[Updated 7/01/08] VietGeek Wishes for All to Critique His Marth. Now.

[VietGeek]

So yeah, I've been working on my Marth. I can confidently say that my Marth cannot suck now, and therefore only blows. My Toon Link however seems to both suck and blow, but this is not time to ponder such things.

My videos shouldn't look like **** anymore, so I'm grateful to that. If you want, you can still add &fmt=18 to the end of my videos' URLs to induce some sort of “high-quality-ness.”

What you're not allowed to critique on:

Sandbags. All of these matches (maybe an exception of one or two of the ROB battles) were taken around 10-11 PM. That's pretty late for Brawling, so some sandbagging may have been involved. The Falco matches show me doing a lot of stupid stuff, but there's ******** stuff everywhere. I did not handpick the best videos to show all of you. Whatever happens happens. No ****ing editing skillz. Moar Sandbagz. >_>

Everything else is up for critique, lawl.

Other crap I noticed:

I fail at fighting Dededes. There's a good number in Georgia, but the penguin is kinda annoying to fight, especially ones that CG Marth correctly. I need to fight more, that's the only way I can get better at fighting them.

I also fail at fighting Falcos. Not only did I do some stupid sandbaggish crap, but I could not find a reliable punisher for the Phantasm. Ah well, I should have just shielded. Maybe next time. Also, I was experimenting on how to get out of Falco's chaingrab without Dolphin Slash. I concluded I need Dolphin Slash, lol.

I cannot, absolutely cannot fight Marth dittos. I fail at them, too much Fair. They fail anyway. Most people don't know how to do them and I Dtilt them to death usually.

Eh, sometimes I apparently (according to Level 99), sandbag unconsciously. Good thing that has yet to happen during a tourney (I think).

With that all said and done, here's those videos:

vs. ROB (Lv.99)

Link to Battle 1
Link to Battle 2
Link to Battle 3

Misc Comments:

[2] Epic aggressive crap happened here, lawl. SHIELD BREAKER!
[3] Standard pretty much. Some stupid crap happened and I was trying to fake him out with an air dodge. I ate an Usmash and then let's not forget the Gyro fun toward the end, lol.

vs. white Marth (Lord Axl)

Link to Video

Misc. Comment: I cannot play Marth dittos, lol.

vs. Falco (Lord Axl)
Link to Battle 1
Link to Battle 2

Misc. Comments:

[1] I FAILED. It was funny.
[2] Sorry Falco, you doing that Brooklyn accent makes it hard to concentrate. I failed at punishing the CG and Phantasm here, but I was experimenting.

vs. King Dedede (Lord Axl)
Link to Video

Misc. Comment: This match is a John in of itself.

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

i sen't some emails 2 u on ur u-tube account!

 

[phi1ny3]

Okay, I finally got some videos of me playing Marth. Feel free to critique them. Oh, and err, subscribe and stuff to get my self-esteem up, or something, lol.

Also, I'm very sorry if these videos have terrible quality. They looked beautiful when I uploaded them to my computer. Apparently Youtube effectively ruined the clear-cut footage my DVD recorder made as the videos were converted to .flv. Since I uploaded 14 or so videos (at the time of writing), I do not feel in the mood to try to improve the quality of them at the moment.

You can however, try to add "&fmt=18" to any Youtube video URL to try to force high-quality-ness. Don't know how well that will work though. Future videos will be uploaded with quality as a priority next time.

Battles:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=C8TfOPGQeKI (Marth vs. Ness) [May 17th]
http://youtube.com/watch?v=CQYGjhL7NFI (Marth vs. G&W) [May 23rd]
http://youtube.com/watch?v=tyX93sbiURw (Marth vs. Pikachu) [May 23rd]
http://youtube.com/watch?v=wPk476QNVO8 (Marth vs. Pikachu) [May 23rd] (2)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=0WsVyyBoDFQ (Marth vs. ROB) [May 23rd]
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kgKhrkB6lEE (Marth vs. ROB [2]) [May 24th]
http://youtube.com/watch?v=iViCS4pfK54 (Marth vs. ROB [3]) [May 24th]

What I've noticed myself:

- In certain battles, Fsmash became my favorite punisher, almost to the point of being spammed. I don't know why I felt Fsmash happy that day, but I think I've gotten over it. >_>

- I knowingly sandbagged (if that is the proper way to describe it) in a fraction of certain battles. This is obvious when I start trying to spam Dolphin Slash out of shield in order to practive pivoting it in the opposite direction of where I'm facing (because I suck at doing that for some reason). Yeah, practicing crap like that during a battle is pretty bad, yeah? <_<

U post like what ur marth is dressed in. You almost sound...
Emo.
jk, but ya, no harm that Emblem Lord's, or most pro marthers can't patch up. Velcome, to de lair ofv de count Marth. Muahaha!

 

[AdmiralComrade]

O.O well at least u have the game... *mumbles sumthing about stupid austrlaia getting it on the 26th*

oh well yeah u were Fsmash happy =P tho the vids are pretty good well at least u kno ur mistakes.. what i did was record my melee matches and see what i did wrong so the next match i can improve and so on..

 

[VietGeek]

U post like what ur marth is dressed in. You almost sound...
Emo.
jk, but ya, no harm that Emblem Lord's, or most pro marthers can't patch up. Velcome, to de lair ofv de count Marth. Muahaha!

If sounding angst gets viewers who will ultimately critique my videos instead of question my fashion sense toward what Marth looks decent with, then I'm satisfied. =P
But it looks like that ain't happening, lol.

Someone e-mailed me saying I need to watch spacing. While the tip itself is ideal (since it's so basic and something everyone always needs to consistently watch for, especially with Marth), they recommended using Fair to space out, because it adds a barrier. The thing is though, my friend plays ROB (therefore almost a definite majority of the videos currently up are against ROB), and he can use teh lazArz and the Gyro. So I found it better to just stand there and shield/walk to shield/camp in his face if camp at all. I found it most ideal just to consistently add pressure to him and not give him a chance to shoot his lasers too often (although he gets a hit now and then).

So, just wondering if the way I deal with ROB and my spacing between him is at least good overall or not. If not, explain what I should do. Don't you dare go play a level 9 CPU ROB and then tell me what you observed from that (because he is teh sUkz0rz).

Oh, and I've always been here since I've signed up. I lurk more often than post though. But hello anyway, yeah?

 

[2.72]

Having watched only the first video:

Whoever said that you should short hop fair as a spacing tool is correct. I agree that it's less than ideal against ROB, but it works well against Ness. There were a few times that you used dancing blade when he could just outspace you -- always a bad idea, because it leaves you open. Fair and ftilt are better options because they leave you much less open. Same goes for fsmash. You made good use of utilt and uair to defend above you, so try to do the same on the ground with ftilt and fair. The first stock was very good, by the way.

A few more random notes: I find that the best way to edgeguard Ness is to jump out and poke him with a bair/fair/nair. You have to be careful to do this only when you can get it in before his PKT connects, but you had one chance (maybe two) at around 1:40 that could have netted a KO. I would be more aggressive off the edge.

 

[VietGeek]

All right, thanks. Being aggressive off edge isn't something I do for some reason. I'll work on that. Hopefully I'll have a chance to try to do some friendlies during the week that tries to work on what I've been critiqued on.

Watch my other videos too. Critique them all if the quality doesn't make your eyes bleed. xD

 

[lordaxl]

whoa you live in buford? thats like.. not too far from where i live either haha, a fellow georgian marth-mainer =D

but yeah, like what others said earlier: work on your spacing and i can tell that you spam dancing blade when its unnecessary ( you could always ftilt or even an sh fair ), and practice set ups - i rarely see you use marth's grab game or mid-air fairs/forward b's to follow into combos (Watching Kizzu or Danimals play helps plenty) i'm also a marth-mainer trying to get better so kudos to you for posting these videos =]

maybe i can meet you at a local tourney and we can run marth dittos sometime? haha

 

[VietGeek]

whoa you live in buford? thats like.. not too far from where i live either haha, a fellow georgian marth-mainer =D

but yeah, like what others said earlier: work on your spacing and i can tell that you spam dancing blade when its unnecessary ( you could always ftilt or even an sh fair ), and practice set ups - i rarely see you use marth's grab game or mid-air fairs/forward b's to follow into combos (Watching Kizzu or Danimals play helps plenty) i'm also a marth-mainer trying to get better so kudos to you for posting these videos =]

maybe i can meet you at a local tourney and we can run marth dittos sometime? haha

Yeah, spacing is always an issue with Marths, lol. I've tried to tone down the side-Bs too.

While the matches I put up don't show it, I for some reason fail to ever successfully grab my friend's ROB. I have no trouble grabbing anyone else, but for some reason Lv.99 is the anti-grab. >_> I shall have to overcome his otherworldly powers to prove that I use Marth's grab game!

Oh, and yeah, I watched Kizzu, like last week. Lv.99 and I haven't gotten in a battle though (he's taking higher-tier math classes during the summer). So I haven't tried using the first slash of side-B in a real battle yet.

You going to the next Waba monthly? Come early and we can fight. Lv.99 and his ROB will be there too if you're interested. =)

 

[lordaxl]

R.O.B.s are a pretty gay match-up for marth unless you can space PERFECTLY, due to the robot's relentless keep-away game. but once you learn how to completely utilize marth's movement (foxtrotting/dash dancing, edge guarding, etc), you'll be gimping any R.O.B player like slicing through pie =D

haha yeah i think ill be at waba this month. it's strange how i never went to the monthlies when the place is like 10-15 min away from me lol. but yeah dude, lets play sometime.

 

[VietGeek]

Cool, hope to see you there.

Anyone else want to comment? Positive or negative, just go for it. In order to change how some of you view this, it's not only improving my Marth, but improving my Marth's ROB ****** skillz. So if that helps you comment, like do so. <insert some idly threatening phrase here>

 

[GhettoSheep]

Well, against GW i saw a few things, but in particular, you let the key hit you a lot. When GW is above you like that you just need to be ready for it. When GW goes above me like that, i ready myself to downB. Counter that ****. The key has a decent amount of lag considering he has to fall to you so you should be able to do it on reaction. Once you counter it a couple times he will stop spamming it

 

[VietGeek]

Well, against GW i saw a few things, but in particular, you let the key hit you a lot. When GW is above you like that you just need to be ready for it. When GW goes above me like that, i ready myself to downB. Counter that ****. The key has a decent amount of lag considering he has to fall to you so you should be able to do it on reaction. Once you counter it a couple times he will stop spamming it

Yeah, I normally do better than that (no Johns) against the key spam. But I'm incredibly rusty since my friend is probably the only serious G&W player in my state, and even then, he's moved on to ROB now. So I'd say it's been a month since I fought a G&W. That match wasn't very good anyway. But what I record I put up, even if that particular video makes me look like ****.

I usually don't do Counter (for the key), but does its opening frames come out faster than Usmash? If so, I'll do that instead of Usmash/Shield-canceled Up-B. I'll try that next time.

Those other particular things are? Aside from the fact that I tried like over 9000 times to land Dancing Blade on the first stock and got severely punished by it of course (since I think everyone already addressed that).

 

[Emblem Lord]

I looked at the very last match with R.O.B on Lylat Cruise.

For the most part I just saw silly mistakes here and there, but your overall play was solid. You did some dumb things on your first stock though. You ran up to your opponent and just randomly u-smashed when he had already moved away. You also got gimped because you got too greedy when you were edgeguarding R.O.B on your first stock. You ended up getting spiked and you died. At another point R.O.B was under the ship itself and you could have ledgedropped Fair or up bed and he would have died.

Just work on the little things and your responses to certain situations and I think you will be in good shape.

I'll look at some more vids to see what else you might need work on though.

Edit: Watched a few more of your vids. Dude, you are good. I have nothing to say. Just re-watch your vids and try to figure out the times where you could have did something better. Overall you have a solid Marth. Also when fighting G&W...hahaha, seems like you never caught on to that Dair spam lol. If G&W abuses it just counter or shield then punish.

All I can say is implement more d-tilt a bit more and more Shieldbreaker tactics. Your Marth has a good hold on all the basic and intermediate level things that make Marth a threat, so now I think it's time for you to move on to more advanced stuff like Shieldbreaker strats.

 

[feardragon64]

Hey, you commented on mine so I thought I'd return the favor and ker-bump your thread =]. Anyways, here's what I found.(I watched the most recent video against rob)

-As said above, working on spacing just a little bit more. You're doing a great job of tippering a majority of the time, but you can tip a little bit further away, while giving yourself more room against R.O.B.
-I know some people said not to use dancing blade as much, but I think you used it just fine. It does wonders for racking up damage. Don't change that
-You really have the dair spike down. Congrats on that since it's not an easy thing to do. One tip though against R.O.B. specifically though. You noticed your first death was cause you got spiked. Never go for the gimp on rob unless you're always above him, or at a 45 degree angle above him. His recovery is absurd and unless you're certain you can nail the spike or at least not get below, in front, or behind him while attempting to nail it, don't go for it.
-DSMASH! It works wonders. It's not so much for punishing the shield rolling, but it has a really big tip and actually has a decent knockback. Try and incorporate it into your play every so often(expecially since it kills relatively early).
-Dtilt. Also works wonders. Especially on small stages where people tend to try and fight a bit closer. It's amazing for spacing or forcing people to approach you from above.(I tend to like going from dtilt to a retreating fair since they almost always aerial approach after I dtilt spam a few times).
-This is more of a side note. Usmash has a somewhat thin hitbox, so even when the opponent is on a platform, either go for a hyphen usmash or the utilt(as you did earlier which btw I loved). That way you cover more ground and don't leave yourself as open to attack.

I like your marth though! Good job!

 

[phi1ny3]

I looked at the very last match with R.O.B on Lylat Cruise.

For the most part I just saw silly mistakes here and there, but your overall play was solid. You did some dumb things on your first stock though. You ran up to your opponent and just randomly u-smashed when he had already moved away. You also got gimped because you got too greedy when you were edgeguarding R.O.B on your first stock. You ended up getting spiked and you died. At another point R.O.B was under the ship itself and you could have ledgedropped Fair or up bed and he would have died.

Just work on the little things and your responses to certain situations and I think you will be in good shape.

I'll look at some more vids to see what else you might need work on though.

Agreed, although it happens to the best of us.
btw, great sig. The background kinda looks like the forest in FF: Advent Children.

 

[Desire]

nice, guess ur better thn me

 

[Shök]

VG, you're a pretty good Marth Player...

But You're too By-The-Book.
Don't be afraid to mix up your strategies. (Ex: I use Auto-Cancelled Fair>Nair or Uair more than most people and I always try to set up for Vertical Spacing, even though these are commonly unused)
And You're Kinda Spamming the Dancing Blade a little too much. it's a good move, but don't overuse it.

Other than that, it was good.

 

[VietGeek]

Shameful bump.

<3?

 

[VietGeek]

Another shameful bump.

Help me fools. I know you love critiquing people.

<3

 

[Pierce7d]

Uh, I have to disagree. Your Marth flowed like a sword master should; you're one of my new favorite Marth's. Even better than myself actually, and I won't even give that to Drago.

You make sloppy mistake, but those will vanish with practice. You're doing awesome, and definitely on your way to great places. I left comments on each Youtube vid so I could be very specific about everything I wanted to say.

 

[VietGeek]

Bump in disguise:

My Roy can do a 0 to death combo on Final Destination by dashdancing camp to Fthrow chains to end of stage to Dancing Blade with the third hit being Up for a meteor smash.