Why does everyone crap on Smash 64 so much?

[Deleted member]

All the Melee fans complain that Brawl has a lot of features from Smash 64 but I liked Smash 64 better than Melee. They sped the game up too fast (your complaining Brawl is slowed down too much).

Imagine how we felt when Melee felt like Smash 64 on speed, some people liked it but a lot of fans of the original didn't. I never ended up buying Melee and stuck with 64 that I didn't like the speed so much. I play tons of fast/difficult games (F-Zero GX) I just felt that Melee's physics didn't feel good and I'm really happy / looking forward to Brawl.

Don't act like going back to 64 is a bad thing, there was still plenty of depth and I've been playing for well over seven years. It's still fun to play. And there aren't many game changing glitches like wave dashing...

To me Melee felt like a different game and if you enjoyed it fine, but don't act like you're getting screwed over when Smash 64 fans got screwed over first and no one cared.

I'm glad I'm finally getting a sequel to Smash 64 and I can't wait to play people online. A lot of people here are so young they probably didn't play much Smash 64 which is sad.

Obviously this isn't towards everyone but just some of the people out there. If Smash 64 had the characters/levels that Melee did I feel it would be the better game easily. Melee with Smash 64 physics would have been the best game ever.

 

[Xanderous]

Melee's speed made it great, but if you didn't like it, you didn't like it. Not anything I can say to change your mind.

 

[S2]

While there isn't anything wrong with enjoying Smash 64 more, the majority of players vastly enjoyed Melee more.

Smash 64 was never a game that was played much in tournaments. Melee was the game where people decided it was deep enough to get monstrously good.

Nearly everyone but a handful considered Melee a massive improvement over Smash 64. Most only found Melee too fast at first, adjusting to its speed quickly so that Smash 64 seemed slow by comparison.

Your free to love Smash 64 more, its a great game. But be aware that the vast majority feels Melee improved over 64 in all areas and is a vastly better game for tournament play.

 

[Deleted member]

Melee's speed made it great, but if you didn't like it, you didn't like it. Not anything I can say to change your mind.

And 64's speed (or lack of) made it great. People are whining that the game is going back to its roots, and the game isn't devolving, just changing. It isn't even that slow...Brawl or the original (if you know how to play).

 

[PanzerOceania]

Melee's speed made it great, but if you didn't like it, you didn't like it. Not anything I can say to change your mind.

can't I love both? or is that astronomically impossible.

Smash 64 was never a game that was played much in tournaments. Melee was the game where people decided it was deep enough to get monstrously good.

I'd say it's more about people's lack of organization at that point than it being deemed "not competative enough" more people were not playing competitively at that time, that's all, but it's plenty competative.

Smash Bros is what you make of it :D

 

[Xanderous]

can't I love both? or is that astronomically impossible?

That has nothing to do with what I said.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm not talking about tournament play. Tournament players are a small minority. Then again they are a vocal minority so perhaps that's where I'm hearing all of this from.

 

[Lecto2007]

Dude you seriously are losing it Melee was 100X better than 64, more characters, better gameplay, More items.
You must have been playing Melee with your eyes closed.

 

[Deleted member]

Dude you seriously are losing it Melee was 100X better than 64, more characters, better gameplay, More items.
You must have been playing Melee with your eyes closed.

If you don't believe opinions exist then please don't post in this thread.

 

[PanzerOceania]

gameplay over grafX BAYBEE!

like I said I think both win for different reasons, that's the thing about smash, if the next game was the same as the last game, only better, then no one would play the last game, but the way it's gone every smash game has it's own unique ups and downs, so we'll always play them all.

 

[S2]

I'm not talking about tournament play. Tournament players are a small minority. Then again they are a vocal minority so perhaps that's where I'm hearing all of this from.

Your downplaying the truth here though.

Tournament players are a minority, but compared to casuals, our voice isn't heard nearly as much. Casuals liked Melee just as much. Many Melee lovers aren't even tournament players.

Like I said, you're free to love Smash 64. But the truth is that a vast majority of casual and competitive players are vocal they like Melee better.

 

[ph00tbag]

I honestly don't get why anyone would hate either of them. They were both good in their own right. I've seen posts to the effect of 64 was much less balanced than Melee, though. And that's definitely saying something.

 

[Deleted member]

I honestly don't get why anyone would hate either of them. They were both good in their own right. I've seen posts to the effect of 64 was much less balanced than Melee, though. And that's definitely saying something.

I feel 64 was much more balanced than Melee. There were more viable characters.

 

[Lecto2007]

Then go play that and not melee, Instead of making a usless thread on it.

 

[Deleted member]

Then go play that and not melee, Instead of making a usless thread on it.

How about you don't go into threads you don't like and stop going around the forums being a useless whiner about everything? I don't like a lot of threads, so I don't go in them. Some people want to talk about things you don't, get over it. This isn't the Lecto2007 forums.

 

[flyinfilipino]

I feel 64 was much more balanced than Melee. There were more viable characters.

Well, there were only 12 characters. That might have something to do with it.

 

[S2]

I feel 64 was much more balanced than Melee. There were more viable characters.

Maybe at low level play. But I charge you to watch some actual high level play vids. If infinite combos is your idea of balance, then yes, its more balanced.

And even at low level play, there is a huge difference between say Kirby and Link. It's hardly balanced or fair at all.

Now watch a Smash64 pro play Pikachu and you'll realize that the game is not well balanced. Melee wasn't super balanced either, but believe it or not, it was a step-up from Melee.

 

[PanzerOceania]

Well, there were only 12 characters. That might have something to do with it.

hmm, yes which is why more characters isn't ALWAYS better, some would be underpowered and end up never being used much.

 

[Deleted member]

Maybe at low level play. But I charge you to watch some actual high level play vids. If infinite combos is your idea of balance, then yes, its more balanced.

And even at low level play, there is a huge difference between say Kirby and Link. It's hardly balanced or fair at all.

Now watch a Smash64 pro play Pikachu and you'll realize that the game is not well balanced. Melee wasn't super balanced either, but believe it or not, it was a step-up from Melee.

I've seen lots of videos and such, I still disagree.

 

[Drclaw411]

Why is Melee better than 64?

MORE CHARS = BETTER GAME. PERIOD.


also, wrong board.

 

[jimmyjoe]

I've seen posts to the effect of 64 was much less balanced than Melee, though. And that's definitely saying something.

First of all 64 was more balanced than melee... there is no good argument saying otherwise. Less characters made it easier to achieve this. While learning smash64 it may not initially feel that way, but a greater understanding of the physics, spacing, and timing, with advanced techs like z-canceling to cover your ***, you'll find any character can win in the right hands.

To the TC:

There have been plenty of 64 vs. melee threads and there are plenty of people that miss the physics/pace/gameplay of 64. We're a minority but you aren't alone

It's so satisfying to connect with a hit in 64 too!

 

[PanzerOceania]

Why is Melee better than 64?

MORE CHARS = BETTER GAME. PERIOD.


also, wrong board.

I thought more competition = better game?

 

[Deleted member]

Why is Melee better than 64?

MORE CHARS = BETTER GAME. PERIOD.

That has to be one of the most ignorant things I have ever heard. What if there were 1,000 characters in Brawl and each character only had one move? Is it impossible to have a real discussion on these boards? I think it's been invaded by GameFAQs because that's what it's feeling like right now.

 

[PanzerOceania]

that's funny because I just started coming here and I thought "Wow this place is like gamefaqs, yikes"

 

[SuperLink9]

Some people thing SSB64 was too slow.

Some people think Melee was too fast.

Brawl is the perfect balance. Can't you see that people?!

I think I speak for an absolute ****load of people when I say SSB64 veterans took a little while to get used to Melee, and maybe even preferred SSB64 for a while after Melee came out.

The same could happen in this case, but in the end it's likely Smash fans will prefer Brawl.

 

[PanzerOceania]

Some people thing SSB64 was too slow.

Some people think Melee was too fast.

Brawl is the perfect balance. Can't you see that people?!

I think I speak for an absolute ****load of people when I say SSB64 veterans took a little while to get used to Melee, and maybe even preferred SSB64 for a while after Melee came out.

The same could happen in this case, but in the end it's likely Smash fans will prefer Brawl.

give this man a drink.

 

[jimmyjoe]

Why is Melee better than 64?

MORE CHARS = BETTER GAME. PERIOD.


also, wrong board.

Completely inaccurate... this is supposed to be about brawl not 64 vs melee but come on... seriously think about that statement.

 

[jimmyjoe]

give this man a drink.

agreed! give him 3 drinks

EDIT: sorry 2 posts

 

[Deleted member]

Some people thing SSB64 was too slow.

Some people think Melee was too fast.

Brawl is the perfect balance. Can't you see that people?!

I think I speak for an absolute ****load of people when I say SSB64 veterans took a little while to get used to Melee, and maybe even preferred SSB64 for a while after Melee came out.

The same could happen in this case, but in the end it's likely Smash fans will prefer Brawl.

I hope your right. Melee was unplayable for me because it just wasn't fun (which is why I play games). I'm hoping Brawl will make me so pleased I have no interest in going back except for nostalgic purposes.

 

[SuperLink9]

I found Melee tons of fun. Hell at first I was a little pissed off the throws were so weak, but the throws weren't weak in Melee... they were overpowered as HELL in Smash 64

If you ask me, Brawl generally looks more fun than Melee. For item play there are many interesting items, including the fun looking Final Smashes. Also not to mention TONS of the newcomers look fun as hell to use.

(Please don't flame me about this...) the removal of some advanced techniques has made the game more raw all around. More raw skill, yet less completely thrashing of a new player because they can't keep up with your lightning fast veteran movements. Sure the veterans will win by miles, but the experience should be more fun for everyone in general, especially with a bigger, more famous and more balanced character cast.

 

[jimmyjoe]

I hope your right. Melee was unplayable for me because it just wasn't fun (which is why I play games). I'm hoping Brawl will make me so pleased I have no interest in going back except for nostalgic purposes.

Melee is so different from smash64, and I do still like 64 better. It took me a long time to even begin to like melee, but when you begin to finally feel like you have control over your character and you start to get pretty decent it is truly very rewarding. Melee is hard work to get good. I wouldn't even say I'm good because I still don't have the precision and total character control I posses with 64, but I use advanced techs in both and melee's speed is still tough for me but being such a difficult game it was that much more rewarding. I actually main the fastest character in melee now, and it even ended up making me a much better 64 player.

I guess I'm saying in a nutshell we all should enjoy brawl and give it a real chance no matter what our first impressions are or we'll all be stuck in the past, be it with melee or 64. Sakurai wouldn't let us down, I believe in him because I understand the beauty that is smash. To an extent he listened to what the fans want, but ultimately people don't always know whats best for them. He will deliver the best game yet.. you can bet on that

sorry for that rant...I just love smash

 

[Copperpot]

Like a lot of others have said, I love both games for different reasons.

As for balance, I'm not sure that these games are balanced around competitive standards. From what I've seen, they appear to be balanced for casual play. Smash 64 (to me) is more balanced than Melee in this respect.

Why is that? It's really quite simple. Any joe-shmoe can pick up Shiek or Marth (or insert easy character here) and easily beat the tar out of another newbie playing, say, DK or Mewtwo for example.

Of course, there is a much larger spectrum of characters in Melee, which is what ultimately leads to the contrast in character power.

In the end, I still like Melee more, but if 64 had Bowser and a few other important characters in it, I might be singing a different tune. That's what gets me so excited for Brawl. The game needs a change of pace, and SSBB will be a good start (or finish).

 

[Thino]

I love both and play both competiv with advanced techniques , I enjoy both

I dont understand the point of this thread srsly are you trying to understand people's opinions?

good luck

facts are that melee has been more successful than 64

 

[S2]

Character balance is never determined by low level play. In any fighting game its determined by the potential and usability of a character in the hands of a top tournament player against other players of the same skill level.

New players oftentimes find very avoidable move overpowered. Show Melee off to someone who's never played it before - many will find Link's Up-B godly. In reality it is very punishable if used incorrectly and is hardly game breaking.

 

[Vex Kasrani]

I love both and play both competiv with advanced techniques , I enjoy both

I dont understand the point of this thread srsly are you trying to understand people's opinions?

good luck

facts are that melee has been more successful than 64

QFT

Listen people, SSB64 and melee are pretty much completely different games, the only real comparison between the two games could be some strategy, and that ******** word we know thats called mind games. the games really are different and some people will like 1 type of game while other people will like the other. I play both competitively(sorta for SSB if you count online tournaments) meh but whatever.

 

[JMOAN]

Smash64 is horribly imbalanced on competitive levels.. Plain and simple. Every character can start a plethora of 0-to-death combos that are much easier to execute than they should be. I mean, I guess the game is balanced in that every character is broken... But some character's are more broken then others. The fact that z-canceling allows for virtually no lag, the fact that DI in the game is horribly lacking, the fact that many spikes are virtually auto-kills.... This all makes the game break down on a competitive level.

There's a reason the Isai SSB64 combo video is named "Don't Get Hit."

SSB64 is a great game and a fun game at low levels. But in tournament play it is vastly inferior to Melee. I don't think the designers of SSB64 had any idea people would legitimately take the game to its limit, but people like Isai CERTAINLY have. Super Smash Bros. 64 is more like Super Smash Marvel vs. Capcom Bros.

 

[PanzerOceania]

There's a reason the Isai SSB64 combo video is named "Don't Get Hit."

that video makes me smile every time.

 

[Teebs]

If I had to take a guess, maybe the lack of character and controls.

 

[Anarchyzoo41]

yeah, I agree

 

[Tope]

I wish I had more of a background in SSB, but I only played it for a couple months before SSBM's release. It seems like a fun game, the times I've played it.

With that said, I got to experience Brawl live this past weekend.


It is different. It is also amazing.


That is all.