Who's the worst character in Smash (in your opinion)

[Mogisthelioma]

People who hate Bayonetta hate her for gameplay reasons though.

They could easily fix her gameplay and she wouldn't be the worst character in the game anymore.

You can't "fix" the fact that Dr. Mario is just Mario in an alt costume.

Some people have a stigma against Bayo for not winning the Smash Ballot. They don't understand that the ballot was not intended for Smash 4. Although I understand their frustration in not technically getting a voice in her inclusion, they hate her regardless.

 

[Arthur97]

Some people have a stigma against Bayo for not winning the Smash Ballot. They don't understand that the ballot was not intended for Smash 4. Although I understand their frustration in not technically getting a voice in her inclusion, they hate her regardless.

Well, I also don't like her for being such a poor fit and a relative nobody of a third party. I also legitimately don't like her character or her series.

 

[Crystanium]

Well, "worst" is different from "unnecessary". I'd have to add more than just one character, though. I think Dr. Mario, Young Link, and Toon Link are unnecessary, for example. In fact, I'd be in favor of Link always having a different appearance and perhaps properties for each game, provided a new Zelda game is within the time period of SSB's development. Since BotW is the current incarnation, any other incarnation is unnecessary to me.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Some people have a stigma against Bayo for not winning the Smash Ballot. They don't understand that the ballot was not intended for Smash 4.

To be fair, people don't understand because her reveal trailer specifically said otherwise, even though it was BS.

I'm not gonna hold it against people who have the wrong idea because Nintendo lied to them.

 

[Arthur97]

Well, "worst" is different from "unnecessary". I'd have to add more than just one character, though. I think Dr. Mario, Young Link, and Toon Link are unnecessary, for example. In fact, I'd be in favor of Link always having a different appearance and perhaps properties for each game, provided a new Zelda game is within the time period of SSB's development. Since BotW is the current incarnation, any other incarnation is unnecessary to me.

On the other end of that, BotW Link is so removed from the rest of the series, having just him feels more like BotW representation and not LoZ representation. Fortunately, the other Links stick closer to the roots. I'd say at least one of them is good to have if they're going to make Link so different.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

To be fair, people don't understand because her reveal trailer specifically said otherwise, even though it was BS.

I'm not gonna hold it against people who have the wrong idea because Nintendo lied to them.

That's true, Nintendo did claim that she was the world's "#1 request," which was a total joke and a lie.

 

[Arthur97]

That's true, Nintendo did claim that she was the world's "#1 request," which was a total joke and a lie.

Blame Europe. Apparently she came in first* there. Though, she may have won if just because so many people voted for stuff like Goku and Shrek.

*Ranked among realizable choices

 

[Oddball]

That's true, Nintendo did claim that she was the world's "#1 request," which was a total joke and a lie.

According to who? Nintendo never released the results of the poll. For all we know she was the top choice out of the viable options.

 

[Arthur97]

According to who? Nintendo never released the results of the poll. For all we know she was the top choice out of the viable options.

Viable being a key word there. Yes, some were likely dumb like Shrek, but they never specified what that meant. Could it just be that she was relatively easy to do taking most of her animations from her games? We don't know.

 

[TheVillagerDucky]

Palutena's moveset is kind of bland...

 

[Mariomaniac45213]

I gotta say I've warmed up to everybody on the roster except 3 and I KNOW I'm gonna offend people by saying these but here goes:

- Even though Sakurai says he isn't a joke character and an "obvious" inclusion. Sorry it's a random mook. I don't care how fun he looks to play or how creative his moveset is, it still doesn't sit right with me seeing all these big name actual characters with a generic mook. Not to mention it opens the floodgates even further than these next two did...

- Sorry he feels so out of place for me. Like his aesthetic just doesn't fit in with the rest of the cast IMO and barely has any history towards Nintendo at all. While yes Metal Gear started on Nintendo systems with the NES game but Nintendo systems have only seen a total of 3 Metal Gear games. 2 of which being ports/remakes. He feels more like a Sony character to me than a Nintendo character he also opened up the floodgates for 3rd parties in Smash which honestly I can't stand. Yes I know it was a request from Kojima his personal friend. But you can say no, if my friend asked me to jump into moving traffic with him, I would say no. Not to mention his moveset while unique in the context of Smash is pretty generic and could go to any other soldier like character with a better history with Nintendo like someone from Resident Evil perhaps like Leon S. Kennedy or Chris Redfield.

- Barely any appearances on Nintendo consoles outside of FF spin-off cameos. I can't stand Final Fantasy, he was OP in Smash 4, Another character that feels more Sony than Nintendo considering his game was the game that shifted the series away from Nintendo platforms. Not to mention while I have no proof of this am willing to bet Cloud was probably the most expensive 3rd party to get knowing how Square-Enix isn't scared to charge people premium not to mention he only has 2 FF tracks both being original pieces, Square-Enix has barely any spirits and no FF spirits that I'm aware of, Cloud wasn't even allowed to be in the Adventure mode cutscene. Makes me wish that all the money that went to Square-Enix and development time dedicated to Cloud and Midgar went to something else in Smash 4 as well as Ultimate.

Those are the only 3 characters I have a personal grudge against. While I'd prefer no 3rd parties in Smash at least all have a longer and more varied history on Nintendo platforms than the 2 I listed above.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Oh this thread isn’t full of salt at all.

I’ll never understand the Bayonetta and Cloud hatred. So what if they were good in Smash 4? Balance them going into Ultimate and there you go. No need to scream for the removal of characters just because they ended up the highest tier at the end of the cycle. They’re also not bad characters and bring some interesting play style changes to the game at least. And both were certainly decently, if not somewhat highly requested by the community.

I don’t really dislike any Smash character though. I want everyone to be there always as unrealistic as that may be.

So I’ll probably give it to Dark Pit. He’s a pretty boring Echo that didn’t have a whole lot of presence request wise (he did have some, but not a ton). Kid Icarus didn’t really need a third rep in any way regardless of how small of an addition he may be, and he’s also just not really well defined from Pit.

But if I have to accept him for his theme, then fine by me.

 

[GhostYB]

daisy. literally just why.

 

[Deleted member]

As characters, and .
As fighters,

 

[Crystanium]

On the other end of that, BotW Link is so removed from the rest of the series, having just him feels more like BotW representation and not LoZ representation. Fortunately, the other Links stick closer to the roots. I'd say at least one of them is good to have if they're going to make Link so different.

BotW Link seems fine to me.

 

[nirvanafan]

I have got to say Richter, honesty i do not really know too many people who are into Castlevania and most people I know, including myself, had no idea who Richter was when he was announced, I am okay with unknown characters since it is a good way to get people to check out a series but we already got Simon and Richter really does not seem to really add much to the table.

I would go as far to say Roy is a close second since he pretty much did the same thing in Melee but I give him a little bit of an edge since his inclusion does make a little more sense since his game was coming out soon unlike Richter since I do not believe a new Castlevania game has been announced,

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Added for promotional reasons and no one was asking for him/her. I'll give and credit. They at least had their reasons to being included.

 

[Arthur97]

BotW Link seems fine to me.

He's just too representative of one game. Yes, in the past they typically went with one design, but the Links were similar enough that he still represented the series as a whole. As much as people love BotW, they need to remember that "Link" unlike the other two, has no special title which allows the others to be more specialized.

 

[Apollo500]

Corrin is one of my least favourite characters in all fiction. Not because of Smash, but because of Fates... I don't hate many things, but Fire Emblem Fates is one of those things.

 

[Rocketjay8]

He's just too representative of one game. Yes, in the past they typically went with one design, but the Links were similar enough that he still represented the series as a whole. As much as people love BotW, they need to remember that "Link" unlike the other two, has no special title which allows the others to be more specialized.

Breath of the Wild changed a lot of the Zelda formula so I think it is really fitting that Link changes so much.

I do like most of his changes in Ultimate. He has a better boomerang, he can actually punish shields now that he lost the Hookshot, and his Remote Bombs look so good for edge-guarding.

 

[Arthur97]

Breath of the Wild changed a lot of the Zelda formula so I think it is really fitting that Link changes so much.

I do like most of his changes in Ultimate. He has a better boomerang, he can actually punish shields now that he lost the Hookshot, and his Remote Bombs look so good for edge-guarding.

Hopefully it doesn't change too much, but in any case, he is no longer representative of the series. This Link acts like one of the marginal Links. He is essentially a Toon Link at this point.

 

[Crystanium]

He's just too representative of one game. Yes, in the past they typically went with one design, but the Links were similar enough that he still represented the series as a whole. As much as people love BotW, they need to remember that "Link" unlike the other two, has no special title which allows the others to be more specialized.

BotW Link is a champion, which sets him apart from the others in that game. As far as I'm aware, the whole "Hero of x" became a recurring theme after OoT. You had Hero of Seasons and Ages, Hero of Winds, &c. BotW Link may informally be called Hero of the Wild. Now I'm thinking of Princess Mononoke.

 

[Arthur97]

BotW Link is a champion, which sets him apart from the others in that game. As far as I'm aware, the whole "Hero of x" became a recurring theme after OoT. You had Hero of Seasons and Ages, Hero of Winds, &c. BotW Link may informally be called Hero of the Wild. Now I'm thinking of Princess Mononoke.

Not...what I meant. I meant the "Young" and "Toon" monikers.

 

[RPGsFTW]

I am heavily in the opinion that Fire Emblem and Pokemon are the two worst represented franchises in all of Smash Bros. When you look at the characters each series has in Smash, account for their important and popularity (to an extent), they are just a mess. It's no wonder why people get mad looking at all of the different "Marths" because they don't recognize the character.

With that being said, I think Fire Emblem should look more like this:

- Marth: The hero king and first of his kind.

- Robin: The idea of a tactician was BRILLIANT and similar to the Pokemon Trainer. It doesn't even have to be Robin, just a tactician.

- Ike: Though I'd personally want to argue against him, he seems to be popular even if his games weren't considered, last I checked, good sellers. Also fights different from Marth, more so than Roy does, like the Hero class.

- Hector: The weapon variety we both deserve and need in Smash, plus being one of the most wanted main Lords in a FE game. Also, belongs to the first FE game brought over to the West.


Those four alone are probably more than enough to represent Fire Emblem honestly and fairly though if I'd consider ANY more I think Anna/Emphraim would be good potential candidates. Anna has existed throughout several Fire Emblem titles in many roles, even playing the role of main character in FE Heroes, to an extent, and has the ability to use practically any weapon (good for the variety we need). Emphraim is less important, I'd say, but is still very recognizable alongside the main Lords from 7, as his game, The Sacred Stones (FE 8), also came to the West and was, at the time, baby's first Fire Emblem.

Now when it comes to Pokemon, semantically, a lot of them are literally NO DIFFERENT than the Piranha Plant, that being that Pokemon exist as generic species minus the select few legendaries and what not. That being said, I think Pokemon's roster is better represented with:

- Pikachu: The poster child of the series and one of the most recognizable Pokemon.

- Mewtwo: Pretty much THE legendary when it comes to Pokemon.

- Pokemon Trainer: BRILLIANT character design that honestly represents what it feels like to have played the Pokemon games suuuper well. Honestly the BEST Pokemon representative in my eyes.


Similar to Fire Emblem I honestly don't feel like Pokemon really NEEDS more than those mentioned above to be represented well. The only others that already exist in Smash that I think would be appropriate are more so fitting based on popularity and not necessarily importance, such as Greninja, who is one of, if not the most popular Pokemon amongst children.

TL;DR

WITH ALL OF THAT OUT OF THE WAY: A lot of characters are awful and don't fit in Smash. I think the biggest offender, and my choice, is Doctor Mario. He's among the few characters (like Samus) to just be wearing a different outfit. He shouldn't exist as a separate character from Mario. Period. Is he fun and do I like playing him? Yes, but that doesn't make up for the fact that he should solely be an alternate costume. Even Samus makes more sense with a different moveset inside/outside of her suit.

 

[Zenithvox]

I honestly still can't understand why melee / brawl Ice Climbers are still legal. They legit have the easiest / most broken infinate in the entire series. A lot of people say that "wobbling is difficult" but from my experience it is a joke. It took me around 5 minutes to learn how to wobble from somebody who never played smash Bros before.

It's literally the equivalent with camping ledges with jiggly. I don't get how anybody believes it's an actual strategy in the game. And it's the main reason I never play brawl anymore. I'm just glad that they hopefully fixed wobbling in smash U

 

[Idon]

I honestly still can't understand why melee / brawl Ice Climbers are still legal. They legit have the easiest / most broken infinate in the entire series. A lot of people say that "wobbling is difficult" but from my experience it is a joke. It took me around 5 minutes to learn how to wobble from somebody who never played smash Bros before.

It's literally the equivalent with camping ledges with jiggly. I don't get how anybody believes it's an actual strategy in the game. And it's the main reason I never play brawl anymore. I'm just glad that they hopefully fixed wobbling in smash U

Well you're in luck because due to both universal changes and changes specific to ICies, it's not possible anymore.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

I honestly still can't understand why melee / brawl Ice Climbers are still legal. They legit have the easiest / most broken infinate in the entire series. A lot of people say that "wobbling is difficult" but from my experience it is a joke. It took me around 5 minutes to learn how to wobble from somebody who never played smash Bros before.

It's literally the equivalent with camping ledges with jiggly. I don't get how anybody believes it's an actual strategy in the game. And it's the main reason I never play brawl anymore. I'm just glad that they hopefully fixed wobbling in smash U

Because if they got banned, that would mean banning Fox/Falco, which would have people lose it completely.

As for Brawl, I see your point. But it's Brawl....just play Smash 4 for the next week.

 

[Crystanium]

Not...what I meant. I meant the "Young" and "Toon" monikers.

Fun fact: Young Link in Majora's Mask was simply called Link. :D

 

[Arthur97]

Fun fact: Young Link in Majora's Mask was simply called Link. :D

I'm still not sure if you got my point.

 

[Zenithvox]

Because if they got banned, that would mean banning Fox/Falco, which would have people lose it completely.

As for Brawl, I see your point. But it's Brawl....just play Smash 4 for the next week.

How would banning wobbling hurt fox and falco in any way? Playing fox and falco at least take some semblance of skill / practice.
The only amount of skill you need to wobble is to get one grab

 

[Terywj [태리]]

I love the Fire Emblem series but it's definitely overrepresented. I wish that they would complete the weapon triangle with an axe and lance user. Keeping Marth, Ike, Robin, and Corrin (the latter two for their unorthodox styles) and then Hector for axes and a medium-speed lance user. Ephraim is the obvious choice but I dunno, I could trade Ike out for Nephenee as the PoR/RD representative.

 

[ARAblazer]

I really like Dark Pit in Uprising, but as an echo fighter he seems like a waste of potential in Smash. I think if he used a unique moveset less people would be salty about him

Same, really.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

How would banning wobbling hurt fox and falco in any way? Playing fox and falco at least take some semblance of skill / practice.
The only amount of skill you need to wobble is to get one grab

Because Fox and Falco are higher up on the tier list. it wouldn't make sense to ban one character but not other characters who are arguably better and more OP.

 

[Crystanium]

I'm still not sure if you got my point.

I think I have. Unless you wish to tell me why previous Links without "Young" or "Toon" didn't bother you. You appear to be focused on SSB, not the Zelda games.

 

[Arthur97]

I think I have. Unless you wish to tell me why previous Links without "Young" or "Toon" didn't bother you. You appear to be focused on SSB, not the Zelda games.

No, the past normal Links did a good enough job of just being Link with a particular design. This new Link is more like Toon Link in that he represents one game, not the franchise (yes, Toon Link can represent several, but he's only really taking from Wind Waker). The new Link is far too specialized because they incorporated too much of a game which does not represent the whole series.

 

[Idon]

No, the past normal Links did a good enough job of just being Link with a particular design. This new Link is more like Toon Link in that he represents one game, not the franchise (yes, Toon Link can represent several, but he's only really taking from Wind Waker). The new Link is far too specialized because they incorporated too much of a game which does not represent the whole series.

I wish there were alt costumes and such to at least get the appearance down.

That said, the only move that's really affective gameplay wise is the remote bomb, which is slightly above the level of the gale boomerang.

But yeah, I totally agree. Link's going to go back to wearing green sooner or later and when that happens this BotW-centric right-handed sci-fi Link is going to look pretty weird.

 

[sanicdude246]

Tbh samus got a bunch of nerfs so rip in peace brah

 

[EricTheGamerman]

No, the past normal Links did a good enough job of just being Link with a particular design. This new Link is more like Toon Link in that he represents one game, not the franchise (yes, Toon Link can represent several, but he's only really taking from Wind Waker). The new Link is far too specialized because they incorporated too much of a game which does not represent the whole series.

Is that not the point of the Zelda representation in this game though? When you have three Links like we do, I imagine it's better to make them define specific eras rather than have one Link be a total representative and the other two specific. They also didn't really change his move set up all the much it seems to me... (It's possible he's much more different than I realize, but from what I've seen at least, I'm making that call).

Especially when I don't think they went nearly as far as they should have in representing BOTW haha.

 

[LoZ00]

I'd say that my least favorite character: he comes from a PS1 game, is another generic swordfighter, is broken and is the least Nintendo character of the bunch.

 

[Arthur97]

Is that not the point of the Zelda representation in this game though? When you have three Links like we do, I imagine it's better to make them define specific eras rather than have one Link be a total representative and the other two specific. They also didn't really change his move set up all the much it seems to me... (It's possible he's much more different than I realize, but from what I've seen at least, I'm making that call).

Especially when I don't think they went nearly as far as they should have in representing BOTW haha.

Well, clearly, as BotW is apparently the best game ever, Link should only represent it apparently. Except, that's not how Link, just plain Link should work. This is essentially wild Link, we have no real default Link in this game.