You can't grab parries

[SheerMadness]

People have been asking me why their grabs don't work vs me for the last 2-3 years now. I thought most people knew by now but 3 people have asked me this week alone, so I figure I'd finally make a thread about it.

You can't grab any type of parry. So when you're right next to a Yoshi and you try to grab him clearly before his upsmash/grab/jump comes out but you whiff and you get upsmashed/grabbed or he jumps it's because he input z before any of those actions which = a parry. It's not him cheating or hacking or anything like that.

Yoshi has complete invincibility for a couple frames during the parry, similar to spawn invincilbilty. Meaning you can't stun him with any type of hit nor can you grab him.

Just thought I'd clear this up.

 

[Blade689]

You can also duck grabs if its the right match up. Kirby can abuse that all the same, and sometimes its better not to Z-cancel just for the duck when you land.

 

[The Star King]

Oh god like once a week I get "OMG WHY DID MY GRAB GO THROUGH YOU?!"

 

[Fynal]

does yoshi shield parry work the same way game-mechanicly-speaking as samus upB parry, or (if doable) DK downB parry? and are they classified the same or is "samus parry" a misnomer?

 

[SheerMadness]

If it were 3 noobs who had asked me I wouldn't have made this thread. But it was 3 really advanced players who asked me this week, which surprised me they still didn't know.

EDIT: No idea fynal, I don't play DK or Samus and don't know that much about their "parries". So I guess a DK or Samus player should make threads about those haha.

 

[Surri-Sama]

I didn't know parring gave you these frames (to dodge grabs), but i did kinda wonder how you dodged grabs (not that i was one of those "advanced" players to ask )

I dont mind admitting i was unaware of this :o

I also would have known better then to think it was a cheat for sure lol

 

[ballin4life]

Parry basically just means invincibility. Yoshi has invincibility for the first 4 frames after pressing Z. Samus has invincibility at the very beginning of her upB.

 

[Dsc]

Doesnt jumping out of a shield with ANY character give you a few invinciblity allowing you to dodge grabs.
Like isais link does against booms falcon

 

[Surri-Sama]

Honestly i thought Parrying was more "like" a shield that you cant see.

But now that you say that it makes a lot more sense.

 

[ballin4life]

Doesnt jumping out of a shield with ANY character give you a few invinciblity allowing you to dodge grabs.
Like isais link does against booms falcon

Yes. But it's only 2 frames.

 

[Fireblaster]

I should have helped clear this up before this happened.

Yoshi's parry has a few frames (I don't know if it's 3 or 4 or w/e) of green hitboxes as soon as he shields. This is his parry. If you haven't read my hitbox thread, green hitbox means that it can be hit but the character is essentially invincible. Samus's UpB is the only other move in the game that I've seen have those green hitboxes.

I'll add yoshi's parry to my list of hitbox animations to post.

TL;DR - Parry is invincibility with hitlag potential. He cannot be grabbed during it and samus can't be grabbed at the beginning of her upB either.

 

[dch111]

Samus's UpB is the only other move in the game that I've seen have those green hitboxes.

What about DK's UpB? Come to think of it, you should upload his UpB since it has both blue and green hitboxes—pretty interesting to see.

 

[th3kuzinator]

remember that time you were able to grab dk during the main part of his upb without being invincible?

yeah, me neither

 

[Surri-Sama]

I think it'd be hard to grab him during UpB despite the frames...the hit boxes would be hard to get around

 

[Fireblaster]

I stand corrected. DK's AERIAL upB has green hitboxes on his arms and I will uploaded an aerial and grounded animation of his upB.

 

[ballin4life]

It looked like pika's upB had a green hitbox for like 1 frame in the animation. I could be trippin though

 

[Surri-Sama]

I stand corrected. DK's AERIAL upB has green hitboxes on his arms and I will uploaded an aerial and grounded animation of his upB.

by this do you mean you CAN grab DK if he uses his UpB on the ground?

 

[Fireblaster]

by this do you mean you CAN grab DK if he uses his UpB on the ground?

Yep. Both versions of his up B have full body invincibility on the first few frames, but after that's done you can still grab DK's arms if he did it on the ground.

 

[DemonicInfluence]

I was always like wtf why can't I grab sheer. It eventually came to me after getting owned enough times that parrying gives him this hax. Yay for deduction

 

[SSBPete]

i could be way off but i think jiggs has a 'parry' frame at the beginning of her rest

 

[Fireblaster]

i could be way off but i think jiggs has a 'parry' frame at the beginning of her rest

Wrong. Jiggs simply has a huge period of invincibility. Look at her hitbox in my thread.

 

[th3kuzinator]

so are we actually calling all invincibility frames parries now?

I thought yoshi's was specifically a parry

I just thought of all the others as invincibility frames.

We dont call someone with respawn invincibility a parry.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

only yoshi's shield move is a parry, all other moves are just invincibilty frames.

 

[Fireblaster]

only yoshi's shield move is a parry, all other moves are just invincibilty frames.

Mind your terminology. Yoshi's parry has the same exact hitbox as DK's arms in UpB, samus's upB, and ness's PKT2

 

[Sempiternity]

So, all of those could be "parries", too, but the only one that actually fits the definition of a "parry" is Yoshi's move.

Definitions of parry on the Web:

* impede the movement of (an opponent or a ball); "block an attack"
* (fencing) blocking a lunge or deflecting it with a circular motion of the sword
* counterpunch: a return punch (especially by a boxer)

The one I'm looking at here is the last one. I generally think of parrying as blocking an attack, and then countering it with an attack of your own. DK can do this, but it's all a single attack, and is more "steamrolling" (plowing on through the opponent) than actually countering.

Anybody play that Legend of Zelda game? I think it was Wind Waker... where you could learn a parry move, and execute it by anticipating an enemy's attack, and like rolling around it and striking the enemy in the back or something.

 

[linkoninja]

So, all of those could be "parries", too, but the only one that actually fits the definition of a "parry" is Yoshi's move.


The one I'm looking at here is the last one. I generally think of parrying as blocking an attack, and then countering it with an attack of your own. DK can do this, but it's all a single attack, and is more "steamrolling" (plowing on through the opponent) than actually countering.

Anybody play that Legend of Zelda game? I think it was Wind Waker... where you could learn a parry move, and execute it by anticipating an enemy's attack, and like rolling around it and striking the enemy in the back or something.

Yeah I generally thought of Parry the same way from the Windwaker. Parrying the swordsman was always hilarious

 

[asianaussie]

Parries are yoshi-exclusive in 64, it's the terminology people are used to, even if its not perfect in its definition.

Wind Waker was underrated imo

 

[Battlecow]

Au contraire, mes amies. "Samus Parry" has been the mot du jour since time immemorial.

 

[asianaussie]

dunno what you're on about tbh

i would just call it 'up-b'

 

[ciaza]

That's the first time I've heard Samus' Up B invincibility frames being called a parry before. I always thought parry was yoshi specific in 64.

 

[Surri-Sama]

Maybe the term "parry" was improperly coined?

 

[Sempiternity]

Most dictionary sources agree that it's basically a "block"... Only a few sources cite the counter as part of a parry, so who knows?

 

[malva00]

parry, v.

1. intr. To ward off or turn aside a weapon or blow by opposing to it one's own weapon or other means of protection.

2. trans. To stop, ward off, or turn aside (a weapon, a blow, etc.) in this way.

b. gen. and fig. To avert or turn aside from oneself (anything threatened); to meet and turn aside (an awkward question, demand, etc.) by an adroit reply; to avoid, evade.

 

[dch111]

Parry is just the popular name for it, just as Teleport is the popular name for the boost that can be done by Puff, Fox, and Samus. Neither term describes their technique with complete accuracy with respect to the rest of the game (or even to itself in the case of Teleport). But if it bothers people enough, there could be a campaign to change it just as there was a campaign for Doug. Or, a new naming convention could be one of the first things on the new backroom's agenda.

I bet the person who coined it was a fencer, because that's the way it looks in fencing...bait an attack, brush it aside, and (often) punish. And it really does look like Yoshi casually brushes the attack aside--just not with his weapon but with his shield. Edit: Actually you could argue his head is the weapon and the "head bob" he does is the parry, which is funnier

 

[felipe_9595]

Parry is just the popular name for it, just as Teleport is the popular name for the boost that can be done by Puff, Fox, and Samus. Neither term describes their technique with complete accuracy with respect to the rest of the game (or even to itself in the case of Teleport). But if it bothers people enough, there could be a campaign to change it just as there was a campaign for Doug. Or, a new naming convention could be one of the first things on the new backroom's agenda.

I bet the person who coined it was a fencer, because that's the way it looks in fencing...bait an attack, brush it aside, and (often) punish. And it really does look like Yoshi casually brushes the attack aside--just not with his weapon but with his shield. Edit: Actually you could argue his head is the weapon and the "head bob" he does is the parry, which is funnier

About the teleport, i have seen danny doing Sliding Dk Usmashs and ALpha doing Sliding Ups B

 

[th3kuzinator]

About the teleport, i have seen danny doing Sliding Dk Usmashs and ALpha doing Sliding Ups B

i was actually gonna post something asking whether DK had teleport.

1/2 the time it seems I can get a small distance slide while doing usmashes. I may just be seeing things though

 

[Tambor]

DK can slide->upsmash a lot in the japanese version, it's really cool.

 

[Battlecow]

Parry is just the popular name for it, just as Teleport is the popular name for the boost that can be done by Puff, Fox, and Samus. Neither term describes their technique with complete accuracy with respect to the rest of the game (or even to itself in the case of Teleport). But if it bothers people enough, there could be a campaign to change it just as there was a campaign for Doug. Or, a new naming convention could be one of the first things on the new backroom's agenda.

I bet the person who coined it was a fencer, because that's the way it looks in fencing...bait an attack, brush it aside, and (often) punish. And it really does look like Yoshi casually brushes the attack aside--just not with his weapon but with his shield. Edit: Actually you could argue his head is the weapon and the "head bob" he does is the parry, which is funnier

^True. Obviously, "parry" in ssb does not necessarily have any actual relation to an IRL parry.

Haha, I don't really think it looks like a fencing parry... Maybe one of those weird circle-parries the epée-nubs do?

Fencing and smash actually have a lot in common, now that I think about it... the spacing is really similar, and there's the three different games, one of which is kinda lame, one of which is the best ever but underplayed, and one of which is weaksauce.

Oh, and lol @ the aussies. Don't you remember that thread where everyone was going on with Darth Ranc about "Samus Parries?". I could name a zillion other times when it's been used as well, but just trust me. It's been that way for a while.

 

[asianaussie]

link please?

I don't remember hearing of parries outside Yoshi techs.

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

yoshi and samus have a parry. I'm not quite sure about dk's reverse aerial upb, but it stops like every aerial approach ever.