What hits the faster? N.air or Up+b?

[Dogysamich]

yeah, I'm lookin for whichever move hits the fastest, as to break up combos.

___

On a sidenote, we sure do need alot of things on the doc thread.

A frame data guide would be nice. D:

 

[Dr.Feelgood]

do you use up+B as one of ur combo moves? like is that move combined with ur other moves. or do you use that as like a finisher?

cuz alot of the time that move can leave you wide open for another attack. imo you should just stick with N-Air. unless they are at like 200% damage then the up+B can kill them, but any other pecentage below 200, it wouldnt be wise to use up+b

 

[St. Viers]

Dr.Feelgood: you can cancel the upB if you want to use it in combos.
Dogy is wondering which is more useful in disrupting other peoples combos, not to combo someone else.

 

[Dogysamich]

Dogy is wondering which is more useful in disrupting other peoples combos, not to combo someone else.

Quoted incase i was unclear.

That's exactly what I want to know. Cause getting combo'd is not fun.

 

[Vudu]

i often use the upB as a combo disrupter! no one usually expects it cuz it Can leave you wide open. but you can cancel it...and if you use it at the right time when stoping a combo...then it works well

 

[$ick]

How do you cancel it?

 

[Vudu]

you just have to L cancel right is all. just try timing it right

 

[St. Viers]

$ick,don't listen to this kid.
Vudu, don't say things you don;t know..you can't l-cancel B moves

The upB cancel is holding the up and to a direction (but not so far horizantal that you cape). Then hit be and as quick as you can flick the control stick to the opposite direction you were holding.
*Doc should pop them up and then turn around on the ground it you switch directions too quickly you wil simply upB the wrong way. It takes timing but is useful. You can perform it out of the shield, meaning that if a fox/falco is sloppy, you can smack them out of drill shining your shield.

but this is off-topic: I'm sure if either of you searched doc, upB cancel you could have found this out yourself....

 

[$ick]

Ya I knew you couldn't l-cancel any b moves that's why I was like how the hell can you cancel an up-b?? Heh, thanks.

 

[maXXXpower]

I just started using Doc's UP-B in the same manner that Samus uses her Screw Attack to get people away from her. It seems to work alright, but is this very wise? I know shield-grabbing is an option, but what if the opponent is behind you? What other options do I have. I'm just curious. Thanks.

 

[$ick]

Whenever I play Doc, I spend most of the match trying to get close to whom ever I'm fighting so I wouldn't use up-b in that manner but that's just imo. Your sig is cool lol.

 

[Kashakunaki]

I would think Up+B for simple reason. In order to Nair you have to do some sort of jump then attack where as Up B can be performed from whatever position you may be in. I don't use it as such... I just perfer to get comboed I guess.

 

[maXXXpower]

You guys wouldn't use Up-B out of shield? What I meant to say is that I use it out of shield when I'm being pressured too much like against a pillaring space animal. I just started doing this yesterday, but I should probably use something else. Any ideas?

Thanks $ick--my crewmate Vato makes awesome sigs.

 

[yomedrath]

i think what dogy wants to know what which attack comes out faster, so you can get it between a combo (means while beeing hit), so lag doesnt matter right now O.o

i dont think i can help, but just of my own feeling i´d say the nair comes out a bit faster... but you can get more dmg in with a upB or not?
but when i´m beeing comboed sometimes i just start pressing A and foregt all about DI XD i think DI is better than N-air XD

 

[St. Viers]

I'm pretty sure that upB hits quicker, but we really need someone with AR/frame data instead of random people guessing,,,

 

[yomedrath]

yay ^^ i´m "random ppl guessing"

well, i just tried to get everything back on topic, i think ppl were missunderstanding everything a bit... like "upB out of shield" and stuff ...

 

[St. Viers]

^I'm not insulting you (I include myself as a random person guessing) but I think that until someone with AR checks this out discussing it is with opinions (mine included) is pointless.

 

[Kashakunaki]

I think it is obvious Up Bing out of shield is quicker than Nairing. Just use common sense. Think of it in terms of geometry. The quickest way to get from point A to point B is a line, right? In this case, that is Up Bing out of shield. No matter your circumstance it is a one step process where as Nairing has multiple steps. First you have to jump and then Nair. So you can also look at it like this: Up Bing takes only the time it takes you to enter the button combination and the attack's start up time while Nairing takes the frame it takes you to hit the jump button, the start up frames of the jump, and then you add the start up frames of the Nair. I think it is pretty obvious which is quicker.

 

[hhliveson]

what makes the up-b a better choice in disrupting is the fact that it has a very high priority, much higher than the nair.

 

[maXXXpower]

The original question was a bit hard to understand. If it's an orthodox combo from underneath, it wouldn't make sense to use Up-B because of the punishment. And if the combo is from above, it wouldn't make too much sense to use a Sex Kick. An AR would really help out...

 

[BigRick]

They both come out in 3 frames... also up+b has an invicibility frame.

http://www.angelfire.com/games5/superdoodleman/Dr._Mario_frames_11.6.05.txt (credit to SDM)

That will cost ya'll a pack of cookies.

EDIT: because they both have a 3 frame startup, up+B out of shield would be quicker than Nair out of shield

 

[Dogysamich]

They both come out in 3 frames... also up+b has an invicibility frame.

http://www.angelfire.com/games5/superdoodleman/Dr._Mario_frames_11.6.05.txt (credit to SDM)

That will cost ya'll a pack of cookies.

EDIT: because they both have a 3 frame startup, up+B out of shield would be quicker than Nair out of shield

Hey, that's actually very useful. Where'd that come from? That frame data thing that I could never get to work? :/

 

[BigRick]

Well the frame data was put together by SuperDoodleMan (SDM) the guy that did the Perfect Control video if you've seen it.

There's more on his website: http://www.angelfire.com/games5/superdoodleman/frames.html

 

[Kashakunaki]

It doesn't matter if they have the same start up. Up B you can do immediately but before you can even Nair you have to jump, which adds on to the start up lag.

 

[Dogysamich]

It doesn't matter if they have the same start up. Up B you can do immediately but before you can even Nair you have to jump, which adds on to the start up lag.

Well if you're getting pillared by falco, or darkreign'd by falcon (whatever the u.air combo for falcon is called), we can safely assume you're in the air and you're gunna get ***** if you dont do something. >.<

 

[Kashakunaki]

If you are in the air then I would say Nair for multiple reasons, but first I must address this:

Well if you're getting pillared by falco

Pillaring is a shield pressure technique, not a shine combo.

Okay, Nair is what I'd say then. Not so much it is a good choice, but that Up B is a worse one. Up B covers a mostly vertical ground with about a thirty degree angle. So if they are anything but above you, Up B wouldn't be a good choice. Nair lasts much longer and covers the front of you. What would I choice over both Nair and Up+B (if I was in the air)? Uair. Quicker, decent priority, covers a largerer arc, more range, quicker in general. Or airdodge.

Overall, given Up B and Nair, I'd say Nair unless you are Up Bing out of shield. Given Up B, Nair, and Uair. I'd say Uair.

 

[yomedrath]

uair? are you sure?
until it´ll hit behind you it last a long time... and i dont think the priority is much better than a nair...
and well, if your trying to do an UpB while the opponent is juggling you you´re just plain stupid -.-
of course its situational, but if your going to be hit by a slap or a bair or something , (you´ll fly away anyways, i know) i think the upB would do more good...
eventhough... i think this question isnt going to be answered XD too many possibilitys

cya :D

 

[Tera253]

Tear's been in this same position, and for her, it's always been the same answer:
"It depends on the circumsances".
other than that, she usually uses up+B.
(and, Doc is like her 6th or 7th best. t's not like she mains him or anything, so apologies for any n00bishnesS)
~Tera253s

 

[Mix]

up b cancel bottom line.