Who else is worried Brawl might not be that good?

[kin3tic-c4jun-3]

It does look like Brawl could be a little bit easier, but take a look at the new gliding update.

It looks like it's easy to initiate, but difficult to use properly or effectively.

Who knows, maybe the reason Brawl has a daily update site is to get more people to play, and by doing so they have chosen a friendly "look how easy it is" approach. Maybe the game itself will be much different than they are portraying it here.

Also, the invulnerability during a move is a balance update in my opinion, not really a design meant to simplify things. I'm sure there will still be CC. I know it.

Things like holding down A to do rapid strikes is what I'm worried about..

Anyways, what I'm saying is that this site is designed to catch the eyes of all those little boyz an' girlz who just bought their Wii's - no doubt. The game could end up being different. Perhaps they are showcasing all these easy moves for the casual, but the hardcore will find that there are a slew of new techs?

 

[Blackshadow]

I feel he's over simplifying things, I mean at least it wasn't ridiculously easy to keep the rapid punches/kicks from Melee going for too long, but now all you need to do is hold a button. Talk about catering for 3 year olds.

Though the rapid punch thing will only concern the noobs stuck in a corner being rapid kick'd to death screaming "CHEAP!1!!1" due to their complete ignorance to the concept of DI.

 

[GreenMamba]

C-sticking in Melee was initially included for the sole purpose of making smashing easier on the newbs, and look what happened.

Try playing the game before worrying about it being too simplyfied.

 

[frankisvital]

I wouldn't worry about the game being "too easy," for a couple reasons.

First of all, all you've been looking at is the stuff from Melee. Who's to say there won't be new things to learn, new "exploitations," if you will? Really people, the whole point of a sequel is that it's the NEXT part in the series. NEXT. Implying forward motion. Implying new things. Do you think the developers expected Melee to evolve the way it did? No, because we made it evolve the way it did.

Secondly, difficulty is relative. Imagine it this way; you're a street racer. You're used to racing in a car that maybe isn't the easiest thing in the world to drive. The steering is loose, the transmission's a bit weird and the interior smells like ***. Your opponent, however, is racing a car of the same quality. December 6th rolls around, and you get a beautiful new car, perfect in every way, and way easier to drive. You'd think that makes a difference, except the guy you're racing got a new car too. You've still got to work hard to win, because you've still got to better than the other guy.

The game may end up being easier to play, but that doesn't mean you'll kick the crap out of everyone you play against. Easy game doesn't mean you're playing against monkeys. It's easy for them too, which means it's hard for you.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Gliding?

I just saw this. I feel like throwing up.

So let me get this straight

Pit :

2 disjointed hitboxes
Aimable projectiles
multiple jumps
incredibly hacks recovery (DI upwards, and glide back)

Sounds like jigglypuff on steroids.

Gliding is a ****ing bad idea. What the ****ing hell are they thinking, and doing to smash?

 

[Joshua368]

While the gliding technique does seem like it may overpower those three characters, there's still plenty of potential for ballancing them out. Gliding may be easy to knock out, or it could fall fast, or you may get stunned if you get hit out of it.

Instead of throwing a fit and complaining like a little baby every time Sakurai posts something that I'm not sure will work perfectly, I'll wait until the finished product comes out and experience it firsthand. Then maybe I'll start whining if something sucks.

 

[max_da_ling]

It's hard to speculate correctly about everything we're seeing without being able to experience it first-hand. For example the glide. Its no doubt this will greatly enhance these characters getbacks, but it could be a risky maneuvre, or just easy to edgeguard.

Footstool jump looks like something that takes skill and precision to pull off, and I think it could be a welcome addition to brawl. The only thing that I dislike is the hold A for rapid attack. What about doing the gentleman with Falcon? And Pikachu's skull bash can be extremely fast is you can tap a rapidly. I guess we'll have to see how it's implemented.

And with the invulnerability frame based moves, I think this is the perfect way to balance characters like poor Bowser, and other slow strong characters who didn't quite hold their own in melee. Just the thing I thought should be implemented. I also don't think it will in any way replace crouch cancelling. It's all a matter of balance, which hopefully the Brawl team can do a great job of mastering.

Melee was an amazing game and I still find it surprising that I'm still playing it more than any other game to date. Even so though, it's great to see a sequel coming out that has a very good possibility of giving me that much more great multiplayer action for years to come. Hopefully it won't be as easy as we think it is though.

All in all from what we've seen in updates so far, I've been impressed and/or surprised by everything revealed to us. The character roster is shaping up to look great, stages are looking excellent, music amazing... and there are some clever item ideas as well. Of course we can speculate what will be broken, stupid, and exempt from tournament play... but we won't know for sure until we're actually playing the game.

 

[chkenparm]

Sakurai even said AT FIRST it seems really good, which means there are negative parts to gliding too, like if you are off to the side of the map one tap of foxs lazer will probably ko someone gliding.

I don't think holding the button down is bad because i don't think it will be any more effective than tapping the button repeatedly, punches will probably be the same speed, just like if you hit up or y to jump, same effect.

So settle down, don't throw a fit 3 months before you even see how this works, jeez.

 

[Takeshi245]

I actually liked the gliding update. To me, gliding doesn't equal being broken. It has to be mastered and used wisely. Sakurai said in the Smash Dojo update that if you're stalling or if you're attacked in mid-air, it gets cancelled out. Also, Sakurai also said that you can't change your direction as you glide. Only your angle. I'm maining Pit, so gliding going to be quite the experience.

 

[MirageofMadness]

I think the gliding is a fun new addition, so suck on that, naysayers. For god's sake- in Melee, Peach was able to friggin FLOAT! Peach's float didn't gradually fall like a glide would, AND you could switch directions, and she didn't turn out all broken and overpowered. Give it a chance! Besides, if the winged character didn't have some sort of gliding action, everyone would just turn around and say, "But ____ has wings!! They should use their wings!!!"

My main concern lately has been the tether recoveries. I really hope they are able to be used as attacks while on the ground. Also, I am scared that everytime someone does a tether-move (like Ivy's vine whip, Link's clawshot, and Zamus's ^B) while in mid-jump, the game will try to do a tether recovery and grab the edge and have you hang there, when you weren't even in danger of falling off to begin with! Also, does anyone else fear that the tether recoveries may not be enough to get you back on the stage? If those characters have weak jumps, their tethers won't do much good if you can never get close enough.

 

[max_da_ling]

Not that I don't agree with you on floating... but Peach was broken.

 

[Adi]

Erm, care to expand on how Peach was broken? If you're talking about CC D-smash than all I have to say is learn to grab.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Time for one of Dylan_Tnga's pessimistic brawl scenarios.

You're fighting pit... You forward smash him, edgeguard time.. right? Wrong.

The Pit you're fighting isnt a total n00b. He smash DI's diagonally upwards, and glides back to the stage at the top of the screen.

Broken. As. ****.

 

[kin3tic-c4jun-3]

Probably.

Here's hoping Snake can fly.

(Because he could IRL, you all know it)

 

[Phantom7]

cmon dude, Brawls gonna be awesome! theyve been working on it 4 over 2 years so it cant possibly be bad.

 

[raphtmarqui]

Time for one of Dylan_Tnga's pessimistic brawl scenarios.

You're fighting pit... You forward smash him, edgeguard time.. right? Wrong.

The Pit you're fighting isnt a total n00b. He smash DI's diagonally upwards, and glides back to the stage at the top of the screen.

Broken. As. ****.

Cry me a river

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

cmon dude, Brawls gonna be awesome! theyve been working on it 4 over 2 years so it cant possibly be bad.

No one's denying brawl is going to be awesome for a lot of people. But this threads dicussion is aimed towards updates that piss you off because they could potentially become extremly abusable and dare I say ''cheap'' in high level play.

Or to ***** about things that ruin smash, like zero suit samus transformation being the byproduct of an item, instead of a sepperate character.

Cry me a river

Go **** a carnivorous gopher.

 

[Oskurito]

Time for one of Dylan_Tnga's pessimistic brawl scenarios.

You're fighting pit... You forward smash him, edgeguard time.. right? Wrong.

The Pit you're fighting isnt a total n00b. He smash DI's diagonally upwards, and glides back to the stage at the top of the screen.

Broken. As. ****.

lol you forgot that he can attack you while he's getting back (I suppose). But if they give pit low traction he'll get ***** by a shine spike (if the shine is still a spike of course). Imo i agree with you, I think that technique will be kinda broken if not totally broken, but we wont know about its brokeness until brawl comes out.

 

[StarshipGroove]

This is what YOU wanted! They're not nerfing the top tiers in any way... they're making everyone else more broken than them! Such poetic justice...

 

[Adi]

Peach can do the exact same thing with float Dylan lol.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Peach can do the exact same thing with float Dylan lol.

Peach doesn't have two swords and aimable projectiles.

Ill be fine with all this crap, so long as fox can still waveshine. Then I can at least keep my main.

 

[shadenexus18]

cmon dude, Brawls gonna be awesome! theyve been working on it 4 over 2 years so it cant possibly be bad.

It's not going to be awesome if.....

1. Brawl is Ridleyless
2. There is no online play
3. More comic relief characters are added to the fray (like Captain Olimar) just to please 10 yr old kids and soccer moms
4. Brawl is Dark Samusless
5. Brawl is Wolfless

 

[raphtmarqui]

^ i dont think dark samus has too much of a chance

 

[StarshipGroove]

Peach doesn't have five massive jumps and an attack that gives her the ability to fly wherever she pleases.

 

[shortwanabelaker]

I think my biggest fear is that they are gonna slow it down a LOT from melee. Not exactly to the speed of the original smash bros (cuz that wud just be lame) but not quite to par with melee.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

I think my biggest fear is that they are gonna slow it down a LOT from melee. Not exactly to the speed of the original smash bros (cuz that wud just be lame) but not quite to par with melee.

They are doing that, you can tell just from the trailers. Sakurai also said he was going to ''moderate'' the game speed.

If you loved melee, you'll probably not be too fond of brawl. I think all the people who were hardcore in love with melee's gameplay will still like brawl, but never as much as the superior smash game.

hehe I love being arrogant about melee being better than brawl, which it is.

 

[Oskurito]

Peach doesn't have two swords and aimable projectiles.

Ill be fine with all this crap, so long as fox can still waveshine. Then I can at least keep my main.

Quoted for thrut. And I'll be happy if fox can waveshine (not just fine)

 

[max_da_ling]

Well Peach wasn't completely broken, but yes the down smash had way too much priority and could be a huge threat to an opponent who uses a lot of crouch cancelling. Sure, you can grab someone who spams it, but that doesn't mean the move has heavy priority and can deal serious damage.

Besides that she was incredibly hard to edgeguard, as she can recover from huge distances and keep high above the player.. and she could take a hell of a beating. I myself don't like using her, I find her boring and defensive.

 

[shortwanabelaker]

They are doing that, you can tell just from the trailers. Sakurai also said he was going to ''moderate'' the game speed.

If you loved melee, you'll probably not be too fond of brawl. I think all the people who were hardcore in love with melee's gameplay will still like brawl, but never as much as the superior smash game.

hehe I love being arrogant about melee being better than brawl, which it is.

what sucks is that i think you're right.. but i really hope you are wrong

 

[RokkuManZer0]

You can't tell a thing from the trailers. They aren't gonna show advanced techs in the trailers. Have you guys seen Melee's gameplay videos? It didn't look as fast as we play it now. Chill out until we get the game in our hands!

As for this gliding update, I quite like it. I wonder how do you cancel gliding... if you can cancel it that is.

 

[Takeshi245]

You can't tell a thing from the trailers. They aren't gonna show advanced techs in the trailers. Have you guys seen Melee's gameplay videos? It didn't look as fast as we play it now. Chill out until we get the game in our hands!

As for this gliding update, I quite like it. I wonder how do you cancel gliding... if you can cancel it that is.

Stop holding the jump button or stop tilting the Control stick backward or forward if you've already rapidly press it forward to backward to link the mid-air jump into a glide. Simple as that.

 

[Shadowplusle]

yeah it would really stink if u cant cancel gliding and just keep going until you hit the stage or fall off the edge

 

[raphtmarqui]

You can't tell a thing from the trailers. They aren't gonna show advanced techs in the trailers. Have you guys seen Melee's gameplay videos? It didn't look as fast as we play it now. Chill out until we get the game in our hands!

As for this gliding update, I quite like it..

Exactly, i agree

 

[TheZizz]

There might be a special "glide attack" in the same vein as the dash attack, great mobility at the cost of offensive options. As far as glide cancelling, we'll have to wait and see if there is some kind of closing-the-wingspan lag animation.

And I too begin to grow weary of the scrubby whining.

 

[specialsauce]

yeah the trailers are exactly that" trailers" just a promotion for the game to give sneak peek. the trailers dont look fast becuase their not ment to be if they were super fast and crazy like a melee vid on youtube, then u would really be able to see the characters much and all they want to do is give people a basic idea of the game once we get are hands on it and push the game to the limits we'll find that it'll be just as fast, when melee came out know one new about wavedasing and **** all that came later, same will happen with brawl

 

[Shadowplusle]

true but hopefully its not too slow

 

[HideousBeing]

I wanna know why Falco isn't at the top of the tiers by now. Seriously.

 

[Takeshi245]

I wanna know why Falco isn't at the top of the tiers by now. Seriously.

Let's not get off-topic now. That's how our last thread was closed.

 

[RokkuManZer0]

I worded myself badly. My main concern is the after effects of gliding. I doubt Sakurai would give INSANE, and I do mean INSANE recovery to characters without some side effects. Will gliding leave you open like if you airdodged? Will you be able to attack? How long does gliding last? There are still many question we have unanswered before we judge if gliding is overpowered or not. Geez, Peach had Float and she wasn't overpowered.

Hold yer horses on the judging guys.

 

[Adi]

I wanna know why Falco isn't at the top of the tiers by now. Seriously.

Because his agressive meta-game has been broken down so much that he isn't as big of a threat anymore?