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Social "Time to Tip the Scales!" - Robin Social Thread

Hong

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Pffft, yeah sure like you woulnd't have been interested in playing as Killager or Robin either anyway :smirk:
But yes apparently vectoring is gone from what i can hear, i'm glad, not so much because i don't welcome a DI-esque mechanic, but because this one felt so weird to use and unintuitive.
Yeah. You got me. No matter how much I smack-talk Smash 4, I am playing it a lot. :)

It will certainly make playing Robin much more fun. As Villager, most of your business is done edge-guarding, being one of the best characters in the game from the ledge. Bowling ball when they come low, growing a tree as the grab the ledge,, off-stage dair, off-stage fair, etc. With Robin, off-stage play is actually kind of sucky beyond nair gimps and the cute occasional Elwind kill when people forget you can do that. LS fair and bair are powerful, but have the worst kind of knockback trajectory possible.

Now Robin's already amazing LS uair, as well several instances of LS bair and fair, should in theory be much improved.
 

The Merc

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Huh. More fluff.


*watches*

@ False Sense False Sense , I don't know whether to love or hate you right now.

Yeah, I really like Hades right now.
Do you now
.
I just realized this scene is finally available on Youtube.


What a great moment between Robin and Lucina...
Oh, my god...... I'm, I'm speechless.
How do you trigger the bad endings on those?
Kill all the other kids. You monster.

YOU MONSTER!
 

Mr. Johan

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If only Thoron was a pure vertical knockback move, that would be silly.

At least Kamehameha can't be vectored now.
 
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Hong

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Speaking of which, has anyone tried seeing if you can still pop out of grounded Thoron with ROB and stuff? In theory, your ability to get out of it with any kind of vertical influence should be hindered. Granted, it could have been a product of crouch-cancelling alone.
 

False Sense

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Huh. More fluff.


*watches*

@ False Sense False Sense , I don't know whether to love or hate you right now.

Yeah, I really like Hades right now.

I... I cried...
C-curse you, blasted feelings!
I cry way too easily when it comes to characters I'm attached to. Robin happens to be one of them.
Heck, I love all the characters; I'd cry for all of them.
Oh, my god...... I'm, I'm speechless.



YOU MONSTER!
Great, I made people cry. :crying:

But I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds that scene to be moving. The use of Id~Sorrow, especially, is excellent, and the moment it plays you can truly feel the emotions of that moment.



By the way, I heard that Vectoring is gone and DI is back. So... Can someone explain what that means, exactly? And is this good or bad for Robin?
 

S.F.L.R_9

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Great, I made people cry. :crying:

But I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds that scene to be moving. The use of Id~Sorrow, especially, is excellent, and the moment it plays you can truly feel the emotions of that moment.



By the way, I heard that Vectoring is gone and DI is back. So... Can someone explain what that means, exactly? And is this good or bad for Robin?
..Regular DI is back?

I don't think it'll mean too much for any character though, you'll just have to get used to holding in a different direction.
 

Hong

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By the way, I heard that Vectoring is gone and DI is back. So... Can someone explain what that means, exactly? And is this good or bad for Robin?
In the shortest of terms possible: Vectoring greatly increased your life-span against attacks that sent you upwards by holding down on your circle pad, and as well as improved your ability to get out of combos sooner by holding upwards. This, in theory, is no longer the case.

To go into depth:
In a DI situation, if you are knocked upwards, you should instead influence the trajectory of your character by holding left or right on the cpad/control stick. If you imagine the blastzones of the stage as literally being a box:



You can elongate the time it takes for you to reach the blastzones by altering the angle you are launched, thus giving you more time to regain control of your character and experiencing the maximum possible launch distance, thereby allowing you to live longer. To imagine this: if you travel 50 meters straight upwards from the bottom of the screen starting from the horizontal centre of the stage, you'd die much faster than if you were going diagonally. If you go diagonally, the net amount of knockback has a greater chance of being accumulated, and you are more likely to regain control before you die.

Vectoring had a most notable affect on attacks that kill vertically. Since Robin's LS uair is one of her better kill moves, the end of vectoring would most likely serve to benefit Robin. It also means Robin may be more succeptible to combos because you can't vector out of combo-oriented throws as easily, but that benefits Robin as well since we may now have combo options out of dthrow that we never had against player-controlled characters prior.
I don't think it'll mean too much for any character though, you'll just have to get used to holding in a different direction.
This is not necessarily the case.

It may be a bit early to say, but studies so far suggest the actual influence of directional influence is nowhere near as strong as the movement generated my vectoring. Vectoring a vertical launch in essence, to put it into crude terms, is "down minus up". That is to say if your character was travelling upwards at 100 units/s, and vectoring was 20 units/s downwards, you would have 80 units/s of upward momentum remaining. In the situation of DI, you are angling yourself sideways.

Even if DI had any level of notable potency (yet to be proven), there are numerable realistic situations where the maximum possible effect of DI can't come to fruition. For instance if you are knocked diagonally from the centre of the stage, at some point you either die because you travelled too far left, or you die because you travelled too far upwards. The mathematical constant of vectoring, with basically a subtractive nature, would mean you can just go "less diagonally upward" up to an even greater percentage until it no longer mattered.
 

LIQUID12A

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So what's everyone lambasting False for-

I just realized this scene is finally available on Youtube.


What a great moment between Robin and Lucina...
...

You know, despite being heartwrenching, that didn't manage to break me. And Awakening is one of FOUR games to make me cry. Wanna know the rest, in order of lowest to highest amounts of tears?

Awakening is at the bottom.

MGS4 follows it. That ending.

Peace Walker trumps MGS4 to me.

And Mario Galaxy trumps all of them. Sad as Awakening was the first time around, it will NEVER make me gush tears harder than ROSALINA'S FRACKING STORYBOOK does.
 
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Shaymikyu

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So what's everyone lambasting False for-



...

You know, despite being heartwrenching, that didn't manage to break me. And Awakening is one of FOUR games to make me cry. Wanna know the rest, in order of lowest to highest amounts of tears?

Awakening is at the bottom.

MGS4 follows it. That ending.

Peace Walker trumps MGS4 to me.

And Mario Galaxy trumps all of them. Sad as Awakening was the first time around, it will NEVER make me gush tears harder than ROSALINA'S FRACKING STORYBOOK does.
I need to complete Mario Galaxy one day. I just stink at most platformers.

Off topic, but how did you remove the lines of the drawing in your avatar? I've tried using online tutorials, and it never works.
 

LIQUID12A

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I need to complete Mario Galaxy one day. I just stink at most platformers.

Off topic, but how did you remove the lines of the drawing in your avatar? I've tried using online tutorials, and it never works.
Do it. Mario Galaxy is a beautiful game.

I took the eye dropper tool, got the exact color of the area where the lines crossed, and painted over them one by one, tedious as it was. I didn't do it for the robe because at that size, they are basically invisible.
 

Shaymikyu

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Do it. Mario Galaxy is a beautiful game.

I took the eye dropper tool, got the exact color of the area where the lines crossed, and painted over them one by one, tedious as it was. I didn't do it for the robe because at that size, they are basically invisible.
I'll just keep the lines then and brighten it or something. It'll take way too long.

And I will next time I'm with my Wii and not distracted by Omega Ruby.
 

Hong

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I just throw it into Photoshop and make a layer of all black underneath it. Then I use the magic eraser (magic wand + delete on other tools if not present), disable anti-aliasing, and see if I can get rid of a huge chunk at once. From there, I just switch to the eraser and manually clean up around the edges. First with a big eraser for a quick once-over, then with progressively smaller erasers to get the hard to reach areas (like the loose strands of hair in my current avatar).
 

False Sense

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So what's everyone lambasting False for-



...

You know, despite being heartwrenching, that didn't manage to break me. And Awakening is one of FOUR games to make me cry.
Yeah, I wouldn't go so far as to say that the scene is a tragic masterpiece or anything like that. But I do think the scene is quite heart wrenching, well done, and provides a little more insight into the characters of Robin and Lucina. Plus it doesn't seem like that many people even know that the scene exists, and I think it deserves more recognition.
 

Shaymikyu

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I just throw it into Photoshop and make a layer of all black underneath it. Then I use the magic eraser (magic wand + delete on other tools if not present), disable anti-aliasing, and see if I can get rid of a huge chunk at once. From there, I just switch to the eraser and manually clean up around the edges. First with a big eraser for a quick once-over, then with progressively smaller erasers to get the hard to reach areas (like the loose strands of hair in my current avatar).
I only have Gimp. I can try something similar, though.
 

LIQUID12A

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Yeah, I wouldn't go so far as to say that the scene is a tragic masterpiece or anything like that. But I do think the scene is quite heart wrenching, well done, and provides a little more insight into the characters of Robin and Lucina. Plus it doesn't seem like that many people even know that the scene exists, and I think it deserves more recognition.
Of course.

But I'm providing my own POV on it. Fiction has to hit me, personally, harder than a Falcon Punch/4x super effective move/whatever analogy you want to make me cry.

I just find it strange that a bonus feature in a Mario game makes me cry HARDER than anything MGS4/Peace Walker and Awakening have to offer. All of those games feature rather mature themes.

And Galaxy has a simple metaphor for

watching your parents die at a young age. "She's sleeping under the tree on the hill!"

GOD MAGNIFICENT *swear*, the difference between what breaks me is amazing.
 
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The Merc

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So what's everyone lambasting False for-



...

You know, despite being heartwrenching, that didn't manage to break me. And Awakening is one of FOUR games to make me cry. Wanna know the rest, in order of lowest to highest amounts of tears?

Awakening is at the bottom.

MGS4 follows it. That ending.

Peace Walker trumps MGS4 to me.

And Mario Galaxy trumps all of them. Sad as Awakening was the first time around, it will NEVER make me gush tears harder than ROSALINA'S FRACKING STORYBOOK does.

Yeah, while I didn't actually cry say as much as Lucina x Robin chapter 21, fore some reason after see it, it maks me ...... 'pity' Grima

*turns around to see Grima kill family and destroy home*

........... Ok, never mind
..Regular DI is back?

I don't think it'll mean too much for any character though, you'll just have to get used to holding in a different direction.
.

RIP Vectoring :crying:
 

Gingerbread Man

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I loved the future past DLC ending. It takes a lot deeper look into the Robin who became Grima than the main plot ever did, which is sort of a shame. A lot of interesting stuff that would have had to have happened in Lucina's timeline is just left in the dark...
 
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Pikachewy99

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And Galaxy has a simple metaphor for

watching your parents die at a young age. "She's sleeping under the tree on the hill!"

GOD MAGNIFICENT *swear*, the difference between what breaks me is amazing.
That
that reference
Oh man the feels
I didn't get to finish the game because as a 10 year old getting through Bowser's dark matter reactor made me ragequit and never want to play it again, but I did find a game theory video on Rosalina and was just shocked by how deep the storybook was.

I'll just keep the lines then and brighten it or something. It'll take way too long.

And I will next time I'm with my Wii and not distracted by Omega Ruby.
Maybe I should start drawing stuff on lineless paper instead.
…Nah. :troll:
It's usually that I doodle on lined paper and then doodles become actual pictures. I also like how thin lined paper is, but that's just me. Drawing on printer paper forever has made me dislike it. (Not to mention that one way or another regular blank paper sucks at fitting in my bag and ends up getting crumpled. :()
 

Shaymikyu

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That
that reference
Oh man the feels
I didn't get to finish the game because as a 10 year old getting through Bowser's dark matter reactor made me ragequit and never want to play it again, but I did find a game theory video on Rosalina and was just shocked by how deep the storybook was.



Maybe I should start drawing stuff on lineless paper instead.
…Nah. :troll:
It's usually that I doodle on lined paper and then doodles become actual pictures. I also like how thin lined paper is, but that's just me. Drawing on printer paper forever has made me dislike it. (Not to mention that one way or another regular blank paper sucks at fitting in my bag and ends up getting crumpled. :()
I usually draw on line paper too, so don't feel bad. It's just so convenient. When I do a printer paper drawing, it takes me longer since I can't take it anywhere.

And a Mario game with a story that isn't one of the RPGs? What is this sorcery?
 

LIQUID12A

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And a Mario game with a story that isn't one of the RPGs? What is this sorcery?
Well, it's only a small story for Rosalina, but it's so goddamn beautiful.

I would pay real money for a hardcover of that story sent to my house.
 
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D

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I liked the part where he caught him with backslash, you could just feel the amount of strategy in that fight.
Totally. Such a tactical move to do!
Now that's strategy!

oh no



Who ever runs the official Smash Bros Facebook page,

I love you.
I saw this earlier... it's freaking beautiful.
I wonder who runs the Facebook page because most of these captions are pretty hilarious and witty.

I got Path of Radiance in the mail today.

It's happening.
Congrats! ...I wish I had PoR. :( Too bad that it's too expensive.

:4greninja:: I suppose i'll get my chance, another day...
Also, Lucina apparently is in KI:Uprising
The track is alright in my opinion; I prefer the one in Uprising to be honest. It's an amazing song still, however.
AND DON'T YOU DARE TAUNT ME WITH GRENINJA NERFS! :cry: RIP Shadow Sneak lag cancel...

You know, I can't think of this cutscene the same way anymore. Now when I look at this, I can't help but be reminded that Chrom took a nap on the ground for nearly the whole Robin trailer.
For saying, "There are better places to take a nap than on the ground, you know," he doesn't listen to his own advice.

I just realized this scene is finally available on Youtube.


What a great moment between Robin and Lucina...
I feel bad for Robin in this scene.
He was forced to kill his best friend, and later caused the destruction of the world as a result of it. When he was linked with Grima, he became nothing but a mere vessel; a mere puppet for Grima to use to cause the destruction of the world.
He knows that he must atone for his actions, but he can't unless Lucina kills him uses the Awakening against him. There is no way out; he can't win in this fight.
It's such a tragedy to see a selfless, thoughtful hero relying on his friends to help him in his journey become the exact opposite of what he is with Grima; a selfish, power hungry fool that only sees his followers and troops as mere tools and even kills off more of his friends.
 

Weeman

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Out of curiosity, why would you want vectoring in the game?
"Because it adds depth to the game, without it the game becomes overcentralized on combos and rushdown with no reading skills needed"
Someone literally replied this to me when i asked the same question. :4dedede:
 
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The Merc

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Of course.

But I'm providing my own POV on it. Fiction has to hit me, personally, harder than a Falcon Punch/4x super effective move/whatever analogy you want to make me cry.

I just find it strange that a bonus feature in a Mario game makes me cry HARDER than anything MGS4/Peace Walker and Awakening have to offer. All of those games feature rather mature themes.

And Galaxy has a simple metaphor for

watching your parents die at a young age. "She's sleeping under the tree on the hill!"

GOD MAGNIFICENT *swear*, the difference between what breaks me is amazing.
I have a better one

"My we met in another life time"


SO SAD. WHY FI? WHY?!:cry:
 

The Merc

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Out of curiosity, why would you want vectoring in the game?
Because it is so much EASIER than DI. Serious, i could never figure out how to DI I properly, never. With Vectoring, how, all I had to do was jam my c stick towards the stage and I would live :b:. Though I guess that makes me sound like a noob now :laugh:.

Doesn't Robin say something almost identical?

:4robinm: "May we meet again, in a better life." :4robinf:
And he/she does have a wide range of knowledge and can anaylise a foe just by look and studying them.......

Fi confirmed to be Robin's mother! :p
 

S.F.L.R_9

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So, if DI is back, I have an idea..
When launched at KO percents, do you guys think Robin may be able to b-reverse Thunder if he/she cancels the hitstun out with an aerial, causing you to stop your momentum and drift toward the stage? I mained Zelda in Brawl and she was able to do something very similar that saved me countless times. Lookie here. Thunder does not carry momentum like Nayru's Love does, but this may still be worth looking into.
 

Hong

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Because it is so much EASIER than DI. Serious, i could never figure out how to DI I properly, never. With Vectoring, how, all I had to do was jam my c stick towards the stage and I would live :b:. Though I guess that makes me sound like a noob now :laugh:.
Understandable, but I think DI can be simple to understand if you break it down to this:

You are launched straight upwards. You are going to fly 100 metres. If you travel any more than 80 metres straight upwards, you are going to die. What do you do with the remaining 20 metres?

The answer is you need to travel at least 20 metres somewhere that is not upwards. You can't get rid of those 20 metres, but you can steer left or right so you can reach those full 100 metres without hitting the blastzone.

Edit -
So, if DI is back, I have an idea..
When launched at KO percents, do you guys think Robin may be able to b-reverse Thunder if he/she cancels the hitstun out with an aerial, causing you to stop your momentum and drift toward the stage? I mained Zelda in Brawl and she was able to do something very similar that saved me countless times. Lookie here. Thunder does not carry momentum like Nayru's Love does, but this may still be worth looking into.
Worth testing.
 
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The Merc

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Understandable, but I think DI can be simple to understand if you break it down to this:

You are launched straight upwards. You are going to fly 100 metres. If you travel any more than 80 metres straight upwards, you are going to die. What do you do with the remaining 20 metres?

The answer is you need to travel at least 20 metres somewhere that is not upwards. You can't get rid of those 20 metres, but you can steer left or right so you can reach those full 100 metres without hitting the blastzone.
I guess that makes sense, though every time I try to DI in brawl or melee, it either feels like that I'm not doing it properly or (mostly in Brawls cause, cause of the little hit stun) I fell like I going accidentally perform an aerial and die. It's so hard.
 

Hong

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I guess that makes sense, though every time I try to DI in brawl or melee, it either feels like that I'm not doing it properly or (mostly in Brawls cause, cause of the little hit stun) I fell like I going accidentally perform an aerial and die. It's so hard.
Just hold the control stick. Don't press any buttons.
 

Hong

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No, I mean with the c stick, no the a button.
I know what you mean, but just focus on DIing with only the control stock. Not the c-stick. Use that to SDI out of multi-hitting moves.
 
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The Merc

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I know what you mean, but like, just focus on DIing with just the control stock. Not the c-stick. use that to SDI out of multi-hitting moves.
Oh, ok, cause I remember watching a DI tutorial youtube video and it showed using the c stick as well, giving even more of a DI effect. Thanks for the advice.
 

ThunderSageNun

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so, the main problem with vectoring was with vertical launches? Sounds like an a-ok change to me, from what I've played of the demo, characters took too long to be KO anyways, moreso than in any of the previous games in my experience.
Also added a certain event on my sig to not forget it
 

False Sense

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So, if I understand correctly, this update:

-Removed a situational glitch that gave Robin a third jump

+Improved Robin's recovery by making it safer, thus allowing Robin greater freedom off-stage
+Nerfed a number of Robin's worst match ups
+Removed Vectoring, allowing Robin to take greater advantage of his/her good vertical kill potential


Seems like it's a good day to be a Robin main. :colorful:
 

Hong

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So, if I understand correctly, this update:

-Removed a situational glitch that gave Robin a third jump

+Improved Robin's recovery by making it safer, thus allowing Robin greater freedom off-stage
+Nerfed a number of Robin's worst match ups
+Removed Vectoring, allowing Robin to take greater advantage of his/her good vertical kill potential


Seems like it's a good day to be a Robin main. :colorful:
I like Robin even more than I did at release. I feel like a legitimate Robin main again, because the ever-so-slight changes really made for a world of difference somehow. I guess it's because the people I play against reeeeeeeeeally know how to eek all the little things like vectoring, so people were just living so long in an already defence-favoui game. It's an anti-combo, anti-KO mechanic, and had no place in Smash to the extent that it was.

Of course I'm not going to go full placebo and act like it's a brand new game, but it's a noticeable improvement in the experience. This, combined with the awesome tournament I saw on the Wii U version tonight, has me actually looking forward to this Friday a fair bit.
 
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