Who's Canonically the Strongest Character in Smash?

[NessAtc.]

So we could continue to talk about Sonic vs Rosalina vs Shulk. The three that obviously fit into the god tier, but I rather talk about who's top of the tier below them.

I'm gonna say kirby over samus because he can realistically negate most of her abilities by swallowing them, he is durable as all hell, and if you get swallowed by him its GG.

yeah, pretty much anybody that ISN'T gigantic is going to get swallowed instantly by Kirby
For gigantic guys? Kirby has other methods. Realistically, if he copied Samus, he'd probably be able to defeat most of the gigantic Metroid bosses.

 

[ChikoLad]

Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles are the result of cartridge size limitations. Sonic 3 was meant to be one entity, but it was split in half due to technical restraints. Sonic 3&K is the same thing as the two separate games, except with the connecting piece between them. The standalone ending for Sonic 3 was created because they were split (it wouldn't be a good ending if you just fell like in the "complete" version and the game ended, after all), and they were split due to technical restraints. The canon version, as originally intended by the developers, is what eventually came to be known as "Sonic 3 & Knuckles."

I haven't found any background info for Sonic 4, but I did find that Sonic News Network states that the game takes place "sometime after Sonic the Hedgehog 3 & Knuckles." Speaking of Sonic 4, it also has lock-on content in the form of Episode Metal, which explains the gap between Metal Sonic in Sonic CD and in Episode II. Like S3&K, Episode Metal explains something that went unexplained in canon. Neither are contradicted, since Episode Metal has several connections to Sonic 4, and S3&K is literally the same thing that's in Sonic 3 and & Knuckles, except in one game, as well as added storyline connections. The actual Word of God doesn't contradict the world that He is creator of. The interview does contradict the thing Iizuka created, that thing being Hyper Sonic.

Episode Metal is different in that the lock on content is marketed as a story relevant thing.

I'm well aware S3&K was originally the vision for Sonic 3. But something being considered during development does not mean it is canon. Rosalina was at one point a blood relative of Princess Peach in development, but that does not make it canon, because the idea was scrapped, and the developers went out of their way to confirm this. Just like what happened with S3&K initially being intended as Sonic 3, the idea being scrapped and somewhat revived, but still having the developers confirm it being non-canon.

Also, S3&K did not fill any gaps. S3 ended with Sonic falling back down to Angel Island. S&K begins with him landing. The S&K manual also clears things up just fine in case you could not come to the obvious conclusion. And then Knuckles' story takes place after Sonic's.

So we could continue to talk about Sonic vs Rosalina vs Shulk. The three that obviously fit into the god tier, but I rather talk about who's top of the tier below them.

I'm gonna say kirby over samus because he can realistically negate most of her abilities by swallowing them, he is durable as all hell, and if you get swallowed by him its GG.

Sonic would be SS tier along with Kirby. Rosalina and Shulk have seemingly limitless potential. Kirby and Sonic are full of potential too. But they also have some well defined limits.

 

[Etc_Guy]

yeah, pretty much anybody that ISN'T gigantic is going to get swallowed instantly by Kirby
For gigantic guys? Kirby has other methods. Realistically, if he copied Samus, he'd probably be able to defeat most of the gigantic Metroid bosses.

What the people who've been final or normal bosses? In the Kirby series, you've never able to eat a boss even when defeated. (Minibosses could.)

So ,,,, (He could be eaten in the Anime and BitF), and maybe even because of DK Junior.

 

[kyxsune]

She did not see it ending this way

 

[Munomario777]

Episode Metal is different in that the lock on content is marketed as a story relevant thing.

I'm well aware S3&K was originally the vision for Sonic 3. But something being considered during development does not mean it is canon. Rosalina was at one point a blood relative of Princess Peach in development, but that does not make it canon, because the idea was scrapped, and the developers went out of their way to confirm this. Just like what happened with S3&K initially being intended as Sonic 3, the idea being scrapped and somewhat revived, but still having the developers confirm it being non-canon.

Also, S3&K did not fill any gaps. S3 ended with Sonic falling back down to Angel Island. S&K begins with him landing. The S&K manual also clears things up just fine in case you could not come to the obvious conclusion. And then Knuckles' story takes place after Sonic's.

So, apparently we're not moving on.

Episode Metal isn't marketed as story relevant content any more than 3&K is. They're both equally relevant to the stories of the respective games, filling in gaps that were originally left unanswered, but more on that later.

(Not using this as an argument or anything, but there's a pretty compelling case that Rosalina is Peach's daughter from an alternate cycle of the universe in a Game Theory episode. It's a really interesting watch; I recommend checking it out. Man, how many times is that show gonna come up in this thread? )

Actually, what you're describing is Sonic 3 & Knuckles' version of it. Sonic & Knuckles begins with Sonic just standing at the start of Mushroom Hill, while Sonic falls from the Death Egg in the locked-on version. Also, I read the & Knuckles manual, and it states that the Death Egg's explosion sent him down into Mushroom Hill, which makes more sense with the locked-on version, since we can see Sonic descending down from the Death Egg in 3&K. Anyway, I'm suggesting again that we drop it and discuss the topic at hand, since, again, I doubt either of us will convince the other at this rate. If you don't this time, I will.

 

[ChikoLad]

So, apparently we're not moving on.

Episode Metal isn't marketed as story relevant content any more than 3&K is. They're both equally relevant to the stories of the respective games, filling in gaps that were originally left unanswered, but more on that later.

(Not using this as an argument or anything, but there's a pretty compelling case that Rosalina is Peach's daughter from an alternate cycle of the universe in a Game Theory episode. It's a really interesting watch; I recommend checking it out. Man, how many times is that show gonna come up in this thread? )

Actually, what you're describing is Sonic 3 & Knuckles' version of it. Sonic & Knuckles begins with Sonic just standing at the start of Mushroom Hill, while Sonic falls from the Death Egg in the locked-on version. Also, I read the & Knuckles manual, and it states that the Death Egg's explosion sent him down into Mushroom Hill, which makes more sense with the locked-on version, since we can see Sonic descending down from the Death Egg in 3&K. Anyway, I'm suggesting again that we drop it and discuss the topic at hand, since, again, I doubt either of us will convince the other at this rate. If you don't this time, I will.

What I meant was that & Knuckles manual explained it, therefore S3&K didn't fill any blank. Plus, if Sonic 3 ended with him falling, it's not hard to come to the conclusion that he landed in Mushroom Hill. We don't need everything spoonfed.

Also, Episode Metal was marketed very directly as being for story. It didn't offer much content besides that either.

And the Game Theory episode on Rosalina is utter trash and is not compelling in the slightest. It goes out of it's way to contradict and ignore facts to prove it's point. Though it's neither here or there.

 

[Munomario777]

What I meant was that & Knuckles manual explained it, therefore S3&K didn't fill any blank. Plus, if Sonic 3 ended with him falling, it's not hard to come to the conclusion that he landed in Mushroom Hill. We don't need everything spoonfed.

Also, Episode Metal was marketed very directly as being for story. It didn't offer much content besides that either.

And the Game Theory episode on Rosalina is utter trash and is not compelling in the slightest. It goes out of it's way to contradict and ignore facts to prove it's point. Though it's neither here or there.

Well, I am a man of my word. *moves on to other topics*

On the topic of Kirby's Inhale, 's running speed may be able to escape the vortex, depending on how powerful/fast it is.

 

[Etc_Guy]

What I meant was that & Knuckles manual explained it, therefore S3&K didn't fill any blank. Plus, if Sonic 3 ended with him falling, it's not hard to come to the conclusion that he landed in Mushroom Hill. We don't need everything spoonfed.

Also, Episode Metal was marketed very directly as being for story. It didn't offer much content besides that either.

And the Game Theory episode on Rosalina is utter trash and is not compelling in the slightest. It goes out of it's way to contradict and ignore facts to prove it's point. Though it's neither here or there.

I don't know if you know this buuuuut........ is suppose to be mysterious so no one will ever know her powers. Saying that S3&K wasn't canon isn't helping.

The real question for the cast is do they have the courage and smarts to go against the Kroolist that is Rool? Some might think they do, but can they out fox a wacky psycho?

will laugh at a hunter with a fully loaded gun so why is that a good idea?

and have been kaptured by once so KKR will have no trouble katching them if and had twice.

and have been kidnapped by and many times now, but torturing them is a new level of wrong.

has been trapped by too.

While I haven't played many Kirby games or watched the anime, I've heard isn't too bright and some of Rool's minions are in eatable size, he could just bust out and Zinger, DKC's equivalent to a Gordo.

I only used examples that I know about so I didn't guess.

 

[kyxsune]

I don't know if you know this buuuuut........ is suppose to be mysterious so no one will ever know her powers. Saying that S3&K wasn't canon isn't helping.

The real question for the cast is do they have the courage and smarts to go against the Kroolist that is Rool? Some might think they do, but can they out fox a wacky psycho?

will laugh at a hunter with a fully loaded gun so why is that a good idea?

and have been kaptured by once so KKR will have no trouble katching them if and had twice.

and have been kidnapped by and many times now, but torturing them is a new level of wrong.

has been trapped by too.

While I haven't played many Kirby games or watched the anime, I've heard isn't too bright and some of Rool's minions are in eatable size, he could just bust out and Zinger, DKC's equivalent to a Gordo.

I only used examples that I know about so I didn't guess.

Playing along....K rool is wayyy too big for kirby too swallow...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EePxnbmwHE

 

[Etc_Guy]

Playing along....K rool is wayyy too big for kirby too swallow...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EePxnbmwHE

I knew that since not only does he play final boss a lot, he can scale size behind the scenes like Bowser does.

 

[Ephemiel]

How many of your 334 messages involve spamming about KKR? It's honestly getting irritating.

Anyway, in terms of Kirby, doesn't he have a more powerful suction in the last Kirby game for 3DS? I forgot the name but i do remember you could inhale bigger enemies there.

 

[Etc_Guy]

How many of your 334 messages involve spamming about KKR? It's honestly getting irritating.

Anyway, in terms of Kirby, doesn't he have a more powerful suction in the last Kirby game for 3DS? I forgot the name but i do remember you could inhale bigger enemies there.

Sorry, i got carried away and figured out that the Kongs computation is and , cause pig person that never served . Porky and K. Rool are similar in what they do in their games. The main difference is how they fight as Rabbidluigi says at number 9 of this video:

Other than that i getting Earthbound this Christmas to see Porky's true colors myself.

 

[Weavile's Wrath]

How many of your 334 messages involve spamming about KKR? It's honestly getting irritating.

Anyway, in terms of Kirby, doesn't he have a more powerful suction in the last Kirby game for 3DS? I forgot the name but i do remember you could inhale bigger enemies there.

Yes, Hypernova. I did the math(I believe two pages earlier) that Kirby with Hypernova swallows the games final boss, who is over 7 feet tall(7 feet 6 inches if I remember my calculations correctly). This should be enough to swallow Samus whole.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I don't know why Rosalina is considered God-tier.

Yes, she is mysterious, but that doesn't mean she's super powerful.

The only time she has extraordinary power is when she has her Comet Observatory, and that's only when it's powered up by Mario getting all the stars.

If she can't power up the Observatory at least a little by herself, then she doesn't have this god-like power mentioned here.

Meanwhile, Bowser got some Star Power himself and is making a whole freaking Galaxy.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I don't know why Rosalina is considered God-tier.

Yes, she is mysterious, but that doesn't mean she's super powerful.

The only time she has extraordinary power is when she has her Comet Observatory, and that's only when it's powered up by Mario getting all the stars.

If she can't power up the Observatory at least a little by herself, then she doesn't have this god-like power mentioned here.

Meanwhile, Bowser got some Star Power himself and is making a whole freaking Galaxy.

Agreed, the real power with Rosalina are with the Lumas. These things can create plantes, galaxies and even a FRIGGIN UNIVERSE!!!!

But she is their "mother", which may be why people claim she is very powerful.

 

[Munomario777]

Agreed, the real power with Rosalina are with the Lumas. These things can create plantes, galaxies and even a FRIGGIN UNIVERSE!!!!

But she is their "mother", which may be why people claim she is very powerful.

In addition, the character in Smash is Rosalina and Luma, so technically speaking, Rosalina and the Lumas are in this together.

 

[ChikoLad]

I don't know why Rosalina is considered God-tier.

Yes, she is mysterious, but that doesn't mean she's super powerful.

The only time she has extraordinary power is when she has her Comet Observatory, and that's only when it's powered up by Mario getting all the stars.

If she can't power up the Observatory at least a little by herself, then she doesn't have this god-like power mentioned here.

Meanwhile, Bowser got some Star Power himself and is making a whole freaking Galaxy.

Except this has already been gone over countless times - it was all a bad case of gameplay-story segregation. This is the same reason why Peach is still being kidnapped in so many games, even though she is well capable of defending herself (and eve had an entire game to herself where she did just that).

Also, people forget that Bowser didn't even raid the Comet Observatory. He used a magnet, so to speak, to absorb the Power Stars from it, from a great distance. And still didn't raid it even then.

By contrast, Bowser has no problem raiding an entire kingdom. So if he's afraid to raid the Comet Observatory, and not the Mushroom Kingdom, that says a lot about what he himself thinks of Rosalina.

Agreed, the real power with Rosalina are with the Lumas. These things can create plantes, galaxies and even a FRIGGIN UNIVERSE!!!!

But she is their "mother", which may be why people claim she is very powerful.

Rosalina's power is not with the Lumas, their power is with her, hence she is their mother figure. She needs to raise them to let them become what they wish, and it's already been established that it was Rosalina alone that fixed the universe in the ending of Galaxy.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Agreed, the real power with Rosalina are with the Lumas. These things can create plantes, galaxies and even a FRIGGIN UNIVERSE!!!!

But she is their "mother", which may be why people claim she is very powerful.

Exactly.
We need to remember that Rosalina was a normal, human girl *cough*Peach'sdaughter*cough*, and only became "powerful" when the Lumas took her in as their mother.

Rosalina is "powerful" in the same way that a general in a war is. They gain their power from the powerful people they command.

Just take at Rosalina in 3D World. Just as powerful as the main 4.
Yes, this was for gameplay purposes, but it doesn't really matter. They made her playable without the Lumas in 3D Worlds so she would be just the same as the Bros., Peach, and Toad.

Except this has already been gone over countless times - it was all a bad case of gameplay-story segregation. This is the same reason why Peach is still being kidnapped in so many games, even though she is well capable of defending herself (and eve had an entire game to herself where she did just that).

Also, people forget that Bowser didn't even raid the Comet Observatory. He used a magnet, so to speak, to absorb the Power Stars from it, from a great distance. And still didn't raid it even then.

To be honest, if I were Bowser, I would have used a magnet because it was so far away. Also because I don't know what's out there.

But as for the Kingdom, I would have had to problem attempt a raid, since I've been successful several times before.

I also wouldn't know who the heck Rosalina is, due to no prior experience with her. All I would know is that there's energy there that I need, and there are life forms that may or may not be able to defeat me.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Exactly.
We need to remember that Rosalina was a normal, human girl *cough*Peach'sdaughter*cough*

Somebody's watching Game Theory!!

But seriously dude, that's *cough*Rosalina'smother*cough* thing is just a theory......

 

[Munomario777]

Somebody's watching Game Theory!!

But seriously dude, that's *cough*Rosalina'smother*cough* thing is just a theory......

A Game Theory! Thanks for-- okay, I'll stop.

There is quite a bit of evidence behind that episode, though. I'd definitely recommend anyone who hasn't seen it to give it a watch.

 

[ChikoLad]

Exactly.
We need to remember that Rosalina was a normal, human girl *cough*Peach'sdaughter*cough*, and only became "powerful" when the Lumas took her in as their mother.

Rosalina is "powerful" in the same way that a general in a war is. They gain their power from the powerful people they command.

Just take at Rosalina in 3D World. Just as powerful as the main 4.
Yes, this was for gameplay purposes, but it doesn't really matter. They made her playable without the Lumas in 3D Worlds so she would be just the same as the Bros., Peach, and Toad.


To be honest, if I were Bowser, I would have used a magnet because it was so far away. Also because I don't know what's out there.

But as for the Kingdom, I would have had to problem attempt a raid, since I've been successful several times before.

I also wouldn't know who the heck Rosalina is, due to no prior experience with her. All I would know is that there's energy there that I need, and there are life forms that may or may not be able to defeat me.

Rosalina is not Peach's daughter (as I said before, the Game Theory episode on her is complete trash and you have no place making any judgements on Rosalina's character if you buy that drivel, as it proves you know jack about the character), and she is not a normal human as she is unaccountably old, and has all of these other powers I listed that are not something a normal human uses (I certainly do not teleport to space and cause a shower of shooting stars just to celebrate a victory in golf).

Lumas have never been the source of her power, quit stating that. You keep stating that and have not provided a single piece of evidence in favour of it.

Also Rosalina is still leagues better than the other characters in 3D World. Any speedrunner of the game will tell you that she can traverse levels far more quickly than the other characters in the game, and she is the only character to have a dedicated, easy to use attack in her default form.

Rosalina is a god-like being, and it's been proven countless times in this thread. You being a contrarian for the sake of it does not change this, you are bringing up bad points that have already been shot down.

Also, Bowser had to have known who Rosalina was (she is basically a lady of legend, so it's likely he heard of her that way) if he stole power from the Observatory at all. Otherwise, how would he know it exists?

There is quite a bit of evidence behind that episode, though. I'd definitely recommend anyone who hasn't seen it to give it a watch.

No, there really isn't. It goes out of it's way to ignore basic facts, and has the audacity to say anyone who has any evidence against it (and anyone who had their brain at least half switched on while watching the episodes would have plenty of damning evidence against the episode) is stupid.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Well, h

A Game Theory! Thanks for-- okay, I'll stop.

There is quite a bit of evidence behind that episode, though. I'd definitely recommend anyone who hasn't seen it to give it a watch.

Or anything from the series!

Rosalina is not Peach's daughter (as I said before, the Game Theory episode on her is complete trash and you have no place making any judgements on Rosalina's character if you buy that drivel, as it proves you know jack about the character), and she is not a normal human as she is unaccountably old, and has all of these other powers I listed that are not something a normal human uses (I certainly do not teleport to space and cause a shower of shooting stars just to celebrate a victory in golf).

Lumas have never been the source of her power, quit stating that. You keep stating that and have not provided a single piece of evidence in favour of it.

Also Rosalina is still leagues better than the other characters in 3D World. Any speedrunner of the game will tell you that she can traverse levels far more quickly than the other characters in the game, and she is the only character to have a dedicated, easy to use attack in her default form.

Rosalina is a god-like being, and it's been proven countless times in this thread. You being a contrarian for the sake of it does not change this, you are bringing up bad points that have already been shot down.

Also, Bowser had to have known who Rosalina was (she is basically a lady of legend, so it's likely he heard of her that way) if he stole power from the Observatory at all. Otherwise, how would he know it exists?

This. But I agree, Rosalina's power is in fact, quite impressive. That shield alone (if you played SMG1 and tried to attack Rosalina, you know what I'm talking about) seems quite powerful.

 

[ChikoLad]

Or anything from the series!

The "Mario is actually faster than Sonic episode" was also complete trash, as was the three part series that started off saying that "the Wii U is the next Virtual Boy" and devolved into "GAMERS ARE A BARRIER TO INNOVATION, OOOOH WE MAKE CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENTS WE R SO GR8!!!".

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

The "Mario is actually faster than Sonic episode" was also complete trash, as was the three part series that started off saying that "the Wii U is the next Virtual Boy" and devolved into "GAMERS ARE A BARRIER TO INNOVATION, OOOOH WE MAKE CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENTS WE R SO GR8!!!".

Almost anything then........ But yeah, those were terrible

 

[Munomario777]

The "Mario is actually faster than Sonic episode" was also complete trash, as was the three part series that started off saying that "the Wii U is the next Virtual Boy" and devolved into "GAMERS ARE A BARRIER TO INNOVATION, OOOOH WE MAKE CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENTS WE R SO GR8!!!".

Yeah, and the Wario Waft episode was also based on some shaky calculations (Wario ten feet tall anyone?), but other than that, the series is usually really, really good.

No, there really isn't. It goes out of it's way to ignore basic facts, and has the audacity to say anyone who has any evidence against it (and anyone who had their brain at least half switched on while watching the episodes would have plenty of damning evidence against the episode) is stupid.

I said there was evidence behind it (which there is, such as the genetic info, the castle silhouette, Super Luigi Galaxy's ending photo, etc.). I never said that there wasn't evidence against it. There's a difference.

Also, which facts do you find it ignores, out of curiosity?

 

[ChikoLad]

Game Theory isn't as smart a show as people make it out to be. It just takes advantage of the fact that most people aren't as good at maths as MatPat, and leads them along that way. Then, people assume he knows better and is some sort of authourity. Then he goes wild with his random fanons that blatantly contradict facts and brush off ones that even he mentions that contradict his point (like the Rosalina episode), calls them theories, and people accept them as canon.

Most Game Theories are either complete trash, or are solid, but unimpressive deductions that any fan could come up with ("Who is the Strongest Link?" comes to mind).

I'll give MatPat the "Mario is Mental" episode (though it is not perfect and is by no means canon), as well as that one about that online game I can't remember the name of, and the PewDiePie one.

Pretty much any other episode fits under the former categories I listed.

It also does not help that MatPat himself is actually really egotistical (and it shows in his videos, especially the end of the Rosalina one), and people who have met him at conventions and such have said he's generally quite mean and disrespectful to his own fans.

Gaijin Goombah is the much better educational gaming channel, and has much more solid evidence behind his points. I don't always agree with him, but he is far more respectful. His points also have more relevance, as culture in gaming is way more important than making the sick notion that Luigi and Peach ****ed and gave birth to Rosalina (especially since Luigi did have an implied crush on Rosalina in Galaxy).

 

[Munomario777]

Game Theory isn't as smart a show as people make it out to be. It just takes advantage of the fact that most people aren't as good at maths as MatPat, and leads them along that way. Then, people assume he knows better and is some sort of authourity. Then he goes wild with his random fanons that blatantly contradict facts and brush off ones that even he mentions that contradict his point (like the Rosalina episode), calls them theories, and people accept them as canon.

Most Game Theories are either complete trash, or are solid, but unimpressive deductions that any fan could come up with ("Who is the Strongest Link?" comes to mind).

I'll give MatPat the "Mario is Mental" episode (though it is not perfect and is by no means canon), as well as that one about that online game I can't remember the name of, and the PewDiePie one.

Pretty much any other episode fits under the former categories I listed.

It also does not help that MatPat himself is actually really egotistical (and it shows in his videos, especially the end of the Rosalina one), and people who have met him at conventions and such have said he's generally quite mean and disrespectful to his own fans.

Gaijin Goombah is the much better educational gaming channel, and has much more solid evidence behind his points. I don't always agree with him, but he is far more respectful. His points also have more relevance, as culture in gaming is way more important than making the sick notion that Luigi and Peach ****ed and gave birth to Rosalina (especially since Luigi did have an implied crush on Rosalina in Galaxy).

I'm not going to go off-topic here. I'm just going to say this: I enjoy watching Game Theory, and find it to be good entertainment. If people take his self-proclaimed "just theories" as canon, that's their fault. I, for one, don't. Also, I don't see how speculation on culture in video games is more important than science and other things in video games, but whatever.

And no, I'm not continuing with this.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Rosalina is not Peach's daughter (as I said before, the Game Theory episode on her is complete trash and you have no place making any judgements on Rosalina's character if you buy that drivel, as it proves you know jack about the character),

1. I was kidding. Hence the *cough* *cough*. I don't necasarilly believe it's true, but Game Theory is just fun to watch. It's never been fact. He even says its just a theory at the end.

2. Calm the hell down. It's a video game character.

and she is not a normal human as she is unaccountably old,

That thing about time going slower in Space that was in Game Theory is true. I thought that was why Rosalina looked so young yet seemed to be so old, before even watching that GT episode.

and has all of these other powers I listed that are not something a normal human uses (I certainly do not teleport to space and cause a shower of shooting stars just to celebrate a victory in golf).

With one Baby Luma Mario is able to spin-attack, and store up to 999 miniature stars, and fire them into space.

Lumas have never been the source of her power, quit stating that. You keep stating that and have not provided a single piece of evidence in favour of it.

I said that in a whopping total of 2 posts.
I'm some big troll who constantly comes in here claiming Rosalina is Peach's daughter and is the weakest character in Smash blah blah blah.

I came here to discuss what the thread title, and dispute a commonly believed statement that I believe is false.

Also Rosalina is still leagues better than the other characters in 3D World. Any speedrunner of the game will tell you that she can traverse levels far more quickly than the other characters in the game, and she is the only character to have a dedicated, easy to use attack in her default form.

Being decently better than Mario, Luigi, Peach, and Toad, while still having weaknesses, does not make her a god.

Rosalina is a god-like being, and it's been proven countless times in this thread. You being a contrarian for the sake of it does not change this,

Again, I'm not trying to be a contrarian for the hell of it.

I am simply expressing my opinion on a commonly believed statement.

you are bringing up bad points that have already been shot down.

I'm bringing up bad points?
Says the guy who used her golf animation and her being slightly better (which is an opinion, as different people have different playstyles) than everyone else in 3D World as evidence of her being a god.

Also, Bowser had to have known who Rosalina was (she is basically a lady of legend, so it's likely he heard of her that way)

What?
Where the hell did you get that from?

If she was a "lady of legend", wouldn't Mario or anyone else have heard of her on any of the numerous star-based adventures hems been on, in a couple of which, stars can talk and are sentient and could easily tell him about Rosalina?

You are literally making things up about Mario's lore now.

if he stole power from the Observatory at all. Otherwise, how would he know it exists?

He would probably find it while looking around for star power to fuel his latest Peach-capture.

No, there really isn't. It goes out of it's way to ignore basic facts, and has the audacity to say anyone who has any evidence against it (and anyone who had their brain at least half switched on while watching the episodes would have plenty of damning evidence against the episode) is stupid.

Find me the part of the video where it says anyone who doesn't belive it is stupid.

And then you could go find some actual evidence that "disproves" the theory, instead of standing there saying it's BS.

I'm not going to go off-topic here. I'm just going to say this: I enjoy watching Game Theory, and find it to be good entertainment. If people take his self-proclaimed "just theories" as canon, that's their fault. I, for one, don't. Also, I don't see how speculation on culture in video games is more important than science and other things in video games, but whatever.

And no, I'm not continuing with this.

^This guy gets it.

 

[kyxsune]

This seems like a good time to segway into another character. Palutena, if she is technically a god, why are we ignoring her. (I'm guessing it's cause none of us actually like her all that much)

Nvm, Turns out she is useless .

 

[Mega Bidoof]

This seems like a good time to segway into another character. Palutena, if she is technically a god, why are we ignoring her. (I'm guessing it's cause none of us actually like her all that much)

Nvm, Turns out she is useless .

Probably because even though she is a god, Pit took her down just as easily as another boss.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

This seems like a good time to segway into another character. Palutena, if she is technically a god, why are we ignoring her. (I'm guessing it's cause none of us actually like her all that much)

Nvm, Turns out she is useless .

 

[ChikoLad]

Yeah, and the Wario Waft episode was also based on some shaky calculations (Wario ten feet tall anyone?), but other than that, the series is usually really, really good.

I said there was evidence behind it (which there is, such as the genetic info, the castle silhouette, Super Luigi Galaxy's ending photo, etc.). I never said that there wasn't evidence against it. There's a difference.

Also, which facts do you find it ignores, out of curiosity?

The genetics point is invalid. MatPat tries to claim she is left handed and his genetics argument basically rides on this, but Rosalina is in fact ambidextrous.

MatPat tries to brush this off by saying that Rosalina's switching hands is down to "right hand bias" in her renders, but that's complete bull. She has plenty of in-game sequences (as in, entire cutscenes that even he shows off in his video, but neglects to point out) in which she holds the wand in her right hand, and there are promotional renders that depict it in her left hand (her Smash newcomer poster).

Furthermore, MK8 depicts her keeping her right hand on the wheel when she holds an item in the left hand. If someone needed to drive with one hand, they would use their good hand. However, given that Rosalina has also used her left hand as her "good hand" in other games, it means she is ambidextrous.

Also, Mario Golf: World Tour depicts her using the wand in her right hand:

Funnily enough, I did make a Tumblr post proving Rosalina's ambidexterity before MatPat even made his video:

http://sonicbrawler182.tumblr.com/post/93065941662/fun-rosalina-tidbit

The castle silohuette is also meaningless as there is no definitive proof it is the Mushroom Kingdom. His biggest flaw in this theory is that it rides on the "tree on the hill" logic, but the tree he pointed out in Galaxy's ending is deciduous - the trees around Rosalina's home in the story book are coniferous.

Hmmm, now what iconic and plot important location in Galaxy DID actually have evergreen trees and the same flower beds MatPat referred to?...

It was the Gateway Planet, of course. Also Rosalina's home stage in Smash Bros:

It was also the location of Rosalina's incredibly poignant 120 Star Ending - the purpose of that scene being to reveal that the Gateway Planet was her childhood home, and that she visits it every one hundred years. She even blatantly says how precious the planet is to her when you do the Red Star mission:

The Super Luigi Galaxy ending photo is actually cold hard evidence AGAINST his point - as I mentioned before, Luigi had an implied crush on Rosalina all throughout Galaxy.

Mario's ending photo depicts him taking Peach out to space to see Lumas. Almost like a friendly date.

Luigi's ending photo depicts him taking Rosalina to the Mushroom Kingdom to meet it's people, the Toads.

The two are literally in direct parallel to each other. The only implication of the ending photo is that Luigi and Rosalina went on a cute little night out after all was said and done, and Mario did the same with Peach in space - that is it. It's not supposed to be some convoluted link that says Luigi ****ed Peach and gave birth to Rosalina. Luigi's crush on Rosalina was hinted at multiple times throughout the game (calling her cute, specifically asking Mario to tell Rosalina that he got the Power Star on Battlerock Galaxy, etc), and that photo was supposed to be a cute little hint that maybe he finally said something to her directly. Super Luigi Galaxy is also completley non-canon anyway, and is just a "what if" scenario. The universe reboot in Galaxy's ending actually leads into Galaxy 2.

And to top it all off, if you still think Rosalina is Luigi's daughter, then apparently Luigi has a thing for his own daughter. Doesn't sound like something Nintendo would greenlight, does it?

2. Calm the hell down. It's a video game character.

I'm perfectly calm, just stating facts - if you buy the Game Theory episode on Rosalina, you don't have basic knowledge of Rosalina's character. And therefore, have no valid part in a discussion about her.

With one Baby Luma Mario is able to spin-attack, and store up to 999 miniature stars, and fire them into space.

And Rosalina can naturally perform the spin attack.

Also, the Star Bit mechanic is a fourth wall breaking thing, not something that Mario performs. The Star Bits are supposed to literally be coming from your Wii Remote pointer.

This isn't the only interesting fourth wall breaker in Galaxy either, it has a few. Such as Rosalina directly thanking the player and saying that she will "watch over you from beyond the stars" in the 120 Star Ending.

her being slightly better (which is an opinion, as different people have different playstyles)

She is exponentially better than the rest of the cast in 3D World, and it is not opinion. Trying to deny this is like trying to deny Meta Knight being top tier in Brawl. She can do so many things in 3D World that other characters cannot do, and her normal form is basically better than every other form in most circumstances.

What?
Where the hell did you get that from?

She also has many other aliases such as that. Also there is "the comet that passes by every 100 years" thing, that comet being Rosalina's Observatory.

Her not being a lady of legend in games like Paper Mario is a mere matter of her not being invented as a character at that point in time, from a real life standpoint. Lumas did not exist either at that time. So it says nothing against this point.

The other points of your post are just taunting and tiresome drivel for the sake of it that actually don't contribute anything to this discussion.

 

[ShadowLBlue]

This seems like a good time to segway into another character. Palutena, if she is technically a god, why are we ignoring her. (I'm guessing it's cause none of us actually like her all that much)

Nvm, Turns out she is useless .

Well we've only seen glimpses of her power so it's hard to discuss her real potential.

Probably because even though she is a god, Pit took her down just as easily as another boss.

That's only because she was possessed and weakened by the Chaos Kin. She was nowhere near full-power. But like I said earlier, we only saw her some of her moves vs Pit, which mostly consisted of a variety projectiles, a move similar to angle missile but with her covered in light and that moves very fast, a flash that blinds anyone within a good range of her, teleportation, and a counter to melee moves.
She also can float indefinitely and fire a GIANT laser that that caused a 3-headed dragon to crash and lose one of its heads.
She has access to her army of (admittedly mediocre but still numerous) Centurions.
Plus she made the bow that Pit uses so she can likely use that weapon, as well as any of his other ones although the later is just an educated guess on my part. Speaking of speculation, there's no reason she can't use any of the numerous Powers Pit uses (her Final Smash, Black Hole Laser is a combination of 2 different Powers- a black hole and a Mega Laser)
Being a god she also shows some degree of omnipotence, which could give her knowledge about an enemies abilities and tactics. And being a goddess, it's unlikely she'd be restricted to only carrying a few like Pit does in the game.
She also could charge up the 3 Sacred treasures, which killed Hades in one blast, although I'm not sure if they would count as her or Pit's weapon. Or maybe neither.

While I'm not sure she has the offense to belong in the top tier with people like Shulk, Ness, Gannondorf, she should be in the second best tier at worst.

 

[Etc_Guy]

Why are we only comparing powers when strongest could mean villains beaten. All of them have special feats that the hero overcame but try and use the most impressive so far in the franchise.The way they've been defeated doesn't matter, it's what the villain has done, doing, evilness, their personality, and other feats and features. Avoid possible spoilers too please.

This might have some potential to change things up a bit and the only problem is smaller franchises don't have big chances.

 

[kyxsune]

Why are we only comparing powers when strongest could mean villains beaten. All of them have special feats that the hero overcame but try and use the most impressive so far in the franchise.The way they've been defeated doesn't matter, it's what the villain has done, doing, evilness, their personality, and other feats and features. Avoid possible spoilers too please.

This might have some potential to change things up a bit and the only problem is smaller franchises don't have big chances.

if you use that scale kirby is the most powerful. Most of his enemies are reality warping universe destroyers...

And honestly, how would u apply that too the pokemon, Captain Falcon and villager?

 

[Munomario777]

On the subject of the trees in Gateway Galaxy, I'm pretty sure those were added specifically for the Smash stage.

 

[ChikoLad]

On the subject of the trees in Gateway Galaxy, I'm pretty sure those were added specifically for the Smash stage.

Either way, it doesn't change the fact that she outright calls the place her home.

It can just be deduced that the trees are gone after the ravages of time. In Galaxy, the Gateway Planet is in a sorry state. In Smash, it seems to based off of how the planet would have been before she left it as a child (even the flower beds have extra decoration around them, and the planet looks bigger, like it seemed to be in the storybook).

 

[Reiga]

You guys are disputing over characters like Roselina or Palutena as the strongest character of smash bros. canonically, but you are all misjudging the supreme powers of Wario!
In Wario Land 1, if Wario dies he just loses coins, not even a life, in 2 and 3 he straight up is immortal, bosses only knock him back a few room, he can be set on fire panic and later shrug it off.
Rosalina may be space god, but in SM3D World she still dies! In Wario Land 4 he may have a health meter, but Wario still doesn't have a life sistem! The true best smash character is the smelly fat man himself, Wario!

 

[ChikoLad]

You guys are disputing over characters like Roselina or Palutena as the strongest character of smash bros. canonically, but you are all misjudging the supreme powers of Wario!
In Wario Land 1, if Wario dies he just loses coins, not even a life, in 2 and 3 he straight up is immortal, bosses only knock him back a few room, he can be set on fire panic and later shrug it off.
Rosalina may be space god, but in SM3D World she still dies! In Wario Land 4 he may have a health meter, but Wario still doesn't have a life sistem! The true best smash character is the smelly fat man himself, Wario!

The characters don't die in 3D World. On the game over screen, they just sit around looking disappointed. When you press Continue, they just jump right back into the action.

The animation for losing a life also just depicts them jumping up saying "oh no" or something (Rosalina sounds like she's half laughing when she says it). And in multiplayer, they straight up float back in a bubble.

This isn't like Mario Galaxy where Mario straight up loses his skin when electrocuted. It's a more family friendly game than Galaxy.

 

[Etc_Guy]

The characters don't die in 3D World. On the game over screen, they just sit around looking disappointed. When you press Continue, they just jump right back into the action.

The animation for losing a life also just depicts them jumping up saying "oh no" or something (Rosalina sounds like she's half laughing when she says it). And in multiplayer, they straight up float back in a bubble.

This isn't like Mario Galaxy where Mario straight up loses his skin when electrocuted. It's a more family friendly game than Galaxy.

I think he meant that has been invincible, while playable, for two games in a row. Even when you can die, he can take heavier beatings than Rosie without falling off the screen.