Things I Like - The Mafia Game - Game Over

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

#HBC | Dark Horse theres a big difference between chaco captioning his vote has an "equality" vote and Pythag merely commenting that he disagrees with my perspective that even wagons are a boring gamestate. Pythag is just expressing a difference in opinion about a relatively subjective take on what is stable/boring vs. volatile/exciting gamestate, I felt that Chaco was trying to mask an attempt to set up two equally possible early lynch options by making and argumentum ad temperantium type appeal

But pythag's vote also tied the wagons so I don't think you can claim that he's just stating his opinion. Unless you think that the distinction comes down to chaco stating it while he voted and pythag stating it later but that doesn't seem like a significant difference in my eyes.

I think you're misunderstanding what I mean when I said "if chaco passed." I meant if chaco passed the "test" in terms of giving a genuine explanation for why he mentioned equality. I don't mean "passed" as in ignored the inquiry and just moved on. Had chaco not responded at all to the question my vote would absolutely had continued to stay on him

Ok my bad but this still ties into the point of it being a non-answer. I feel like if you thought there could have been a right answer then you would have at least some idea of what this right answer could be.

 

[Chaco]

#HBC | FrozeηFlame But you know me better than that, if I were to be opportunistic as scum it wouldn’t be in RVS wagoning.l to project forward. That’s why I think you’re just putting to much stock into it. Plus that might work in a less skilled playerlist but there’s no chance in hell that would work in this line up. I see where your head is at there, but it’s just unlikely from any point of view. It’s to much speculation for an obvious answer of there was no purpose. Occam’s Razor.

 

[Chaco]

#HBC | Dark Horse Frozen is basically saying that I was trying to start a vote off between the wagons and ultimately it end in a quick Lynch I’m guessing. That’s the only thing I can gather. Even though it’s way off base to even assume that.

 

[Wam]

Starting catch up.

Well I am gonna question an order that has me as the townest in all the land. What is this even?

That's exactly the ping I got from this and some subsequent posts.

Why not? Why shouldn't people find you town?
As I said I'm having a hard time splitting the town reads.

I thought I answered this earlier but I guess not. The case is kinda over-blown and relies a lot on meta. I agree that Chaco started out fluffy and I said as much in #227 but you don't need to repeat that over and over. Feels pretty genuine from LG though.



So you scumread LG here? He can have a bad case and still be on the right lines.



I think you didn't sweat your RVS waggon, more than once you have said what I've been thinking and while some of your questions seem kind of simple it feels like you're trying to solve the game. And someone has to be at the top.



I liked the way that he answered my questions, his case against you feels genuine to me, it's really overkill from him if he's faking it, he generally seems to be no-nonsense trying to solve the game so I'm pretty comfy on him.


Then I don't follow why you cared about obvious RVS votes on him?



Am I supposed to give you fair warning before I scumread you?

No but I went from null to a strong scum read without a single comment. Just wondering what your logic was.

Meta thing was for the RVs thing. Also I have seen it used as a distancing tactic un thenpat by leaving the vote on a buddy through day 1. By not committing you leave yourself options.

is the complete mirroring of these two slots' bottom 3s weirding anyone else out at all?

Wam fonti has posted a bunch since this, any update on your read there?

I'm working on it! And that's the end of page 9!

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

#HBC | Dark Horse Frozen is basically saying that I was trying to start a vote off between the wagons and ultimately it end in a quick Lynch I’m guessing. That’s the only thing I can gather. Even though it’s way off base to even assume that.

That doesn’t make much sense

 

[Sabrar]

Unvote
Vote FrozenFlame

Don't like #60 and the doubling down in #86 that ignores the context entirely.

 

[Chaco]

That doesn’t make much sense

Yeah j may be wrong in that assumption, but that’s the only thing I can gather. But it didn’t make much sense to me either.

 

[Malakandra]

Unwilling to Yeet:
Dark Horse

Pythag
Boomfrog
Sabrar
Fonti

Maybe willing to Yeet:
Kary

Laserguy
Chaco

Somitomi
Synchronicity

Down to Yeet:
FF
Wam

-----------------------
I've decided to let my FF read simmer for a bit

Shamelessly Jumping on the Wam wagon for now.

Vote: Wam

 

[Malakandra]

Unvote
Vote FrozenFlame

Don't like #60 and the doubling down in #86 that ignores the context entirely.

what made you come to this conclusion now?

 

[Sabrar]

what made you come to this conclusion now?

Reread.

 

[Malakandra]

12. Malakandra
13. Wam

FF
Wam

touché

 

[Sabrar]

BoomFrog : is wam an easy wagon?

 

[Malakandra]

Wam be honest with me, are you sheeping other peoples reads in your reads list and elsewhere?

 

[Pythag]

Wam be honest with me, are you sheeping other peoples reads in your reads list and elsewhere?

actually along with this Wam have you responded to any of the sheeting accusations?

 

[Wam]

You're misrepresenting him though. His reasons for voting Boom wasn't to tie the wagon, it was because he wanted to pressure Boom more than Mala. The equality statement was just acknowledging the fact that it was tying it up. That doesn't mean it was his reason for voting.





So based on this, how is Chaco's reasoning for why he voted Boom any less valid than your reason for why you wanted to vote Mala?

There is some weird sync chaco buddyjng defence in this one?

Wam:




This initially struck me as odd, but due to unfamiliarity with the sites playstyles I was fine with it overall. 0



This post is fine until the last part. It’s almost altruistic when it’s obvious Boom is joking.




I actually thought the top question was a good question and was glad he asked it because it reinforced the read of Mala. Then we go into following the leader, this time it’s FF. -1



I’m going to mark this as null, but I find it extraordinarily odd that he feels the need to clarify that his vote is now serious. 0



Actually a good inquisitive post from Wam. If I look back and see someone else asked it first I will retract the positive point here. +



This is where the parrot starts to really roost. I find it extremely odd that he almost commentates his following of players. That’s why it almost feels innocent to me, nonetheless negative for following again . -1



Curiously enough again we are back to the serious vote question out of the blue. I’m starting to see a trend of where his veteran time frame of play doesn’t equal veteran play. Marking this as null for now. 0



Unsubstantiated claim again. -1



I wouldn’t normally have a problem with someone saying I thought this too, but in my opinion it was fairly clear that I hadn’t produced a read on Boom. Kary misunderstanding is one thing, and anyone else saying that I would be like okay cool, but it’s the trend of following other people’s reads and opinions that is troubling. -1



Besides this post being very hard to understand from formatting, I’m starting to see some parallels here. Subtle misspelled words, wording jumbled, etc. Could be indicative of phone usage or what I think is more likely is that they are struggling to acclimate and understand this game. Therefore the mirroring of reads and following. What is troubling here is the initial following of FF and then saying they don’t have enough to go off of in them. And saying I Like DarkHorses placement does I’m gonna use that one here. Or Kary placed me low and that’s not fair. I see some genuine things trying to shine through here. Nevertheless the negatives outweigh the positives. -1



This really bothers me because I believe they didn’t even check. You’re not gonna go skim some posts quickly and tell me that it doesn’t line up that fast, so I believe this is just another example of follow the leader. -1

Overall Score: -5

Conclusion: Although they mirror and parrot a lot, at this conjecture I want to believe it comes from genuine lack of understanding. That’s the secondary theme I picked up upon right after the content copying. Now if this doesn’t check out from Sabrar LaserGuy BoomFrog somitomi or any other X player, then I would be inclined to vote here from the reasoning above it is not typical of his play and this parroting is something new and my hypothesis is incorrect that there’s a lack of understanding.

I'm always scummy day 1 and yes this is my first game for a year! But I find this read really weird. To me it comes across as scum who wants to mislynch me but is preparing their defence.

At the end of page 10. Going to tiso gorf/font tomorrow to look at the changes. Saw the below at the end.

actually along with this Wam have you responded to any of the sheeting accusations?

No havent yet. Basically if I see I agood case I agree. I agree some original thought is needed but if I agree I say.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

So what I can’t seem to grasp here is how my town flip leads to a Wam lynch next? When you just said yourself he’s likely potato town correct? You’re not making any linear sense. And who are these supposed outliers that you’re suspicious of, because it’s not obvious sans your recent interest in Synchronicity.

Your approach to Wam’s slot is uncharacteristic for anyone with any experience. If you can tell from the get go that I’m asking if he’s just not a good mafia player, and trying to ask people he has played with if that’s the case, you’re trying to turn it into some TMI protection of Wam from my slot (low hanging fruit) and then in the same breath turn around and say you’d lynch him next. You say Wam right now because you’d happily push that lynch, as well as mine and wash your hands from the back up comments of he could be potato town. Seems like that’s making the most sense to me of why you’re heading this direction. One foot in and one foot out.

I did not say that Wam is "likely potato town", incorrect. While I agree that Wam is a potato, I have no idea why you think they are town. You said in your post-by-post that they 'feel genuine' but I don't get that feeling and what I really want to know here is what specific things make you think that.

To me, Wam is slightly scummy, for openly bandwaggon hopping, for asking questions that seem too naive to be real, and for the OMGUS vote. They are not a top priority for me but I also see no reason to keep them around, and I am skeptical of anyone defending them.

If you are town, I think you are assuming that potato = potato town, and defending the slot for no/bad reasons. If you can point me to a good reason, please do. But the fact that you are sticking to your guns and jumping to the conclusion that Wam must be town and I am mafia pushing you here suggests to me that reason has gone out the window somewhere because you have uncanny conviction on a slot that is very much a crapshoot in my view.

The only reason I said that I would look at Wam when you flip town is because you asked me who on your waggon I would look at. Since I consider your waggon to be Laser, Frozen and Wam that is not a very difficult question. The people I am suspicious of are exactly the people I rated low in my reads, and I am a lot more concerned about a slot like Sabrar or Synchro getting a town pass than I am about Wam.

Passive aggressive at Fonti trying to defuse, why the reactivity here?

I don't enjoy it when people interrupt my conversations, or make 'helpful' suggestions like maybe one of my scumreads is a scumread of mine.
As to why I am passive aggressive, that's more of a personal question.

 

[Wam]

Reads list is me, realised I only answered half the question.

 

[Chaco]

#HBC | Kary Ah I thought you meant potato town. But regardless I just don’t see Wam having scumbuddies and allowing him to potate it up in here. Look at his response to my analysis of him and he says I’m setting him up for a mislynch. I just can’t see him as scum with that, but you’re right, I may be giving him way to much benefit of the doubt. But I’m pretty firm in my stance of him being potato town at the moment. I could be grossly wrong, but I just can’t see any mates allowing that. Especially with this playerlist, to much depth to not be coaching along the way.

 

[Wam]

I am also ignoring the potato comments!

 

[Chaco]

Also #HBC | Kary I said I saw some genuine things shining through in one post. Nothing more than his wall post where it seems he tried.

 

[Chaco]

I am also ignoring the potato comments!

Don’t take anything personal, Wam. It’s just lack of better terminology in this case. I’m trying to establish a baseline to figure you out so that we can move forward from there in the best manner to help you and help us as a whole.

 

[Malakandra]

what does "potato" mean in this context

 

[Synchronicity]

This game is moving too fast. Neither head is entirely caught up. Please slow down if possible.

Some impressions up to page 8,

Freshly brewed tea: Sabrar, LaserGuy, Dark Horse, Malakandra, BoomFrog

Scapegoats: Chaco, Pythag

Mosquitoes from the west of the Nile: FrozenFlame, Kary, Fontisian

This sums up the Frozen case well. Fontisian's reads are like irritable bowels. Kary's agenda is an open book. He is fond of scapegoats.

We are still pondering Somi and Wam and will have more in depth posts later, ideally if the game slows down.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Arbitrary doesn't mean fake. I also don't think the rest of Chaco's play can be remotely described as soft. I think if you go over Chaco's points about Somi again, you'll find that the assignment of positive or negative values was what's arbitrary, not the logic itself. His vote came from feels, and that negative feeling about Somi is evident throughout the post.

I believe in fostering unity between town and breaking up unproductive pushes.

And my reads are developing nicely, thanks for asking.

So do you think Chaco had a strong start?

Because I currently have zero reason to trust your good judgement

Kary a couple of questions:

1. Do you think scum!wam would pivot to bussing scum!chaco as hard as he did?

2. What made you start to townread FF?

3. Why did you like synchro's #365 if you later voted them for "bringing up old rvs stuff"?

1. I feel like scum Wam would do whatever his buddies told him to do. In general I think that mafia Wam is unlikely to vote for his partners on D1 but I don't remember a particularly hard bus so maybe I need to review that interaction.

2. After going deep on the things that rubbed me the wrong way about FF, I felt like I had gone too deep, so I just asked myself why he would do them as mafia. At first I was concerned because frozen was posting a lot and seemed to be throwing out a lot of accusations, then when he continued to do it I felt like he was just saying things as they come to mind and there isn't any agenda behind it. Like the somi emoji post is different to most of the things he posted but then I don't recall frozen doing reaction images before, either. I think he is just relaxed and happy and not scum for once.

3. Because I usually 'Like' things that make me laugh. And I had to ****ing laugh when I saw them finally start playing on page 10 but it's about RVS.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

#HBC | Dark Horse who do you want to eliminate toDay?

 

[Sabrar]

FoS Synchronicity

for not analyzing confirm-posts.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

what does "potato" mean in this context

maybe 'useless'. compare 'couch potato'

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

So do you think Chaco had a strong start?

Because I currently have zero reason to trust your good judgement



1. I feel like scum Wam would do whatever his buddies told him to do. In general I think that mafia Wam is unlikely to vote for his partners on D1 but I don't remember a particularly hard bus so maybe I need to review that interaction.

2. After going deep on the things that rubbed me the wrong way about FF, I felt like I had gone too deep, so I just asked myself why he would do them as mafia. At first I was concerned because frozen was posting a lot and seemed to be throwing out a lot of accusations, then when he continued to do it I felt like he was just saying things as they come to mind and there isn't any agenda behind it. Like the somi emoji post is different to most of the things he posted but then I don't recall frozen doing reaction images before, either. I think he is just relaxed and happy and not scum for once.

3. Because I usually 'Like' things that make me laugh. And I had to ****ing laugh when I saw them finally start playing on page 10 but it's about RVS.

1. Maybe “fast bus” would be a better term than hard bus. What struck me is that he seemed to pivot to chaco very quickly after Laser’s case.

2. I guess I disagree with you about FF’s intent, I can definitely see some of his posts having scum intent behind them

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

#HBC | Dark Horse who do you want to eliminate toDay?

Preferably in the pool of fonti (trending up), somi, frozen (trending down)

I can probably give you a more definite answer after hearing more from fonti and frozen.

I also think wam’s been scummy but I’d prefer to yeet those three over him.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Preferably in the pool of fonti (trending up), somi, frozen (trending down)

I can probably give you a more definite answer after hearing more from fonti and frozen.

I also think wam’s been scummy but I’d prefer to yeet those three over him.

what's your opinion on synchro then?

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Slight town lean, I liked his push on gorf and I liked his FF inquiries.

I don’t think it’s fair to dismiss the problems of FF’s Chaco view as just RVS stuff when he used it to jump onto Chaco in a decidedly non-rvs fashion

 

[BoomFrog]

BoomFrog : is wam an easy wagon?

I'm 3 pages behind and don't know the context here, but yes. Almost always in general, and definitely this game. So far he feels like he is struggling to have unique thoughts and it's easy to read/frame that as scummy.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Slight town lean, I liked his push on gorf and I liked his FF inquiries.

I don’t think it’s fair to dismiss the problems of FF’s Chaco view as just RVS stuff when he used it to jump onto Chaco in a decidedly non-rvs fashion

I think it's grody from synchro to bring up something 9 pages later when the points already been discussed and when they neglect to mention it before. I don't know why people let them get away with it, or how many miselims its going to cost us this time. Maybe I shouldn't marry my frozen read but the way Synchro was picking at frozen on page 10 rubs me the wrong way. feels less like they're trying to improve their read, more like they're getting in some offense before they commit to the waggon. doesn't feel honest from them.

I take it none of this bothers you at all?

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

I mean the slot has seemed like it’s in catch up mode. Plus I do think that the points they were picking at were valid. What do you think of sabrar voting frozen off of old posts in his #486 then?

 

[somitomi]

Okay, it's got a bit too late so reads will happen tomorrow morning.

The bottom part of this post is actually good. It leaves a stance on Wam, FF, and myself. But what I notice here again is a small upon the voting, which I’m finding more weird.

I mention the voting thing again, because someone asked about the earlier remark. What exactly is weird about that?

somitomi And my God you’re making me spell it blatantly out, it is not alignment indicative but player indicative. I’m asking if it’s phone typos or if they struggle with spelling and such, which would lend to probably the lack of mafia experience as well. Do you see the overall theme yet of what I’m asking yet regarding Wam?

No, I'm actually more confused now. Why did you point the typos and formatting out if they're not alignment indicative? How does that factor into your reads? What do typos have to do with experience level?

Arbitrary doesn't mean fake. I also don't think the rest of Chaco's play can be remotely described as soft. I think if you go over Chaco's points about Somi again, you'll find that the assignment of positive or negative values was what's arbitrary, not the logic itself. His vote came from feels, and that negative feeling about Somi is evident throughout the post.

Yeah, but if the points are arbitrary and don't seem to really reflect Chaco's actual impression of someone, what's the point? (no pun intended)

Why not? Why shouldn't people find you town?
As I said I'm having a hard time splitting the town reads.

The question is why do you find me town?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I mean the slot has seemed like it’s in catch up mode. Plus I do think that the points they were picking at were valid. What do you think of sabrar voting frozen off of old posts in his #486 then?

Don't like it either. But their admission that they don't really have reads and might end up on Wam seems more open and honest than what Synchro is doing.

 

[LaserGuy]

Actually I may put this back. I'll have some updated reads later.

Vote Chaco

 

[Chaco]

somitomi It just seems disingenuous. Like there’s truthfully no point to really being that forward except to gain some positive points from saying it. Like you didn’t speak out against it really per se but left sidebar commentary about it. Like it could’ve gone without saying at that point but you outline it a few times.

About Wam I’m trying to figure out if he’s shown capability of playing at the level that we generally do here because I’m unfamiliar with him. The alignment is not what I was questioning when I was searching his meta, I was trying to figure out at what level he plays mafia which will ultimately help me discern what he’s doing which will help me figure out his alignment.

And the points I make are an overview and I i next my own opinion. Like I score you on content and then out my own thoughts into it. Like are you going to look at someone’s play and say you’ve been completely anti town because of one post where there could’ve been a scum slip? No you interject your opinion about the things in question. I don’t treat it as a means to only highlight negatives or positives but as a whole.

 

[Chaco]

Actually I may put this back. I'll have some updated reads later.

Vote Chaco

Considering we are less than 24 hours to deadline I would like you to actually substantiate your case, because it’s been pretty blatant that your last case was nothing to go off of. So why am I actually scummy to you Laser? Or am I at all? Is it only cold meta? I’m genuinely curious because you’ve never said anything stuck you as scummy only that it was different.

 

[giraffelasergun]

Bumping for new page