Why do people think Charizard sucks?

[Charizard92]

Okay, first things, first, this is my first thread so I'm trying my best not to make a spam thread or break any rules from the start so can you be easy on me for now.

Now, when I was a guest I saw a ton of posts & threads saying that Charizard is a lackluster character on the P. Trainer's team, only to be used to use in case the other two have problems or the damage meter is high. But I pretty much mastered Charizard and in my eyes, he's the best of the three.

Please post here, if you disagree, one flaw you see on Charizard and I'll try my best to argue otherwise, provided that I quickly learn how to post.

If you do agree with me that Charizard doesn't suck, you can help, as I am new and I am at the start of the learning curve.'

Either way, thanks for posting on my first thread.

 

[Retro Gaming]

Can anyone really think this? Charizard is a very powerful force that can kill and tank succesfully. I don't think he's the best (Ivysaur) but I find him more useful than Squirtle. Squirtle only seems to be useful versus certain characters because of his poor range. That's just my opinion, though.

 

[Charizard92]

This is actually what I mean, I might have over exaggerated on how much people think of Charizard but he is usually put on the bottom of the list in comparison to the other two. To put this easier, looking at all three Pokemon at a glance on the P. Trainer's team, they typically look at the other two as great and Charizard being below them, and several other characters (I have even seen people put Charizard low on their tier list individually).

 

[DoubleAced]

I like Charizard a lot, but Squirtle's gotta be my favorite. I really like all three of them pretty closely, though.

 

[Charizard92]

Thank you for supporting Charizard to at least that degree. He is my favorite Pokemon on P. Trainer's team, which is why I had to write a thread to try to improve his popularity to many more. I was kind of hoping that someone can come up with a reason why Charizard isn't seen in the same way other than the fact that he's big or easily chain grabbed by certain characters (it is not just Dedede as sobe believe) wihch I just can't explain away because they are Charizard's main flaws. I made this thread to tell others that those are really his only flaws, he is in fact very fast despite being a tank, he is quite versatile, the list of pros is longer than those putting him on lower tiers think, so if you're not convinced, please post about it.

 

[Kemious]

Charizard is a monster. He is some cases the only reason why I win at times. Though no one Pokemon is betterthan the other.

 

[infernovia]

Its really hard once someone gets under you, which basically means you need to air dodge (I think the only attack option you have is Nair/Dair). Especially when they are good jugglers. :/ Juggle target.

Basically, he is a big target and a bit on the slow side (although he has some nice nasty attacks). I guess thats the problem?

 

[Charizard92]

Actually, Charizard is on the fast side, 7th fastest tied with Pikachu. I think the reason people think he's slow because he's a tank, where several of the slowest characters are located, so that could lead to a misunderstanding. Say, can you tell me how you provide links to other posts so I don't look like I'm an idiot, I just don't have a complete grasp on tech thats all.

 

[hippochinfat!!]

Because they're one of em' crazy teenagers with their Hip hop and crazy ring tones. **** kids.

By the way, Charizard is slightly faster then Pikachu.

 

[Charizard92]

I rest my case, Charizard's only reasonable con is the big size (and the chain grab which annoys other characters too).

 

[JJBro1]

Charizard is my fav video game character period. Hes my friggin main man.

 

[poncho_mcshoe]

Charizard is the 7th fastest smash character? I can make up statistics too. If you want to prove that Charizard is a powerful character, you should form your argument more like this:
"BOULDER! Boulder boulder boulder boulder. Boulder."

 

[chubas]

By the way, Charizard is slightly faster then Pikachu.

Running. I'd hate to say it, but Pikachu is way faster in everything else. But not as powerful.

I don't think Char sucks. I think people are not customed to heavy, slow characters, so they cannot find all the goodness in it. Curiosly, I've heard more complains of Ivysaur than Char (Ivysaur wasn't made for the average player, seriously).

Actually, PT is seen overall as a bad character by people who have not played it. And I love to prove them wrong.

 

[Kemious]

Charizard is the 7th fastest smash character? I can make up statistics too. If you want to prove that Charizard is a powerful character, you should form your argument more like this:
"BOULDER! Boulder boulder boulder boulder. Boulder."

Hes referring to movement speed , dashing if you will. You probably mistook it for attack speed

 

[JiangWei23]

In order of favorites, for me it used to be Squirtle > Ivysaur > Charizard. I'd do the standard rack up damage with Squirtle, switch to Ivysaur to hopefully land a kill, and switch to Charizard when damage was high. I was never wieldy with Charizard, and more often than not when I got to him I died quickly.

That is, until I forgot to pick Squirtle when I chose PT, and started off with Charizard. Instead of switching to Squirtle immediately, I decided I'd try him out.

Wow. I knocked off two stocks with Charizard (by the second he was fatigued!) before needing to switch to Squritle, who then mopped up the match. SH Rock Smashes, Flamethrowers, Utilts, I was just tossing them out left and right. My respect for Charizard went up immensely that day.

Also, there is nothing more satisfying than landing a KO with Fly, especially early on in a match. <3

 

[infernovia]

lol, I said he is a bit slow, not that he is ganon. I already know about his awesome dash speed, his dtilt. But there are equal amount of moves that have huge lag and start up time. Besides, I just wanted to point out his badpoints since that is what you asked for.

And yeah, his fly is awesome. Its always fun when people come to spike you and totally set themselves up thanks to your fat frames in fly.

 

[OriginalVillain]

My opinion on PK trainer's team goes Squirtle>Charizard>Ivysaur. Sure Ivy has good killing ability and range, but he's just so slow and awkward, plus his recovery sucks.

Charizard is really great tho due to his good aerials and high power, and although he's slow, he's heavy and has great recovery. I usually play with Squirtle to get damage up and then finish with Ivysaur or Charizard, and if my damage is too high I just play with Charizard.

 

[goodoldganon]

I'm not a PKMN Trainer main or even an avid player, but Charizard is the man! When I get PKMN Trainer as a random character in our 4 player FFAs I always play exclusively as the big guy. I'm glad my friends aren't jerks because they let me change without interference.

 

[Charizard92]

Wow, There are really a lot of people who back my case. But alas, I do not really see the lag speed of Charizard's moves. And even if that was huge by others standards, other non tank characters do have lag time on their moves, and if you want to be picky about it, even Squirtle would technically have slow speed on some of his moves, everyone does. Besides, for a tank (and non tanks) Charizard has some fast moves, compare the time it takes to unleash rock smash to that of several special and smash moves (eg. the falcon punch or Bowser's side smash). Whenever I see Charizard preform a smash attack, it looks like it is around as fast as Ivysaur's. He is clearly better in almost every aspect to almost every other Tank.

 

[infernovia]

Ike is probably better as a tank compared to Charizard. Now that guy has some heavy hits, although his recovery is a sore point. Also, he is incredibly quick if you play him right.

:/ I am just saying, Fsmash is really slow. Ftilt is fast but still has punishable lag. Flamethrower comes out pretty slowly. Dair, Nair depending on what you are doing. He is just not a fast player and some people just do not enjoy slow characters. Compare to squirtle where the only move you really think is slow is Usmash and Fsmash and almost all attacks come out instantaneously. Charizards just requires a bit more mindgames to land his move.

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

I find Charizard is absolutely excellent as a character. His grabbing game is terriffic. Side and up throw do so much damage for something that can grab you from half way across the stage.

I once played very defensively and got in about 5 grabs on my opponent before he hit me. I would just stand there and predict his approach, then grab him during the openings. XD

Charizard is amazing.

 

[Ray_Renarth]

Coming from personal experience, before I understood how to use the Pokemon Change effectively, I always viewed Charizard as being the least reliable of the three Pokemon. Yet when it came to fighting an Olimar, I just had so much trouble getting past his defenses with Squirtle or Ivysaur. All of a sudden I try out Charizard, and he starts to do a fantastic job against Olimar, burning his Pikmin with flamethrower and using huge area attacks which strike all around him, in addition to being very difficult to K.O due to his weight. Suddenly a character which I once thought was the least reliable suddenly became my most powerful Pokemon in this specific match-up.



`Quoted from the guide.

 

[Charizard92]

For some reason I hear this often, mainly because it's true. The best way to see any Pokemon's potential on the P. Trainer's team you have to face an opponent that is causing the other two to rip apart a wall (metaphorically of course, Squirtle would erode the **** out of a wall). And again, Charizard is good at the wait to come then tear apart strategy, but he can play the close the gap game too, he just has to rip the opponent apart with either way. Oh yeah, Charizard's moves can be fast if you use him right too. (by the way, all the Pokemon on P Trainer's team [along with Lucario] have an 87.5% chance of being male, so I refer to all of them as male)

 

[PkTrainerCris]

Charizard is the man (or the dragon?)!!!! I mean, come on, hes got excellent range, very good grab range, fast moves that are very powerfull too( poor pikmin, they dont even last two seconds on my char when i start jabbing and tilting like crazy XDXDXD ) , is hard to push him out the stage and hes got great recovery and a awsome glinding attack( in therms of nockback and priority) , but of course, he has some trouble too, he feels very slugish when walking and falling, and the most important , he is such a BIG target, once you miss an attack, mess up at spacing, or do anything that leaves zard open , its almost sure you are gonna get hit, and that could lead into a combo or anything that makes you lose control of your pokemon (thats why i always keep moving and atacking like crazy XDXD , that too confuses your oponnent) so i think that people use zard the best or the worst depending on their way to play, and it seems like a lot of people doesnt play zard very well, they just play him at high damage and wait for the chance of maybe landing a ko when the oponent comes to attack you, which many times end up bad for you

 

[AnimalTaglits]

I don't know if Charizard is the best of the three but he is definitely my favorite. And he doesn't suck at all. I put my Charizard skills on the line almost everytime I play. I start with Charizard and if I lose a stock (I ignore fatigue) I swich to Ivy so I can use Charizard again on the last stock. I just don't feel comfortable trusting the other two to win matches.

 

[Charizard92]

**** I can't explain away the size, but I can say that I clearley picked the right topic for my first thread. I guess all I needed to do to find the Charizard supporters was pretty much asking why some people have a negative (even somewhat) view of him. Not to say that I was trying to fish the fans out, I was just saying what I see for some reason, some people who can't seem to see Charizard's potential. I thank you for your support, but this thread is far from over.

 

[Mentok the Mind Taker]

Personally I think that Charizard is the only one of the three that could be broken off into his own character. He's got the recovery, defensive options, killing moves, and long *** grab range. Charizard is clearly the most versatile of the three.(Mebbe because he suits my playstyle the best lol)

 

[Charizard92]

I agree, he is very versatile, especially for a tank.

 

[slave1]

i am beginning to think that charzard for sure is the best of the three, except against someone like pit.
squirt dies too easily and ivy can get gimped so fast it is not cool.

 

[Charizard92]

So why don't the people who put Charizard at the bottom of the list see that?

 

[Leahdybug]

I dont know of anyone whos said Charizard isnt reliable. Those who do need to practice more becaus hes freaking awesome. All the negative crtisim I've seen goes towards ivy. I use to think i was great with ivy adn lowsy with Charizard. Now fighting more experienced players my Ivy game is down and charizard has sky rocketed. My favorite move in his arsenal, flamethrower Its prority is awesome. Spamming electric pikas F u eat fire!. People seme to sit in flamethrower too I have no remorese either thaey can take over 60% dmg with flamethrower if they want XD. Rocksmash is a quick second.

 

[Retro Gaming]

In general, I see all three too low on the lists, except for maybe Squirtle. Ivysaur in low tier? For shame.

 

[Charizard92]

Wait, eventually the Pokemon Trainer's team as a whole will rise on the tier list. All of them as an individual should be high tier too. But in comparison to Charizard, I have seen that Ivysaur has few negatives that has surfaced, all of which are true, while Charizard has more, and most of them are total myths. This Tread was made to dispel those myths. And it seems to be working too, in a happy thank you for helping me way.

 

[Retro Gaming]

I'm actually just going to attribute it to the fact that there aren't many Pokemon Trainers, and a lot of people don't care to learn about him. This is fine with me, if they're not prepared for a good character, all the more power to me.

PT needs one spot anyway, since you more or less have to play more than one Pokemon at some point.

 

[PkTrainerCris]

Yeah, i think the PT is a very understimated character, maybe people is too lazy to leran three characters in one, or they just are not enough versatile to play him on all his potential, and when they randomly fight P.T. they only know that zard is the tank, and they choose him only at high percents, and altought charizard is heavy and has fly, its not THAT hard to ko him, so they get killed and associate the bad image of the lost stock to zard, and they start saying taht charizard sucks

 

[Charizard92]

Yeah, that is why after each KO in a one on one I always switch. Besides, even Bowser and Dedede can be KOed at percentages below 100 which means that using Charizard only once your percentage is high is a poor idea. For that matter, every character used offensively at high percentages is a bad idea (except, if you're good, Lucario who is meant to get a wailing).

 

[Leahdybug]

Basically For me When charizard is out hes out until he dies. Which mean hes probably out for two ko's. Charizard is the man he's invincible but he can be a ***** to kill you jsut have to know what the hell your doing!

 

[goodoldganon]

Charizard is rated low because he is heavy. Unlike most of the rest of the cast, the heavy characters have lots of lag on their attacks. You can't just throw attacks out willy nilly. So, for that reason all the heavies are underrated because they take a little more time a patience to learn then someone like Meta Knight or Pit.

Charizard is a great character, but in my experience he can get zoned hard by a good camping character. I might not be playing him right, but against campers, my Charizard starts to fail.

 

[Steeler]

goodold makes a pretty good point. i think it's a combination of being a part of pt, which is a very underrated and overlooked character, and being large and susceptible to camping.

luckily you have squirtle to approach or ivy to outcamp (in some cases)

 

[Kemious]

Really it all depends on whose camping. Team starfox equals problems however any others can easily be deflected by flame thrower. I get more complaints about how Charizard is too power over squirtle now.