[v3.6] R.O.B. Community Matchup Chart + Discussion

[bubbaking]

IIRC, the last time we talked about this MU, JC felt that ROB beats Zelda slightly. Here are my recent thoughts on it, which I posted in the social thread:

I feel Zelda really isn't that bad. Her hitbox priority is annoying, but she's slow, so we can easily get in quickly if she tries something laggy, like planting a Din's. Angle your lasers so you don't have to worry about it coming back at you, and if she doesn't land-cancel Nayru's, its lag can be punished. Also, the moment we send her into the air, like via a grab, we can harass her fairly well. This is also one of the few MUs where uthrow actually does something at high %'s.

Also, Zelda is pretty vulnerable offstage, and we're one of the best chars to take advantage of that. She falls slowly and her upB has a deceptively long amount of vulnerable start-up which quick fairs, uairs, and lasers can easily knock her out of. On the flipside, we're probably also one of the best chars at avoiding offstage Din's traps. Also, rather than try to get a 'string' going, just aim to not let her land (not easily, at least). Dthrow practically always combos into uair for good damage or a kill after nair stops comboing.

Sheik (among Peach, Squirtle, and Charizard) is one of ROB's hardest matchups.

I disagree with the Peach bit. Peach can be scary when she gets in but only if she gets in, and she's so slow that we can run circles around her. We out-zone her with tilts and fairs and we can easily knock her out of her float with said tilts and fairs, lasers, or gyros. If worse comes to worst, Peach is one of the few chars who is actually prone to circle-camping.

Should I or someone else make a new matchup thread? I think its safe to say that this thread is out of date and dead and I'd really like to talk about R.O.B's matchups.

Maybe @ Juushichi could rename this thread for 3.0 or something...

 

[Dandizzle]

It's been over a year so if the thread isn't majorly updated I'll make a new one. I don't have to much experience with formatting and the like but I would try to keep discussion flowing with a few ideas of mine. When 3.5 comes I'll try to make the thread. Feel free to contact OP but make sure he actually wants to do it and not just because he is obligated to.

Any who I have one real experience with a good Zelda player and in my mind we lose. I think I already wrote about it in the social thread so I don't wanna repeat myself. It wouldn't be the first time Jceaser was overly positive about R.O.B but I don't think its too far from a 50-50.

 

[Juushichi]

Sorry, bout that. Updated. Try to ask a mod to give you control of this thread.

Also, @1-up get in here imo.

Also, back when I played against Zhime a lot in netplay I thought it was 5-5. Could see it as 45-55, though. Either way it's close.

 

[(1UP)]

Also, @1-up get in here imo.

reporting for duty

 

[Dandizzle]

If they want to I say DF or IUP should run it. I'd still enjoy doing it just I understand that people would want someone more renowned for their R.O.B play to run the thread because they probably know more. I'd still take it in a heart beat.

 

[(1UP)]

i actually do not have a great deal of interest in discussing matchups in detail. basic components of MUs aside, i believe it's mainly up to the player to figure out what works for them and their particular style

 

[Dandizzle]

I'll give it a day before I'll yell at a mod then.

Edit: Any preferred mods to yell at? lol

 

[bubbaking]

Not only that, but honestly, ROB is pretty basic and his gameplay linear. Many may see this as boring which is why his player-base is really quite small. The way of the future is probably figuring out more gyro or booster nuances, but I personally think we've also got to expand our creative use of Arm Rotor a little bit.

 

[Mister Eric]

Not only that, but honestly, ROB is pretty basic and his gameplay linear. Many may see this as boring which is why his player-base is really quite small. The way of the future is probably figuring out more gyro or booster nuances, but I personally think we've also got to expand our creative use of Arm Rotor a little bit.

Ppl said the same about Brawl ROB. And I see a lot more potential with PM ROB. I just wish his breversal spam was better.

 

[Dandizzle]

I want a sooooooooooooper wavedash

EDIT: SO THE THREAD IS MINE NOW give me some time to make some cosmetic changes I'm new to this. I will try to have the matchups discussed on other threads on here ASAP tell me if I missed something.

 

[Crome]

I have mixed feelings on the R.O.B v Marth/Roy matchup. It sucks recovering low with R.O.B against those two. Marth can spike you, and Roy can use his neutral special. However, on the ground I feel R.O.B can hold his own, if you can space the other player properly. They can fair your top, which sucks, but the laser is always there. I agree with the "slight disadvantage" rating.

 

[Dandizzle]

I can't say much because I personally am bad at the matchup and haven't played it in awhile. If I hear another opinion I'll rank it. I also add Peach, Luigi, Mario, or Lucas If there's a bit more input. I'll edit my post tomorrow about my opinions on some matchups, on moblie.

 

[Crome]

I can't say much because I personally am bad at the matchup and haven't played it in awhile. If I hear another opinion I'll rank it. I also add Peach, Luigi, Mario, or Lucas If there's a bit more input. I'll edit my post tomorrow about my opinions on some matchups, on moblie.

I play pm semi-seriously with my friends, one happens to main ness (sometimes lucas) and the other plays mario. Robs pretty okay at both of these match ups, kinda disadvantaged with Lucas. I'll go into more detail tomorrow.

 

[bubbaking]

I really dislike the Marth MU. Marth can kind of keep us in the air forever and utilt kills us much earlier than I'm used to. Also, like none of our moves can challenge his when we're both spacing and he can just attack through or over the gyro top. Lasers are nice, but he just has to react and shield or counter it when he's at mid or full-screen and now he can get in.

I have mixed feelings about Roy, but I definitely enjoy playing against Roy more than Marth. Roy doesn't edgeguard us as easily as Marth.

 

[Dandizzle]

Ye I feel you, I've had major trouble with Marth before but now it should be better. I would want a bit more discussion on Marth before I place him since a lot of it hasn't aged well. I read stuff on the 1st page of the matchup thread that makes me go crazy, saying how R.O.B seems like a better Marth (Seriously too many people think this character is good without playing him) and how the Charizard matchup is fine because Oracle beat a mediocre Zard. NOOOOOOPEEEE.. I've probably played against Charizard 200+ times and I know it is HELLDICK for R.O.B. His big fat aerials, juggles and recovery are everything this character hates. He jabs our tiny shield twice and there's little left. I am for sure putting that matchup as BAD at least on the flat disadvantage section. Now I've been looking for secondaries to cover the matchup, and I'm currently trying Peach. Bubbaking, can Peach beat that ****ing dragon because I've had it. I'm also willing to play Olimar, Yoshi, PIikachu,ZSS and Wario. I know some of those are evenish but I kind of want to play someone who wins because my buddy mains Charizard and as you know NY is stacked with em'. Also some of these characters will arguably change distastefully next patch and I don't want my heart broken.

Also I'm interested on talking about the MK and Kirby because I really don't think either are very good. I'll go in more depth if it's brought up but they got:
-Combos we can't really get out of easy because of our terrible OOS game.
-Its hard to get follow ups from Dthrow. (Way more so Kirby because MK is a fastfaller)
-They can chase us offstage
Haven't played one awhile but Kirby was my biggest fear way back and I wonder if anyone feels the same. Good Kirby's do stuff you didn't think Kirby could do.

 

[DrinkingFood]

I had a nice ****ing paragraph typed up on Kirby but I'm on a phone and pressed the wrong button so now it's all gone. Ugh. Whatever I think it's either disadvantageous or slightly disadvantageous. ROB has a really hard time punishing Kirby, and gets straight out prioritized by Kirby's every aerial. He even has a pseudo air dash with a hitbox, and can copy our laser and stay airborne or crouched and avoid gyro pretty easily, and can stop ROB's upair with a stone which is ROBs only real reliable damage racker against floaties.

 

[(1UP)]

you have to have to HAVE to kill Kirby early because it is very difficult to get a good string on him. from my experience nair wrecks him but other than that nothing is reliable. however, even though Kirby is much better at racking up damage, he shares the same killing problem, making for a very long set generally. if you have a gyro keep it close by.

 

[Crome]

What are some MU's that are good for rob?

 

[Dandizzle]

We just brought this up on the social thread, you should follow that for some good anime fighter talk and records of my inability to get to tourneys. Some of us think Ivysaur is pretty good for us compared to how others struggle. I totally believe we beat peach but I want some more talk on that, I play Peach now a days and I totally agree tho. We do good against Squritle IMO, plop down a gyro and that guy has to rethink what he's gonna do, he has nubby limbs etc. I could see Toon Link being pretty good but I haven't fought many. We do pretty damn good against Mario and pretty sure we beat Luigi solidly. Puff is pretty free, but its not like R.O.B counters her conceptually just that she kidna blows. We do really good against Samus, like this is totally 60:40 material, which is pretty great. I haven't fought Raptor yet but there's a lot of mean things we can do too Yoshi, but I could see him wrecking our shield and eggs messing us up offstage. I would write specifics but I haven't played any of these in a very long time, I can tell you in every way shape and form how Charizard is a god damn nuisance though. I don't really want to add anything to the OP unless there's a good paragraph or two why we win and a couple others agree.

Also I do agree killing Kirby off the top is nice and makes it way better, but I think he makes R.O.B be the little spoon too often to make it even. MK less so but he can't go as deep offstage, we can cc a lot of his stuff more so than kirby I'd say, and doesn't have as good instant horizontal movement or ground approaches that Kirby has, which I really don't like to go against with Kirby. Both can also easily put us in a tech chase and our tech rolls are so bad you can predict R.O.B to go the other direction and still punish him, that's a big problem. Also its another reason why Charizard is terrrrribleeeeeee for us.

Against Marth/Roy punishing laggy moves with DACUS (everybody gotta DACUS more it's so real) is a really good option because you don't have to jump and it gets them above you. They have plenty of ways to not get juggled from it but it makes you the opposite of above him which is where you DO NOT want to be. One hit from below can be lights out for you if you are not careful. If you go on a stage with platforms, shield dropping is a smart thing to do, usually into nair, but I haven't done this enough. Gyro allows you to take way more on shield and hit them from afar. Best to use laser when they are in hitstun or far away if fully charged, it's pretty laggy so you can get punished from afar. You can throw a gyro at their recovery and it'll usually kill them, grabbing the ledge is pretty good too, maybe after a fair chain. The match up isn't as bad as it could be but even ehh... maybe Roy.

 

[DrinkingFood]

MK can't force a tech chase out of a grab if that's what you're talking about. You can just DI d throw up and in and he will only get a nair, maybe a uair. In fact you might be able to jump out even if you don't DI at all which would make even the aerial follow-up difficult or impossible.
I was considering saying ROB has a slight advantage on MK, and my basis was that you need to be extra careful at low percents to only CC hits that you can punish with a dsmash which would lead to a lot of damage as he is a fast faller. But I forget MK can just hold up to get out of dsmash like most characrers, so voila, there went the best possible option against him that isn't outright camping.

 

[Dandizzle]

I remembered the throw wrong my bad. I'll put kirby under disadvantage and maybe MK under slight disadvantage tomorrow probably. Isn't MK able to get outta dsmash super easy tho? I remember him always getting out. I was gonna talk about Lucas and Diddy but I know they are ripe for changes, which is great considering I don't think it's that bad now. Two characters that come to mind are Wario and DK, two matchups that are pretty interesting. Wario was my old main so I know a lot about him. Anyone can just bring up whoever they want, just that I'd like to reach a conclusion on some so I can update the OP. Plus if we don't close some of the conversations talking about them in the first place didn't do to much. Just want a vague idea about em because I'll change the conclusion if someone proves me wrong anyway. Sorry for wall of text, mobile.

 

[bubbaking]

I've been looking for secondaries to cover the matchup, and I'm currently trying Peach. Bubbaking, can Peach beat that ****ing dragon because I've had it. I'm also willing to play Olimar, Yoshi, PIikachu,ZSS and Wario. I know some of those are evenish but I kind of want to play someone who wins because my buddy mains Charizard and as you know NY is stacked with em'. Also some of these characters will arguably change distastefully next patch and I don't want my heart broken.

All of the characters you named lose to Zard pretty hard except for Yoshi and ZSS. That includes Peach.

Also I'm interested on talking about the MK and Kirby because I really don't think either are very good. I'll go in more depth if it's brought up but they got:
-Combos we can't really get out of easy because of our terrible OOS game.
-Its hard to get follow ups from Dthrow. (Way more so Kirby because MK is a fastfaller)

I think we lose both MUs, but you know that ROB can CG MK, right? Dthrow combos MK fairly well.

even though Kirby is much better at racking up damage, he shares the same killing problem, making for a very long set generally. if you have a gyro keep it close by.

That's, uh, kinda not true. Kirby gets many reliable follow-ups out of dthrow, one of which is a usmash that kills at 120%. I believe he can also CG us fairly well.

MK less so but he can't go as deep offstage, we can cc a lot of his stuff more so than kirby I'd say, and doesn't have as good instant horizontal movement or ground approaches that Kirby has, which I really don't like to go against with Kirby.

You mean MK has more "instant horizontal movement or ground approaches" than Kirby. Between a much faster run, much larger DD, quicker DA, more usable tilts, faster SHFFL, and the anomaly that is DC, MK has many more grounded options than Kirby and he is just outright more mobile on the ground.

MK can't force a tech chase out of a grab if that's what you're talking about. You can just DI d throw up and in and he will only get a nair, maybe a uair. In fact you might be able to jump out even if you don't DI at all which would make even the aerial follow-up difficult or impossible.
I was considering saying ROB has a slight advantage on MK, and my basis was that you need to be extra careful at low percents to only CC hits that you can punish with a dsmash which would lead to a lot of damage as he is a fast faller. But I forget MK can just hold up to get out of dsmash like most characrers, so voila, there went the best possible option against him that isn't outright camping.

I believe at low %'s, MK can CG ROB. At any %'s, if ROB DIs up and in, MK can definitely combo him.

 

[Dandizzle]

but... I got a chaingrab... and stufff. Seriously is the stupid how pretty much every character I like sucks against this Charizard. He got winningmatchups for dayzzzz and a lot of stupid stuff in this kit. Then who would be the hardest counters? I've already asked a couple other Zards including Numbers and they just kidna shrugged, Projectlies projectlies they claim, but its a god damn shame that pretty much every character par spacies with one has a huge flaw that Charizard abuses the hell out of. I've been searching for the one for around a half of a year. I just want to play the video game and do good man.

Anywho this is isn't the place for this, I may do a bigggggg writeup all fancy like explaining why Charizard vs. R.O.B is horrible because I am 99% percent sure no one has played it more than me.

And I would say Kirby's dash attack is mostly what i'm talking about because its pretty bad to go against and I'm pretty sure it can cross us up and then its a bad situation for sure. And it's more bursty movement like you said which is more problematic. You guys jump on me for one thing and I don't even mean what you are picking up most of the time. So ruthless

 

[DrinkingFood]

I kinda want to play a good Charizard now and see how it goes. My state is like 90% melee characters tho lolol

 

[DrinkingFood]

Double post, seriously **** this forum on mobile

 

[Dandizzle]

Oh yea Smashboards on mobile is trash, any who Ness seems to be a good secondary for R.O.B and I'm pretty sure he beats Zard. DF I'll respect your opinion on any other character in the game but not if you say Charizard is fine/easy. I will fly to your state and beat you with an actual NES R.O.B. It really is that bad and this isn't fresh salt I have more experience with Zard then any other character in the game. And I'm not THAT bad.

 

[bubbaking]

Then who would be the hardest counters? I've already asked a couple other Zards including Numbers and they just kidna shrugged, Projectlies projectlies they claim, but its a god damn shame that pretty much every character par spacies with one has a huge flaw that Charizard abuses the hell out of. I've been searching for the one for around a half of a year. I just want to play the video game and do good man.

Link does pretty well against Zard. So does Mewtwo. What do you expect? Zard is a decent character.

Anywho this is isn't the place for this, I may do a bigggggg writeup all fancy like explaining why Charizard vs. R.O.B is horrible because I am 99% percent sure no one has played it more than me.

Lolz, are you kidding me? Numbers went to my university. Any of my chars vs his Zard were the most played MUs at Stony Brook, and I am fairly certain that no one has played the ROB:Zard MU more than me.

And I would say Kirby's dash attack is mostly what i'm talking about because its pretty bad to go against and I'm pretty sure it can cross us up and then its a bad situation for sure. And it's more bursty movement like you said which is more problematic. You guys jump on me for one thing and I don't even mean what you are picking up most of the time. So ruthless

Wasn't "jumping" on you, merely pointing out something I felt was incorrect. Yeah, Kirby's DA is problematic but it's actually kinda easy to see coming unless he does it really close. MK is just that fast all the time. Both of their DAs also cross us up, although MK has to do his pretty deep. MK's DA also gives him a pretty wicked DACG.

 

[Dandizzle]

ey u don't gotta tell me MK is fast he's Sanic 2.0. And no I am staying by my word. Me and L_Pag will play for around 8 hours straight pretty regularly. I've been using other character's lately against him but I've played R.O.B Zard many, many a time. I've played yearrrrs of zard and I guess I know a lot about the character. Also I'm playing Ness now which is pretty zzzzz but works for Charizard and most other characters I'd want a secondary for. If Link is less dumb next patch maybe if Ness doesn't click with me.

I will try to get 2 Xfire; I really don't know how good your R.O.B is considering you don't really go him in tourney but It'll be fun to play win or lose. I will say my heart will be broken if I am blown up. When does it start and how can I know who you are?

I may add more matchups to the thing tomorrow just that I'd like someone outside the social thread usuals to say stuff, because we may just be weirdoes. I'll probably put Marth as slight disadvantage or disadvantage and Roy slight or even? Kirby as a disadvantage and Mk as slight too?

 

[bubbaking]

So, uh, no offense, but Numbers and I are both better Zards than L_Pag (with very consistent results to back it up), and I am a better ROB than you (from the results of you that I've found). Numbers and I have been college-mates for over 4 years, and during that entire time, we played Smash with each other for several hours nearly every day. We were both on Project M since day 1 of v2.0 and we've both always been playing Zard and ROB (although ROB was only a secondary to my main, Lucario, at the time). I used to beat his Zard super-consistently with ROB until he learned the MU and leveled up a megaton. I literally think no one knows the ROB:Zard MU as well as we do except for maybe Oracle because he was really good with both chars. If you don't like what I just said, then you should come to the biweeklies I host. Surely you've heard of them, the Stony Brook Biweeklies, host to Rolex, Numbers, Raptor, and various top-level competitors from NYC. They're restarting again for this semester, so if you live on Long Island, you should definitely attend. I'll be looking forward to ROB dittoing you. $10 MM (I'll go down if that's too high for you)? You'll know who I am 'cause I'll be the TO.
#ShamelessSelfPlug

I always used to go ROB a lot in tourney until very, very recently. In any case, Xfire should be next Friday, but I'm not sure if I'll be going to that one.

 

[DrinkingFood]

I think it's definitely worth saying that Zard doesn't have the same properties sheik has that enable her to force ROB to approach. Those properties being small, highly changing hurtboxes during her jump/crouch/landing and various other moves as well as a quick chargeable projectile that can be thrown a long ways down at an angle from a jump or just while grounded, to tack on safe damage at a distance.
It could still be a bad matchup but it's not as bad or worse than sheik.

 

[Dandizzle]

I'll respond more formally later but Charizard ain't got needles but he got more range and way less ass recovery but that's kinda a no brainer. And he can mess up our shield pretty badly as well especially if he crosses us up, not Sheik bad but not fun. I have only played bad Shield and I have beat everyone I have fought so I can't really compare the two. And I wasn't dissing your play bubbaking I've been playing smash like this for a year, I'm pretty happy with how far I've gotten I suppose. And u don't gotta tell me l_pags a fraud I would know hehe. Yea we should money match it because it would make it more interesting; amount I'm not sure because I saved up for a Wii U and wouldn't want to miss out on a game. I can probably donate 10 tho in exchange for advice. And I guess I'll have to make a throwaway Facebook to keep in touch. If the SB weeklies are on Friday Saturday or not too late Sunday I'll go just this weekend I made plans so. It's mobile so you ain't getting formatting.

 

[L Pag]

So, uh, no offense, but Numbers and I are both better Zards than L_Pag

aw heeeeeeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllllllllllll naaw (numbers definitely is but we gotta see about you)

 

[Dandizzle]

WE JUST GOT A REAL MATCH (and derailed the thread to hell and back) I can't make it this Saturday though, maybe you can fight L_Pag then I wouldn't know.

 

[bubbaking]

Too bad this couldn't happen in the social thread, but then again, it all spurred from a MU topic.

And I wasn't dissing your play bubbaking I've been playing smash like this for a year, I'm pretty happy with how far I've gotten I suppose. And u don't gotta tell me l_pags a fraud I would know hehe. Yea we should money match it because it would make it more interesting; amount I'm not sure because I saved up for a Wii U and wouldn't want to miss out on a game. I can probably donate 10 tho in exchange for advice. And I guess I'll have to make a throwaway Facebook to keep in touch. If the SB weeklies are on Friday Saturday or not too late Sunday I'll go just this weekend I made plans so. It's mobile so you ain't getting formatting.

No offense taken. Yeah, the biweeklies are every other Saturday. However, this Saturday is Melee only. We'll have PM two weeks from now.

aw heeeeeeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllllllllllll naaw (numbers definitely is but we gotta see about you)

Lolz, sorry dude, but I've seen your placings, and results don't lie. I've also taken names of some fairly notable people with Zard. Beat Kels' and Hat's Sheik, Bstuk's ROB, and some others all with Zard. However, if you feel I speak falsely, then I'll gladly do a MM with you as well.

 

[L Pag]

Too bad this couldn't happen in the social thread, but then again, it all spurred from a MU topic.


No offense taken. Yeah, the biweeklies are every other Saturday. However, this Saturday is Melee only. We'll have PM two weeks from now.


Lolz, sorry dude, but I've seen your placings, and results don't lie. I've also taken names of some fairly notable people with Zard. Beat Kels' and Hat's Sheik, Bstuk's ROB, and some others all with Zard. However, if you feel I speak falsely, then I'll gladly do a MM with you as well.

I don't like money matches, I'd rather do an honor match, your choice though. Among my list is Anther (in zard dittos), Green Ranger, Griffy (again, zard dittos), Mask (zard dittos), PeachyHime, and a few friendlies off Narq (he won most though) the other day just to name a few. I'm not one for trash talk as I usually end up eating my words, but next time I see you, I'm taking your pride.

 

[bubbaking]

Oh yeah, I don't think I've ever lost a game to Peachy.....as any character. Also went to Zenith '14 and beat DarkBlues in a MM with Zard.

In any case, I can respect that. If you'd rather do a pride match, that's cool, too. You should come through to my biweekly when it features PM in a couple weeks.

 

[Dandizzle]

Guys, what about me!?!?!

 

[L Pag]

Oh yeah, I don't think I've ever lost a game to Peachy.....as any character. Also went to Zenith '14 and beat DarkBlues in a MM with Zard.

In any case, I can respect that. If you'd rather do a pride match, that's cool, too. You should come through to my biweekly when it features PM in a couple weeks.

I plan on it, see you there! Now, back to the zard boards from whence I came!

 

[Dandizzle]

I am updating a lot of the thread slowly, please if you find any other info on any matchups please send it my way so I can add it, I can't check every other character's matchup threads, reddit etc. for every little piece but I'd like to have as much as I can. I would perfer if you would talk about the updated current discussion.

 

[Frost | Odds]

How do you guys think ROB does against Falco and Toon Link? Wondering what to CP a local ROB with at the next event.