We need to make serious improvements

[Aggromidget]

what is this **** about focusing on reaction instead of reads ffs

Haven't read through this thread yet.
I'm guessing that when most people "read", they're just guessing.
You can influence the way they move/react to you. The one big read that I've seen is Mango vs Hungrybox at EVO on FoD. On Hbox's final stock where he is at high percent, he's in shield near the edge. Mango is closer the the ledge as fox, dashes past and charges a huge u-smash, which Hbox rolls into. The following method is the most basic way I try to read people - after a throw, I initiate a dash in the opposite direction. This is based on the fact that they're on the defensive and see a free way to get away from you.
You can also "read" them by realising if they're a defensive person, they may prefer to roll inwards towards the centerstage/away from edge. You may realise that they're aggressive and prefer to tech in place.
Personally, I'm not that good at reads, so I prefer to rely on grabs+throws, regrabs, throwing them onto platforms, and then into air.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFtGQRm1bTg

required watching for anyone who wants to be good
reading is everything, it's not just something you employ to try and get an extra hit in every now and then
it is literally woven into every other game element at high levels of play

 

[gravy]

I refer strictly to using reactions in tech chases because I think it makes falcon much better, of course I'm going to use reads a ton. I'd rather be in the right place always for a tech chase and read that they're going to utilt on wakeup or whatever than just guess with knees and stomps all the time. Granted they're educated guesses, but still guesses.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

shouldn't be guesses dude
99% of players are dumb, true facts
just got to apply yourself to thinking, and being one step ahead of them
instead of just hoping you can out-smart them with your auto-pilot reading comprehension

know what im sayin

 

[gravy]

I just disagree. Not a single falcon player in the world can get every tech chase off a pure read, in fact none even get 50%, I don't care how #mangonation you are. And giving up such a great opportunity to go for a stupid stomp is bad play.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

you misunderstand me
I'm saying to aim as high as you can, I realize no one can actually get every read perfect every time lol

and it shouldn't be about 'guesses', you should always be making what feels like the right decision
if you don't have the read that doesn't mean you should go "welp time to throw some dice"
it means you should go for something you ARE sure about, like just covering yourself with a sh nair or some ****

 

[gravy]

I think we agree more than it seems them. In my eyes if I have a tech chase set up that I am sure I can react pretty well to put myself in a good position.

 

[DuckPimp]

its not like reaction is unimportant

it fills in the space between reads, allows you to press your advantage, get in in specific prepared circumstances, and allows you to gain momentum and information that you use to read people

 

[Zeallyx]

I think Dair->up b is a legit damager racker at lower percentages.

Actually, I think well timed up b's are a hidden gem altogether (tech chasing at lower percentages, combo ending at lower percentages and OOS punishing).

 

[Ziodyne]

what exactly does dair -> up-b do well that dair -> grab, knee, uair, etc. does not

 

[Zeallyx]

I thought it did more damage, but 15% indeed isn't that big of a deal.

Also, on the topic of edge guarding: in some situations a reversed Uair by WDing off of the side of the stage works wonders.
But I guess this too is beaten by better alternatives. My former Brawl mentality might still be involved a bit here.

 

[gravy]

It can be useful for VERY niche tech chases, like if you used a double jump to bait an opponent on top plat into get up attacking and he gets up after you fall through.

 

[Ziodyne]

don't worry, wasn't being sarcastic. it's good though to critically analyze options to make sure they're actual legit

reverse WD uair sounds interesting, but i'm not sure what options you'd be trying to cover with it. i'm thinking a lot more about uair ledge regrab, because it seems like it can help cover a lot

up-b always seems silly to me, but being honest it should be pretty awesome falcon has such a command grab, even if it sucks donkey **** when it misses. all people do on platforms against falcon is hold shield, so up-b sounds god like

gonna try to play someone and see how it works

 

[gravy]

Use it oos if a spacie or sheik is tilting the back of your shield, I promise you.

 

[SAUS]

Use it oos if a spacie or sheik is tilting the back of your shield, I promise you.

Haha that's actually pretty funny. It could be a really good way to OOS punish when they are behind you (where normally falcon can't do much).

For me, I've been finding a lot of success (and have been finding it for a damn long time) with heavily delayed up-airs. You can use them to tech chase, shield poke, and even edge-guard from a distance. It also works in juggling cases where your opponent gets out of their hit stun. You can double jump to chase them if they jump and if they don't you can just hit them with the up-air.

It's the whole attack-by-doing-nothing concept. If you leave your options open while your opponent has limited options, they have very few ways to get away.

 

[gravy]

I like to aerials in a way that I consciously separate the jump and the aerial, so usually I jump in and finally decide that uair would work. But yah, that hitbox is amazing. Low and right in front of you, like a super fast dtilt.