Things I Like - The Mafia Game - Game Over

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

anyone who still thinks that fonti and I are mates are very seriously failing to appreciate how my past two scum games reveal my scum meta re: mates

at the risk of selling out my scum viability in the future (or atleast my ease of playing scum according to my normal approach), anyone who read midnight ops or vanilla should know damn well that I almost never open buddy mates. I know as a slot I tend to draw a lot of attention and very rarely make it to endgame so I generally just assume Im going to flip early and hate being the guy who gives the game away for his mates upon flip. I definitely approach supporting my mates very conservatively and try to avoid connections with my mates slots whenever possible

ok sure its technically wine to say this because of course I could be gambiting and going for a whole new style if I'm scum but come the **** on that would be such an extreme shift in my scum meta, and I would have had to decide ON THE SPOT to start open budding gorf's slot immediately upon fonti's replacement. like logistically it makes no ****ing sense and would be nigh impossible to pull off

like seriously, Laser and Mala should know this better than anyone in the game because we were mates in midnight. yall should remember I was trying my hardest to not even touch yall with a 10 foot ****ing pole in that game

the reality is this, either fonti is town and again accurately soul read me (this time as town) or she is scum and very quickly picked up on the opportunity to pocket me knowing I'd be fearful of her slot given my last experience

anyone continuing to push the fonti/frozen buddy narrative is either ****ing scum or just being dense at this point because it literally makes zero ****ing sense. I'll very willingly admit I could be getting snowed hard by her but I don't see it at this point

 

[fontisian]

man if DH and Kary are mates I'm gonna laugh my *ing ass off at how ironic it is that so many slots gave me * for pointing out that one early interaction they had as potentially coordinated lmaooooo the vindication would be so ****ing good

Pretty sure Kary is town, dude.

 

[giraffelasergun]

Vote Count 3.6:
OsieOrb (2): FrozenFlame, Fontisian
Fontisian (1): Kary
BoomFrog (1): Laserguy

Not Voting (4): OsieOrb Pythag, Malakandra, Boom Frog

With 8 voters, it takes 5 votes to eliminate. Day 3 Deadline is 5 PM CST on Friday the 25th, Roughly 25 Hours from this post. Live End of Day Countdown

 

[#HBC | Kary]

You're going to make me break down the good parts of a case against me, huh?

Fine, give me an hour or two.

you've had two days to respond to Boom's case but you spent more time cozying up to him than trying to refute him.
you wanted to talk to me, but now you're brushing me off and saying you're gonna go off on a tangent
you really have no shame whatsoever lmao

 

[#HBC | Kary]

#HBC | FrozeηFlame I want to hear your opinion on fonti's initial response to Boom's case. Just this one post, in a vacuum.

 

[BoomFrog]

My working theory is that it is you/fonti/Frozen.

And in a circle we go. Can you argue ingenuously with me please? So this was a flippant brush off but you aren't taking it seriously?

It wasn't at the time you wrote your case. But I suppose I should entertain the possibility that fonti is Town and it's only you that's scum in this scenario.

Can you please give a new and better response to my original point then?

The key wrinkle in your theory (this applies to Wam too) is that you assume scum me pulled this elaborate plan but then failed at the end. Please give me more credit. If I was going to actually try stopping the Fonti yeet I'd have had a specific target after the reveal, not this. The Fonti wagon is still rolling through inertia. 9 out of 10 Fonti is still the yeet and the only thing I see possibly changing that is if Osi pulls out some amazing reads. If I planned this whole thing I wouldn't be caught "scrambling" at the end.

 

[BoomFrog]

You're going to make me break down the good parts of a case against me, huh?

Fine, give me an hour or two.

I agree with Kary. That's not a good use of time and energy.

 

[fontisian]

you've had two days to respond to Boom's case but you spent more time cozying up to him than trying to refute him.
you wanted to talk to me, but now you're brushing me off and saying you're gonna go off on a tangent
you really have no shame whatsoever lmao

?

Ok, I thought that's what you were asking for. Like, you're wondering how I can townread someone because of their push on me, the reasonable conclusion is that you want me to go into more detail on the push?

 

[fontisian]

Also, like, I did refute him? It's literally the first thing I did? Is there something I'm not refuting?

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Not sure I have time to respond to everything right now, so I'm just going to shoot off some thoughts.

Overall, I actually like the case for Boom. Like, I feel like it's the closest to getting me anyone has gotten in the game, and that's kind of crazy, since the conclusion itself is off, heh.

I'll be honest, I don't like fonti's use of "the closest to getting me anyone has gotten in the game" but seems way too dumb of a slip for it to actually be one. Also I'd kind of be a hypocrite if I docked fonti for this because I've used similar diction re: how I felt Synch was constantly "out to get me."

I'll fully admit that I have failed at forming and maintaining a towncircle this game, and the main fault in that was me not stepping up to defend Syn when I needed to. And I didn't do that in part because I didn't think it was something I needed to do. I do think the Chaco kill can be /blamed/ on me, considering that he was Vt, very wrong about Syn and Somi, and through my influence still ended up being shot. That he was killed at all is partially a reflection of what I did well, in allowing him the space to be towny and for other people to develop townreads on him.

I'm equally guilty of forming a towncircle and this reinforces my town read on fonti because I feel guilty in the same way for not atleast having a somewhat functioning coalition of people I trust. All I've done is spooked people about some crazy open mate buddy gambit and give scum the ammunition they need to set me and fonti up on the chopping block as "must flip" slots because of our "sketchy buddying." It sucks. I suck. Chaco's prob mad at me for not taking away what he prob wanted me to take away from his flip. Sab's probably pissed at me for antagonizing him all D1 in useless semantic TvT. somi's probably pissed at me for sheeping fonti and voting him when I was just mates with him in vanilla and accurately read early on that somi was not tonally the same as in Vanilla mafia. The list of my faults goes on and on. tbqh this game has been a very humbling experience (in fact all the new age games have been, everyone has gotten so much ****ing better at the game).

It's hard for me to parse the "blame the chaco kill on me" analysis. I'm honestly still trying to wrap my head around the chaco kill myself because it was absolutely not my expectation. I'm not sure I remember fonti being the one that "helped give chaco space to be townie," but that'd probably a POV problem. Chaco and I had some back and forth at EoD2 that was reassuring to me but I didn't exactly express it vocally in the thread and I wasn't trying to precisely because I wanted him around for another phase to work with and try to better sort.

I didn't go into Syn's iso with the intention of defending them, I went in the with mixed feelings and logic and wanting to figure if I /wanted/ to go to bat for them. Because defending scum and poking holes in cases on them is one thing, but getting in the way of a strong, correct wagon on scum on D2 and throwing it off course is game throwing. And while I had a part of me feeling like they might be town, they were kind of dickish and weird and just tonally off so much. There was no thing that I could see like Xivii like I saw in Mignight where his thought process and paranoia was just laid to bare. I think he probably wasn't as invested in the game itself maybe, and those thoughts were posted in their hydra instead of here, so I couldn't get that tool to work with.

I essentially have nothing to add as the bolded very succinctly summarizes why I was all aboard the synch train. Synch's inquiries into my slot never felt like they were in good faith, and I also just find reading hydras to be massively aggravating so I probably let that color my judgement and convince myself I was more certain of a scum read there than was really warranted. But generally speaking I think this paragraph is the most genuine of the whole post

Part of this gets into why I felt hurt by them, but I got the impression me talking about that makes people uncomfortable, so I'm going to keep this limited. But like, I was trying to reach out to Bessie and Xivii to get them to give me something I would feel comfortable using to defend them. I asked about Bessie aggro because, in retrospect, the townie feeling I was getting from them was because Bessie was so, so different from Sumting, where she just kind of coasted along and didn't try to burn any bridges (this is not the idiom I want, but close enough) and part of that was Bessie had an issue with her eyes or something that made it so she couldn't keep up with everything, so I was expecting some differences, but not aggro pushed by her to that level. I also felt like I could not have made it more clear that I wanted them to help me help them through my questions and they just didn't pick up on it at all, so it's not surprising that Boom didn't pick up on it here, but it's like, ** man, I was trying so hard and no one even noticed, what the **. I should move from this, sorry.

honestly no idea what to say to this and would rather not given it seems rather personal and not worth drilling down on, I kind of take the whole thing as outside the game and NAI

There's a point about me talking to Laser before the case. I did do that, for a few reasons. 1. I thought Laser was scum pushing me. 2.I can't really help it. When someone pushes me, and it's a strong, worked out case, I get like incensed? I start shaking and just want to get in and rip them a new asshole, and I have to hold myself back from doing that a lot. I'm feeling it now, though I'm in a better mood for irl reasons, and that's probably reflected in this. And I probably needed to hold myself back there, but I overestimated how much time I had to read Syn after, and only ended up getting through D1 of their iso as a result.

hey fonti is me but with this cool thing called self control! also the order of operations in her responses just doesn't feel significant to me at all

I think I ****ed up about not talking about the Neighbor thing more. Like, I think that was the thing that should have told me they were town, because Bessie and Xivii were super paranoid about town having role stuff in Sumting but they would never just throw it out there and straight up ask us, they'd talk themselves in circles and then shoot me or Frozen, 100% believing we had that role. But I justified that maybe they knew I'd remember that or maybe they didn't feel like neighbors were high priority shots anyway, so putting the role info out there didn't actually have a big risk of blowback, or maybe I misremember and Xivii did ask about a role in the thread in Sumting, because there's something kind of like that shape in my memory (my memory for specifics is garbage a lot of the time). But even if the read itself isn't fully accurate, it would have absolutely saved the game and I should have done the stupid MU thing where they keep repeating a point until people remember it instead of assuming that everyone has read it, considering it, and dismissed it as irrelevant.

this is all meta so it's hard to really use this to sort fonti but ultimately none of this comes off as self serving or like a misrepresentation of xivii/bessie

What else? Kary. Uh, how to say this without being really rude? I don't like how Kary makes reads. I think they are town but will probably always be opposed to me on some level unless our reads end up in similar places by sheer random chance. I didn't consider anything they were saying about anyone to be very valuable to me, and I don't know their track record well enough to respect their reads independently. I'm still reading what they write, I just don't value it.

I find myself agreeing with fonti here. I don't like how you (Kary) have expressed your reads this game, but I totally respect it. Just a different way to ball. The unfortunate reality tho is that because I've had a hard time vibing with your read development, it's making me more paranoid of a snow from you vs. one from fonti

 

[BoomFrog]

Fontisian, I spent literally 48 hours equal parts fantasising about how I would rain fiery judgment down on you and being sure I would get NEed. And then with this I am disarmed:

So much this. fonti comes across as frustratingly genuine.

LaserGuy, you said "so much this". I showed you my fiery judgement, where's yours? Because this did not feel like fiery judgement to start the day:

I think this is where I want to start today. More later this evening.

Vote: fonti

You backed off of Fonti as soon as I did, then you hopped back on when I laid out my case, then you backed off once I backed off again and push me instead. If you were convinced at day start that Fonti is scum, why have my shenanigans convinced you that Fonti is only scum with me?

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

man team has to be some combo of kary/Darkheuryosie/LG/pythag

kary and pythag showing ZERO ****ing urgency at a crucial juncture in the game

DH slot is literal poison (no offense to you osie literally has nothing to do you with)

LG's cases just never seem to take off and it's weird to me, makes me feel like he's trying to get something to stick and his mates are playing wait and see and then not jumping to support the case unless and until townies do first

If its boom he's getting a powerwolf award because the man has been toeing the ****ing line all game and deliberately so. Tbh he's like a polite Ryker in a weird way if any smashboards players get the reference

 

[BoomFrog]

#HBC | FrozeηFlame If you are town, Fonti is town. Kary and Mala are in the core town anyway. If Kary has snowed you, me and Fonti then just congrats gg, at this point, so assume Kary is town. Focus on analyzing the other slots.

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

#HBC | Kary sorry forgot to tag you, #2370 is re: your post asking me to assess that fonti post in a vaccuum

fontisian sorry if that post is confusing af without the above context lol

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

#HBC | FrozeηFlame If you are town, Fonti is town. Kary and Mala are in the core town anyway. If Kary has snowed you, me and Fonti then just congrats gg, at this point, so assume Kary is town. Focus on analyzing the other slots.

ok fair, thinking about it more subbing wam in for kary if I assume I'm just being hella paranoid about kary doesn't make me question the PoE

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

#HBC | FrozeηFlame If you are town, Fonti is town.

also am I to take this to mean that for the first time ever this game someone actually agrees with me that scum!fonti is unlikely to attempt to pocket me in such a grandiose way?

 

[BoomFrog]

Pythag I'd love your opinion on me vs LaserGuy

 

[BoomFrog]

also am I to take this to mean that for the first time ever this game someone actually agrees with me that scum!fonti is unlikely to attempt to pocket me in such a grandiose way?

No, sorry, that logic is still crazy to me (although it may be true idk, can discuss after game). But I can't make a plausible Fonti team that doesn't include you. Also, Fonti has been agonizingly townie toDay (in a way that is going to make her next scum game really awful tbh).

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

If team is fonti/boom/kary this is the most outplayed I've every been outplayed in my entire ****ing life

 

[LaserGuy]

And in a circle we go. Can you argue ingenuously with me please? So this was a flippant brush off but you aren't taking it seriously?

I'm not sure I'm exactly understanding what you're asking. As I said at the outset of my case, I feel that most likely scumteam is you/fonti/Frozen. You/fonti/Osie is possible, but fonti jumping at Osie slot so quickly after your case is giving me second thoughts about that secondary pairing. I am much more confident in my scumread on you than I am on any particular team that does not include fonti.

Can you please give a new and better response to my original point then?

Possibility 1: You are buddies with fonti. Your intention was to manufacture a case on fonti to create distance between you and to also help relieve pressure on her slot. This second step would be accomplished by you walking back your read over the course of the day and giving the appearance of being convinced by her that she's not mafia. This serves several goals: First, you don't need to carry around your lingering scumread of her from D2. Second, you can give mutual townreads to each other for how reasonable you were in the whole exchange even though you were both scumreading each other at day's start. Third, in 'convincing' you that she isn't scum, she also helps convince all of the people who supported your case to begin with that she is not scum and they will be more amenable to being redirected to some third party yeet. Fourth, it gives the appearance that you are actively attempting to solve the game.

Possibility 2: You are scum and fonti is Town. Your intention was to manufacture a case against fonti to prove that you are doing BoomFrog things and solving the game. However, you want to create plausible deniability for actually yeeting her or get some townie points for "calling" her correctly when she flips, so you walk back your case. If the yeet still goes ahead, fine, if not, you end up with fonti trusting you going into the next phase. Presumably in this scenario your buddies are relatively safe slots that aren't likely to be accidentally yeeted if fonti is successful at defending herself. So probably not wam or Osie.

Possibility 3: You are Town and fonti is scum. You have correctly caught scum but are giving too much credit to fonti's tone and AtE and are going to end up being misdirected onto some townie yeet because you were afraid to pull the trigger.

Possibility 4: You are both Town and my reads on this game have been completely wrong at every possible instance. Wouldn't be the first time, but scumteam in this scenario is so outlandish and playing so townie that I don't think I would ever get there.

LaserGuy, you said "so much this". I showed you my fiery judgement, where's yours? Because this did not feel like fiery judgement to start the day:

You backed off of Fonti as soon as I did, then you hopped back on when I laid out my case, then you backed off once I backed off again and push me instead. If you were convinced at day start that Fonti is scum, why have my shenanigans convinced you that Fonti is only scum with me?

My "so much this" did not refer to the fiery judgment part, but rather to how disarming the AtE stuff that was in immediate response to my question to her was. fonti said she wanted time to process, so I gave it to her.

I have had you as likely scum since fairly early in the day and expressed my reservations about fonti in the same post. I was actually thinking about voting for you right around the time you dropped your case. After you presented your case and seemed to suggest that you had some additional analysis forthcoming, I held off in committing to anything until you could show all of your work.

 

[fontisian]

LaserGuy , in the post you just linked you said you were convinced Frozen is town. What changed since then?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Also, like, I did refute him? It's literally the first thing I did? Is there something I'm not refuting?

I admire your chutzpah in expecting me to do the legwork, and to just claim you answered everything.

I think you underestimate my ability to do legwork, though.

hahaha
hahahahahahahahahaha

 

[fontisian]

I admire your chutzpah in expecting me to do the legwork, and to just claim you answered everything.

I think you underestimate my ability to do legwork, though.

hahaha
hahahahahahahahahaha

Bruh.

Just tell me what you me to answer, holy ****.

 

[fontisian]

If team is fonti/boom/kary this is the most outplayed I've every been outplayed in my entire ****ing life

Why did Pythag like this?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

okay, here's all the times you tried to persuade me sync was a bad elimination:

I wouldn't be shocked if Syn was a hit, and could see myself conceding to my townreads here. I would, however, like all of #HBC | Kary #HBC | FrozeηFlame and @Chaco to really consider this and what scum!Syn is trying to do here first.


That's what I've got.

 

[fontisian]

okay, here's all the times you tried to persuade me sync was a bad elimination:

Ok, the "this" is that post refers to the two previous posts where I talked about Syn a lot:

Fontisian (Replacement for Gorf)

Kary
Chaco
Frozen Flame

HeuryAlone

Wam
Synchronicity (Xivii and Bessie Hydra)

Malakandra
Pythag

LaserGuy
BoomFrog

Words.

Kary, Chaco, Frozen is the core. Kary always town for her fights with Syn, her conviction against Chaco, her push on Boom, and her paranoia of me. Her reads feel like they suck, but ** it, town are allowed to have ** reads. Chaco bounces between reads fluidly, his read on Frozen is solid, he believes his Syn catch, but he was willing to swap onto Laser regardless. Frozen is falling off activity wise, but the way he went back to Sabrar's read to reinforce his read on me feels like someone who /wants/ to be right more anything, and that fits into the picture of his personality I got in Midnight. His relying on me could be throwing me off. I don't think it is. He's significantly more abrasive and loose compared to both Midnight and Vanilla.

Dark Horse was probably tilted by Gorf early, and that's why his vote was on me for such a long time. He swapped between pushing me and Frozen at eod, and again, while that sucks, it was also probably real. He seemed to focus more on whichever one of us was antagonizing him at the time, which indicates a reactive mindset rather than a manipulative one. He's probably just town.

Wam is probably a designated misyeet. His reaction to pressure feels town. He feels like he's trying to do his own thing. His approach to me Day 1 was weird, and seemed to depend on whether I was going to keep my vote on him or not. He said he gets stronger through the game, and that's something that has been somewhat borne out, with him feeling better Today compared to Yesterday. He can be held to that standard of continued improvement.

Mala feels town, on an emotional level. I see Chaco's argument for him simply being stuck in a loop. I feel like he's smarter than that, and like he has to be being deliberately obtuse here, but then he posts something like " Your not Xivii, stay away from me. You've twisted and corrupted him. You've even stolen Bessie's cute puppy dog!" and I'm like, this dude has to be town.

Pythag feels disconnected. I think he may have been disconnected in Sumting too. He feels chill whenever he's around. The clearing both Gorf and Dark Horse when they were fighting at the of the game felt kind of tmiy. I think I like this:

The expecting consistency from people is just a really weird thought process to have as scum? There's potential scum motivation, in wanting the people who were going after town!Gorf to also go after town!Chaco, but like, that's a thought you write in scum chat or wait to call people out on later, not like this. The fake that it ended up in thread is a sign that Pythag didn't have a scum chat to write it in.

Laser, Syn, Boomfrog are the mess. No more than two of them can be scum. Most of my positive feelings for Syn come down to feeling like we were on the same page with Somi (when we probably weren't) and Chaco, and the feeling that Laser and Boom are being manipulative around /them/. But if Laser's town, then Boom/Syn with Boom just trying to cause chaos and allow wagons to flourish elsewhere is possible. I can think of reasons to clear all of them (Laser believes in his pushes enough to sacrifice himself. Syn refuses to back down in the fight with Kary now because they feel they're right, and they asked about me/Frozen being mason because they're paranoid ****s.) Actually, that's a solid point for Syn, Bessie and Xivii were overly worried about town prs in Sumting, but they never would have discussed their suspicion in the thread like that. Like, either it was a ploy to get me specifically to townread them, or they're just town. Yeah, I'm moving Syn up.

Uh, reasons to clear Boomfrog. Boomfrog just feels kind of genuine sometimes? Like, when he said he was going to give me space to figure him out. And I think the sliminess I perceive behind his posts is what I always feel from him. He just kind of ended up at the bottom /again/ because I have no reason to townread him, and because he keeps doing things to make himself look aligned with Syn. I don't know, this just feels ****ty.

#HBC | FrozeηFlame

I think this full exchange with Frozen looks pretty good for Syn. It feels very, humm, fair? in how they approached him, and Frozen seemed to agree with that at the time since this is what broke him out of his Chaco tunnel. It doesn't feel like a gotcha thing, but it does shed some light on the origins of Syn's Frozen tunnel. I threw in the question to Pythag as well, because it's close chronologically and has the same feel of this head of hydra trying to dig deeper into a mindset. I strongly recommend going back and reading the whole thing for yourselves.

This and the previous post are the extend of the defense I'm going to give Syn. I think they've been very strange for most of the game. The people they've chosen to go after and the reasons for it have been weird. The fight with Kary now is weird. The way they defend themselves by just getting deeper and deeper in semantics is really weird and kind of indefensible. Them saying to leave Boom for another Day is weird. Them using Sabrar's death to push Boom for not bringing up that Bessie wouldn't like doing that but then not saying that's a reason to townread them is weird, but maybe in a town way, because they really need all the help and wifom they can get now.

 

[fontisian]

okay, here's all the times you tried to persuade me sync was a bad elimination:

And be real with me, was there any point where you were actually willing to listen to me anyway?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

And be real with me, was there any point where you were actually willing to listen to me anyway?

did you think I was REPEATEDLY chasing you for an answer on whether you would vote for sync.... as a past-time?

 

[fontisian]

did you think I was REPEATEDLY chasing you for an answer on whether you would vote for sync.... as a past-time?

I thought you were trying to figure out my alignment? Like, you thought Syn was scum and you thought I be a partner who was reluctant to vote.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

you thought I was trying to figure out your alignment.... that explains why you didnt want to answer LMAO

 

[fontisian]

you thought I was trying to figure out your alignment.... that explains why you didnt want to answer LMAO

Could you maybe just let get of your conviction that I'm scum for a few minutes and actually talk to me like a person?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

1. she can't go against them in LYLO so she needed to NE them to get them out of the way. That's why Chaco was NEed. Fonti has been hard town reading Chaco, but Laser and I are much more potentially yeetable.
2. She can't actually find scum, so she has to go into this "frusterated" I don't know where to go attitude and "end up" on yeets that she "didn't want".
3. Fonti repeatedly trying to sow doubt when one player gets a hard town read on another player.
4. The worst offence is the D1 pillars of town post with Sync on it, but then she backs off defending Sync D2 for little reason. Either her D1 read wasn't as strong as she claims or she should have been defending Sync a lot harder throughout D2.
5. Instead of defending Sync she uses it only to attack me. And then when LaserGuy makes a case on her the same thing is repeated,
6. she spends two huge posts defending against the case and not defending Sync.
7. And all my town reads want this yeet so what can little ol' me do?"
8. However, when I ask why she never defended Sync she says, "I did". A blatant lie,
9. on D1 Fonti made several posts as if she expected to die N1. And later confirmed, she thought she would be NEed.
10. Fonti was "lost and frustrated" near the end of D2. And yet, when Kary posts her reads Fonti says she didn't scrutinize them because she was confident that Kary was town. These two thoughts don't coexist at the same time in a townie:
11. "This is a lie. I'm going to hammer you."

so... which of these points did you actually address?

 

[Pythag]

Why did Pythag like this?

Earlier I said if the scum team is boom and fonti I’m going to lose my mind. Add Kary to the mix and it’s just more so.


#HBC | FrozeηFlame I actually didn't think I was being that chill, I'm actually quite paranoid because everything is so messy

BoomFrog , with regard to you and laser

I don’t get why scum!boom throws a huge spanner in the works with the fonti case, all of your work not just in fonti has always seemed townie to me, the activity was one of the only things that was giving me pings. It's the simpler explanation that you're just town. I'm comfortable with that.

Laserguy? Tunneled chaco, which Sab absolutely demolished, and almost always seems to be off kinda doing his own thing? I haven't seen his impact, I guess. I'm not trying to sling mud, lord no, I'm just giving thoughts here. and My thoughts are that he actually may be on the scummier side.

Why do you ask?


While I'm speaking...

I don't think I've ever seem scum!fonti, so I have no idea how hard fonti will dig in or fight. Someone will have to let me know what's more in line with her playstyle, but her responses to everything are pulling me back a little,

It seems we've all decided that Osie slot is scum, and I'm on board with that. I wasn't for the DH slot dying early, as I didn't find it nearly as scummy as everyone else was, but with the lack of activity, it hasn't aged that slot well, I think frozen is probably right that we should get rid of that slot asap.

If one mafia has not been talking, I think it becomes easier for town to start searching for more scum in a 'smaller pool' as it were.


Kary - it's hard for me to tell if Kary 'putting up the ruse' or being legitimately cantankerous. But I'm leaning on the side of town!Kary

really it almost comes down to : do I believe fonti more, or Kary? I think I believe Kary is more town than Fonti currently



Therefore currently the scumpool for me would be
Osie>Font>Laser

I've got a few hang ups, like currently with fonti, my thought had been that the focus should


vote OsieOrb

 

[fontisian]

Thank you.

1. I think the argument that town!Laser and town!Boom are more yeetable than town!Chaco is kind of crazy? Especially since Chaco was so scumread at the beginning of the game. Also, by that argument, scum!me would just townread the people I knew I couldn't yeet anyway, which I think is pretty clearly not what I'm doing.

2. I'm telling you I think DH is scum. In general, I have a more town finding oriented playstyle while poeing scum out than a scumhunting one, with some exceptions when I get a very strong gut scum vibe. Sometimes I get that vibe multiple times in a game, sometimes I don't get it at all, it's not within my control. Here, I haven't gotten it.

3. I don't think I've been doing that? I'll disagree with a townread if I think it's really bad or if I think scum is making it, and sometimes I get a little too hung up on logical issues, but the goal is towncore unity. I'll own up to be wrong to tell you not to trust Mala, but like, your reason for townreading him was still based in a massive underestimation of his abilities, and I don't think it's wrong for me to share that.

4. My townread of Syn was at it's strongest when I made the pillars post, and they were still at the bottom of the towncore. It was made in a moment where it felt like Syn and I were mindmelding. Then Somi flipped town, Syn came out the next Day with the flip flopping on Wam, and it all went to ****.

5. I made the strongest defense of Syn I was comfortable making. And I was frankly only comfortable doing that much in part because I felt like I was being manipulated by Boom. I was not trying to attack Boom or trying to yeet him, I was trying to sort out feelings about the way he was approaching Syn and me, and I think some of those come down to him thinking my Syn read was a lot stronger than it actually was and expecting more out of me.

6. I talked about this already. I felt like Laser was trying to yeet me and fighting cases revs me up. We're really far out from it now, and I don't remember the exact feelings I experienced, but I know I underestimated my time and thought I would both be able to respond to Laser and get a full iso on Syn done.

7. Talked about this. You weren't listening to me, Chaco was interested in hearing anything good about Syn, Frozen was listening and I communicated with him, and most importantly /I/ wasn't sure Syn was town. A more emotion connected part of me felt it, but it did not match up with the other feelings Syn's refusal to work with me generate and it wasn't something logical I could flesh out. I am not going to bat for someone I'm not 99% sure on when all of my townreads want them super dead. I read through your reads, because of course I did, and didn't find anything in the ones not about me worth talking about, because I already thought you were pretty town and in the areas where we disagreed you weren't going to convince me.

8. I provided some defense for Syn. Not thinking the defense was strong enough doesn't mean it didn't happen.

9. I wasn't seriously expecting to die N1. Like, it wouldn't have surprised me if it happened, since I had a strong game the last time I was here, but the Nk wasn't something I sat down and thought about. Sometimes I do die N1 and it's basic courtesy to get my state of the game out and make my opinions clear before each Night Phase in case I do go down. Frankly, it's how everyone should play.

10. I wasn't "lost." Lost isn't just not knowing where to go, it's also not knowing where you are, and I had a strong towncore I believed in and was trying to work with. You specifically made it clear you were not interested in working with me, and I wasn't getting anything valuable from your reads, so I reached out to Frozen and Chaco instead.

11. Ok, so, from my pov, Syn literally took a longer interaction and reduced it down to make me look bad and launch a wagon against me as I was running out the door before eod. I literally did not have time to read and assess all of the post, because I saw that and felt like the turn was happening and knew I needed to quote the actual context and fight back. Yes, my impression was wrong, but I don't think it's fair to expect me to have done better in those circumstances.

 

[fontisian]

I've got a few hang ups, like currently with fonti, my thought had been that the focus should


vote OsieOrb

Was there supposed to be more to this sentence?

Also, welcome to the wagon, we take those.

Could you talk about /why/ Frozen is right that we should get rid of the Osie!slot asap?

 

[LaserGuy]

I don't think I've ever seem scum!fonti, so I have no idea how hard fonti will dig in or fight. Someone will have to let me know what's more in line with her playstyle, but her responses to everything are pulling me back a little,

Don't really have time to respond to the rest atm, but weren't you in Sumting Sumting?

 

[fontisian]

@Kary, it’s a toss up I think between wam, or DH, but probably wam.I don’t know if I want to yeet boomfrog today.

I don’t like wams claim, I don’t like that he was against the claim, and then the theater of pretending to “fake a claim”

I’ve had a change of heart from the beginning of the dat. I thought that Fonti was gonna keep hitting us with AtE, but that doesn’t seem to be the case.

current thoughts :

Town :
FF
Fonti
LaserGuy
Mala

Wildcard : Kary

scum energy :
Boomfog
BabyHuey
Wam

Earlier I said if the scum team is boom and fonti I’m going to lose my mind. Add Kary to the mix and it’s just more so.


#HBC | FrozeηFlame I actually didn't think I was being that chill, I'm actually quite paranoid because everything is so messy

BoomFrog , with regard to you and laser

I don’t get why scum!boom throws a huge spanner in the works with the fonti case, all of your work not just in fonti has always seemed townie to me, the activity was one of the only things that was giving me pings. It's the simpler explanation that you're just town. I'm comfortable with that.

Laserguy? Tunneled chaco, which Sab absolutely demolished, and almost always seems to be off kinda doing his own thing? I haven't seen his impact, I guess. I'm not trying to sling mud, lord no, I'm just giving thoughts here. and My thoughts are that he actually may be on the scummier side.

Why do you ask?


While I'm speaking...

I don't think I've ever seem scum!fonti, so I have no idea how hard fonti will dig in or fight. Someone will have to let me know what's more in line with her playstyle, but her responses to everything are pulling me back a little,

It seems we've all decided that Osie slot is scum, and I'm on board with that. I wasn't for the DH slot dying early, as I didn't find it nearly as scummy as everyone else was, but with the lack of activity, it hasn't aged that slot well, I think frozen is probably right that we should get rid of that slot asap.

If one mafia has not been talking, I think it becomes easier for town to start searching for more scum in a 'smaller pool' as it were.


Kary - it's hard for me to tell if Kary 'putting up the ruse' or being legitimately cantankerous. But I'm leaning on the side of town!Kary

really it almost comes down to : do I believe fonti more, or Kary? I think I believe Kary is more town than Fonti currently



Therefore currently the scumpool for me would be
Osie>Font>Laser

I've got a few hang ups, like currently with fonti, my thought had been that the focus should


vote OsieOrb

What happened to your Wam read?

 

[Pythag]

Also, welcome to the wagon, we take those.

Could you talk about /why/ Frozen is right that we should get rid of the Osie!slot asap?

I think frozen's correct because it makes me think of almost the placebo effect.
if the only active people are town, the only people who are going to have cases against them are going to be town. Things will be 'scummy' that may have no right being scummy. It might just be that they shine brighter in the void.
I've been assuming three scum, and if so many people are appearing town, what if that's because they actually are town?

The point being that DH had pressure on him early, which I wasn't necessarily buying then, but with the supreme lack of info from that slot, combined with how hard it is to find footing right now, I think chances are better that the slot is scum.

That's the thought process there.

Was there supposed to be more to this sentence?

Ah yes, the more to it was that I was thinking we should be looking more at VT claims rather than role claims.
That's stickier because you're not a VT claim, which kinda throws my gut into a loop.
I think my wam read falls into that as well, but I feel pretty good that it's not wam


side note: How popular is sab tho?
like, how the f did three people target sabrar. If I went to him, wam went to him, and scum went to him as well, I just thought that was kinda incredible.

 

[BoomFrog]

current thoughts :

Town :
FF
Fonti
LaserGuy
Mala

Wildcard : Kary

scum energy :
Boomfog
BabyHuey
Wam

My town read of boom was always stronger than my town read of fonti. Me going with the flow was town reading her, cause it seemed everyone else did, and I was pretty “meh” on it.

all of your [boomfrog's] work not just in fonti has always seemed townie to me, the activity was one of the only things that was giving me pings. It's the simpler explanation that you're just town.

Hey Pythag you skipped answering this before. Why was Fonti so high and me so low on your start of day reads list?

 

[Malakandra]

It seems we've all decided that Osie slot is scum, and I'm on board with that. I wasn't for the DH slot dying early, as I didn't find it nearly as scummy as everyone else was, but with the lack of activity, it hasn't aged that slot well, I think frozen is probably right that we should get rid of that slot asap.

when did we all decide this?