The true realization about Rainbow Cruise

[EclipseWebJS]

It's due to the fact that you can complete a single lap in two minutes. When the game starts, the ship already makes its way toward the left side of the level and "sinks" 35 seconds leter. From there, you have to jump across a series of platforms back over to the right side, and you'd be back to where you've started off.

But did you know, if anyone's ever played around with camera mode, that the ship is still down there? To prove my point, start a match with at least two CPU's in Camera Mode, and use Rainbow Cruise as the level. Point the C stick to the upper left, and the Control Stick pulled back. You might want to hit Right on the D-Pad to make the ship more visible.

Now, when the ship starts to sink, watch what happens with it. It'll relocate back over to the right side of the level and rise up, just in time to complete a lap.

What the ship is doing in Rainbow Cruise while characters fight overhead

​

Now I understand it's banned in tournaments because...?

 

[leafgreen386]

It isn't banned. Does that answer your question? It's actually on the random select as a neutral stage.

 

[Office_Shredder]

How neutral can a stage be when kirby can suicide kill within a second?

 

[The Burrito of Time]

About as neutral as stage where D.K. can also do the same.

 

[bladeofapollo]

it's not banned because nothing about the stage is random; everything is fixed... the only alterations occur when you or your opponent steps on a falling block... if anything, Pokemon Stadium has a better chance of being banned cuz it's much more random... and Rainbow Cruise isn't as bad as Hyrule Temple cuz you can't run all around the entire map all the time... you're forced to adapt to the movements, ultimately forcing you to fight your opponent SOMETIME

and really, kirby can suicide kill pretty much anyone on pretty much any level... the power of the back throw!!!!

 

[Office_Shredder]

it's not banned because nothing about the stage is random; everything is fixed... the only alterations occur when you or your opponent steps on a falling block... if anything, Pokemon Stadium has a better chance of being banned cuz it's much more random... and Rainbow Cruise isn't as bad as Hyrule Temple cuz you can't run all around the entire map all the time... you're forced to adapt to the movements, ultimately forcing you to fight your opponent SOMETIME

and really, kirby can suicide kill pretty much anyone on pretty much any level... the power of the back throw!!!!

Right, but on rainbow cruise kirby can up throw at the beginning, and you both land on the platform above the ship.

It's fricking annoying.

 

[TheRedMarth]

I've played in multiple tournaments. Not just house-party types. Institutionally-funded, and I have never seen Rainbow Cruise allowed.

It isn't that there are unexpected quirks to RC, it's that it's distracting. Having a 1v1 on RC at the tournament level is like having a Kung-fu tournament on a conveyor belt. Yes, there is an element of skill to the person who best adapts to fighting on moving ground, but were not here for that. We here to see just the best moves without excessive complication.

 

[Mic_128]

Right, but on rainbow cruise kirby can up throw at the beginning, and you both land on the platform above the ship.

Well if you're that bad that you can't stop Kirby from grabbing you for the first 5 seconds....

 

[Volasko]

the leve is dumb, it should be banned IMO.
heh useless comment for my 500th post!!

 

[Wave⁂]

that place is fun, but it should be banned for being a side-scroller.
another useless post...

 

[Juke]

I actually don't mind the stage. Having to constantly move because of the stage always leads to some interesting kills.

That's interesting about the ship. I never knew it was still down there the entire time.

 

[Ryan-K]

Just because it moves doesn't mean it should be banned.

The stage stays on a fixed course. It's not really a huge adaptation you just have to know how to use the stage to your advantage and not get caught on stupid little things like platforms disappearing behind you.

Also the final stretch is similar to a mini FD so i don't see the problem.

 

[nomis]

The stage sucks. Too much moving around, I want more action involving two opponents trying to beat the crud out of each other, not two opponents trying to beat the crap out of each other and moving along with the stage's course.

 

[park5150]

I love that stage cause of the 'MARIO' theme song. but. i prefer to play at FD.

 

[MookieRah]

I've played in multiple tournaments. Not just house-party types. Institutionally-funded, and I have never seen Rainbow Cruise allowed.

Say what??? I have been attending tournaments all over the place, big and small, and RC was NEVER banned. It is actually now considered neutral by most major tournaments!

You guys are being kinda lame about this. 90% of teh reason for you guys wanting to ban this stage is simply out of not liking it. If a stage isn't inherently bad or broken, it doesn't deserve a ban. RC is a fair stage, and while it's questionable about being neutral, it DEFINITELY doesn't deserve to be banned.

 

[Fenrir]

Most tournaments have that rule where each player can ban a stage for their set, so I don't see much of a problem in the first place. <_<

 

[bladeofapollo]

well if you really think about it, it's a waste of banning stages... like if you're gonna fight a marth, you're gonna be worried about yoshi story and battlefield... not RC...
and if you're fighting a samus, you're gonna want to ban dreamland 64 or final destination... not RC...
so more than anything, it's just a ridiculously annoying stage that you're gonna have to deal w/... that's life, ya kno?

 

[FastFox]

Nobody wants to play here anyways, it's just so.. Stupid..

 

[stewie91]

Rainbow cruise sucks, IMO. It's almost as stupid as Icicle Mountain. I use Marth and Roy and I would rather play in Battlefield or FD, not pointless sidescrollers.

BTW is Icicle Mountain banned from tourneys?

 

[bladeofapollo]

yea, icicle mountain IS banned in tournaments...

i personally loathe rainbow cruise as much as the next guy... but i WILL play on it cuz it's a legit stage... i just pray that i don't get it when i play :-D

 

[Aiser]

Rainbow cruise sucks, IMO. It's almost as stupid as Icicle Mountain. I use Marth and Roy and I would rather play in Battlefield or FD, not pointless sidescrollers.

BTW is Icicle Mountain banned from tourneys?

Maybe because Marth and Roy play pretty well on those stages?

 

[Dragon Jedi0]

I have no idea what it's like at tournements, but a true Melee master would be able to adapt any character to any stage regardless of the stage moving or not. IMO you guys are just blowing hot air out of your collective arses.

 

[FastFox]

I have no idea what it's like at tournements, but a true Melee master would be able to adapt any character to any stage regardless of the stage moving or not. IMO you guys are just blowing hot air out of your collective arses.

I strongly disagree. Moving stages such as poke'floats or rainbow cruise act as handicaps to almost every characters recovery. That is why most players do not like to play on these stages, because of the fact that they can act as a handicap. They can be unfair to both players, whereas stages such as FD, Dreamland, and Yoshi's Island are more stable stages that don't directly effect anyone. It is there where skill is determined.

 

[shockfrost]

I agree with fastfox. It is reduction of additional random influence.


Now random influence is a "Good thing" for a fast paced and fun game. Turn on gobs of items. Who wins? Nobody knows! Is it fair for tournaments? It comes down to 'who can get the hammer' or 'race for the heart container'.

By the same logic, a moving stage introduces an element of randomness which makes the winner of the game less based on skill, and more based on what randomly occurs.

Since Rainbow Cruise follows an EXACT, SET pattern, it technically isn't random. It just requires a layer of skill WITH that specific LEVEL - Skill at fighting in Rainbow Cruise.

Poke Floats is the same way. One can become SKILLED at fighting in Poke Floats.

But do we want tournaments decided like that? A and B are almost equally skilled. But A is a talented Rainbow Cruise fighter, and uses it for an edge when Rainbow Cruise is chosen at random.

A wins because of stage choice, instead of fair contest?
Bad mojo for a tourney.

(just fine for goofing off with friends, bad for tourney)

 

[_the_sandman_]

The platform that sways back and forth in the picture, makes me upset. You can fall through it if you press down. You also CAN'T fall through the long white platform in that picture for some reason. Stupid glitchy platforms.

Anyways its always banned in tournaments I go to. All moving levels are banned actually. Its because some characters would be at a disadvantage if they aren't good at jumping. At least thats the reason given, which sort of makes sense. Not to mention Rainbow Cruise as a couple messed up platforms.

 

[ycz12]

I strongly disagree. Moving stages such as poke'floats or rainbow cruise act as handicaps to almost every characters recovery. That is why most players do not like to play on these stages, because of the fact that they can act as a handicap. They can be unfair to both players, whereas stages such as FD, Dreamland, and Yoshi's Island are more stable stages that don't directly effect anyone. It is there where skill is determined.

I agree with fastfox. It is reduction of additional random influence.


Now random influence is a "Good thing" for a fast paced and fun game. Turn on gobs of items. Who wins? Nobody knows! Is it fair for tournaments? It comes down to 'who can get the hammer' or 'race for the heart container'.

By the same logic, a moving stage introduces an element of randomness which makes the winner of the game less based on skill, and more based on what randomly occurs.

Since Rainbow Cruise follows an EXACT, SET pattern, it technically isn't random. It just requires a layer of skill WITH that specific LEVEL - Skill at fighting in Rainbow Cruise.

Poke Floats is the same way. One can become SKILLED at fighting in Poke Floats.

But do we want tournaments decided like that? A and B are almost equally skilled. But A is a talented Rainbow Cruise fighter, and uses it for an edge when Rainbow Cruise is chosen at random.

A wins because of stage choice, instead of fair contest?
Bad mojo for a tourney.

(just fine for goofing off with friends, bad for tourney)

First of all, you guys aren't agreeing. Fastfox is saying that people don't like playing on moving stages because it makes it harder for them to execute their strategies, while shockfrost is saying that people don't like certain stages because it changes the criteria for winning.

Have you ever heard of anything being banned in any sort of competition whatsoever because every single person competing agreed that they "didn't want" it? Because that's pretty much what this would require, based on your standards.

Did you consider that maybe being able to play on certain stages is a skill? Did you think of the fact that smart stage selection is as much an important ability as smart character selection?

Like you even admitted: Poke Floats and Rainbow Cruise move in a set path. There is no randomness whatsoever involved, so that has nothing to do with this discussion.

You do not want to have stage selection as a factor. You don't like it when the stage disadvantages you. That just means you're going to lose in the majority of tournaments you go to that involve counterpicking stages.

Oh, wait! Ken's too good at chainthrowing Falcos on FD, so let's ban it when his Marth goes up against Bombsoldier's Falco! Hang on! Some people are better at using Fox than others! Ban-hammertime!

If I wanted to play a game competitively without variables such as moving/platformed/"non-real skill" stages, I would not choose SSBM. I would choose something like Street Fighter, which is deeper and essentially the same as the watered-down version of SSBM you choose. (Items are arguable.)

If David Sirlin were dead, he'd roll over in his grave. Some stages make the game harder. Tough luck.

 

[The Burrito of Time]

First of all, you guys aren't agreeing. Fastfox is saying that people don't like playing on moving stages because it makes it harder for them to execute their strategies, while shockfrost is saying that people don't like certain stages because it changes the criteria for winning.

Have you ever heard of anything being banned in any sort of competition whatsoever because every single person competing agreed that they "didn't want" it? Because that's pretty much what this would require, based on your standards.

Did you consider that maybe being able to play on certain stages is a skill? Did you think of the fact that smart stage selection is as much an important ability as smart character selection?

Like you even admitted: Poke Floats and Rainbow Cruise move in a set path. There is no randomness whatsoever involved, so that has nothing to do with this discussion.

You do not want to have stage selection as a factor. You don't like it when the stage disadvantages you. That just means you're going to lose in the majority of tournaments you go to that involve counterpicking stages.

Oh, wait! Ken's too good at chainthrowing Falcos on FD, so let's ban it when his Marth goes up against Bombsoldier's Falco!

Some stages make the game harder. Tough luck.

Oh! Nice burn on Ken!

 

[ycz12]

For more action-packed high intensity arguments about (omg) video games, see http://www.sirlin.net/?p=82. Watch ycz get owned! (In the comments section.)

Oh! Nice burn on Ken!

...either you missed the entire point of my post, or you were just being funny(-ish). Whatever.

 

[bladeofapollo]

i agree w/ ycz12... as much as people dislike this freakin' level... it's as important an aspect to adapt to changes as it is to be skillful... if moving stages bother you... then we'd have to ban pokemon stadium and dreamland 64 (which by the way, are much more random than rainbow cruise)... adaptability is as important a skill as advanced techniques... if RC bothers you, practice on it... memorize it... get OVER it! it's important for you to learn how to adapt... i find it important at least, and obviously the people at MLG do too...

i've said it before, i absolutely abhor this level... but i'll play it if it comes up... that's just the way life goes...

good luck to you guys on getting better at this level! i kno i need it

 

[anti_dan]

This level is SWEET. The movement is slow and really opens up fighting. It is unfair to classify it with poke floats because those are are really odd shaped and you cant jump through any of them, so the 1st person onto the new stage basically has a free kill.

 

[Dragon Jedi0]

i agree w/ ycz12... as much as people dislike this freakin' level... it's as important an aspect to adapt to changes as it is to be skillful... if moving stages bother you... then we'd have to ban pokemon stadium and dreamland 64 (which by the way, are much more random than rainbow cruise)... adaptability is as important a skill as advanced techniques... if RC bothers you, practice on it... memorize it... get OVER it! it's important for you to learn how to adapt... i find it important at least, and obviously the people at MLG do too...

i've said it before, i absolutely abhor this level... but i'll play it if it comes up... that's just the way life goes...

good luck to you guys on getting better at this level! i kno i need it

Hmm... isn't that what I said?

 

[Shazz]

Vote Poké Floats for final rounds of FC6 please!

 

[halu102]

Hmm I think the gripe about stages like this is that at any time, one player may be made more disadvantageous than the other on the account of the stage. As for stages like pokemon stadium or Dreamland 64, the player position doesn't critically change the chance of survival. But as for stages like Pokefloats, someone standing on Chansey may suddenly find themselves losing a stock. I suppose tournies don't find pushing other players into disadvantageous parts of the stage to be fair play.

 

[Yuna]

Only incredibly moronic tournaments ban Rainbow Cruise. Some even have Rainbow Cruise on random.

More than just the ship stay on the stage. The platforms above the ship are also there when you're fighting on the ship for one.

As for Pokéfloats: You obviously know about Chansey. So don't stand on chansey and do a long move like some downsmash. This game is not only about knowing your own character and your opponent's character. It's also about knowing your stages.

 

[Shazz]

Only incredibly moronic tournaments ban Rainbow Cruise. Some even have Rainbow Cruise on random.

More than just the ship stay on the stage. The platforms above the ship are also there when you're fighting on the ship for one.

As for Pokéfloats: You obviously know about Chansey. So don't stand on chansey and do a long move like some downsmash. This game is not only about knowing your own character and your opponent's character. It's also about knowing your stages.

That's true, although I guess some people heavily complain on map alterations taking place, and blame them for losing. I prefer simple maps though, like Final Destination or Fountain of Dreams or whatever.

 

[bladeofapollo]

Hmm... isn't that what I said?

oops, sorry x) ... just reiterating i guess

 

[Firestormzero0]

Rainbow Cruise level...... sucks.... dont like jumping from platform to platform over and over again and again... an annoying level that should be banned...

 

[leafgreen386]

...dont like... an annoying level...

That's not a reason to ban a stage. Just because you dislike it doesn't mean it's broken in some way. Certain stages, like Hyrule Temple, have good reason to be banned. If a level is annoying to you, deal with it. I find Dream Land annoying. The wind often messes me up, and its huge kill zone makes it even more annoying to kill characters like Samus and Jiggs. Do I think it should be banned? No. But I deal with it.

 

[Dragon Jedi0]

oops, sorry x) ... just reiterating i guess

Salright, I just looked at both our posts and yours is clearer. I was being too general.

Anyway, I have some levels I dislike, but I have learned to adapt to them. Although, I do tend to commit unvoulantary suicide >.>

Brinstar Depths and Yoshi's Island. Brinstar Depths because when the stage starts to rotate, sometimes I get caught in a place that has no floor >.< Yoshi's Island 'cause it's WAAAAYY too small. Though, it is a challenging match in Giant mode ^.^

 

[leafgreen386]

Brinstar Depths is banned from most tourneys.