OoT would probably get more support/ be more probable because popular games in a given franchise have a demand of representation. Those popular games have way more influence over how the character appears than the minor ones.

I think if Link's FS changed Sakurai would just show us the new one.

Also, I don't think Sakurai cares as much about popularity or sales as you do. Samus' design in Smash 4 is taken from Other M, despite it not being very popular(selling less than 1m units). By your "logic", she should still be using her Prime/Super Metroid looks because those games are more popular/sold better.

 

[FlareHabanero]

1. Chroms about as bland as every other FE lord. If you praise Ike, Marth or Roy while condemning Chrom, you have a huge problem with hypocrisy.

We don't need Chrom because he provides nothing along the likes of Marth and Ike. That's what I'm more talking about, I know most Lords are pretty straight forward.

2. Not talking about FE:A when talking about chrom is a pretty bad idea. We don't apply that logic with other characters. We don't say, lets talk about Pit, but leave the actual games out of this.

Just, PLEASE, talk about Chrom himself and don't get involved with sales. That's all I'm begging for, because so far this support is the most pathetic I've ever seen. Best support comes from THE CHARACTERS. We play as CHARACTERS. We don't play as demographics.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

I think if Link's FS changed Sakurai would just show us the new one.

Way to completely miss the point.

Also, I don't think Sakurai cares as much about popularity or sales as you do. Samus' design in Smash 4 is taken from Other M, despite it not being very popular(selling less than 1m units). By your "logic", she should still be using her Prime/Super Metroid looks because those games are more popular/sold better.

I don't care about sales. Its about whats popular at the moment. "Whats hot" as Sakurai has said it before.

Awakening is the "hot" game.

people on smashboards like to think that the only thing being analyzed are the characters themselves. That way, its logically possible for the actual roster to be completely consistent with their own so long as Sakurai shares the same opinions they do. The pattern I've seen is Sakurai looks for the trending titles, finds the character(s) that represents it, then finds a way to make the playable character enjoyable.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Way to completely miss the point.

Your fault for using a bad(and hypothetical, I might add) example.

I don't care about sales. Its about whats popular at the moment. "Whats hot" as Sakurai has said it before.

Awakening is the "hot" game.

Ike's games weren't exactly "hot." In fact they sold pretty poorly, even by FE standards. Yet he still made it into Brawl.

people on smashboards like to think that the only thing being analyzed are the characters themselves. That way, its logically possible for the actual roster to be completely consistent with their own so long as Sakurai shares the same opinions they do. The pattern I've seen is Sakurai looks for the trending titles, finds the character(s) that represents it, then finds a way to make the playable character enjoyable.

And yet you resorted to making up a hypothetical case in order to prove your point.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

We don't need Chrom because he provides nothing along the likes of Marth and Ike. That's what I'm more talking about, I know most Lords are pretty straight forward.

First off, I really doubt that the developers are so incompetent that they can't make Chrom while Marth and Ike around.
Secondly you can rearrange that sentence to say that "we don't need Ike because he provides nothing along the likes of Chrom and Marth" or "we don't need Marth because..".

Just, PLEASE, talk about Chrom himself and don't get involved with sales. That's all I'm begging for, because so far this support is the most pathetic I've ever seen. Best support comes from THE CHARACTERS. We play as CHARACTERS. We don't play as demographics.

I think chrom is a cool character. Unfortunately, that's completely subjective and usually countered by waves of people claiming that hes universally bland. I've seen and made unique move set before and explained how he can be unique, which is then usually countered by the whole "People can make a unique move set for anyone" argument.

The only objective place we can go to is the popularity (supported by sales and reviews) of fire emblem awakening itself.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

The only objective place we can go to is the popularity (supported by sales and reviews) of fire emblem awakening itself.

Popularity/success of a game =/= popularity of a character.

 

[FlareHabanero]

1) His color scheme is perfect. The dark blue tone matches with the white. And the colors repeat themselves through out the piece. The gloves match his calves. The hilt matches his sheath. The white cape goes with the white straps. And there is of course, the fact his hair matches the blue in his outfit.

And that will create a compelling and unique gameplay style. Also, that's hardly unique. Looks really generic.

2) His design also reflects his personality, which was Yusuke Kozaki's intended goals. His left side represents order. The order he must retain when he becomes Exalt (as his sister dies rather unexpectedly). It's a dignified look, with the sleeve fully covering his arm. His right arm is bare and uncontrolled, matching his actual personality. He is stated as "the person most likely to break things." He appears also to be clumsy

And that will create a compelling and unique game play style.

3) His design match his role as Shepherd. As a prince (and later Exalt), there is a certain air of nobility to him. But his right arm is unprotected, in the same way that he takes a risk in protecting his kingdom as a Shephed.

And that will create a compelling and unique gameplay style.

4) Capes are cool. If you don't like capes, then you don't deserve to have them.

And that will create a compelling and unique gameplay style.

His personality is very rooted in the do-gooder shounen manga protagonist, similar to Naruto and Goku. I can understand if you don't like these types of personality, but there are people that do. Just like there are people that prefer Superman (pre-New 52 and MoS) to Batman (who convinced everybody to like him with body armor and a raspy voice). Or Captain America to Iron Man.

And that will create a compelling and unique gameplay style.

His sword style, as presented in the cutscenes, is very cool. It's a mixture of the samurai style that Lucina uses, along with the european influences that most other lords have used.

FINALLY some gameplay talk, took about 400 posts to finally dwell into that.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Ike's games weren't exactly "hot." In fact they sold pretty poorly, even by FE standards

Among FE fans, PoR and RD were the hot new games.

And yet you resorted to making up a hypothetical case in order to prove your point.

Actually, no. My favorite FE characters are Robin, followed by Hector. The unjustified hatred Chrom gets on this site simply annoys me.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Popularity/success of a game =/= popularity of a character.

Yeah, 'cause the villager got in because his character was sooo popular. Not his game or anything.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Among FE fans, PoR and RD were the hot new games.

Yes, but they didn't sell well, which is what you're arguing about Chrom(that Awakening being successful means that Chrom is inevitable somehow)

Actually, no. My favorite FE characters are Robin, followed by Hector. The unjustified hatred Chrom gets on this site simply annoys me.

But you still felt the need to make up a hypothetical situation to use as evidence.

 

[FlareHabanero]

"we don't need Ike because he provides nothing along the likes of Chrom and Marth"

Doesn't exactly work that way, because Ike has the Ragnell, a large and heavy two-handed sword, which in that context is an unexplored idea for characters in general. It's the reason why Ike contrasts so much from Marth in terms of play style, Ike being more of a slow heavy hitter while Marth uses speed and agility, and also contrasts with other characters in a similar ilk.