Which fake leak/rumour do you wish was real?

[Wario Wario Wario]

me? easily this:

 

[Crosstails20]

No Cloud or Bayo in the next smash.

 

[Geno Boost]

Geno in brawl

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Tower of smash, it included 3 of my most wanted characters after all. And the whole tower of smash mode still sounds cool tbh.

 

[Crystanium]

No Cloud or Bayo in the next smash.

My thoughts exactly. I don't think Cloud will return, but Bayonetta probably will. I hope Sakurai and his team have heard the complaints about Bayonetta.

 

[SSBBDaisy]

I wish there was a comprehensive thread on the leaks instead of having to be merged with a general discussion thread where you can't even find the leaks in the thousands of pages.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/414524048


I doubt this leak is real, but it would make me a happy camper.

 

[Gimj]

No Cloud or Bayo in the next smash.

My thoughts exactly. I don't think Cloud will return, but Bayonetta probably will. I hope Sakurai and his team have heard the complaints about Bayonetta.

Can you both please, please, stop spreading this cancer? It does nothing positive, AT ALL. Unless you both are trolling, but I suspect not.

It sounds a lot like a bandwagonish philosophy if you ask me, for one. And two, it is such an emotionally-charged illogical statement that it shouldn't be presented as if it is worthy of reasonable consideration. This is not opinion-based, it is fact-based. The outright removal of characters because they are S-tiers is about as logical as removing Mario from Smash because he's too popular. It's that nonsensical.

Repeat this after me:

"Cloud and Bayonetta can both be in Smash 5, and not be the exact same as they were in Smash 4."

Cloud and Bayonetta SHOULD be in the next Smash because they are popular unique characters that many people wanted in the game. Stop being so selfish and emotional as not to see the forest for the trees. All it does is make people feel bad about characters and have stigmas surrounding them simply because they out-perform the rest of the cast. I find it incredible people actually want characters removed because they are (too)good competitively. Ridiculous.

If they do get removed, will you both whine and beg for 5mash S tiers to be removed in Smash6? Cut it out. Probably the same people who complain that Smash 4 Sonic shouldn't be able to spam Spin Dash.

endrant
-------------------------


As for the topic at hand, the leak that specifically said Spyro will be revealed and that 5mash will be a mix of Melee and Smash 4 is my pick.​

 

[Gameboi834]

There was that rumor that Spyro and Crash were going to be revealed and that was why the Spyro Trilogy on Switch announcement was delayed. I would LOVE if that were the case, but I'm pretty sure that rumor had no basis in reality...

 

[Yokta]

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/414524048


I doubt this leak is real, but it would make me a happy camper.

You should link to the archived copy of that post.

Until then, I don't think we need to explain who this leaker claims we will see in the next Smash.

 

[Crystanium]

Can you both please, please, stop spreading this cancer?

Funny you say that. This is about Bayonetta and Cloud, after all.

It does nothing positive, AT ALL.

Assertion. Here's the neat thing. People complain enough and the developers might just change things. Look at Meta Knight, for example. Or when they nerfed Little Mac's recovery, or Diddy Kong's hoo-hah. You get the idea. Even Sakurai knows that Cloud is too good because he thinks making characters in extremes is fun.

Unless you both are trolling, but I suspect not. It sounds a lot like a bandwagonish philosophy if you ask me, for one. And two, it is such an emotionally-charged illogical statement that it shouldn't be presented as if it is worthy of reasonable consideration.

I take it you're not aware of the fact that presenting evidence or logical arguments isn't going to necessarily convince anyone. It's called the backfire effect. You're actually better off persuading someone using pathos.

This is not opinion-based, it is fact-based.

Whatever you say.

The outright removal of characters because they are S-tiers is about as logical as removing Mario from Smash because he's too popular.

Removing a veteran character who is the face of Nintendo is probably not a good comparison.

Repeat this after me:"Cloud and Bayonetta can both be in Smash 5, and not be the exact same as they were in Smash 4."

No ****, Sherlock. Hence why I mentioned nerfing Bayonetta.

Cloud and Bayonetta SHOULD

"Should" is a preference. It's opinion-based.

Stop being so selfish and emotional as not to see the forest for the trees.

Selfish, huh? Well, I don't believe altruism actually exists, so I'll be selfish all I want. It's not any surprise that some people stopped playing the game competitively because of EZ Money.

All it does is make people feel bad about characters and have stigmas surrounding them simply because they out-perform the rest of the cast.

So? They're video game characters. They don't have feelings. Developers need to balance a game, otherwise it's just not enjoyable.

I find it incredible people actually want characters removed because they are (too)good competitively.

Nope. I actually want the roster to be reduced because it's too large.

Ridiculous.If they do get removed, will you both whine and beg for 5mash S tiers to be removed in Smash6?

Nope. Don't be so emotional.

Cut it out. Probably the same people who complain that Smash 4 Sonic shouldn't be able to spam Spin Dash.

Nope. Now who's being illogical?

 

[Gimj]

Funny you say that. This is about Bayonetta and Cloud, after all.

I'm sure that attitude graduates into a well-developed sense of skill in those matchups.

Assertion. Here's the neat thing. People complain enough and the developers might just change things. Look at Meta Knight, for example. Or when they nerfed Little Mac's recovery, or Diddy Kong's hoo-hah. You get the idea. Even Sakurai knows that Cloud is too good because he thinks making characters in extremes is fun.

It's actually not though. You both are suggesting the outright removal of characters because they outperform the rest. Complaining and supporting said philosophy does nothing positive, at all. So you believe removing Cloud and Bayonetta is positive? Do explain, I'm all ears(or eyes).

I take it you're not aware of the fact that presenting evidence or logical arguments isn't going to necessarily convince anyone. It's called the backfire effect. You're actually better off persuading someone using pathos.

I never said such a thing. People can, and do, refuse to accept both pathos and logos-charged arguments if it goes against their beliefs. It's a case by case basis. Thanks, but I'd rather not forgo logic and evidence when I don't have to. Let's not chase anymore red-herrings eh?

Removing a veteran character who is the face of Nintendo is probably not a good comparison.

The old "you can't use that analogy because of my incredulity" complaint. No, it is a perfect comparison because it makes absolutely zero sense to remove the face of Nintendo. In a similar way, it makes absolutely zero sense to remove Cloud and Bayonetta because they are top tier. The comparison doesn't make any sense, as does your "Cloud and Bayo should be removed" complaint.

No ****, Sherlock. Hence why I mentioned nerfing Bayonetta.

No Cloud or Bayo in the next smash.

What was your response again?

"My thoughts exactly."

You WANT both characters removed, but acknowledge that Bayonetta will most likely be added. What I am arguing against is the fact that your DESIRE to have them removed makes zero sense, not the probability of whether they will be added, Sherlock. If Bayonetta and Cloud could be balanced in Smash 5, don't you agree that they SHOULD be in the next game? And if you do, then how doesn't this invalidate your desire to have them removed, like Crosstails20?

"Should" is a preference. It's opinion-based.

It actually isn't. Sakurai supports this thinking directly, he doesn't like cutting characters for a reason. Cutting characters is a bad idea because it is the removal of content and the main appeal of Smash. Characters that were in Smash SHOULD stay because they were largely added based on principles of popularity, feasibility, and etc. It makes people play said characters and get attached to them, wanting them in the next game. The only time this is not the case is in extraordinary outlying circumstances, ie Snake, Pichu, Pokémon Trainer.

Selfish, huh? Well, I don't believe altruism actually exists, so I'll be selfish all I want. It's not any surprise that some people stopped playing the game competitively because of EZ Money.

Cool red-herring, but btw altruism exists. I'm sorry you live your life believing that, I genuinely feel sorry for you.

So? They're video game characters. They don't have feelings. Developers need to balance a game, otherwise it's just not enjoyable.

Not the video game characters...the FANS of the characters(you honestly think I'm talking about video game characters feelings...lol). I was never opposing balance, I am supporting it, hence my disagreement with you.

Nope. I actually want the roster to be reduced because it's too large.

​

Ah the arbitrary roster reduction claim is here too. Try rephrasing it to, "we should get rid of X characters because of Y reasons." Saying "because it's too large" says nothing because "too large" is subjective and the roster can be "large" but consist of CORE ICONIC video game characters. Not quantity, but quality. And if it consists of a "LARGE" number of QUALITY characters, then "reducing size because it's too large" becomes absurd. Your claim assumes that a large roster can't consist of quality characters. Smash 4 has great roster picks, and is largely successful at achieving what I alluded to.​

Nope. Don't be so emotional.

​

What happened to pathos? But thanks for proving my point.​

Nope. Now who's being illogical?

Grats you disproved a personal guesstimation(unless you're lying ofc) that I was perfectly aware that could be wrong. You missed the point though.

 

[CodakTheWarrior]

I will say that I will legitimately never understand the complete and utter hatred of some characters. If you don't like a character, that's totally fine! Just, please, stop wishing characters that tons of people really like and love to play as to be cut. If you don't like them, then just stop playing as them. Simple as that! I'm not going to go on a personal vendetta and wish for the removal of your main, so please have some level of decency and respect and do the same for me and others.

 

[MarioManTAW]

I will say that I will legitimately never understand the complete and utter hatred of some characters. If you don't like a character, that's totally fine! Just, please, stop wishing characters that tons of people really like and love to play as to be cut. If you don't like them, then just stop playing as them. Simple as that! I'm not going to go on a personal vendetta and wish for the removal of your main, so please have some level of decency and respect and do the same for me and others.

While I do agree, the problem for most isn't their enjoyment playing as the character, but against the character. Not much you can do about that.

 

[CodakTheWarrior]

While I do agree, the problem for most isn't their enjoyment playing as the character, but against the character. Not much you can do about that.

I get what you are saying, but it just seems uneccesarily hateful when's people just wish for characters to be cut. This is a crossover for goodness sake, it's supposed to have a ton of characters, I would say the more the merrier. That's like me saying I don't want Spider-Man to Ben in avenger 4 because I don't like him, it make sure no sense and is so pointless.

 

[Crystanium]

You know, it doesn't even matter.

 

[Gimj]

You know, it doesn't even matter.

It matters that you spread negativity throughout the community with purely emotional complaints; clamoring for characters to be removed due to selfish frustration and nonsense. Like I originally said, stop spreading the cancer that doesn't even begin to get off the ground in a positive or reasonable way. It's people like you that make the Smash scene worse because of your vocal unreasonable hatred. Think before you speak/type, please.

You know what? I really hate Samus. She's really annoying to play against because she has too many projectiles, and I don't like that. All she does is shoot me with charged shot and camp and it is really frustrating. So I want Samus removed in Smash 5.

...See my point?

Removing Cloud and Bayonetta from Smash 5 because they are "broken/too good/top tier/OP/annoying/they own me/I don't like them/I hate playing against them", will NEVER be valid nor be a positive thing to say in any detectable sense. I don't care if you admit you're wrong, I just hope you at least inwardly register how emotional and negative you are being by disregarding literally EVERYTHING but yourself. You complain about altruism not existing, yet proliferate egoism in your actions. Smash Bros doesn't revolve around your personal(illogical + emotional) taste, it revolves around ALL the Smash fans collectively. It's okay to have personal opinions, but when it is literally ONLY justified by your personal emotions(ignoring literally everything else), it becomes cancer.

I'm done.

 

[Crosstails20]

What was your response again?

You WANT both characters removed, but acknowledge that Bayonetta will most likely be added. What I am arguing against is the fact that your DESIRE to have them removed makes zero sense, not the probability of whether they will be added, Sherlock. If Bayonetta and Cloud could be balanced in Smash 5, don't you agree that they SHOULD be in the next game? And if you do, then how doesn't this invalidate your desire to have them removed, like Crosstails20?

Bayonetta and Cloud shouldn't be in the game, period. Why do you think Snake got removed because he had nothing in common with the other fighters in terms of original game, he hasn't been on a Nintendo console in a very long time and doesn't hold any significance to development of Nintendo or Video Games. R.O.B. played a huge role in reviving the video game industry, Duck Hunt helped introduce the peripheral shooters, Pac Man was an influential part of the video game industry and part of Bandi Namco one of the developers of Smash 4, Game and Watch is a huge part of Nintendo's history, Sonic also played a huge role in video games. What did Snake do, close to nothing. Same can be said to Cloud who has no connection with Nintendo until Smash. Bayo is hated amongst most of the community and I don't think most players have to learn one technique just to play against her. With the removal of Bayonetta, it will increase the player number of Smash by decreasing the number of people who rage quit.

Also, your claim on S tier characters is completely wrong, I am fine with Diddy and everyone else because they make sense to be in Smash, while Cloud and Bayo are the most out of place characters in Smash 4. And the thread is titled
Which fake leak/rumour do you wish was real?
Not judge others opinion on fake rumours
If anyone is spreading cancer it is you. Now that is out of the way I would appreciate this thread to be locked to stop this silly argument.

 

[FrostyPlayZ]

Bayo had the same amount of landing lag as bowser.

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

Honestly, Gematsu/Sal Romano. If the newcomers we got were capped at Chrom & the Chorus Kids, it would've made for a much more self-contained & deeper base roster than the kitchen sink Smash 4 became.

 

[MarioManTAW]

Is anyone considering the reason Cloud and Bayonetta were added in the first place? The Smash Ballot! Bayo was the highest character* and Cloud was the highest character from the Final Fantasy series, which had a significant presence with Nintendo.

 

[Gimj]

Bayonetta and Cloud shouldn't be in the game, period. Why do you think Snake got removed because he had nothing in common with the other fighters in terms of original game, he hasn't been on a Nintendo console in a very long time and doesn't hold any significance to development of Nintendo or Video Games. R.O.B. played a huge role in reviving the video game industry, Duck Hunt helped introduce the peripheral shooters, Pac Man was an influential part of the video game industry and part of Bandi Namco one of the developers of Smash 4, Game and Watch is a huge part of Nintendo's history, Sonic also played a huge role in video games. What did Snake do, close to nothing. Same can be said to Cloud who has no connection with Nintendo until Smash. Bayo is hated amongst most of the community and I don't think most players have to learn one technique just to play against her. With the removal of Bayonetta, it will increase the player number of Smash by decreasing the number of people who rage quit.

Also, your claim on S tier characters is completely wrong, I am fine with Diddy and everyone else because they make sense to be in Smash, while Cloud and Bayo are the most out of place characters in Smash 4. And the thread is titled
Which fake leak/rumour do you wish was real?
Not judge others opinion on fake rumours
If anyone is spreading cancer it is you. Now that is out of the way I would appreciate this thread to be locked to stop this silly argument.

Don't respond if you don't want to argue. I will agree, this is a pretty silly argument. I can't believe I have to say what I'm saying.


So you truly believe Cloud and Bayonetta SHOULDN'T be in the game? Did you realize that they were added in Smash 4 or did you forget they were playable? Don't you get that Masahiro Sakurai added Cloud and Bayonetta in Smash 4 on purpose? That alone debunks your entire post. I literally don't have to say anything else, because they are already in the game. What you think should or shouldn't be in the game is quite demonstrably not accurate, hence them being added in the first place. Again, your standards do not evidently match Sakurai's(reality). It's not about "what characters do for gaming" and how "impactful" they were to gaming revolutions.

Pit, debunks you.
Ice Climbers, debunk you.
Roy debunks you.

Snake got removed because he was a special case. He was only added as a favor to a friend of Sakurai's that begged him to be in the game. It makes sense he was a one-time thing.

The only standard for a Smash character addition is: originated from a video game. Can you point me to one singular time Sakurai or Nintendo stated that "new characters to Smash have to be all-stars or historic video game icons to be in Smash"? You can't, and there are already characters IN THE ROSTER without said qualifications.

Another reason Bayonetta should be in Smash is because she won the Ballot. Did you forget about that or not know about it? I honestly don't know.

"Let's get rid of the Smash Ballot winner because there is a small vocal minority who hate her and think she will be the same in Smash 5." Makes sense....

Bayo is hated amongst most of the community and I don't think most players have to learn one technique just to play against her. With the removal of Bayonetta, it will increase the player number of Smash by decreasing the number of people who rage quit.

Repeat this after me(again):

"Cloud and Bayonetta can both be in Smash 5, and not be the exact same as they were in Smash 4."

Bayonetta is not immune to balance changes, just a friendly reminder. Her game code can in fact be edited in Smash 5(and Smash 4). And if her coding can be edited, she can be changed. If she can be changed, she can be (more)balanced. So your quote above is literally demonstrably invalid. Why are you afraid of the obvious? I just don't get it.

Do you remember Meta Knight in Brawl? Can you take a guess what happened to him from Brawl to Smash 4? Is he the same? Is he S tier still? Didn't the "competitive players" not like and consider banning him? Wasn't he too good? Wasn't he causing "rage quits"? Did he cause controversy? Wasn't he "cancer"? hmmm...

Cloud and Bayo are the most out of place characters in Smash 4

You forgot Ryu. I do not agree Cloud is out of place at all, actually. Bayo and Ryu maybe, but now I feel they fit just fine(thanks to the artistic direction). My personal opinions aside, this too is not a reason they "shouldn't" be in Smash 5.

If these characters were too "out of place" to be in Smash 4...THEY WOULDN'T BE ADDED INTO SMASH 4 IN THE FIRST PLACE. Do you truly not understand this or just not want to understand? I'm not even a Bayonetta fanboy, but I just hate non-arguments made against characters being cut. You literally have no legitimate reason to remove them from Smash. None at all. You have zero arguments. Just personal selfish emotions, which makes this all come full circle yet again.

I hate the way Bowser Jr was implemented into Smash. Do you see me begging, whining, and/or complaining for him to be removed? Even I recognize there is a degree of "genius" to his design to where he is a proxy for the Koopalings(whom I also don't like). I recognize OTHER PEOPLE LIKE THESE CHARACTERS, and so I do not spread my "hatred" for no reason. More importanly, I don't delude myself into thinking Bowser Jr will or should be removed because I personally don't like him conceptually(though I think my "opinion" is more sensible than yours). I wish what I want would happen, but I know the world doesn't revolve around me. Get your head out of the sand.

 

[SethTheMage]

The "Super Smash Bros. Channel" that arose upon the discovery of the Forbidden 7, which happened in the month between the Japanese and worldwide release of Brawl. IIRC, people thought that this channel would be added soon after the game got localized, and it would be a way of adding DLC to the game. Dixie was my most wanted newcomer, and Mewtwo and Roy were two of my Melee mains at the time (the other being Young Link who also got the axe in Brawl), so I was really hoping this rumor was real.

EDIT:Whoops; didn't realize this was in the Wii U/3DS board. Sorry. For Smash 4, it would be the rumors for the Wii U version on 4chan after the 3DS version came out (I believe this was the Tower of Smash leak). It said that Ridley, Dixie, Ice Climbers, and Wolf were on the Wii U version and would come as DLC for the 3DS version.