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Tranquility - Game Over

#HBC | Laundry

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@ #HBC | Laundry #HBC | Laundry Why didn't you get JTB's votecount before voting? Why didn't you ask people to push Shen more?
game owes me $20 get@me

I didn't get JTB's votecount because I assumed that a slot wouldn't be at L-1. I forgot to check before voting because it's rare for a slot to be at more than L-1 and I didn't think Gorf's vote put him at it. It was a mistake.

Honestly, at that point, I did want JTB gone. I made a post saying how I disliked his switch from Soup to my slot and that it was scummy. He was going to be a slot that stuck around as well. Scum won't shoot him and at this point, it's pretty safe to bet that there are no other killing roles in the game. It was a slot I did want gone, just it wasn't the top pick I had, and that opportunity probably wouldn't have arisen so easily again, not without more pressing consequences for being wrong. Like I said when I realized I hammered, I don't regret that lynch. That slot needed to go. It sucks he was town but that's about all I regret from it.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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And, knowing how you'll bring up that I should've waited for a claim, do you think his claim would've saved him? Hindsight is 20/20 and all but he would've claimed vanilla and not a damn person in this game would've given a ****.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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The whole point was to make him crack. I don't care if I look muddy in the process because I know I can always redeem myself. The huge deciding factor of my town-play compared to my scum is that I take more risks as town. I'm giving away some of my scum-meta but I will adapt :)
Good ****. I approve.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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Soup did you roll jester?

Like seriously?
why the **** are you doing this

soup did the one thing that has needed to happen to kantrip since d1. he can play like the towniest of townies and still be scum (see: E+A mafia) so you have to pressure him or bait him a bit to see how he reacts.

soup are you still down for lynching kantrip? if so, why?
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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Isn't this synonymous with townreading them for playing well? Which is exactly what you're saying needs to stop?

You say the way I'm play isn't producing results, but I disagree. Did I ever say that playing more passively wasn't working for me? It's actually really helping for me to get unbiased reads. I always have trouble reading people and interactions that I'm involved with/in. People who are all up in my face typically get scumreads and people who like me get townreads, so I'm sitting back and getting reads without diving into everything that happens. But I realize that people need to be able to read me too, because that's half of mafia, so I'm trying now to give more content so people can see where I'm coming from.

This is good and I'm happy you took that away from Luigi's. I do think that scum is partly taking advantage of the thread being a bunch of people arguing and they are probably hanging back more. Shenan is a player who is doing this. They had more content early and now they're way more in the background. Laundry hasn't posted toDay at all (or at least nothing that I remember) and that also worries me because he seemed to have such strong opinions when he was catching up but then he randomly hammered JTB and now he has faded into the shadows. I think he's a slot I really need to reread.
I think they're playing well, but it's a town kind of vibe I'm getting. I find it interesting that you grow more and more paranoid of YOLO/Gheb though. I'm not going to ask you if you think they're aligned because it isn't relevant. I'm interested in your perspective about Gheb/YOLO. Is there anything other than gut feels on them? I've skimmed some of your posts but I do recall that your stance on Yolo is simply that you feel he is swaggering the game too much for his own good, or perhaps you're paranoid as to how he's always calling for someone to not hammer or something like that. I'll look into it more, but what makes you think this couldn't just be town marshy doing his thing?
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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why the **** are you doing this

soup did the one thing that has needed to happen to kantrip since d1. he can play like the towniest of townies and still be scum (see: E+A mafia) so you have to pressure him or bait him a bit to see how he reacts.

soup are you still down for lynching kantrip? if so, why?
No. Not today. I want confirmation of Shen's alignment first. I'm banking my read on him on that, but right now I am mostly agreeing that he is being townie as of late.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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There is a difference a pressure vote and asking someone, "What is my scum intent?" And "Prove that you are town?"

This isn't null, this is scummy. You're trying to put it on him when you ain't got anything to back it up with.
"You're not this dumb" -Ruy 2014
 

#HBC | Laundry

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No, this isn't fly with me.

I want to know why you voted Kantrip and then 180'd.

I have a slight problem with your play which revolves around keeping pretty much the entire player base as an acceptable lynch.

You called Soup out on meta D2 being, "he plays bad when he rolls town" but then later said he was a null read at best.

You did this with WashedLaundry later today saying he is not a town read either.

Who is town to you?
LUIGI'S MANSION ROUND 2

MARSHY DOES HIS USUAL ****, RUY HATES HIM FOR IT

LET'S ALL PROMPTLY AVOID THE ONCOMING EGO ****STORM AND LOOK AT RAKE LIKE WE SHOULD'VE IN THAT GAME
 

#HBC | Laundry

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I normally wouldn't care.

But I'm dang sure you've said at least everyone in the game was ok to lynch at some point.

It looks like you might be keeping you options open outside of the pool posts you have made.

Still I want to know what was that Kantrip vote at the start of the day.

Why even?
"


You can't be serious.

You are not this dumb."

-Ruy 2014
 

#HBC | Laundry

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laundry

wuddya think of potatos interest in my slot?
Honestly at this point, I've grown to expect players to become wary of you. I've been guilty of it in the past but it just strikes me as paranoia every time someone says "I just don't like marshy" when you have an inherently antitown style of play that you purposefully maintain just to avoid getting shot or whatever.

That said, I think it's mildly justified given that you're still alive D3 and two lynches you've championed were both town; however, I don't particularly fault you on either because BSP modkilled himself rather than got lynched (so you saying something along the lines of "I kinda regret it because I was thinking he was town before he did it" means **** because there's no way to prove it) and JTB was a crapshoot and likely to flip either way. If you continue to breath tomorrow, especially if you lead a mislynch today, town needs to dedicate D4 into figuring out your alignment. I have no idea if I'll make it that far though.

In short, I think it's justified but at the moment it just hits me as paranoia. The one point he has is that a lot of what you're doing thus far doesn't hit me as 'town', just as 'marshy'. That doesn't mean you're scum but I don't immediately townread you either.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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While I'm at it, everyone give me a reads-list. I might be playing like "****" but by god am I not letting this game go down like Luigi's.
Off the top of my head,

I like:

You, Potato, Ruy (reminds me a lot of LM Ruy), Gheb

I'm okay with:
Yolo

I can't read:
Vinyl.

Scum:
Nabe, Shen

that's about it
 

#HBC | Laundry

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No. **** that.

This whole time you've been telling me to stop giving you my scumreads because I was "redirecting to other people instead of responding to your case." You ****ing ****, you can't try to turn this around now and ask for my reads when I've been trying to give them to you because I already knew the argument was pointless.

This whole time you've been like "OMG RESPOND TO MY CASE KANTPLAY" and I looked at your case and it was wrong so I said why each point was wrong. After doing so, I said the direction I wanted to go with the day and why and you said "NO I DON'T WANT YOUR SCUMREADS I WANT YOU TO RESPOND TO MY CASE." So I, once again, went over the points you gave me and explained why they were wrong. Then I tried to explain where to go from there and you just wouldn't take it. And NOW you're telling me to go back to the basics and give you a readslist?

**** you. You can go dig through the thread for it yourself. I've already been trying to give you that information and you spat it out on the floor. Pick it up yourself.
man potato

you got baited and outsmarted

now get off the saltlife and actually cooperate pls. just pretend it's me asking you
 

#HBC | Laundry

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If we lose I will say the inactives were a real contributing factor.

That and the not needed why even modkill, seriously BSP why?

Kantrip and Soup need to stop yelling at each other. It's downing the thread.

Nabe needs something on the table, Vinyl replacement is needed, Yolo needs to answer that past question, I need to reread Shen.
If we lose, I'm wholly blaming it on BSP modkilling himself. It's leading me to multiple incomplete resolutions on certain slots that I have to give up on because I can't prove it one way or another.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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I would like more on why you town-read laundry right now. I am in the same boat of yolo right now and while I like laundry on the surface, pawn's play still has a huge mark in my mind.

For that other notion, I want an updated read on Ruy. Not anything that is just the same garble you were telling me earlier confronted about it, but how you're reading him now.
like

literally

all you guys do is talk around me without actually talking to me and keep citing pawn's play despite mentioning how much you've liked what i've posted

all i'm left is saying "what do"
 

#HBC | Laundry

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im not saying lynch an inactive today (tho i would LOVE to hardbody laundry and nabe back to back. i promise good things would come out of that) but to actually discuss **** today for the sake of getting something outta the question marks
:eyeroll:

here comes yolo
big tongue wobblin'
flyin' through the air
like a big dumb goblin
 

Red_Antoine

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Ruy and Shenani have one of the strongest connections this entire game, so if/When Shenani flips scum what do you look at that slot as?
In what way do we? Because I'm not seeing it, and I don't know about Ruy, but I'm still not totally up for any "Strong Connections" yet, if you mean in terms of reading as town.

page 27 now
 

Red_Antoine

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Loaded questions I despise, whirling sand in people's eyes
Guilefully trying to establish false ideas that the genius is no longer on my list!
There's no turn of 180 degree - I simply move my head to see
That more than one stands out to me; Sometimes two equals can coexist


:059:
are you going to just spout poems

because it's not content
 

Red_Antoine

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I feel like I'm not giving Koops enough credit on the side of the hydra. Upon re-reading I actually like the side of Koops and I think I might have been too soon to jump at Ruy earlier.
While I appreciate it, I have to admit I haven't been posting as much as I'd like to. I'm going to totally fix this.

I really don't know what's happened to myself in the past few years, I make less big posts and just small replies to people, but I'm making them as well now to convey my thoughts.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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Okay, so the gist of the hate for my slot is that I'm a) Pawn's slot, and b) my hammer sucked, just like Shenan said on page 30. I've already talked at length about both but I'll put answers to both issues here.

A) I can't excuse Pawn's play but for the sake of avoiding more pressure on it, I will simply continue to point to KvK, where he played like ass, was considered scum by most of the roster, got lynched, and flipped town and hope that one of the multiple people still in this game will remember that and take that into consideration. Marshy won't because he didn't play that game, so if he's willing to sit on that point, that's fine. I wouldn't blame Gheb either given that he also replaced out. Anyone else, I'm a little bit more expecting of you than them.

B) In terms of the hammer, it was an accident, but one I don't wholly regret. I regret the fact that he flipped town but that slot was going to be a crapshoot to read. He wasn't going to get shot by the mafia and even if a vig had existed (which I doubted), he still had to choose between he, vinyl, and nabe, who still had yet to commit to the game after replacing a surprisingly inactive and unhelpful Joey. I disliked his play in thread. I literally quoted all of his posts and said I disliked his play, particularly his switch from Soup to my slot, and his reasoning for Soup only made sense after he posted an explanation of it after he had been hammered. I'm not sure what the hell he was waiting for but his play simply was not good. This was the best opportunity to remove that slot and so I ultimately signed off on that lynch, even though early in the phase I did say I didn't wholly agree with it. I don't like lynching inactives, and I never have. I wasn't certain that he was going to flip scum either but I felt there was a good shot he would. Both of these factors turned me off the lynch, but I ultimately joined it because that slot simply had to go due to it not being removed by other forces (roles) and I recognized that the more I read YOLO/Cream Team's interaction towards the end of the day. Mix that with how much the game had slowed down and I lost my reasons for not joining it. I didn't mean to hammer but it's done and I can't take it back.

yolo you asshat you even liked my explanation for hammering wtf

I still think Shen is scum. I still dislike that slot in particular. I don't like how Nabe responded to me calling his slot out, nor do I like the lack of presence from Joey before him (something I don't expect from Joey at all), nor do I like his lack of presence now, something I don't expect of Nabe.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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I also think Nabe is a fine lynch. I know who Nabe is as scum. He will not post just because you ask him to. He will use the time you give him to set things in motion or keep coasting to victory. Nabe doesn't react unless you give him a reason to. I would be more than happy with getting pressure on him so he isn't trouble to deal with.
Like, literally why I want to lynch Nabe right now.
 

Red_Antoine

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And, knowing how you'll bring up that I should've waited for a claim, do you think his claim would've saved him? Hindsight is 20/20 and all but he would've claimed vanilla and not a damn person in this game would've given a ****.
It could have. It's never likely, especially in vanilla games, but a claim could have definitely helped. Plus, we would have got information out of it.
 

Shenanigenius

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I disliked the way he seemed to sidestep all my questions, so I'd be fine with offing Nabe atm. I can't get past the fact he has different people on his scum list and his lynch list and won't talk about it.

Also you still need to chill out Washed, we know who Pawn is. (and there weren't lynches in that game per say)
 

YOLOSWAG

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laundry have you read nabes latest posts? or is the slot past the point of no return for you?

man im actually enjoying this game now. wish things had unfolded minus the modkill/replacements

/vent
 

#HBC | Laundry

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II feel what I want to mention is that there's an eerie vibe between Kantplay/Ruy/Shen. Something people have noted before but upon re-read I've noticed it a bit more. Kantplay has always solidly town-read Ruy but Ruy has never placed his read other than wanting to like him for the most part.

Shen/Ruy have had this death bear 4 lyfe gig going on for the majority of D2. I don't feel like Ruy would do this to his partner especially in light with the majority of people disliking Shen. It's risky and I feel Ruy would play to the crowd rather than be stubborn about it. In that sense, how Kantplay was reading him earlier seems to line up.

However, It's so weird how Ruy handles Shen turning against him. He doesn't even acknowledge it at first, let alone care. It's off-putting to me, especially how he was so willing to jump down my throat at first? Maybe he thought Shen was still town and just wrong? I don't know. They both hard defend each other so much. I don't see an opposition besides Shen claiming dislike of something Ruy did but then they're just instantly buddies after that. Nothing is discussed. Ruy holds to his Shen read.

Shen is individually scummy. His whole play reeks. The way he handled me reeks. The way he handled ruy reeks. He makes pushes but doesn't follow through on them. He also reminds me of Rajam who hides behind his catch-up posts as scum.

I feel on my re-read I gained a clearer head, but the weird thing is that my reads didn't really change. I do not like Kantrip, but I feel if I want to get at Kantrip, I should get at Shen first. Ruy is not a priority but he's also claiming he wants shen as of late too.

Shen is the piece to the puzzle right now, and holds the most connections. I am sorry for the overly long post but I made this post up as I was reading. Consider my vote on him in spirit, but there is this agonizing feeling I get about the inactives.
Thank you for re-highlighting this, this has been what's bothering me at the back of my mind for awhile.

Mostly the Shen/Ruy interaction really. It's odd to me seeing how they both mentioned they really liked each other, only for Shen to immediately jump to disliking Ruy as soon as I ask Dietz his thoughts. Ruy has only just now noticed this and come around to it and it's caught on. I still think this is dumbtown Ruy from LM. He's acting exactly like it and while I know that's reading Ruy for his meta, I can't see his actions as particularly sinister.

Shen really is the lynchpin. Is he at L-2?
 

Shenanigenius

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Also I'm down to clear the air if there's no doubt that out slot is going to be the play otherwise, what are we at?
 

Shenanigenius

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It's a dumb story. I come in and speak my mind and everyone just attributes it to whatever they feel like at the time. For real
 

#HBC | Laundry

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yall are -2
welp

Now that I've read a bit of Nabe, I'm not sure what to make of it. The last thing I expected was long, drawn out explanations of why he thinks what he thinks. I haven't seen that out of Nabe...ever, and if he has done it before, I don't remember a single game where he has (meaning it was either on AiB or I didn't play in it).

lemme see where he eventually gets to, it's more about looking at the things nabe's doing. nabe will have reads regardless of alignment, but what he does with them is more important.
 

Shenanigenius

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Then I'll wait and see what we can get from Nabe in the meantime as long as deadline isn't near
 

#HBC | Laundry

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You serious bro? I mean I gave you a chance to say "nah that's just the short version", but if you actually think that a replacement had anything to do with the Ryu questionings after you already quoted the relevant posts: that's weak.

I find it hard to believe you're generalizing like that.
Not really, given that a lot of other people have cited the same reason as a reason to dislike you. It's not like you changed your read before I asked. I think Dietz opened that post responding to my question with "Now that you mention it...".

There's open conflict between nabe/shen in thread. This is the most interesting thing to me.
 

#HBC | Laundry

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(that's a bold false statement to make by the way, personally speaking as the party in question. were you keeping track :woman:?)

What's your read on Washed really like also? You seemed to point out his potential bad qualities pretty well when asked, but he's a town lean on your list among the other discrepancies in your list vs lynch pool already noted.

Vote: Nabe
Oh my gog I hate this vote.

Marshy pls be good at math

vote: Shenan
 

Shenanigenius

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Not really, given that a lot of other people have cited the same reason as a reason to dislike you. It's not like you changed your read before I asked. I think Dietz opened that post responding to my question with "Now that you mention it...".
Whoah if Ryu is going to dismiss his interactions with Soup as "trolling" I am not okay with that. I was all on board with you getting reads out of him when he acted like he had something to hide but this page 12 stuff is not cool. Calm yourself jesus

Same goes for having us as his town read because "rake". I know I like to use gut on my hydra partner too but that way out of line to throw a full on town read on us for gut only.

(I know, I'm far behind)
Nope.

Everyone just makes up their own random reason to hate it, it's like hate Christmas only the presents are people ****ting on what may have been the towniest thing I did the entire game: question a read.
 
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