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You've never done the triple d-air to up-air combo?
That's what I meant, a combo leading into a d-air can be done, but it's VERY RARE, and situational. Y. Link can rarely do it, I'm not saying I use it competitively, but it can be done, others can 0-death better and reliably.
Again, I fail to see how this differs from what I said.
He's not easy to edgeguard. He isn't the hardest charachter to edgeguard but he surely isn't easy. His upB spin recovery has extensive range that usually keeps all close-ranged attacking opponents away from him and can cut through most projectiled attacks from his opponents. His secondary recovery is from his hookshot which can allow faster recoveries and better verticle recovery overall as well. Please mention how he is easy to edgeguard.
LOL, Young Link is nothing like Kirby
How?
100% false
Tht's completely wrong. Young Link (&Link) probably both have the most Edgeguarding oppurtunities in the game. How is he easy to recover against when there are 3-4 projectiles flying at you and disrupting your recovery? Some few charachters have strange hitboxes in their movement or prioritized/long ranged upBs (i.e. Sheik or Link) but projectiles can screw over quite a lot of charachters in the game (Peach, Samus, Ganon, Falcon, Fox, Falco, a tad Marth, etc.). Then, if you ever do pass by his armada, he is patiently waiting with an edgeguarding attack to finish you off (d-smash, f-tilt, nair, d-tilt, etc.). There are TONS of other more ways to edgeguard but you get the gist.
You don't have to mindgame in order to get a free dair and it could be tricky if you decided to do so. Young Link has an auto-dair combo (I call it the Bomb Plant Combo) which is a simple bomb->dair. The beauty of the attack is that at around 110ish-130% (for varying charachters) it is an almost inavoidable finishing combo and is VERY effective on charachters (esp. floaties like Peach or Marth).
I fail to see how are his projectiles "avoidable" if he is spamming and spacing you the whole time? I mean, yes you CAN avoid them sometimes, but projectiles always hit eventually and follow up with a melee combo almost always.
Actually Ganon destroys Young Link
Fox is only a counter to Young Link when he plays REALLY fast and doesn't give YLink time to breath. Otherwise, Fox isn't a hard matchup.
What I THINK he meant to say is Young Link being one of the most versatile Edgeguarders in the game, which IS true. He has multiple techniques and attributes with his projectiles and kill moves that could make waste of many charachters recoveries.
That isn't a 0-death combo.You've never done the triple d-air to up-air combo?
A combo leading into a Dair is simple- Bomb-> Dair combo >_>
No you said that Young Link is low tier BECAUSE he can't do 0-death combos on a regular basis and I disagreed with you and told you that's completely wrong and the real reason why he's low tier with what I said in my post about bad tournament performance, and that doesn't come from a lack of 0-death combos.
Translation: Fox only counters Young Link if Fox knows how to play. In the case of a Fox that doesn't know what he's doing, feel free to play any character you think looks fun at the moment, because does it really matter at that point?
Basically yes, Fox counters him almost all the time, but there are slower paced Foxes who can play still very well....... like Masashi >_> I guess
I was joking, I see my feeble attempt at homor has failed miserably. You're right though, your opponent needs decent endurance for the combo to work, which doesn't allow them to be K-Oed by it.
True, but I was still talking about 0-death combos. A full inescapable combo that racks up sufficient damage is VERY rare.
True, but he would fare better in tourneys if he did have a consistent 0-death combo now wouldn't he
Ultimately though, semantics aside, that's what I meant. He's not unusable, but other's are better, therfore fare better in tourneys, therefore other smashers look down upon his capabilities, therfore he is low tier. He might be a place or two higher, but that's just a matter of opinion really, I think he's just about where he belongs myself.
*Rampant Applause*
That isn't necassarily true, the only reason Fox has the ability to counter Young Link is playing so fast and applies so much pressure on Young Link that it becomes hard to breath. When Fox does lots of arials, shine combos, and plenty of upsmash/uair finishers, it's really hard for Young Link to get out projectiles and keep up a good defense. I mean, I don't think a fast fox makes the matchup impossible, just difficult.
Who's "he" specifically? Are you refering to this annonymous player or Fox himself?
Yes, it was a feeble attempt, especially if you would take into consideration and pay attention where you currently stand. You're in a debate. Don't make silly jokes if you're seriously going to try and argue with me in the middle of this debate. If you are going to kid, then insert something like |>sarcasm| at the end of your sentence ok? You were obviously wrong in trying to make up a 0-death combo that is IN DEPTH and explains step-by-step how this combo goes and then finishes soley with a dair. You probably just did some random combo on a computer dummie in training mode and thought it was an actual combo that could ACTUALLY be used in a real battle.
Yes, but you only mentioned a "dair combo" not "0-death dair combo" in your post. There's a difference. Don't make your posts sound ambiguous like that.
If you read the post/understand it, I say that he does poorly in tourneys because he gets his butt kicked by the most common charachters found in tournament play: the higher tierers aka his counters. If you want to go into detail on how these charachters counter him, then give me a PM or something asking the question if you want. I don't want to make this post any longer than it is though.
See, you shouldn't debate with me if we both have the almost identical ideal of this charachter. I, personally, don't really care for his position in the tier list. It would be hard for more Young Link players to place higher in tournament play and bump him up higher on teh list. If we were going by charachter matchups/potential I would say either high low tier or low mid tier.
It really depends on how you see the effectiveness between the two's spam game. I agree with you on Young Link's spam. In terms of damage, quantity, accuracy, etc. all go lean towards Young Link. He does have the most versatility with his projectiles and possesses the most projectiles as well. But, actually SHB is, IMO, not only one of the ultimate projectiles, but it's also the best offensive approach in the game. I mean, Falco's SHB can screw practically every charachter in the game because of it's speed, offense, and it's ability to control the match really well. All in all, they're (projectiles) both effective and both are used efficiently with those respective charachters and their playstyle. Falco's is better when merged in with his close-up game and allow him to dominate. Young Link's is the same idea, but with completely different moves, strategies and ultimately isn't as effective as Falco's. I hope that sounds clear XP
Sigh... I'm sorry, alright. I thought that the winking smiley make that point evident, but I suppose I could be a bit more blunt. i suppose it's jsut my tendency to be a bit dry, It's my fault, not yours that you didn't understand.
What do you want from me? Explanatary footnotes1.
When did I say that it did? D-air was an EXAMPLE of a good combo finisher that works at low damage. Combo's can also finish in a d-smash when they comedown and you're grounded or a good repeated boot to the face, but those are dependant on the map or being near the edge of a map. I was just using it as an example it's abit wordy to discuss every option at every juncture, so I assumed it as an example. Sue me.
I understand that many high tierers counter Y. Link but few other middle tier characters fair much better vs. the higher tiers, not enough to blame his low tier status on them by anymeans.
I didn't try to debate you, you corrected me with an arument with no contrary content. I pointed that out. Not my fault.
As an offensive strategy, sh-laser is worlds better, but Y. Link's projectiles can be used aggresively and defensively which makes them better (in my eyes at least.)
Again, just as another reminder, don't joke if you want to debate. I mean, you can if you want, but it has to be obvious sarcasm when you bring it up. When you're breaking up my post, anyone would assume that you were trying to tell me the 0-death combo since that was how it was quoted. Obviously, the winky face made your statement appear to look as though you were notifying me of this 'new combo that I may of not seen before'. So note-to-yourself that the winky face DOESN'T make your statement a sure-fire joke.
Oh, ok, so you're just proving yourself wrong that it is a completely, utterly useless combo that will almost never work unless the high demanding circumstances are met: your opponent doesn't know how to DI properly, the opponent also has to be a slow sluggish charachter, and the player must not be paying attention and has to get by flying random dairs. Which was exactly what I thought. It's a horrible combo, and I congradulate you on accomadating your mistake of making the joke and realizing it was a bad mistake to do so. So, like mentioned above, let's not have anymore jokes unless it's pointed out to be one obviously
. OK, but it was in that post you said a simple "dair combo". Just mention 0-death dair combo from now on in your posts whenever you say it. It reduces chance of misleadings in this discussion, especially when I'm argueing with 3 different people at a time, it's sometimes hard to keep track. Don't get me wrong, I'm not johning or anything. I take responsiblity for that minor error of mine.
Please elaborate on this a little more, will you? Yes, most middle tierers have the ABILITY to do better against higher tierers because... they're middle tier >_>, and most of them do better than lower tier. If you understand the post I made a little better, I specifed about OVERALL CHARACHTER MATCHUPS, not his tournament performance.
de·bate
Falco's SHB can be used for defense and aggressive play -_-
the triple dair > uair combo isnt 0-death.Sorry about that, what I meant to post was:
You've never done the triple d-air to up-air combo?
