We Can Do It! - The Female DLC Character Discussion and Support Thread

[Deleted member]

I guess I'll be the first to say that I'd like to see Mona (from WarioWare) come to Smash Bros.

Honestly, I guess I'm biased for saying it, but it leaves a bit of a weird taste in my mouth to see that Mona didn't make GameXplain's 'Top 100 Females for Smash' list...

It's their list, but hey, you could still do support!

Well only time will tell if we get more female fighters in this 2nd pass (i`m actually rooting for 2 or 3 more). Also unlike buying the whole pass like i did with the 1st one (which i still regret doing so) i`m just gonna buy the DLC individually for the sake of this.

Well, the probability that a DLC pack could be all male is quite nigh...but hey, maybe Sakurai will get his **** together and actually add some female characters. Here's hoping.

I'm also planning to buy only Joker, Terry, and Byleth in the first pass. Here's to more female DLC, and please make it enough for me to shut up and have themselves take my money.

 

[zipzapsparkle]

Not to be shady but I always notice that for lists talking about female characters people dismiss Pauline a lot but somehow obscure and less prominent characters like Captain Syrup are in such lists. Pauline is a popular and significant character. I’m just glad Gamexplain notes her importance because Smash fanbase underrates her, and the Mario girls in general.

Anyhow I also support a few female characters. Pauline, Lara Croft, Kos-Mos and such. Although some of my mw have been sadly deconfirmed. (Poor Edelgard)

 

[Deleted member]

Not to be shady but I always notice that for lists talking about female characters people dismiss Pauline a lot but somehow obscure and less prominent characters like Captain Syrup are in such lists. Pauline is a popular and significant character. I’m just glad Gamexplain notes her importance because Smash fanbase underrates her, and the Mario girls in general.

Anyhow I also support a few female characters. Pauline, Lara Croft, Kos-Mos and such. Although some of my mw have been sadly deconfirmed. (Poor Edelgard)

Well, she does have the bigger legacy, though coming off the dust, people can't easily think of a moveset for her. Don't get me wrong; she has potential.

Well...just play Byleth with the Edie alt as the closest thing to do.

 

[Emelie]

Not to be shady but I always notice that for lists talking about female characters people dismiss Pauline a lot but somehow obscure and less prominent characters like Captain Syrup are in such lists. Pauline is a popular and significant character. I’m just glad Gamexplain notes her importance because Smash fanbase underrates her, and the Mario girls in general.

Anyhow I also support a few female characters. Pauline, Lara Croft, Kos-Mos and such. Although some of my mw have been sadly deconfirmed. (Poor Edelgard)

Maybe it's because Pauline didn't get much development until Odyssey.

The version of Pauline (that most older fans are familiar with) is only called "The Lady" and doesn't have any dialogue so I guess I could understand why people who only know Pauline/The Lady from Donkey Kong wouldn't be too excited about her.

I guess Pauline (blonde old version) had more character in the Donkey Kong cartoon but it's so obscure. I'm a huge Pauline fan but I didn't even know about until recently.

It would be nice if Smash opened up the possibility for Pauline to be in more bigger games instead of just small cameos in spin-off games.

Kind of weird that they prioritized Daisy over Pauline since Odyssey was still fairly new when Ultimate was released.

 

[Deleted member]

Kind of weird that they prioritized Daisy over Pauline since Odyssey was still fairly new when Ultimate was released

To be fair, Daisy is an Echo Fighter, which meant that it would take less time to produce her compared to Pauline. This reasoning is also applicable as to why we gor Ken instead of Chun Li.

 

[WeirdSandwich]

Not to be shady but I always notice that for lists talking about female characters people dismiss Pauline a lot but somehow obscure and less prominent characters like Captain Syrup are in such lists. Pauline is a popular and significant character. I’m just glad Gamexplain notes her importance because Smash fanbase underrates her, and the Mario girls in general.

Anyhow I also support a few female characters. Pauline, Lara Croft, Kos-Mos and such. Although some of my mw have been sadly deconfirmed. (Poor Edelgard)

I like Pauline but most people would dismiss her chances since she already has a cameo appearance on the New Donk City stage. I'd prefer Captain Syrup because it would give Wario Land more rep, and it would be easier to give her a moveset, being a pirate and all.

 

[Jasper the Tourist]

I feel like the Smash team has really blown it on female character inclusion. The biggest offense, imo, is the lack of Dixie Kong (who is one of my favorite Nintendo characters and the only missing Nintendo "all star", if you will). I also feel like they screwed up with the FE characters. I'm not super familiar with the series, but I know there are a boatload of female characters and I think they often have the more interesting designs. And even I know that Lyn should have been put in the series long ago. They could have even made the small gesture of making fem Corrin and fem Byleth the defaults as they are clearly the more popular designs, yet they failed to do that. I agree that representation is important. I think Jill from Resident Evil would have been a great pick, but it looks like that's not happening.

 

[fogbadge]

Dixie Kong (who is one of my favorite Nintendo characters and the only missing Nintendo "all star", if you will).

she isnt

 

[crazybenjamin]

she isnt

This does raise the question, what is the definition of an "all-star?"

 

[Deleted member]

I feel like the Smash team has really blown it on female character inclusion. The biggest offense, imo, is the lack of Dixie Kong (who is one of my favorite Nintendo characters and the only missing Nintendo "all star", if you will). I also feel like they screwed up with the FE characters. I'm not super familiar with the series, but I know there are a boatload of female characters and I think they often have the more interesting designs. And even I know that Lyn should have been put in the series long ago. They could have even made the small gesture of making fem Corrin and fem Byleth the defaults as they are clearly the more popular designs, yet they failed to do that. I agree that representation is important. I think Jill from Resident Evil would have been a great pick, but it looks like that's not happening.

That is also a disappointment going into Smash Ultimate. Smash 4 added many females, back when the only ones were Peach, Zelda, and Samus. But now it looks like they're not taking it into consideration anymore...

 

[fogbadge]

This does raise the question, what is the definition of an "all-star?"

i meant she isnt the only missing nintendo all star rather than she isnt an all star to be clear

 

[TheYungLink]

To be fair to fogbadge , I can agree that Toad / Toadette are big omissions. However, Toad still has a major presence as a summon character for Peach and Daisy. Dixie Kong is only in the game as a Spirit and a Mii hat, so she feel's more "missing" to us Dixie fans.

 

[Arcadenik]

I don’t care about the gender. These are the characters (who happen to be female) I would like to see in Smash.

Mario series
Birdo
Toadette (Toad Echo Fighter)

Donkey Kong series
Dixie Kong
Pauline

Zelda series
Impa
Toon Zelda

Star Fox series
Krystal

Pokémon series
Meowth & Team Rocket (Jessie is female so...)

Fire Emblem series
Lyn

Kid Icarus series
Medusa

Pikmin series
Louie / Brittany (semi clone of Olimar / Alph with Rock Pikmin)

Mii series
Wandering Hero (one of the alternate costumes would be the Princess from Find Mii)

Splatoon series
Octoling

Other Nintendo series
Balloon Fighter / Alice the Balloon Kid
Lip from Panel de Pon

Pac-Man series
Ms. Pac-Man

Street Fighter series
Chun-Li (with both costumes from original Street Fighter II and Street Fighter Alpha)

Final Fantasy series
Terra Branford from Final Fantasy VI

Castlevania series
Shanoa from Order of Ecclesia (but I want Alucard and Soma Cruz more)

Fatal Fury series
Mai Shiranui (alter her clothes a bit so she will be appropriate enough for good boys and girls)

Other third-party series
Amaterasu from Okami
Lara Croft from Tomb Raider
Morrigan from Darkstalkers
Shantae

 

[fogbadge]

To be fair to fogbadge , I can agree that Toad / Toadette are big omissions. However, Toad still has a major presence as a summon character for Peach and Daisy. Dixie Kong is only in the game as a Spirit and a Mii hat, so she feel's more "missing" to us Dixie fans.

us toad fans still feel hes missing, no matter how much he does with peach

 

[crazybenjamin]

However, Toad still has a major presence as a summon character for Peach and Daisy.

I'd argue that Toad's presence in Peach's moveset is a mere afterthought. "Major presence" would more accurately describe Luma or Kazooie.

 

[TheYungLink]

us toad fans still feel hes missing, no matter how much he does with peach

I'd argue that Toad's presence in Peach's moveset is a mere afterthought. "Major presence" would more accurately describe Luma or Kazooie.

Both of you, I never said Toad wasn't missing. I just said that Dixie feels more missing. Dixie Kong is not an assist trophy or a stage cameo or part of a special move or anything like that, only a spirit and a Mii hat.

 

[Jasper the Tourist]

I mean, Dixie is an all star in my mind because she is a main character in what is regarded one of the best sidescroller platforms and SNES games of all time (DKC2) and was the main star of its sequal, not to mention her role in Tropical Freeze, another highly regarded Nintendo platformer. I think she qualifies to be part of the club.

 

[sbhouse12345]

I mean this with all due respect. I don't understand why you guys care so much about the lack of female characters. Don't get me wrong, there's tons of female reps I want. But I want them in smash simply because I think they would be cool characters, not because of diversity or female representation. Shouldn't we really focus on the fact that smash has no FPS reps or Horror reps instead of what gender the character should be. Again I would love it if certain girls were in smash but not for the sake of getting a female character.

 

[crazybenjamin]

Both of you, I never said Toad wasn't missing. I just said that Dixie feels more missing. Dixie Kong is not an assist trophy or a stage cameo or part of a special move or anything like that, only a spirit and a Mii hat.

It's mainly the "major presence" part that I took issue with.

 

[TheYungLink]

I mean this with all due respect. I don't understand why you guys care so much about the lack of female characters. Don't get me wrong, there's tons of female reps I want. But I want them in smash simply because I think they would be cool characters, not because of diversity or female representation. Shouldn't we really focus on the fact that smash has no FPS reps or Horror reps instead of what gender the character should be. Again I would love it if certain girls were in smash but not for the sake of getting a female character.

The past few months have shown that the only person around here who only wants female characters added simply because they'd be female is the thread owner. Every other woman besides I think Pumpkaboo and a few others (they share the sentiment that characters should get in with gender being a nonfactor) voiced their desire for a female Smash character for reasons beyond simply being female. Examples include KatKit, Night Gale, and more.

By and large, people do want more female characters. But it's disingenuous to imply that the vast majority of women who want more female characters do so simply to have another woman on the roster.

Let's look at Byeth. Fire Emblem: Three Houses is one of the most critically acclaimed and financially successful games in the series (I think it's actually sold the most? I dunno, it's definitely sold a lot, though). If you were on social media and knew some Nintendo fans, chances are that fanart of Fire Emblem 3H was everywhere, and speaking for myself I say Edelgard x Byleth fanart every single day since the game came out. While some people wanted Edelgard and were disappointed we didn't get her, Byleth was also being looked forward to for a variety of reasons. They'd be the second canonically bisexual character after Corrin, they'd fulfill an archetype yet to be seen in Smash (they're a teacher), and would overall showcase what a character using a whipsword could do in Smash. It also helps that people just plain loved Fire Emblem 3H, and in particular I saw more women talking about the game than men, though that may be colored from my own personal perspective.

Either way, some people wanted Byleth in Smash, including women. Do you think most women who wanted Byleth in Smash did so simply because they'd be another woman on the roster and no other reason? No, they didn't. They had other major reasons to back Byleth.

Also, I take big issue with this:

Shouldn't we really focus on the fact that smash has no FPS reps or Horror reps instead of what gender the character should be.

Why "instead"? Why not "alongside"? There are plenty of women who wanted Jill Valentine, for example, because she'd be a woman AND represent survival horror.

Caring about what gender a character is is just as valid as caring about what series they're from, or what genre their source game is, or even how old they are (from the 80s, 90s, 2000s, 2010s, etc.). It's important to let people want what they want, and gender is not a less "important" reason, especially since, again, most women who express a desire for more playable women in Smash will usually list off a bunch of choices that showcase merits beyond simply their gender.

 

[sbhouse12345]

Yea, that last part came out wrong. Just pretend I didn't say that. I totally understand people that want a character for many reasons and one of those reasons happens to be they want another female character. As for you main point, I've been active on YouTube, and various other discord servers. And tons of people say stuff like "Idc as long as it's female" and they don't list any characters they even want. This happens all the time and it shows that a lot of people want a women in smash just for the sake of having another female. And I just don't understand why that matters.

 

[TheYungLink]

Yea, that last part came out wrong. Just pretend I didn't say that. I totally understand people that want a character for many reasons and one of those reasons happens to be they want another female character. As for you main point, I've been active on YouTube, and various other discord servers. And tons of people say stuff like "Idc as long as it's female" and they don't list any characters they even want. This happens all the time and it shows that a lot of people want a women in smash just for the sake of having another female. And I just don't understand why that matters.

I mean, you can ask the women here. I cited a couple of examples, but as for me, I can tell you people just want more characters they can identify with. Whenever I play a character with a choice between male and female versions, I pick the male version because I'm a guy and I like playing as a guy when a character gives me a choice. It feels right.

Also, while I said many women want female characters for reasons beyond being female, I'd like to ask you a question: would you be okay with just ANY first person shooter or survival horror character? Like, if I had the power to put Daikatana Protagonist in Smash, or Alyssa Hale from Clock Tower II: The Struggle Within, would you be satisfied? People by and large hate Daikatana, and while Clock Tower is an important series to survival horror, The Struggle Within is one of the most hated entries in the series for being unbelievably obtuse and difficult in a very unfun way.

But when you say "more FPS and survival horror characters", you don't mean JUST anyone, right? You want specific choices, from games you love, or other people love, or are from games considered to be classics or pioneers of their genre.

It's the same with people who "want more women" in Smash but don't get specific. They want great choices, not bad ones, even if they don't say it outright. They want characters like Lara Croft and 2B, not bad female characters women don't like, or female characters from very bad games that are unmemorable.

(FYI if you reply to someone by clicking "reply" on their post, they get notified so it's easier for them to reply to you)

 

[smileMasky]

I'm disappointed no one said Roll. And no she would not be a clone of megaman (for the most part) look no further than Tasunoko vs Capcom. She had a unique move set and a banging theme Here .

On another note If we would get a Monster Hunter rep I think it would most likely be a Female since a lot of crossovers with the franchise that I've seen have been female.

 

[sbhouse12345]

I'm disappointed no one said Roll. And no she would not be a clone of megaman (for the most part) look no further than Tasunoko vs Capcom. She had a unique move set and a banging theme Here .

On another note If we would get a Monster Hunter rep I think it would most likely be a Female since a lot of crossovers with the franchise that I've seen have been female.

I think it'll be the female costume as the main default but the male as an alternate costume.

 

[smileMasky]

I think it'll be the female costume as the main default but the male as an alternate costume.

This^^^^. Also it got me thinking if we replace Byleth's model with monster hunter you think it would be a perfect fit for a move set?

 

[Deleted member]

It's the same with people who "want more women" in Smash but don't get specific. They want great choices, not bad ones, even if they don't say it outright. They want characters like Lara Croft and 2B, not bad female characters women don't like, or female characters from very bad games that are unmemorable.

Technically that's really implied by some people asking for more females, like me.

 

[zipzapsparkle]

I notice fan request lists usually have a lot of male characters and sometimes don’t list even one girl. They’re hardly frowned at or questioned about it.

However when someone requests female characters I notice there’s usually someone that questions it or disagrees with it. I don’t really understand why.

 

[Wrathful_Scythe]

I notice fan request lists usually have a lot of male characters and sometimes don’t list even one girl. They’re hardly frowned at or questioned about it.

The gaming landscape was, and still is in many areas, male dominated. Not only in audience but also in regards to occuring characters. The trend is changing but still apparent. This, obviously, has a huge impact on votings. The gist is that most people (the silent majority) just don't care about female representation and just choose who they want to see. There isn't really any ill-intent to call out.

However when someone requests female characters I notice there’s usually someone that questions it or disagrees with it. I don’t really understand why.

Requests rarely get questioned. However, people start to argue if chances of inclusion are mentioned. "Shantae is sure to be/has to be the next newcomer because female indie" is a lot more debatable than "oh jolly, I sure would love to have Shantae as the next newcomer because female indie". I haven't seen any serious argument against a female character because they are female. Its usually other aspects that a called into question.

 

[fogbadge]

Both of you, I never said Toad wasn't missing. I just said that Dixie feels more missing. Dixie Kong is not an assist trophy or a stage cameo or part of a special move or anything like that, only a spirit and a Mii hat.

another one of my most wanted is in a similar boat, though i dont think he gets to qualify as an all star

 

[Deleted member]

I notice fan request lists usually have a lot of male characters and sometimes don’t list even one girl. They’re hardly frowned at or questioned about it.

However when someone requests female characters I notice there’s usually someone that questions it or disagrees with it. I don’t really understand why.

This is the male bias I am combatting. Eveyone seems to gravitate to male characters even moreso than females.

I reprimanded my ex-friend for only including males on his wishlist, and then he started thinking of females.

That's the gaming landscape for ya, and so I decided to set up this female thread to help people become aware of the issue.

 

[fogbadge]

hat kid anyone?

 

[Deleted member]

hat kid anyone?

She has a unique moveset, I'll give her that =)

 

[Arcadenik]

she isnt

Thank you. I’m tired of seeing people act like Dixie is the ONLY missing Nintendo all-star when there are several missing Nintendo all-stars such as Toad, Waddle Dee, Meowth, and Tom Nook.

 

[fogbadge]

Thank you. I’m tired of seeing people act like Dixie is the ONLY missing Nintendo all-star when there are several missing Nintendo all-stars such as Toad, Waddle Dee, Meowth, and Tom Nook.

id saay they were all, all stars too

 

[Ridrool64]

There's only one female character I seriously want with any chance, and that's Arle, for basically every reason you could think of. Moveset potential, stage potential, music potential, spirit potential, loving the franchise, wanting to see it grow, wanting more exposure for the franchise, being a fan of the character. Number 1. Amitie as an Echo would be nice, but we're gonna have to wait and see if Echoes will get another chance.

However, there is another that, while I consider impossible to get, that's been on my mind since post Smash 4 pre Ultimate.

Rydia, from Final Fantasy IV. I always wanted a black mage but also a true summoner, as well as a character whose gimmick would be that her costumes change her size and stats. Plus at the time we didn't have a whip character, though we do now. And, Final Fantasy IV was my former favorite FF. And to some extent, I think she'd still be great to see.

Now if you asked me today, I would say a Final Fantasy V character in the form of Freelancer. And, there would be two Freelancers that are women (Lenna and Faris) in the same slot, albeit Bartz and Galuf, men, would be the first two alts, and the third girl, who I won't spoil, is too short to fit as an alt. They'd incorporate everything that makes FFV great, including the switching of jobs, the various combinations of physical weapons and magic, and perhaps a stage based on the final dungeon, which I won't spoil. And two fantastic songs (Clash on the Big Bridge, and The Decisive Battle) that would be fantastic for Smash.

The idea for Aigis, from Persona 3, is one that won't leave my head alone. I think she has cool potential, but Joker basically brings everything that's needed from Persona. Still... she'd be really cool.

And of course, there's none that I'd say I'm particularly opposed to. Some I don't gel with very well, but nobody who I actively dread and would make me roll my eyes.

 

[Deleted member]

There's only one female character I seriously want with any chance, and that's Arle, for basically every reason you could think of. Moveset potential, stage potential, music potential, spirit potential, loving the franchise, wanting to see it grow, wanting more exposure for the franchise, being a fan of the character. Number 1. Amitie as an Echo would be nice, but we're gonna have to wait and see if Echoes will get another chance.

However, there is another that, while I consider impossible to get, that's been on my mind since post Smash 4 pre Ultimate.

Rydia, from Final Fantasy IV. I always wanted a black mage but also a true summoner, as well as a character whose gimmick would be that her costumes change her size and stats. Plus at the time we didn't have a whip character, though we do now. And, Final Fantasy IV was my former favorite FF. And to some extent, I think she'd still be great to see.

Now if you asked me today, I would say a Final Fantasy V character in the form of Freelancer. And, there would be two Freelancers that are women (Lenna and Faris) in the same slot, albeit Bartz and Galuf, men, would be the first two alts, and the third girl, who I won't spoil, is too short to fit as an alt. They'd incorporate everything that makes FFV great, including the switching of jobs, the various combinations of physical weapons and magic, and perhaps a stage based on the final dungeon, which I won't spoil. And two fantastic songs (Clash on the Big Bridge, and The Decisive Battle) that would be fantastic for Smash.

The idea for Aigis, from Persona 3, is one that won't leave my head alone. I think she has cool potential, but Joker basically brings everything that's needed from Persona. Still... she'd be really cool.

And of course, there's none that I'd say I'm particularly opposed to. Some I don't gel with very well, but nobody who I actively dread and would make me roll my eyes.

Arle pretty much has normal chances compared to everyone else...

 

[Night Gale]

Three top contenders I see getting in are Cooking Mama, Ring Fit Adventurer, and a Girls Mode or Style Boutique/Savvy character.

Cooking Mama has over a dozen games and spin-offs. It's so successful that its creators - Cooking Mama Ltd. - renamed the company after the franchise. Cooking Mama is a third party series with very close ties to Nintendo and most of its games are Nintendo exclusive. It also has an upcoming Switch title.

Ring Fit Adventure is a new popular first party IP that already sold over 2 million copies. So far it isn't in Ultimate in any capacity.

Kat can explain why Style Boutique should get in better than I can, but that s*** really should happen.

Other characters I would like to see are:

Lara Croft
Velvet Crowe
Blaze Fielding
Reiko Nagase from Ridge Racer
Katarina from League of Legends
Velvet from Odin Sphere
Yumi or Asuka from Senran Kagura
A2
Junko Enoshima
Kurisu Makise from Steins;Gate
Aya Brea
Miriam from Bloodstained
Shiori Fujisaki
Veran from Oracle of Ages
Sarah Louise Kerrigan
Sakura Amamiya
Emily Kaldwin from Dishonored
Selvaria Bles
Elizabeth from Bioshock
Zero from Drakengard 3
Faith Conners
Reimu or Marisa
Nina Williams
Aloy
Jeanne from Bayonetta
Mitsuru, Aigis, Sumire, or Labrys from Persona 3/4A/5R
Katrielle Layton
Katalina from Granblue Fantasy
Sarah Bryant
Madotsuki from Yume Nikki
T-elos as a KOS-MOS echo; I don't care about KOS-MOS as much but I need her in to make T-elos a possibility
Hell, I'll settle for Elma if I can't get T-elos
Sophitia Alexandra
Peacock or Valentine from Skullgirls

 

[Deleted member]

Cooking Mama has over a dozen games and spin-offs. It's so successful that its creators - Cooking Mama Ltd. - renamed the company after the franchise. Cooking Mama is a third party series with very close ties to Nintendo and most of its games are Nintendo exclusive. It also has an upcoming Switch title.

Cooking Mama would be amazing, though people are gonna flip out on the possible moveset concept they have for her.

 

[nessdeltarune00]

This is the male bias I am combatting. Eveyone seems to gravitate to male characters even moreso than females.

I reprimanded my ex-friend for only including males on his wishlist, and then he started thinking of females.

That's the gaming landscape for ya, and so I decided to set up this female thread to help people become aware of the issue.

Lesley, this post right here is exactly why a majority of this board doesn’t think highly of you. How dense do you have to be to cut off a friend for wanting certain characters in a video game? What an absolute crime, the world will never recover from him wanting his favorite characters in the game, just like, idk, everyone in this community.

And if we are going to play by that game.

Monokuma
Phoenix Wright
Ryu Hayabusa
Crash Bandicoot
Doom Slayer
Dante
Lloyd Irving
Sol Badguy
Heihachi
Master Chief
Gordon Freeman
Kratos

This is my wishlist atm. Am I a sexist for it, by your logic?

I can assure you this though, I don’t want them to “assert male dominance”, I want them because I love the games they are from. It truly shouldn’t be that hard of a concept to grasp why some wishlists will pan out differently from others. And I’ll throw you a bone and say that I also REALLY want Reimu and 2B, but you’d probably move the goal post anyway.

But yeah. This will likely be my last post for awhile, but just know acting like that isn’t going to do any favors in helping your movement.

EDIT: I might’ve accidentally misconstrued the post a bit, but my point still stands. Why should someone's wishlist for a video game be worth “reprimanding” for? Still is really petty to say the least.

 

[Deleted member]

A little status opinion on my part:

We don't know exactly what pattern Sakurai and the development team will follow. Will it be all-male? All-female? Equal? More men than women, or more women than men? I honestly kind of feel that yeah, Sakurai is also aiming for fan requests, but it's the least he could do.