They ruined Samus.

[KINGBOWSERKOOPA]

By new appearance, you mean how they looked like in their most recent games. Mario will always look the same in any game, Zelda and Link were Twilight Princess-ed, Yoshi didn't have any new games and will always look the same, Ice Climbers needed a makeover since their 1980 something game, Ike looks like he did in his GC game, Snake actually looks like his classic Snake appearance from MGS for the PS1, Wario has his recent appearance from the Warioware games etc.

And then there's Samus. You could say Samus looks like she did in Melee, without all her shinyness, but she has been enhanced graphically.

Her bombs are retro bombs because that's how they were in Melee. They couldn't change them so much as to make her a different character. Her missles were the same speed in Melee too. Her screwattack needed to stay the same since the Prime games made it more situational to use. The only non-Prime thing I noticed were her bombs, and that's it. No biggie.

Considering how much they changed characters like Link and Mario, I see no problem with updating Samus in the same fashion.

 

[burrito]

Well, there is obviously a difference between what they will do and they should have done.

Still, I have hope that there will be a second Metroid level from Prime, hopefully. It was weird to wait so long for a Metroid stage only for it to be Norfair.

 

[Falco&Victory]

she's shinier

woooooooo

 

[KINGBOWSERKOOPA]

hahah, this is hilarious

listen, if they were going to rep Prime they would have. They didn't. Failed

prime takes place before super metroid, go figure

and in the words of Mr Wong, "Black people run fast, but problem run faster Norbit"

Those comments were nothing but presumptuous.

 

[capncone]

1. Don't double post.
2. It's never a good idea to just make a topic and then flame everyone who disagrees with you. If you don't like what they're saying, try to explain why and don't just say "Actually, I think the case here is that you're a noob at life" . It's like elementary school all over again.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Actually, I think the case here is that you're a noob at life. You do nothing but take the words you want to hear out to other people's assessments and turn them into arguments unwanted and unneeded.

Good job trying to dose the flames, bud. You ain't gonna do it with gasoline.

At any rate, tho'. I started my Metroid experience with the Prime series. I thought it was an excellent game in its own right. However, I still have to give Super Metroid the respect it deserves. You might as well consider it the grandaddy of the Prime games; they both borrow elements from one another, right? As I recall, there are very few canonical differences (nearly all of the classic weapons from Metroid are present, Ridley is still Samus's archrival and so forth, etc.). The only difference that I honestly see is presentation. Of course Prime is going to feel different from its two-dimensional predecessor; it is more of an FPS after all (with scruples).

It's safe to say that, because Prime borrows from previous Metroid games, it isn't a matter of "under-repping." Unless you guys are calling for stuff from Prime 2 (like the Light and Dark Armor) and Prime 3 that totally deviates from the formula. My honest opinion on that is that there isn't really that much of a place for it.

That's just my two cents, tho'.

 

[BigRick]

I hate the Brawl boards...

 

[KINGBOWSERKOOPA]

Nevermind. I thought I might have been able to find an alternative after the Nintendo forums closed. But I guess was wrong, the people on this forum's are nothing more than pricks, willing and wanting to bash anything and anyone different from their own preferences. Even when it comes to going off topic or hurting the other person's feelings. And no matter what they may have been like in the past on these forums, that is inappropriate, annoying, and detestable. No intelligence to be found. Plus, the system for this forum is to slow. Goodbye and good luck.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Nevermind. I thought I might have been able to find an alternative after the Nintendo forums closed. But I guess was wrong, the people on this forum's are nothing more than by pricks, willing and wanting to bash anything and anyone different from their own preferences. Even when it comments to going off topic or hurting the other person's feelings. And no matter what they may have been like in the past in these forums, that is inappropriate, annoying, and detestable. No intelligence to be found. Plus, the system for this forum is to slow. Goodbye and good luck.

Yeah, but you have to realize...

YOUR NO BETTER

 

[Xenesis]

There's a reason I've been registered since 2002, and I've only got a handful of posts, you know.

It's an interesting place to lurk, however.

Back on topic seeing Prime elements would be really good. Fission Metroid Assist trophy = :D

 

[burrito]

I have to agree that you guys didn't take this very well. You didn't even try to understand his argument and just went on some random tangent. *sigh*

 

[.Yoshi]

Nevermind. I thought I might have been able to find an alternative after the Nintendo forums closed. But I guess was wrong, the people on this forum's are nothing more than pricks, willing and wanting to bash anything and anyone different from their own preferences. Even when it comes to going off topic or hurting the other person's feelings. And no matter what they may have been like in the past on these forums, that is inappropriate, annoying, and detestable. No intelligence to be found. Plus, the system for this forum is to slow. Goodbye and good luck.

Your posts were grammatically correct and more compound-complex than most sentences here in these forums (minus one mistake), so I appreciate you sharing your intelligence with us

Farewell and goodnight, Aurora Unit!

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

There's a reason I've been registered since 2002, and I've only got a handful of posts, you know.

It's an interesting place to lurk, however.

Back on topic seeing Prime elements would be really good. Fission Metroid Assist trophy = :D

If it was made by America, we might see that...But Japan doesn't like Prime...


The Link was more natural since the new Link is just a better looking version of the old...wearing chain mail and pante instead of tights...

Samus however is a different story since Super Metroid and such is very different from the Prime series

Your posts were grammatically correct and more compound-complex than most sentences here in these forums (minus one mistake), so I appreciate you sharing your intelligence with us

Farewell and goodnight, Aurora Unit!

He flames and never gave any points why he was right though

 

[blayde_axel]

He had a point. But, we don't know everything about the game yet. He shouldn't have assumed that they just forgot about Prime. They obviously know about Prime, so they are going to implement it somehow.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

I hate the Brawl boards...

I do too. Sometimes. But, I don't wanna get an infraction point so...

...back on topic.

I can't really think of anything other than a stage to represent Prime. *scratches his head.*

 

[Xenesis]

I'd have to disagree....the big difference between Super Metroid and Prime is mostly one of perspective. Plus the fact that Prime Samus is one the whole the second weakest Samus in all of the series (I'd place NES Metroid Samus as the weakest), but she seems to pick up some niftier powers in Prime 2, and I assume Prime 3, but it's not out here yet.

ZS Samus is obviously a nod to Zero Mission, which I personally thought was rather unspectacular at best, but it is evidence they are showing off newer stuff in the series.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I'd have to disagree....the big difference between Super Metroid and Prime is mostly one of perspective. Plus the fact that Prime Samus is one the whole the second weakest Samus in all of the series (I'd place NES Metroid Samus as the weakest), but she seems to pick up some niftier powers in Prime 2, and I assume Prime 3, but it's not out here yet.

ZS Samus is obviously a nod to Zero Mission, which I personally thought was rather unspectacular at best, but it is evidence they are showing off newer stuff in the series.

YOu realize Zero Mission was just a remake of the first game, right?

 

[BigRick]

I do too. Sometimes. But, I don't wanna get an infraction point so...

...back on topic.

I can't really think of anything other than a stage to represent Prime. *scratches his head.*

But seriously the Brawl boards really suck

I'm glad you agree with me but I don't think that there's enough ppl who understand this.

 

[Xenesis]

YOu realize Zero Mission was just a remake of the first game, right?

I wouldn't use the word remake.

More like remix and re-adaptation. It's a newer GAME (and has new stuff in it), but in the timeline, yes it is the start of the series.

*waves fist at the retconning*

 

[burrito]

He flames and never gave any points why he was right though

Ugh, you should go back and reread this thread.

He had a point. But, we don't know everything about the game yet. He shouldn't have assumed that they just forgot about Prime. They obviously know about Prime, so they are going to implement it somehow

Yeah, but the other series such as Mario and Zelda got updates to represent their newest series. The way that they just seem to shun Prime in this respect is a bit bothersome. Samus should have gotten a Prime level as her "primary" level because it represents her newest incarnation, but she got Norfair instead.

 

[M@v]

Ugh, you should go back and reread this thread.


Yeah, but the other series such as Mario and Zelda got updates to represent their newest series. The way that they just seem to shun Prime in this respect is a bit bothersome. Samus should have gotten a Prime level as her "primary" level because it represents her newest incarnation, but she got Norfair instead.

I like how They kept samus's moves similar; Im used to them. Dont forget she gets a whole new form in zero suit Samus. But, I think to add on the modern look, it be cool if samus donned the PED suit for brawl. But then again, they may have to make adjustments to fit the PED suits purpose.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Ugh, you should go back and reread this thread.


Yeah, but the other series such as Mario and Zelda got updates to represent their newest series. The way that they just seem to shun Prime in this respect is a bit bothersome. Samus should have gotten a Prime level as her "primary" level because it represents her newest incarnation, but she got Norfair instead.

His post specifically stated that by adding more from the older series, but in this case it's actually Zero Mission, it ruined Samus...which is completely untrue...

Whether Prime deserves representation in Smash is up to it's creator...who, along with everyone else, has his own bias

and insulting someone who insulted you is no better than the person who insulted in the first place

 

[Shuma]

His point "They ruined samus" . They did not.

What he tried to say: "Prime needs Rep". No it doesn't, Japan hates the Prime games, and guess what? this is a japanese game, besides the only rep from prime you could ever see is Dark Samus.

 

[Xenesis]

His point "They ruined samus" . They did not.

What he tried to say: "Prime needs Rep". No it doesn't, Japan hates the Prime games, and guess what? this is a japanese game, besides the only rep from prime you could ever see is Dark Samus.

They didn't say that the Prime games needed a character. They just said they needed representation in Brawl. Items, a stage, assist trophies, etc.

Also, Japan not liking Prime isn't a valid reason - Sakurai knows that Brawl is an international game and that referencing things that are popular in other regions is important too.

 

[burrito]

His post specifically stated that by adding more from the older series, but in this case it's actually Zero Mission, it ruined Samus...which is completely untrue...

No, he wasn't asserting that it was the inclusion of things from older series ruined Samus, he was saying that the lack of things from the newer(prime) series ruined Samus.

Whether Prime deserves representation in Smash is up to it's creator...who, along with everyone else, has his own bias

What's your point?

and insulting someone who insulted you is no better than the person who insulted in the first place

True, but at least it's understandable. It must have been frustrating for him to be ganged up against for something he didn't say.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

They didn't say that the Prime games needed a character. They just said they needed representation in Brawl. Items, a stage, assist trophies, etc.

Also, Japan not liking Prime isn't a valid reason - Sakurai knows that Brawl is an international game and that referencing things that are popular in other regions is important too.

Why is it not a valid reason? Designers have bias in their own work...If he doesn't like something that's enough reason not to include it or modify it

 

[Xanderous]

Yeah... you can't ruin Samus by keeping her the same. That doesn't make sense.

 

[burrito]

What he tried to say: "Prime needs Rep". No it doesn't, Japan hates the Prime games, and guess what? this is a japanese game, besides the only rep from prime you could ever see is Dark Samus.

I cans see how this point can be used for why Prime didn't/wont get representation, but it doesn't make any sense to use this as a point for why Prime doesn't need representation. Plus, i wouldn't go so far to say Japan "HATES" the prime games.

 

[Shuma]

They didn't say that the Prime games needed a character. They just said they needed representation in Brawl. Items, a stage, assist trophies, etc.

Item: Most of the items in Prime where also on Super Metroid, no point in adding them with Prime decorations.

Stage: Well, why not.

Assit trophies, unless they add the hunters as assissts i don't think you'll see them either.

So the only Prime rep you would see is DS, since is the only "important" thing from the prime games.

Edit:

Prime needs no representation, why? The rep is for the Metroid franchise, and since 90% of the world agrees that Super MEtroid is better there's no point in Representing Prime. It doesn't "NEED" rep.

 

[Xenesis]

Why is it not a valid reason? Designers have bias in their own work...If he doesn't like something that's enough reason not to include it or modify it

Obviously. But Sakurai is attempting to cater for three regions here. Japan, America and Europe. Hasn't he said that he's been trying to avoid being overly Japan centric in interviews?

One good example is the Advance Wars assist trophy: AW is extremely unpopular in Japan compared to the west, yet it got some representation.

 

[Shuma]

You're not seeing the point, the Rep is for the whole Franchise(metroid) so there's no point in giving Rep for Prime since Super Metroid is loved worldwide.

 

[Johnknight1]

Metroid Prime 3: Corruption > Metroid Prime: Hunters > Metroid Prime 1 and 2: Echoes > Super Metroid > Metroid Zero Mission = Metroid Fusion > Metroid II > Metroid > Metroid Pinball.

I've played and beaten all of them, minus Metroid Pinball.

Seriously, we need MP stuff. While this stage is nice, the next Metroid stage needs to be Prime-based. Super Metroid is long gone. I haven't seen a ALTTP stage in SSB, and that game is far to superior to Super Metroid. And it's only two or three years older. 1 Super Metroid stages is enough. Give the next 1-3 to Prime, seriously. Maybe 1 to Fusion, or Zero Mission! SERIOUSLY! Pretty much all the Super Metroid SSB stages failed (minus Brinstar in SSB64, and that barely was good, while Brinstar Melee amd Brinstar Depths sucked worse then Mewtwo on the tiers). Point is this looks like the first EXTREMELY GOOD Metroid stage, and since all of them have been based on Super Metroid...that needs to chage, seriously. Brinstar Depths should die. DIE! DIE!

And that sucks taht Samus doesn't have the Light Suit, Fusion Suit, Dark Suit, Phazon Suit, SR Phazon suit thingy from Metroid Prime 3: Corruption, or any other suits as alternate outfits. Well, we haven't seen any yet, though I got a good feeling about the Light Suit, and maybe the Dark (not Dark Samus) suit. Simply put, Metroid Prime 3: Corruption is a instant legendary classic game, and deserves to be repped in Brawl. END OF DISCUSSION!

 

[burrito]

Whether or not Prime is popular in Japan, it's still an important part of the series. Without it, the Metroid series would still be stuck in the past. That is why I feel it deserves acknowledgement.

The Metroid series is evolving, sticking with just rep from older Metroid games is a step backwards.

 

[Xenesis]

So why include Earthbound in SSB or SSBM?

Europe never even heard of them ever before those.

 

[kaid]

One side says Japaneese hate FPS, the other says Sakurai is aming for a wider audience than just japan.

What you are overlooking, is that Sakurai is Japaneese too. So's his Dev team. It's quite possible none of them ever played a Prime game, and they felt Zero Mission, Fusion, and good old Super Metroid were good enough, remaining "true to samus's roots"

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

So why include Earthbound in SSB or SSBM?

Europe never even heard of them ever before those.

Because it is a popular series in Japan and a cult Classic in America

 

[Xenesis]

Because it is a popular series in Japan and a cult Classic in America

But it's not loved universally. Why give it rep?

See:

You're not seeing the point, the Rep is for the whole Franchise(metroid) so there's no point in giving Rep for Prime since Super Metroid is loved worldwide.

 

[DraginHikari]

Heh, at first I thought this was going to turn into another 20-page topic on Zero Suit Samus again.

Really they just take different directions with different characters. As most have stated already many of the items seen in Prime are also in the previous games in the series as well. Much like they did with Sonic's sound effects they decided to do a bit of a backtrack and not massive alter Samus' appearance since her Zero Suit status kinda of replaces the need for alot of major improvements to her basic character.

As for the Norfair stage, I kinda of assumed that one, in an earlier update, the music for the battle with ridley remixed was the music for Samus' stage. So what better place for it then Norfair

However, I have read the entire topic, however the Post title is rather misleading. The exact phrase he used was 'They ruined Samus'. It may not have been a direct attention to start a flame war, but when you phrase something in a manner like that, it's likely to drawn negative attention.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

But it's not loved universally. Why give it rep?

See:

Ness WAS the best representative of Earhbound at the time because he was known more throughout the world than anyone else from his series...

 

[burrito]

It's obvious that Nintendo must think something of the Prime games or they wouldn't be constantly lettign Retro make sequels.

What you are overlooking, is that Sakurai is Japaneese too. So's his Dev team. It's quite possible none of them ever played a Prime game, and they felt Zero Mission, Fusion, and good old Super Metroid were good enough, remaining "true to samus's roots"

I doubt it, Metroid Prime isn't popular in Japan, but it's not that bad. Sakurai probably does a lot of "research" for Brawl, as well.