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Fair enough points, out of curiosity when you say this (the stuff I quoted); can the Rosa player actually input commands while in hitstun with Luma acting on his own, or will Luma simply finish moves he'd already started before Rosa got knocked into hitstun?
They're big bruisers. Lucario is not. Sounds like 75% aura is fine for him.
Ganondorf is far slower and less mobile than Lucario. He has to work to get and land hits while for Lucario it's generally much easier. Also, I don't know why you're focusing on bair, SideB and UpSmash kill just as well.
Uhh, no. Lucario's weight is 99, 1 higher than Mario. Most characters kill him at 120-130%. His recovery is also very good and is hard for most characters to intercept.
You can input attacks for Luma at any time. While Rosa's grabbed, in hitstun, doing something else, or even dying off the top.
Actually I tested this, its at minimum 25% average without vectoring (and even 1% less damage results in no KO) and less if its Jigglypuff and Toon Link.
Did you test it in Training Mode? Training mode isn't reliable for kill percents, it doesn't apply the 5% freshness bonus (KO punch will always be fresh since you can't use it often), and it also ignores Mac's Rage bonus. He usually has about 80% damage by the time he gets the move.
those hits that kill are slow
Uhh, Down Smash has always been a good roll punish move. Also, his kill moves got better since Brawl and he can edgeguard decently too. The fact that his command grab kills pretty much instantly gives him better kill options than a fairly substantial portion of the cast.
He's actually slightly heavier than average and has good recovery. His weight is only 5 units less than Yoshi.
Yes, but he only has to land one to completely turn the game around. He doesn't need to make every one count.
Yeah, that explains it, it's not like there are characters with more than one move for horizontal recoveries....
(hover)(sort of)(sorf of) (fly+sideB)(sort of) (hover too)
No I tested it in for glory. *I also have been hit by it a few times while also surviving*
70% isn't kill range in this game, though, almost no one can kill at that range outside of like Bowser's charged FSmash. For a move to be considered a kill move it should kill around 110-130% if reasonably fresh, which both USmash and SideB will do.
Yes but Villager has a host of other issues to offset his amazing recovery. Lucario is much more well-rounded as a character.
40% can be a kill range in this game, have you seen a Captain Falcon go to work on on someone?
In theory, there are people who can kill you at 0% (albeit you have to do something REALLY dumb for it to happen; but most counters will definitely do it)
Honestly I never paid much attention as more often then not my counter gets shielded and since it can never break a shield or do absurd damage when countering a warlock punch Im probably gonna say it follows its own rules of functioning on aura levels. I really have not had a low aura counter kill like ever.
no it scales with aura only
when lucario is over 80 it kills like at 85-90 ish
One can wonder if the changes to the Luma's respawn time has something to do with the players who are always whining about Rosalina being broken. And the odd part is that Rosalina was never broken to begin with.
Ideally with most fighting games, you'd want to look at high level play. Thats where most imbalanced stuff is usually used to its fullest effect, you can get a pretty good idea of who is strong there as well.
Yes, ideally... Though what is ideal for the Japanese competitive scene is not the same for the NA scene, since the players there fight always on Final Destination (right? that is what I read here on SB a couple times). I do think they should have For Glory in mind, though, since it sort of is the main online mode of the game and it would suck to see it being neglected when it comes to balancing characters.
I really don't know about that. Pit and Dark Pit, known for having neutral matchups across the board, typically struggle with Rosalina. Even with DP's Electroshock, which'll OHKO Luma most of the time, it's a difficult matchup.
I'd say an increase of range would do the trick. Maybe slightly less ending lag. Meta Knight got hit hard to make sure he isn't broken in tournaments this time, perhaps TOO hard.
Quoted for truth. The change to the Luma's respawn time seems unwarranted, as it means that Rosalina will have to stay in defense mode for a longer time period if she's trying to survive.
...Typically helping those with bad matchups with her.
Having a get-out-of-jail free card to escape from grabs, combos, etc. when no other character has something similar...I'd call that anything but balanced. Basic, universal fighting game fundamentals don't apply to your character as long as that damn Luma exists.
i'd have to agree, i have no issues with rosalina. shes a threat, especially a good one, but shes counterable.
He's Robin Walker's favorite, but I'm sure the Heavy has more of a chance.
Yeah that's why my suggestion was to greatly buff his air game while bringing his ground game down a tad. LM is such an extreme character that he can be top tier on some stages and bottom tier on others, which just shouldn't happen. I'd still keep him as a ground specialist, but not to that degree.
It's not a coincidence that the only people who don't think Rosalina is somewhat busted are Rosalina players. There's a virtually 99% consensus that she's either the best character in the game or second best. Only Olimar boasts that same level of agreement on his tier position.
