Who thinks the Ice Climber's have been de-confirmed?

[Chibirobo]

Who thinks that thank's to the new Rumble Falls stage-no more Ice Climbers. I mean,this place seems to be the Icicle Mountain of Brawl,and I just can't see the IC's having a different stage.(Unless the characters won't have a stage to back them up,which seems unlikely)

so,who agrees with me and who thinks this is just mindless speculation?

 

[detonator512]

I does sorta mean the IC are de-confirmed because of the way the new stage is, but doesn't this also mean diddy and dixie kong duo are semi confirmed?

edit: Since IC is mostly out of the picture, and this is a DK Stage....

 

[the grim lizard]

No one with a brain.

 

[Pieman0920]

The ICs were probably going to get a new stage anyway, so I don't see why they would be de-confirmed at all.

 

[Copperpot]

Exactly. In the event that the Ice Climbers are in Brawl, the chances of them using the exact same stage they had in Melee are slim to none. I mean, come on, there's no way anyone here should be able to say that the Ice Climbers aren't in because of this.

That said, I don't necessarily want the Ice Climbers to come back. I just think this is a pretty unsound argument.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

I agree with the 3 people above me. Seriously, did anyone actually think that if the Ice Climbers returned, they'd keep the same stage they had in melee? All this update shows is that they are reusing some ideas from melee concerning stages, which was already sort of implied with the Mario Kart stage and Delfino Plaza.

This update doesn't reflect anything regarding the IC's chances of returning.

 

[Fawriel]

Good thing that Captain Falcon is deconfirmed, too.

 

[Willz]

I agree with other people, it's very likely in the case that the IC's would return they'd proberly get a new stage, but then again Yoshi's island still there (for yoshi proberly)?

 

[Wiseguy]

Errr... exactly what kind of new stage would Ice Climbers have? That game is all about jumping up and up an endless series of platforms. This is why Icicle Moutain was the only IC stage in Melee - there were no more good concepts from the game to draw upon.

Yeah, you could argue the same about the Mario Kart stage deconfirming Captain Falcon - but there are 2 problems with that comaparison:

1) The new Mario Kart stage is pretty different from Mute city. One is a moving stage the other isn't. One is a walk-off, the other is a standard fall-off-the-edge stage. In fact the only real similarity is the oncoming vehicles.

2) Mute City is not the only stage conceot to drawn upon for an F-zero stage - as is made evident by Big Blue. The Icicle moutain format is all there is to the Ice Climbers game.

So, yeah. This isn't really proof of anything, but I'd say it could be percieved as a nail in the coffin of a character that wasn't very likely to return anyway.

 

[the grim lizard]

Wiseguy...I thought you were better than that, but I guess not...

Seriously, like it's that difficult to come up with a stage. How was Peach's Castle 64 like the mario games? Because it had a castle in the background?? Oh, and Saffron City was legit because Pokemon occasionally came out of the door?? ...Not to mention a good number of stages in Melee, which were only loosely based off of the games they were representing.

Based on past stage examples, it's clear you can create a generic stage and add elements that make it more or less representative of a game. They could simply make a large platform with two floating platforms and make it in the orange/green/blue type blocks from the game format and...voila! Iceclimber stage.

 

[Pieman0920]

They could finally reach the summit! :O

 

[Wii4Mii 99]

Good thing that Captain Falcon is deconfirmed, too.

lol Yeah. And apparently, Captain Falcon has a big chance of returning.

It's kinda wierd that the Mario Kart stage and Delfino stage are both half of Mute City...

Until wii meet again,
Wii4mii 99

 

[Fawriel]

Wiseguy... Delfino Plaza. Same thing as Mute City, without the cars admittedly.
And DK's first appearance was about climbing up.

In the original Ice Climbers game, the stage never scrolled up on its own, unless you took too much time. Then some ice bear came along and made it scroll. Besides that, you're as free to move upwards as quickly as you are in old Mario games, except those go sideways.

I wanna see an Ice Climbers stage that has two steep glaciers at the side with a few random platforms sticking out and a big hole in the middle. KOs only possible through the bottom or off the top. Wheee~

 

[Wiseguy]

Wiseguy...I thought you were better than that, but I guess not...

Seriously, like it's that difficult to come up with a stage. How was Peach's Castle 64 like the mario games? Because it had a castle in the background?? Oh, and Saffron City was legit because Pokemon occasionally came out of the door?? ...Not to mention a good number of stages in Melee, which were only loosely based off of the games they were representing.

Based on past stage examples, it's clear you can create a generic stage and add elements that make it more or less representative of a game. They could simply make a large platform with two floating platforms and make it in the orange/green/blue type blocks from the game format and...voila! Iceclimber stage.

Generic stages are the exception - not the rule. Most stages in the Smash series have tried reflect their game series of origin. And judging by the very focused and inspired design of the Brawl stages revealed thus far, Sakurai is trying harder than ever to accurately represent the games through the stages.

Making a generic Ice Cimbers stage stage is still possible, but think about it: why would Sakurai and his team take a stage format that perfectly represents the Ice Climbers game, give it is Donkey Kong and then make up a generic stage dressed up with an Ice Cimbers theme?

I'm not saying this proves squat, all I'm saying is that update does not bode well for IC's return.

EDIT: @ Fawriel> But there are far more stage ideas from F-Zero to draw upon than Mute city (ie; Big Blue) which is more that can be said for Ice Climbers.

Yeah, Icicle moutain might behave a bit differently from the actual game (scrolling on it's own, etc.) but it was still the most (and only) obvious stage fromat for representing the game. Your glacier format id cool, but if Sakurai had thought of it - it would have been a secong IC stage in Melee.

 

[joepinion]

The new stage doesn't cut IC's chances in half or anything, but if I was an oddsmaker in Vegas, this update would definitely make me reduce their odds.

Although I love that stage idea, Fawriel.

Out of the "original 14" in SSBM who were unlocked at the start, only Yoshi, Capt. Falcon, Peach, Ness, and Yoshi remain a mystery. There has already been evidence in the updates of Yoshi and Facon, and Peach is likely to return, since Bowser is back.

There has not been a shred of evidence for Ness or ICs. At least Ness, though, was in 64. Minimize today's update all you want, but it's the first piece of evidence that's actually against the ICs.

I'd say the IC will be hidden characters at least, and may not be back.

 

[the grim lizard]

That isn't true at all, Wiseguy. Almost every stage takes elements from the games and adds them to a generic or at least a conceptual stage. In the past, there have been hardly any "direct from the game" stages. A stage like Great Bay has been the exception, and even that had some improvisations.

Big Blue and Mute City = both had cars from F-Zero. Hoo-boy that sounds like step right out of the game. They could easily do the same for Iceclimbers, add the same kind of elements (besides, we're comparing apples and oranges with IC and F-Zero). In any case, Icicle Mountain didn't represent the IC game very well anyway, let alone being the only way to represent it.

Edit: Besides, just take a look at any of the bonus stages (which were just as common as the normal stages) in IceClimber, and they have a completely different layout than IM.

@joepinion, they likely wouldn't be hidden because they haven't been hidden before.

I don't know what people have against the ICs anyway.

 

[ZeldaFox38]

I really can't say if this de-confirms them, but I do think it's a weird idea to use for a Donkey Kong stage. I mean, if you were going to have a vertical climbing stage, wouldn't you want to model it somewhat off the first DK game? Like, with gasoline barrels and red iron bars and stuff? Well, maybe that idea is a little too old school . . .or insane.

I'm kind of hoping they're not coming back, but I can't say that this staked the vampire's heart either. Know what I mean?

Hmm . . .blood-sucking Ice Climbers . . .that's just a little morbid.

 

[GimmeAnFSharp]

I wanna see an Ice Climbers stage that has two steep glaciers at the side with a few random platforms sticking out and a big hole in the middle. KOs only possible through the bottom or off the top. Wheee~

Right before I read that, I was thinking the same thing. And thank HEAVENS that idea wasn't implemented in Melee; Fox Up+A KO's ftl D:

Although, I suppose if that gap was wide enough and the platforms were sparce enough, Meteor Mashes would've been a viable option.

Oh! And to be on topic... I'm the same as everyone else. Just stop trying to interpret... because no one knows, and that's it. No. One. Knows. I'm all for speculation, but atleast make it kinda sensible.

 

[freeman123]

Chibirobo
Who thinks the Ice Climber's have been de-confirmed?

All the stupid people.

Chibirobo
I mean,this place seems to be the Icicle Mountain of Brawl

Except that Icicle mountain went up and down, and moved at random. This stage only goes up and doesn't seem to stop moving.

I does sorta mean the IC are de-confirmed because of the way the new stage is, but doesn't this also mean diddy and dixie kong duo are semi confirmed?

It doesn't confirm or deconfirm anybody, it's just a new stage.

I guess Captain Falcon is deconfirmed now because they added that Mario Kart stage to replace the F-Zero stage. Also, that confirms a Petey Pirahna/King Boo duo. Also, I'm ********.

Wiseguy
Errr... exactly what kind of new stage would Ice Climbers have? That game is all about jumping up and up an endless series of platforms. This is why Icicle Moutain was the only IC stage in Melee - there were no more good concepts from the game to draw upon.

In what Star Fox game did you fight on the Great Fox?

Wiseguy
The new Mario Kart stage is pretty different from Mute city.

The new DK stage is pretty different from the IC stage too.

Wiseguy
In fact the only real similarity is the oncoming vehicles.

The only real similarity between the DK and IC stages is that the stage moves. Infinite Glacier didn't have latters you could climb, it went up and down, and it moves at random. On Rumble Falls "The screen’s constantly changing", which leads me to believe it doesn't stop moving like the IC stage.

Wiseguy
The Icicle moutain format is all there is to the Ice Climbers game.

You're right, if someone like you(who thinks Bonk is likely to be in the game) can't think of a new IC stage, I guess professional game designers don't have a chance at coming up with one.

Wiseguy
but I'd say it could be percieved as a nail in the coffin of a character that wasn't very likely to return anyway.

No it can't.

the grim lizard
Wiseguy...I thought you were better than that

Did you not see that he picked Bonk as one of the most likely characters to be in Brawl?

Wiseguy
Most stages in the Smash series have tried reflect their game series of origin.

What? Infinite Glacier was probably the only stage where the gameplay was even remotely similar to the game it was from.

Maybe if they add Bonk, they could make a stage for him that no one ever plays or cares about. So it'll be just like his games.

Wiseguy
all I'm saying is that update does not bode well for IC's return.

It doesn't hurt their chances either. This update has absolutely no effect on Ice Climbers at all, or any character for that matter. It's just a new stage.

Wiseguy
Your glacier format id cool, but if Sakurai had thought of it - it would have been a secong IC stage in Melee.

G&W only got one stage and Fire Emblem didn't get any. So what makes you think they didn't want IC to have just one stage?

joepinion
The new stage doesn't cut IC's chances in half or anything, but if I was an oddsmaker in Vegas, this update would definitely make me reduce their odds.

Do yourself a favor and stay out of Vegas. This has no effect on their odds at all.

joepinion
Minimize today's update all you want, but it's the first piece of evidence that's actually against the ICs.

No it isn't.

joepinion
I'd say the IC will be hidden characters at least, and may not be back.

You just said that they would be hidden characters at least...

 

[Wiseguy]

That isn't true at all, Wiseguy. Almost every stage takes elements from the games and adds them to a generic or at least a conceptual stage. In the past, there have been hardly any "direct from the game" stages. A stage like Great Bay has been the exception, and even that had some improvisations.

Big Blue and Mute City = both had cars from F-Zero. Hoo-boy that sounds like step right out of the game. They could easily do the same for Iceclimbers, add the same kind of elements (besides, we're comparing apples and oranges with IC and F-Zero). In any case, Icicle Mountain didn't represent the IC game very well anyway, let alone being the only way to represent it.

Big Blue and Mute City are both represenations of actual stages in F-Zero X. There are literally hundreds of other stages from the F-Zero series to draw upon.

And yeah, I stand by my statement. In Melee, all the Mario stages were ripped from specific Mario games, the Starfox maps representing specific planets in Starfox 64, the same goes for the Kirby, Yoshi, Ice Climbers, F-Zero and Game & Watch stages. The only generic stages attached to a licence were Great temple (which captures the essence of a Zelda temple, but is from no specific game) the new DK stages and Poke-floats.

So again, generic stages are the exception - not the rule. I suspect Sakurai is trying to avoid them altogether this time around, judging by the stages unveiled so far.

And yeah, Icicle Moutain represented the dull monotony of the Ice Climbers title perfectly and better than any other stage idea could.

 

[SubparSmashBrother]

I have to agree with Wiseguy here, for the reasons he's already stated. Why would they take the Ice Climber's stage concept/build, change it to a Donkey Kong theme, then rebuild a new Ice Climber stage instead of just making a different DK stage in the first place and keep Icicle Mountain the same.

I also think that they might make Diddy/Dixie replace the Ice Climbers, and make Rumble Falls stage "their" stage.

 

[Wiseguy]

I have to agree with Wiseguy here, for the reasons he's already stated. Why would they take the Ice Climber's stage concept/build, change it to a Donkey Kong theme, then rebuild a new Ice Climber stage instead of just making a different DK stage in the first place and keep Icicle Mountain the same.

I also think that they might make Diddy/Dixie replace the Ice Climbers, and make Rumble Falls stage "their" stage.

The problem with this being Diddy/Dixie's stage is that it's based on DK: Jungle beat - a game in which neither Diddy nor Dixie appeared, to my knowlege.

Diddy has a jetpack. He doesn't need his deadweight girlfriend.

 

[GreenKirby]

*sees an Anti-Ice Climbers thread*

*drenches said with gasoline*

*lights match*

BURN! BURN!

Besides, Marth and Roy didn't even have stages and yet they were still in Melee.

 

[ZeldaFox38]

Besides, Marth and Roy didn't even have stages and yet they were still in Melee.

That's an interesting point. This was ditto for Captain Falcon and Ness in the first Smash game as well, if I remember correctly.

Personally . . .I'd like to see a Fire Emblem stage. But I'd rather have the characters confirmed first.

 

[the grim lizard]

Big Blue and Mute City are both represenations of actual stages in F-Zero X. There are literally hundreds of other stages from the F-Zero series to draw upon.

And yeah, I stand by my statement. In Melee, all the Mario stages were ripped from specific Mario games, the Starfox maps representing specific planets in Starfox 64, the same goes for the Kirby, Yoshi, Ice Climbers, F-Zero and Game & Watch stages. The only generic stages attached to a licence were Great temple (which captures the essence of a Zelda temple, but is from no specific game) the new DK stages and Poke-floats.

So again, generic stages are the exception - not the rule. I suspect Sakurai is trying to avoid them altogether this time around, judging by the stages unveiled so far.

And yeah, Icicle Moutain represented the dull monotony of the Ice Climbers title perfectly and better than any other stage idea could.

That isn't true at all. You don't know what you're talking about. Go watch some of crappycapturedevice's Melee analysis on stages. Yeah, there are elements from the games that are put into the stages, but the stages themselves don't resemble the game AT ALL for most stages.

And no, while IM may have some similarity to the game it represents, it is more similar to a generic mountain than the IC game. There are way better ways to make a stage that better represents the game. For example, Popo's target test.

Sorry, but you're just flatout wrong on this one. Kinda like you were wrong with Tom Nook, Deoxys and Goroh.

 

[Wiseguy]

*sees an Anti-Ice Climbers thread*

*drenches said with gasoline*

*lights match*

BURN! BURN!

Besides, Marth and Roy didn't even have stages and yet they were still in Melee.

Again, that was the exception - not the rule. Those were the only characters to ever appear without their own stage.

EDIT:

That isn't true at all. You don't know what you're talking about. Go watch some of crappycapturedevice's Melee analysis on stages. Yeah, there are elements from the games that are put into the stages, but the stages themselves don't resemble the game AT ALL for most stages.

And no, while IM may have some similarity to the game it represents, it is more similar to a generic mountain than the IC game. There are way better ways to make a stage that better represents the game. For example, Popo's target test.

I disagree. Stages like Peach's castle, Great Bay, Mute Cuty, Corneria, ect. represent specific games BECAUSE their settings, names, hazards ect. are taken from these games. And with all these series - there are plenty of more games and concepts to draw upon.

Ice Cimbers, however, IS one big generic moutain. That's all there is to the game. If there were more to it, we would have seen a second IC stage in Melee.

Sorry, but you're just flatout wrong on this one. Kinda like you were wrong with Tom Nook, Deoxys and Goroh.

Ouch. That was a low blow...

 

[joepinion]

You just said that they would be hidden characters at least...

Yes, they will at least be locked, and at most, they will be removed completely.

Stop drinkin' the Haterade, Free Man.

Green Kirby has the best point of anyone here. Even if it did mean no IC stage, that wouldn't necessarily mean no IC.

 

[the grim lizard]

Ice Cimbers, however, IS one big generic moutain. That's all there is to the game. If there were more to it, we would have seen a second IC stage in Melee.

ding ding ding! We have a winner!

So, basically, this DK stage has nothing to do with the ICs or an ICs stage. They could easily come up with something different (that didn't suck) for the ICs, even something somewhat generic. As I said, one of the little sub-stages for the bonus part of the game would work fine for their stage.

edit: and you're still wrong on the second stage thing. G&W had like 50 games. "Flatzone" was essentially the game "Helmet." They could just as easily have had another stage for him, but they still went with one. They went with one for each because they wanted just one.

 

[Gypsy Lee]

Oh my God, you people are so ******* ********. Stop finding similar things that happened in Melee and automatically assume that's what's going to happen with Brawl.

7|-|@t |)k 57/-\93 100ks |_!k3 teH 1{3 cL!m|3eR$ 1 fru/\/\ m3lee!!1! 1{3 c|_!/\/\beR5 d3{0|\|f!r/\/\3D!!!one!211

t3|-| 1C'5 \/\/eR3 @ du0, 50 7|=|e |)k $t/-\9e = d!|)dY /-\|\|d |)1x3Y Ko|\|9 dU0 {o|\|p|-|1rM3|)!!!!!on1!!

z3r() 5u!7 s@/\/\U$ h/-\5 2 m0V35 t|-|a7 l00K |_1k3 $|-|!eK's!!!one!! 5h13k |)e{0|\||>h!r/\/\3d!!!!one1122two!!

Seriously people, if you want to make stupid assumptions, make them in the SmashBros.com white Background = Doctor Mario Returning! Thread.

 

[freeman123]

Wiseguy
Again, that was the exception - not the rule. Those were the only characters to ever appear without their own stage.

Please tell us what the fugging rule is then, because I'm dying to know. Or just dodge this post like you do every other time you don't have a response.

the grim liZard
Kinda like you were wrong with Tom Nook, Deoxys and Goroh.

And like he will be wrong with 90% of the other things he's said. Except Bonk, of couse. He's definately going to be in.

Wiseguy
I disagree. Stages like Peach's castle, Great Bay, Mute Cuty, Corneria, ect. represent specific games BECAUSE their settings, names, hazards ect. are taken from these games. And with all these series - there are plenty of more games and concepts to draw upon.

What does that have to do with ICs at all?

Wiseguy
Ouch. That was a low blow...

It would be if you had anything down there.

joepinion
Yes, they will at least be locked, and at most, they will be removed completely.

Why do they have to be locked? They weren't before. I mean they could be locked, but what are you basing that on?

joepinion
Stop drinkin' the Haterade, Free Man.

Because I don't agree that a new Donkey Kong stage has anything to do with Ice Climbers, I'm "drinking haterade"?

 

[Wiseguy]

ding ding ding! We have a winner!

So, basically, this DK stage has nothing to do with the ICs or an ICs stage. They could easily come up with something different (that didn't suck) for the ICs. As I said, one of the little sub-stages for the bonus part of the game would work fine for their stage.

That in responce to your statement that Icicle moutain is "more similar to a generic moutain than an ICs game". My point was that this is why it perfectly represents the game. In fact, if you took a level from the game and removed the enemies you would essentially have Icicle Moutain.

As for your Bonus sub-stage idea, it could work - but if Sakurai's team thought it had any promise it would have appeared as a second ICs stage in Melee. The reason that the Ice Climbers and G&W only have one stage while every other series has two is becuase those games only had decent concept to draw upon. It's also why this update is bad news for the ICs.

 

[the grim lizard]

That in responce to your statement that Icicle moutain is "more similar to a generic moutain than an ICs game". My point was that this is why it perfectly represents the game. In fact, if you took a level from the game and removed the enemies you would essentially have Icicle Moutain.

Except, that you wouldn't.

As for your Bonus sub-stage idea, it could work - but if Sakurai's team thought it had any promise it would have appeared as a second ICs stage in Melee. The reason that the Ice Climbers and G&W only have one stage while every other series has two is becuase those games only had decent concept to draw upon. It's also why this update is bad news for the ICs.

They had one stage because A) They only wanted them to have one stage or B) They ran out of time. Do you seriously not know your history, man? You say all of this stuff about "Sakurai's team could do this or that" but you don't know what you're talking about. You talk about "exceptions"...Well look at the facts:

-Who were the only new series in Melee? ICs, G&W, and FE. The first two had one stage each and the latter had NO stages at all. Don't give me crap about exceptions and lack of inspiration for stages.

-Also, let's look at why Balloon Fighter wasn't in the final game. They took him out after the beta version because they wanted to focus on the ICs, who would prove to be the most unique character in the game, and they didn't have enough time to do both. This is why they were in in the first place; so why is everyone so dead-set on having them removed?? You seem to know so much about Sakurai and his team...why would they work so hard to put a character in the game, only to so easily toss them aside at the next?

Let me also add that they could just as easily take a segment from Icicle Mountain and use that as a stage, instead of the whole moving thing.

 

[Wizzlecroff]

Yea, why remove one of the most original movesets? Also to your the bonus stage having promise... what if they thought it had promise so they kept the design for a later smash?

 

[Gypsy Lee]

Wiseguy has his own karactr predishon thred!! He must b a profeshonle spectulater!! Evary1, lisin to him bcuz he must be rite abowt everything!!11on2! Ice Climbers deconphirmed!!

 

[Pomfrod]

And yeah, I stand by my statement. In Melee, all the Mario stages were ripped from specific Mario games, the Starfox maps representing specific planets in Starfox 64, the same goes for the Kirby, Yoshi, Ice Climbers, F-Zero and Game & Watch stages. The only generic stages attached to a licence were Great temple (which captures the essence of a Zelda temple, but is from no specific game) the new DK stages and Poke-floats.

So again, generic stages are the exception - not the rule. I suspect Sakurai is trying to avoid them altogether this time around, judging by the stages unveiled so far.

I strongly suggest you take a look at CrappyCaptureDevice's video series on Youtube. Brinstar was a fusion of at least three different chambers from the first three Metroid games. The Super Mario World stage combined the first two stages, while using music from yet another stage. Green Greens used a gameplay element from The Great Cave Offensive while adding in the Whispy Woods boss battle. Flat Zone took ideas and scenarios from the Oil Panic, Manhole, and Helmet LCD games. The Pokemon stage comprises many different environments--the concept of a shifting stadium actually comes from the anime. The word you're looking for, Wiseguy, is comprehensive, not generic. To give due representation to a broad series of games, it makes sense to include as many elements as possible.

Not only are your generic vs. specific comments wrong, they are irrelevant. The true question here is, "Since it appears that they have used, in part, an element found in the Icicle Mountain stage in Melee, and since similar stages should be avoided, could the Ice Climbers' stage be reimagined or optimized for this game?" As you have already seen, plenty of ideas for a better Ice Climbers stage have been offered, and we're just amateurs.

 

[Wizzlecroff]

You have the weirdest wishlist ever lol.

 

[the grim lizard]

IMO, the only thing this stage deconfirms is the return of Icicle Mountain.
...as if there were any doubts there...

 

[Wiseguy]

Except, that you wouldn't.

Fine, I exagerate. But it is heavily inspired by an Ice Climbers stage, to my eye at least...

They had one stage because A) They only wanted them to have one stage or B) They ran out of time. Do you seriously not know your history, man? You say all of this stuff about "Sakurai's team could do this or that" but you don't know what you're talking about. You talk about "exceptions"...Well look at the facts:

-Who were the only new series in Melee? ICs, G&W, and FE. The first two had one stage each and the latter had NO stages at all. Don't give me crap about exceptions and lack of inspiration for stages.

That's a fair point, but I strongly suspect that lack of inspiration also played a factor. After all, there are dozens of Mario games that could have worked as a stage - but only one Ice Climbers title. Meanwhile, the G&W stage drew inspiration from all the games in the series to create a single stage.

-Also, let's look at why Balloon Fighter wasn't in the final game. They took him out after the beta version because they wanted to focus on the ICs, who would prove to be the most unique character in the game, and they didn't have enough time to do both. This is why they were in in the first place; so why is everyone so dead-set on having them removed?? You seem to know so much about Sakurai and his team...why would they work so hard to put a character in the game, only to so easily toss them aside at the next?

Sorry, if I sounded like a know-it-all, I'm really just speculating....

I agree that Ice Climbers were a cool and unique addition to Melee's roster, and I don't doubt that Sakurai sacrificed Balloonfighter so he could include the character.
However, isn't assuming they will return just as much of a leap as saying that they will be cut? This update aside, there is no evidence SUPPORTING the Ice Climbers return.
Personally, I strongly suspect that retro characters like ICs and G&W were intended as cool guest appearances, not permanent additions to the roster. In addtion to Pit, we'll likely see one or two more cool-yet-obscure characters like Balloon Fighter, ROB or Machrider to fill the void left behind by ICs and G&W.

In shgort, cutting a cool and unique character like ICs would be a shame, but it would provide more time for including other cool and unique characters.

 

[DonkeySmasher]

first of all stop using marth and roy as an example because you missed a big reason they had no stage

in 64 ness and falcon had no stage from series why? since they were hidden

marth and roy is a completley new series that was unlockable so it makes sense that they would have no stage

game and watch was the ONLY unlockable character to have a stage specifically based on him why? because he was a surprise character showing nintendo's past history so a stage is a good way to celebrate him

 

[Pomfrod]

You have the weirdest wishlist ever lol.

Satire. Look it up.