why is young link low tier?

[Mike231]

I think he should at least be middle tier.

I'm asking for good reasons why he isn't.

 

[Tha L@wl]

Slow Physical Attacks...and very few killing attacks...
Most of his combos (that i do) are possible to DI out of....

 

[PDOT]

Light
Not many good KO attacks (harder to KO with than other above tiier chars)

 

[Dogysamich]

because in all actuality, the difference between the bottom of the middle tier, and the top of the low tier is opinion.

Just like everything is past jiggs, for the most part.

Hell, be GLAD y.link's lowtier, atleast you can use him in low-tier tournaments.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

It's all relative. People shouldn't look at it as "Young Link is in the low tier". Young Link is ranked up against each opponent individually and placed in accordance to the number of his good/bad matchups. His position really isn't all that bad.

 

[Mike231]

Ah I see, but his attacks really isn't slow. I understand the Di and not having good KO moves though.

 

[Giggidax]

i remember a thread like this,

reasons why young link is low tier :
a bit slow, his tilts definitely dont compete with shieks tilts

very low knockback on most of his attacks. SPECIAlly the first hit of his Fsmash
not many killing moves. i think nair and dair are his main killing moves. sometimes uair on floaties
hes small and light, making him very easy to knock off stage.
recovery is predictable and limited. his hookshot is so short, his upb has good vertical range tho.
his range isnt so great. its pretty decent id say but the small kokiri sword jus doesnt have much reach.

 

[Laijin]

Tiers are just opinions. Im just glad no body uses Young Link. It makes my match ups in tournaments alot easier since most people have never played a good Young Link.

-His main problem is his lack of kill moves.(His main ones being d-air and d-smash. Maybe n-air. Check out my kill move FAQ for more details on how to kill)
-He dies fairly easy.
-He is pretty fast, but not as fast as alot of characters. Characters like Captain Falcon, Pikachu, and Shiek can easily appear in Young Link's face while he's trying to projectile spam.
-And most of all, people don't know how to projectile spam. :\ They don't understand that his moves have crap for knockback. So they just automatically assume he sucks cause he can't kill.

 

[Chip.]

It's all relative. People shouldn't look at it as "Young Link is in the low tier". Young Link is ranked up against each opponent individually and placed in accordance to the number of his good/bad matchups. His position really isn't all that bad.

Nope, It's actually based on wide tournament performance of that individual charachter by players. That means how good that charachter does in tournaments. That indirectly could be essientially the same or similar to their charachter matchups though. The last time I investigated more deeply on this topic was a while ago I might need to check to make sure though

XP

Not that many people use Young Link. Not too many people win that often with him either in tournaments. It's harder than most people think. But the few who do, are what make Young Link what he is.

 

[Giggidax]

lol i forgot dsmash as a killing move, even tho i use it alot ive realized.
not alot people use ylink because they think he sux. he is quite a challenge to use but hes one of my best characters, ive been told he is my best tho.

 

[ToyzSoldier]

I think not a lot of people use our youngin' Link because if you hit anybody with a sword, it shouldn't sound like you're hitting them with a really hard paddle.

 

[Mike231]

I think not a lot of people use our youngin' Link because if you hit anybody with a sword, it shouldn't sound like you're hitting them with a really hard paddle.

Hahahahaha.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Laijin can't be more right...its like you combo a marth all to pieces, and he gets lucky with one f-smash tipper, you just lost your stock.

 

[Dogysamich]

Tiers are just opinions. Im just glad no body uses Young Link. It makes my match ups in tournaments alot easier since most people have never played a good Young Link.

--evil glare--

____

In all seriousness, though, after playin a lil' y.link myself, I have to put him in the same boat as Doc/Mario.

That boat being the preference boat.

Like somebody mentioned, the tier list this year is based off of tournament performance. Doesnt go off of character potential, doesnt really go off of character rankings, just tournament results.

And Link's higher than Y.Link. When I see that, that just makes me think Link's used more, and therefore will naturally do better than Y.Link.

But it's not like Y.Link's worse than link.

This is where the Mario/Doc statement comes back.

I used to play Mario as my main, but I switched to Doc. I actually like how Mario plays moreso than Doc, but Doc fits more into my playstyle.

_____

The tierlist is just the opinions of a bunch of people who sat around and said "Yeah, this character generally beats the hell out of these characters, so lets put them up there".

So like I was leaning towards in my last post, once you get past - oh say the middle of the mid tier, the rest of it really doesnt matter tierwise.

Hell, be glad Y.Link's low tier. I wish I could use Doc in low tier tournaments. I'm actually kinda jealous.

 

[Bane]

Laijin can't be more right...its like you combo a marth all to pieces, and he gets lucky with one f-smash tipper, you just lost your stock.

or one sheik anything to f-air...

 

[Jash]

People just don't know about his power.....its our jobs to show them how powerful Young Link can be.

 

[Super Mari0]

isnt it because of the young link pros in the tournaments?

dont they decide who comes in what tier with tournaments? if its that then it is because the young link pros didnt do a good job?

i dont know but i think young link is pretty annoying(i mean he is good)

 

[D20]

Young Link is low tier because he is a fairly one dimensional character that simply doesn't have answers for everything the high tier characters throw at him. He has absolutely no way to "gimp" his opponents and has an average recovery (at best). He is also the perfect weight to be chain grabbed by many characters (like Doc, Ganon, and Sheik) and has no way to chain grab them back.

Add those things up, and you have yourself a low tier character. Sure Young Link has some advantages, but when one of them is the "element of surprise"... you know you're in trouble.

 

[smasher_25]

he isn't very strong or fast and can be sent flying really easily.

 

[Laijin]

--evil glare--

____

In all seriousness, though, after playin a lil' y.link myself, I have to put him in the same boat as Doc/Mario.

That boat being the preference boat.

Like somebody mentioned, the tier list this year is based off of tournament performance. Doesnt go off of character potential, doesnt really go off of character rankings, just tournament results.

And Link's higher than Y.Link. When I see that, that just makes me think Link's used more, and therefore will naturally do better than Y.Link.

But it's not like Y.Link's worse than link.

This is where the Mario/Doc statement comes back.

I used to play Mario as my main, but I switched to Doc. I actually like how Mario plays moreso than Doc, but Doc fits more into my playstyle.

_____

The tierlist is just the opinions of a bunch of people who sat around and said "Yeah, this character generally beats the hell out of these characters, so lets put them up there".

So like I was leaning towards in my last post, once you get past - oh say the middle of the mid tier, the rest of it really doesnt matter tierwise.

Hell, be glad Y.Link's low tier. I wish I could use Doc in low tier tournaments. I'm actually kinda jealous.

btw guys. Dogy is referring to the awesomeness that is Laijin's Young Link.

 

[flaco]

Well for me young link is low tier cuz hes attacks does not have enough knockback example if you got hit with the fsmash with all hes strength on 0 it won't push you that much but do it with marth or dk and you will go a little bit farther and also like example hes boomerang has no reach as link .

 

[DarkKnight077]

There is one possible reason. Y. Link up-B lacks a semi spike. Seriously is he had one he would be like middle tier. But..he doesn't, why? Because Y. Link lacks power, he is really light. His Bow is a tad better but his boomerang lacks range plus his Smash attacks except D-smash can't really kill. Plus..no bomb jump err sort of.

Y. Link is suited for more like slower larger characters, or probably spam game..but he is not better than Link.

 

[Laijin]

There is one possible reason. Y. Link up-B lacks a semi spike. Seriously is he had one he would be like middle tier. But..he doesn't, why? Because Y. Link lacks power, he is really light. His Bow is a tad better but his boomerang lacks range plus his Smash attacks except D-smash can't really kill. Plus..no bomb jump err sort of.

Y. Link is suited for more like slower larger characters, or probably spam game..but he is not better than Link.

Yea.
He is better than Link.
Why?
-Faster
-Easier to combo
-Edge guard is better
-Better dodge attack
-Better projectiles(all of his projectiles are just simply better)
-Better match ups.

Of course, all of these are opinions. IMO, Link failz with aids.

 

[Fallen C]

young link bad?

but seriously, too few kill moves, no knock back, other characters are better, stuff like that.

 

[Jash]

But isn't mindgames what count? So his few attacks are pretty hard to kill with, i think Young Link has one of the most mindgames ever. I mean even picking him for a friendly or a Tourney is a mindgame itself...people are all like "what? Young Link? Are you serious?" Mindgames!

 

[Kanzaki]

In my opinion, tech skills > mind games.

Young Link don't really have anything to "gay" some one as well. Fox has shine spikes, Sheik has chain throws, Falco has laser/shine/dair, Marth has tippers, and so forth. They can all kill are fairly low percentages, while Young Link has to build up to 120+ to kill.

 

[Laijin]

In my opinion, tech skills > mind games.

Young Link don't really have anything to "gay" some one as well. Fox has shine spikes, Sheik has chain throws, Falco has laser/shine/dair, Marth has tippers, and so forth. They can all kill are fairly low percentages, while Young Link has to build up to 120+ to kill.

Not really. Young Link has plenty of techs. And just cause you've mastered every tech with one character does not make you good. I know plenty of people like that in GA who literally look really really good because they have mastered every tech with that character, but lack mind games So they are not that amazing.

YL's techs are not that apparent, since not many people use YL that seriously. So there is not a lot of stuff to watch about him. Most of his techs come from his projectiles and combining them with his normal moves to combo.

 

[Wak]

But isn't mindgames what count? So his few attacks are pretty hard to kill with, i think Young Link has one of the most mindgames ever. I mean even picking him for a friendly or a Tourney is a mindgame itself...people are all like "what? Young Link? Are you serious?" Mindgames!

Mindgames depend of the player, not the character.

In my opinion, tech skills > mind games.

Let's see which fox, captain falcon or falco in the world, with an almost perfect control of their character, can beat mikael's peach or ken's marth.

Mikael or Ken doesn't count on their tech skill to beat fast characters, they count on their mindgames (I'm talking about every stage except FD, where they can chaingrab 0 to death...)

so IMO, mindgames > tech skills

 

[pdk]

practically all the low-tiers have 1) poor defense 2) pissish longevity (either by being super gimpable like bowser/ness or having recovery on an almost dr mario level of badness) 3) not enough MAD OFFENSE SKILLZ D00D to make up for these (now you know why falcon ain't in the low boat)

YL arguably suffers from all of these, but hey, least he can wavedash!

 

[dot_eater]

isn't pc chris ranked higher than ken in mlg points now? as for mikael, im not good with japanese players

ylink is gimped, i need to know what kind of mindgames and what other skills he has you guys are talking about that ylink has over other characters

 

[strider43]

Well it's kinda nice that people think Y-link is low tier because in low tier tournaments you can just choose Young link and own everyone up the mud-butt.

 

[Artistry]

If you catch someone off guard, you can also kill at 100%+ with his dash attack.

 

[Chip.]

The truth is Young Link does have a solid KO move and fairly high KO potential overall. I've seen posts by people who have some bad examples why he has a bad KO potential. I've read some terrible posts on how Young Link is low tier on this thread.

Has anyone really seen the power behind Young Link's D-smash LOL? It's an excellent kill move that he has. It's quicker, faster, less laggier, and almost as strong as Link's upB and is overall a better kill move.

Also, NO ONE uses the first initial hit of the F-smash sole alone. It's an uncommon attack Young Link players use meaning you won't see it used often and if it is ever used it would then follow up with the second attack >_>. Get it? The part of the attack that will ACTUALLY send the opponent to die.

Stating that Young Link's boomerang doesn't have range is another poor excuse why he's low tier. Any good Young Link player knows how to get their boomerang in range of their target. It's super easy and there is no reason to complain much about it because it's range is fairly good.

And on the discussion on Link, Young Link is a far better choice of charachter. His higher tiered matchups are better and don't blow as hard as Link's do like when vs Sheik, Fox, Falco, Peach, etc. Link's abilities fail when up against these charachters more than Young Link.

It's hard to tell who has better match-ups overall, though, but it's fairly close between the two.

 

[Gimpyfish62]

why does it seem taht every low tier forum tends to ridiculously overrate their character? ylink is low tier because he just isn't very good lol he's got some good matchups to be sure, but he isn't a good character. weak, light, easy to kill ylink, hard to kill with ylink.

yeah, i'm gonna be broad, deal with it.

 

[Bane]

why does it seem taht every low tier forum tends to ridiculously overrate their character? ylink is low tier because he just isn't very good lol he's got some good matchups to be sure, but he isn't a good character. weak, light, easy to kill ylink, hard to kill with ylink.

yeah, i'm gonna be broad, deal with it.

Broad, but right, I can list positive attributes of Y. Link as well, but the reason we can list them is because we've played as him enough to weed out many of his weaknesses, and focus on what works for us. Those tactics are the good amoung the bad, and aren't better then those of any character above him. Y. Link isn't the worst, but he's not great, and it's exactly for the reasons you listed. You can nail someone with a ridiculous combo of nearly everymove every move in your repetoire and they can still come back and kill you in just a few moves. His only 0-death death combos are into d-airs, which isn't an easy feat. Other characters without such flaws are better, that is why Y. Link is low tier. Get used to it, life goes on, it's just a reason to prove how good you can be even with some drawbacks.

 

[Chip.]

why does it seem taht every low tier forum tends to ridiculously overrate their character?

Read the post Gimpy. I said, in a nutshell, that he has good KO potential, his F-smash shouldn't be used regularily and only with his second slash, his boomerang has moderate range and should most often be able to hit you're opponent when thrown and doesn't mean he is low tier, and that Young Link is a better choice of charachter than Link. Get it? I never ridiculously overrated him, just stated some reasonable opinions that are true IMO

ylink is low tier because he just isn't very good lol he's got some good matchups to be sure, but he isn't a good character.

How can a charachter have "good matchups to be sure" but "isn't very good"? Matchups are what most often make up the charachter's status in tournament play. If you would be more specific on which matchups he had were good then I might understand your point. Young Link isn't a bad charachter and isn't a great charachter, and I've never have gone against that. But to be sure I'd say he's at least good.

weak, light, easy to kill ylink, hard to kill with ylink.

"weak"

Well, if you're refering to racking up damage then I would disagree. Young Link can actually rack up damage fairly well in most of his matchups. In comparison to Link, most of Link's attacks only do about 2-3% more damage than Young Link does. And if you've forgotten, Young Link has some good projectiles up his belt. If you get a point-blank boomerang, then that scores almost 20% and his bombs on regular do 12%. Link's P-BB does about 16% and his bombs do 6%. Why am I comparing him with Link? The reason is that Link is usually assumed not as a weak charachter. I'm just showing Young Link isn't all that weak in comparison with a non-weak charachter.

"light"

He his light which is, IMO, one of his biggest fallbacks. The only thing to say about that is good DI, but yeah, being light still sucks.

"easy to kill ylink"

'light' and 'easy to kill' both essentially lead up to the exact same thing. So no reason for redundencies in trying to prove that he's not good.

"hard to kill with ylink"

It's something I've heard many people on this thread say but haven't given a logical and correct answer in why it's hard to kill with him, so I've yet to see something.

His only 0-death death combos are into d-airs, which isn't an easy feat.

Actually Young Link doesn't have a 0-death death combo with his dairs LOL. I'm sure maybe you could get a 0-death death combo with a finishing dair...... somehow, but it's not the only way to get one. In fact you're probably never going to get a 0-death death combo unless the people you play don't know how to DI you're attacks, that and Young Link really has no 0-death death combo potential.

Other characters without such flaws are better, that is why Y. Link is low tier. Get used to it, life goes on, it's just a reason to prove how good you can be even with some drawbacks.

Young Link isn't low tier because he can't do a 0-death combos on a regular basis. It's because most players that use Young Link don't place very good in tourneys, according to the tier list that is.

yeah, i'm gonna be broad, deal with it.

deal with what? Young Link is not a great charachter and doesn't do great in tournaments too, which is the true reason why he is low tier, not charachter potential. I've yet to see me overrating him. GGz

Oh yeah, and Gimpy, 10$ mm Ylink vs Bowser? How about one 5$ mm Ylink vs Sheik and Ganon too?

 

[Gimpyfish62]

easy to kill is absolutely NOT the same thing as light

he is easy to edgegaurd, easy to kill in general, side or top either way he dies at low %

when i say he is weak i mean generally speaking he has low knockback moves, which IS true, his moves generally speaking dont deal a lot of knockback, but aren't at that knockback where its easy to combo out of, basically he's got that awkward in between knockback that characters like kirby suffer from, luckily for you ylink players, he's a heckuvalot faster than kirby and can SORT of manage to combo (but not into anything very effective XD)

its hard to kill with ylink because its hard to combo into his kill moves, every time you get a kill you had to mindgame into it basically, he's got pretty par edgeguarding ability vs most characters in teh game, meaning he isn't too hard to recover against, and he isnt' giong to kill you off the top with anything but dair at any kind of reasonable percent.

you aren't just dairing to your hearts content obviously, thats not what i'm saying... mindgaming into that "first hit" (meaning either a combo starter, or a finsher that wasn't combod into, or whatever, i'm sure you know what i mean) can be somewhat tricky, but ylink DOES have the projectile setups, but generally speaking those are avoidable, his lack of range of his actually melee and damaging attacks is what makes him suffer

i say he has a few good matchups because he does have a few good matchups, generally speaking ylink does well vs what? peach and ganon? (as far as higher tiered characters go) he certainly doesn't do very well vs fox/falco/sheik/cf/iceys/samus/marth

theres not a lot of peaches OR ganons in higher levels of play so who cares about those matchups anyways

ylink isn't a good character lol

anyways...

just so you know, ylink is my least favorite matchup as bowser over all others BY FAR because its a ridiculous counter match and is just generally realy, really gay... but i accept a $10 bowser vs ylink match regardless

come to a gameclucks puhlz.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

Gimpyfish, I accept your money match offer. Now, buy me a plane ticket. My wife needs one too.

 

[Laijin]

Wow GimpyFish, your Young Link must completely blow at life. :\
Whats wrong? You can't handle a little Fox or Marth?
Whats that? You think his Edge Guard game is sub par against most characters? Oh my..your YL really must blow. Cause last time I checked, YL's edge guard was one of the best in the game( IMO of course).

 

[Gimpyfish62]

LOL @ ylink's edge game being one of the best

i think you might be using a different character

and it doesn't have anything to do with MY ylink if i was talking about any character otehr than bowser then pretty much every character is by far the worst in the game lol

ylink isn't very good, sorry