Where you AGT? The Official Toon Link General Discussion/ Video Thread!

[`dazrin]

.. Didn't even say that...?

Get out of my thread, neko. Lol

 

[BRLNK88]

16-man invitational.

hrmmmm... Mango, Hbox, Armada, Kage, Axe, Vro, Metroid, Chillin, who else?

Totally guessing on those, lol.

 

[GHNeko]

daze.

obviously.

 

[Deleted member]

Mango barely plays P:M iirc. I don't know if any top melee players really even play P:M much lol.

 

[BRLNK88]

I know for a fact both Axe and Kage play a good amount.

 

[GHNeko]

I thought Kage gave this game up because of Lucario in 2.1.

 

[`dazrin]

Getting off topic, guys. :b

 

[GHNeko]

So how and when to use SH Zair?

 

[Deleted member]

I personally short hop and then air dodge towards or away from my opponent and zair. (Not too early though, or theres no hitbox) I find that if you're trying to retreat or approach this can work well.

 

[Jolteon]

I really like zair as a poke when someone's cornered.

 

[Shadic]

You don't even know how to recover with your own character js ;b

Didn't I show you how to AGT?

We gotta Toon Link dittos sometime soon. Or I could just go Link.

I'm like a DBZ character, holding back my true form. That's why I play lazy characters instead of the Links. :D

 

[Dubforce]

http://www.smashboards.com/images/smilies/alakadoof.png

 

[Yung Mei]

i went tink at GC, but only my match against Ciz got recorded


because i went DK first game and got ****ed up, then went Tink and lost because i accidentally saved him when his recovery fell short ;_;

i played a charizard player as Falcon, and then lost, then won 2 games using Tink, but it wasnt recorded

 

[`dazrin]

Good stuff, Calvo Way to represent haha. Sorry I couldn't be there, but I'll try to go next time.

Didn't I show you how to AGT?

We gotta Toon Link dittos sometime soon. Or I could just go Link.

I'm like a DBZ character, holding back my true form. That's why I play lazy characters instead of the Links. :D

Lol naw, Frenum showed me how to AGT. Your method is jank. And I'm always down for some Tink dittos or Tink vs Link.. even though I'm terrible at those MUs lol.

So how and when to use SH Zair?

I use zair very rarely, but I find it's useful for spacing and poking in instances where it would be unsafe to nair. It's basically a longer range, safer, and weaker alternative to nair. Kind of situational, but useful when you just can't quite get in range or afraid to challenge certain moves. It's also safer to zair a shield than to nair a shield, since nairing a shield can result in a shieldgrab.

 

[OkamiBW]

So how and when to use SH Zair?

Pull a bomb. Short hop, drop it, Air dodge backwards and z-air.

Advanced dribbling.

 

[BRLNK88]

I thought Kage gave this game up because of Lucario in 2.1.

I find that difficult to believe, Ganon/Lucario isn't that bad.
Plus Kage plays Street Fighter, after which Lucario is modeled. AND, PM Ganon >> Melee Ganon.

Can TL still air grab? #ontopic

 

[`dazrin]

Calvo: Is this you?- http://youtu.be/vTjyffjIMOI?t=2m10s

Going to add it to the OP, but I just need to make sure I don't mistake you for someone else, since you seem to have entered as "meilong" at GC.

And yeah BL, Kage quit this game for awhile because of 2.1 Lucario shenanigans. Said that "he defied the laws of smash" and was pretty frustrated about it, which is very understandable, and is something we looked into for 2.5. Pretty sure he's back now though lol. And yes, TL can still grab people out of the air. However, one of the global changes made in 2.5 was hurtbox grabability. In 2.1, it was possible to grab limbs, whereas in Melee, it is not. In 2.5, hurtbox grabability has been matched to Melee, so it's a little more difficult to get grabs out of the air now, though it's still possible.

On another note: Watch as Okami gets exposed by Bowser on some of the easiest stages to fight a Bowser as TL.

huehuehueh

 

[GHNeko]

Okami y u bad.

But on a serious note: That was pretty entertaining haha. It's a shame he didnt try to use grounded up b to try and gimp badguy when he recovered to high.

That or dsmash. I saw some opportunities to dsmash at the ledge lol.

 

[OkamiBW]

I give up. Done. :/

 

[GHNeko]

We love you okami. <3

You're got the most recoveringest Tink around.

 

[Shadic]

Except when Bowser is around. That just isn't fair.

 

[Deleted member]

Good job Shadic.
Good job.

 

[Yung Mei]

yeah thats me ;w;


and its meiling, not meilong :3c

 

[BRLNK88]

Link seems to be a better pick against Bowser than TL.
TL's light weight and general lack of range really work against him, and the fact that Bowser's defensive options run counter to his strategy.
Link can at least survive longer, can compete with Bowser's range and has better killing power, even if he's slower.
They both combo Bowser hard, but Bowser basically only needs 3 or 4 solid hits to kill TL.

 

[Deleted member]

You can take on bowser as long as you zone him out. Just don't get put on a small or bull**** stage and youll be fine. I will agree that link might do better, but theres no problem using TL as long as you're not bad.

 

[Dubforce]

Toon link is growing to be one of my favorites. I think his zoning has improved a lot. Is it me or are his bombs buffed as far as the time it takes to pull one out?

 

[`dazrin]

Bomb pulls are slightly slower, Ellondu.

 

[`dazrin]

Double post for epic justice:

Ishieymoro's amazing TL combo

 

[BRLNK88]

Double post for epic justice:

Ishieymoro's amazing TL combo

I've actually done that... quite a bit, lol, no offense to Ish.
bair -> fire spike is a legit combo on any character at certain percents.
Works best on big, heavy characters, so its still legit it pull it off on a tiny character like Ness.

 

[`dazrin]

Yeah, it is BL lol. But it's the moment and the reactions that really make it epic haha (for me, anyways lol)

 

[Gimpyfish62]

Y'ALL TALKIN BoUT

BOWSER?

 

[`dazrin]

The post + your avatar is a pretty epic combo.

 

[Ishiey]

We are now ;D

Yeah, bair > fire spike is legit for sure. I just rarely get to set it up at %s where it will work, and off of a combo starting at 0% too lol. T'was good fun :3

 

[Dubforce]

I've actually done that... quite a bit, lol, no offense to Ish.
bair -> fire spike is a legit combo on any character at certain percents.
Works best on big, heavy characters, so its still legit it pull it off on a tiny character like Ness.

Salty as ****. That was sick ishy.

 

[GHNeko]

Double post for epic justice:

Ishieymoro's amazing TL combo

Look at all that PJSalt

 

[GunBlaze]

Double post for epic justice:

Ishieymoro's amazing TL combo

There was so many...

 

[BRLNK88]

Any tips on how to edgeguard ZSS?

I'm also finding that Mario is a tough MU. He's surprisingly difficult to combo, and he has some really nasty combos on TL. His fireballs can also really disrupt your projectile game, and he can easily cape your recovery.

 

[`dazrin]

Yeah I agree with that, BrownLink. Mario is one of TL's harder MU's imo.

Here's something I wrote on Smashmods a long time ago. This was during the 2.1 days, so take it with a grain of salt.

Spoiler

I think Mario is one of Toon Link's hardest match-ups. There aren't very many competent and dedicated Mario mains in my area, so it could be that it's just hard for me to practice and gain MU experience. But even bad players who play Mario can give me a difficult time, and playing against Mang0's drunk Mario was extremely difficult. The main reason why Mario is so good against Toon Link is because of his cape. His cape, when used correctly, is the answer to everything Toon Link does because it nullifies Toon Link's projectile game, which in turn, stuffs all of Toon Link's bread-n-butter projectile approaches and severely nerfs his camping ability. His cape can also gimp TLs recovery, and it's not even very difficult to do. On top of that, Mario has his own great projectile that he can abuse, forcing Toon Link to find a way to deal with Mario's fireballs ON TOP of the projectiles that get reflected at himself. When done correctly, it forces Toon Link to only rely on bombs and nairs for approaches, which can easily be telegraphed by the Mario player.

Another thing that makes the match-up difficult is Mario's grab game. Mario is extremely solid in this area and can CG TL at low to mid %'s. Mario also has a great edgeguarding game; doc bair and mario/doc fair, nair.. pretty much all Mario needs to do is throw out an aerial offstage and TL is as good as dead. Not to mention that Mario's dair CUTS right through TLs up-b CLEANLY.

He is just everything that TL is weak against fused into one character:
- A way to nullify TL's projectile game
- An easy way to gimp TL's recovery
- A great projectile to stuff TL's approaches
- Great grab game
- Great offstage/edgeguarding game
- Dair outprioritizes everything

Looking back at this in hindsight, (I wrote those in the early days when 2.0 was just released) I was very projectile heavy back then, and I wasn't very smart. I still think Mario is a decently hard MU, but I don't think it's as bad as I exagerated it to be in that post. You're just required to play more CQC against Mario and spam much less. You can combo him pretty well, but he combos you very well also. He can also out edgeguard a TL, so IDK. I still think it's a hard MU but I think it's much easier in 2.5 considering TL's adjustments in his CQC game.

 

[Yung Mei]

so...

i wasnt the only one who thought marios dair slaps the **** out of tink in general?


good

 

[OkamiBW]

I think if you grab the edge and then click back, z-air, back, z-air, back, z-air, you can have invincibility all throughout Mario's Up-B.