Will some characters dominate in tornements for brawl?

Joined
Oct 24, 2006
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#1
Great argument, will a few characters dominate the tournaments like they did in melee (Fox, Falco, Marth, shiek) Or will there be a wide range of characters winning tournament's?
 

Sideem Slingh

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#4
Doubt it. There'll probably be a certain 3 that are used way too much like last time. Then again, since the game is less oriented on technical skills and more on mindgames, I'd say that it has a much better chance of being balanced.

Overall analysis: Too early to guess.
 

OrlanduEX

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#8
I think that Brawl is more balanced than Melee so there will be MORE characters used at a high level, but it is already evident that some characters will prove better than others.

There has never been a perfectly balanced fighting game. Even the most competitive fighting games like Tekken, Virtua Fighter and Street Fighter have considerable imbalance between characters. As long as the characters are diverse and plentiful, imbalance will rear it's head, And the Brawl roster is both diverse and large with 39 MOSTLY unique movesets.

Thus, tiers will exist and a group of characters will dominate. I don't think we need to play the game for that long to realize this.
 
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#10
It should be noted that Melee already had a very high number of competitive characters, relative to other fighting games.

In contrast, about 7 out of 64 characters were useful in MvCII
 

Losnar

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#11
there were 56 characters in MvC2.

Brawl looks to have evened the field a little since the crappy overpowered characters of melee.
 
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#14
Yes. Some characters will dominate. Hopefully we see around 10? That'd be a great number, hopefully not too high to aim for. Although 1/4 of the roster does seem a bit much!
 
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#16
I seriously doubt there will be as large a gap in Brawl between the innately good and those who are lackluster. (Compared to SB64/Melee)

Sans Yoshi and possibly Olimar. Who knows? Maybe the potential is there to be half decent. No DJC and Olimar's recovery will make it an uphill battle, though.


Back to topic, with the lack of L-Canceling, wavedashing, and "floatier" characters, the fast ones can no longer hit a character once, especially heavy ones, and endlessly combo them off the stage without fear of a counter-attack. Shuffl made already good characters insane, and already bad-mediocre characters not much better. The results speak for themselves.

Now that pretty much every character has SOME lag time with MOST of their moves and no SHUFFLING around it, a select group won't be able to spam/string non-stop attacks. Since this huge advantage over the rest of the cast is gone, and unless some unknown lag-reducing technique is discovered, the game looks to be one of the more balanced multiplayer ones I've seen in a long while. (Not perfect)
 

sprittles

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#17
Wrong

Donkey Kong himself got fed up with all the crap he got from players, he beat the **** out of the tier list and is now gonna **** anyone up who gets in his way!

But he wont harm yoshi, Dk likes yoshi....THE OTHER's WILL DIE!
 
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#18
Back to topic, with the lack of L-Canceling, wavedashing, and "floatier" characters, the fast ones can no longer hit a character once, especially heavy ones, and endlessly combo them off the stage without fear of a counter-attack. Shuffl made already good characters insane, and already bad-mediocre characters not much better. The results speak for themselves.
Gannondorf and Captain Falcon disagree with you.

It's also way too early to be talking about character balance. The game isn't even out yet and people are talking about who they think the best character will be *coughmarthlolcough*:laugh:
 

vydran212

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#25
I'm gonna take the less traveled route and actually come up with an answer based on what I've seen in videos and tournaments on youtube thus far. Yeah yeah, "its too early to tell!!" and "the game's more balanced now!!", but where's the fun in that? The point of a forum is to debate possibilities, and with this in mind, I present to you my list of possible dominating characters in tourneys:

FOX/FALCO/SHEIK/MARTH
As long as they're still in the game and remain relatively unchanged, they'll still dominate the tournaments. The people who used them in melee tourneys can only get better.

WOLF
In my opinion the best out of the three space animals. Factor out the horrible recovery and you have a great character, capable of the attacking speed and combo goodness of Fox and the power of Captain Falcon.

METAKNIGHT
Forget that he has little to no killing moves. He's a combo master, and the faster users who loved being Fox/Falco/etc. will find great ways to whittle down their opponents with him. He's also got an incredible recovery.

ZERO SUIT SAMUS
Expect heavy stun spammers and whip crackers. Zamus is relatively fast and has a lot of combo potential and the ability to stun, making her very appealing to users.
 
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#28
The larger the middle tier, the more balanced the game. It's like economics, the larger the middle class, the better the economy. In an ideal game, there'd be three tiers, with maybe 21 in the middle tier, 10 in high, and 8 in low. With only three tiers, there wouldn't be as large a gap between them, the difference between the best character and the worst character would be like comparing Sheik and Pikachu, rather than Fox and Mewtwo.
 

Dynamism

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#29
I'm gonna take the less traveled route and actually come up with an answer based on what I've seen in videos and tournaments on youtube thus far. Yeah yeah, "its too early to tell!!" and "the game's more balanced now!!", but where's the fun in that? The point of a forum is to debate possibilities, and with this in mind, I present to you my list of possible dominating characters in tourneys:

FOX/FALCO/SHEIK/MARTH
As long as they're still in the game and remain relatively unchanged, they'll still dominate the tournaments. The people who used them in melee tourneys can only get better.

WOLF
In my opinion the best out of the three space animals. Factor out the horrible recovery and you have a great character, capable of the attacking speed and combo goodness of Fox and the power of Captain Falcon.

METAKNIGHT
Forget that he has little to no killing moves. He's a combo master, and the faster users who loved being Fox/Falco/etc. will find great ways to whittle down their opponents with him. He's also got an incredible recovery.

ZERO SUIT SAMUS
Expect heavy stun spammers and whip crackers. Zamus is relatively fast and has a lot of combo potential and the ability to stun, making her very appealing to users.
Alright, this isn't melee lol. Seriously though, the fast characters will have their moments but speed isn't everything. If MK, Zamus and Wolf were in melee, this could be the case.
But come on! lol

The larger the middle tier, the more balanced the game. It's like economics, the larger the middle class, the better the economy. In an ideal game, there'd be three tiers, with maybe 21 in the middle tier, 10 in high, and 8 in low. With only three tiers, there wouldn't be as large a gap between them, the difference between the best character and the worst character would be like comparing Sheik and Pikachu, rather than Fox and Mewtwo.
Then that's possible with melee!
High: Marth, Fox, Falco, Sheik, Peach, Falcon, ICs, Jiggs
Mid: Samus, Mario, Doc, Ganon, Link, YLink, Luigi, DK, Pika, Roy
Low: Zelda, G&W, Yoshi, Ness, Bowser, Pichu, Mewtwo, Kirby

And really the tier list is very much along these lines because it is so mismatched. You take Marth out of the picture and anyone he absolutely destroys along with everyone that counters Fox, Falco and Sheik will move up. The tiers list should be a grid (which would be the best way at least to decide it) but meh.

TiErS DoN ExIsT! lol

I second this post
I second THIS post...
Now I'm 4thing MYSELF lol
omg I'm awesome!!!

I seriously doubt there will be as large a gap in Brawl between the innately good and those who are lackluster. (Compared to SB64/Melee)

Sans Yoshi and possibly Olimar. Who knows? Maybe the potential is there to be half decent. No DJC and Olimar's recovery will make it an uphill battle, though.

Um...Yoshis lack of DJC gives him the ability to chase off the stage, combo with less limits and he hasn't lost much of the pausing for a moment factor that made it effective. He'll do just fine, better than fine really. And Olimar still has a recovery that can almost match Bowsers lol But Olimar can rack up damage like ten of the cute giants

Back to topic, with the lack of L-Canceling, wavedashing, and "floatier" characters, the fast ones can no longer hit a character once, especially heavy ones, and endlessly combo them off the stage without fear of a counter-attack. Shuffl made already good characters insane, and already bad-mediocre characters not much better. The results speak for themselves.

Now that pretty much every character has SOME lag time with MOST of their moves and no SHUFFLING around it, a select group won't be able to spam/string non-stop attacks. Since this huge advantage over the rest of the cast is gone, and unless some unknown lag-reducing technique is discovered, the game looks to be one of the more balanced multiplayer ones I've seen in a long while. (Not perfect)
Yeah I agree that Brawl will be better. Hopefully perfect ;) , and melee was a fluke. But Brawl being a fluke probably won't be necessary because of what you pointed out.

um...

Random is the best character...
It's all characters combined so what's there to not understand?
 
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#30
i agree that it's too early but i think that there will definately be more defining qualities to the individual characters making them all good in their own way as opposed to melee where most of the characters played essentially the same except different speed, power, ect. i think, or would like to think, that in brawl all characters have a relatively equal chance of winning
 
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#31
Also for the record, shffling improved slow characters more than fast characters. Marth misses an l-cancel on his fair? Big deal. If bowser misses ANY l-cancels... he gets combo'd to death.
 
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#32
Right now it's pretty much even.

Until some guy with WAAAAAAAAAAAAY too much free time and WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too much dedication creates another waveshine combo then everyone and their brother will pick that character.

I weep for balance.
 
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