Social The Social Thread 3.2.1

[SnakeFighter64]

I think the main issues are the decision to not have enemies respawn and limiting how many different types of Pikmin you can have on the surface.

I actually brought this up earlier. The latter is inconsistent with every previous game in the series, has a poor in-universe justification, and all in all just makes gameplay less interesting and fun.

Then there's the whole matter of surface enemies not respawning. Not only does this make growing Pikmin more difficult since it takes a while to find and gather Onions, but it also makes the game's huge and absolutely beautiful surface locations seem far more barren and devoid of life. Like, you make these absolutely huge, gorgeous environments the likes of which Pikmin has never seen before, with the best graphics in the series up to this point, and even new mechanics like low tides during the middle of the day and night, and you don't even let enemies (aka natural creatures on the planet) respawn to populate these natural locations?

I wouldn't say the game is outright easy, because a lot of enemies are still dangerous and therefore, the locations themselves very much still are difficult on your first visit. But the decision to not have any of them respawn ever, with the sole exception of caves, makes much of the game both easier than any of the prior games in the series, as well as the levels themselves far less full of life.

Don't get me wrong. still absolutely adore the game. But even as someone who hasn't finished the game yet, 4 has a lot of changes that have outright baffled me, and for all the quality of life and game design improvements that the game has over the past three entries, it felt like several other aspects of the game took a step backwards at the same time.

I really liked Pikmin 3, but every time I hear about the changes they made in 4... it makes me not want to play it.

And considering I'm also really nervous about trying 1 and 2 because they're older and therefor don't have things the later ones do (the other pikmin types, yellow's functionality as a whole, and the rush ability)... man I might only ever play 3 and that sucks.

 

[Shroob]

I really liked Pikmin 3, but every time I hear about the changes they made in 4... it makes me not want to play it.

And considering I'm also really nervous about trying 1 and 2 because they're older and therefor don't have things the later ones do (the other pikmin types, yellow's functionality as a whole, and the rush ability)... man I might only ever play 3 and that sucks.

Play Pikmin 1 if nothing else.


It's easier than 2 by a country mile, and since it only has 4 real areas, the game is really not that long.



Like, Pikmin 1 is a game that really rewards you knowing the layout, which means you can speed run the game pretty easily, I can easily do 13-14 day runs by this point.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

Play Pikmin 1 if nothing else.


It's easier than 2 by a country mile, and since it only has 4 areas, the game is really not that long.



Like, Pikmin 1 is a game that really rewards you knowing the layout, which means you can speed run the game pretty easily, I can easily do 13-14 day runs by this point.

look I know people love those games and I'm sure they're great. I just... yellows are the only ones that can carry bomb rocks and there's no rush to just deposit exactly as many Pikmin as I need on an object (seriously in 3 I only ever threw Pikmin if the thing I wanted them to grab was on a ledge). I feel like I can live without most of the other pikmin types (even if I love Winged Pikmin for both their design and being able to just carry everything away over the maze of obstacles in a straight line) but those two things.. they feel like big issues.

Also treasure and ship parts just doesn't seem like as interesting a thing to collect as fruit. I love fruit.

 

[Shroob]

look I know people love those games and I'm sure they're great. I just... yellows are the only ones that can carry bomb rocks and there's no rush to just deposit exactly as many Pikmin as I need on an object (seriously in 3 I only ever threw Pikmin if the thing I wanted them to grab was on a ledge). I feel like I can live without most of the other pikmin types (even if I love Winged Pikmin for both their design and being able to just carry everything away over the maze of obstacles in a straight line) but those two things.. they feel like big issues.

Also treasure and ship parts just doesn't seem like as interesting a thing to collect as fruit. I love fruit.

You really don't need Bomb Rocks aside from a couple walls and the final boss. Bomb Rocks are kinda just a puzzle element that doesn't really come up as often as you think.

As for the other thing, I mean you can still swarm objects with the C stick, you don't 'have' to toss as the only carry method.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

You really don't need Bomb Rocks aside from a couple walls and the final boss. Bomb Rocks are kinda just a puzzle element that doesn't really come up as often as you think.

As for the other thing, I mean you can still swarm objects with the C stick, you don't 'have' to toss as the only carry method.

does the switch port have swarming?

 

[Shroob]

does the switch port have swarming?

Not like Pikmin 3, but you've always been able to use the C stick to guide your Pikmin army.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

Not like Pikmin 3, but you've always been able to use the C stick to guide your Pikmin army.

then how do you control the camera in the switch versions of 1 and 2?

 

[Shroob]

then how do you control the camera in the switch versions of 1 and 2?

Controls

The Pikmin games have a variety of controls used to control the game's menus, leaders, camera and gameplay mechanics. These controls come in the form of button presses and releases, analog stick tilts, Wii Remote pointer movements and touchscreen...

www.pikminwiki.com

Here ya go.

 

[Noipoi]

then how do you control the camera in the switch versions of 1 and 2?

Prayer

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Auto lockon is a big one for me like.

Aim was part of the challenge(and fun) of old Pikmin games.


If you're going to just have the cursor snap onto whatever you want then it removes a bit of skill.

Personally, I don't mind it so much given things like Dandori Challenges where there's a lot going on with a time limit and it can be difficult to keep track of.

That said, yeah, it does limit how much skill you need, or even can use if you use it too much. At least it can technically be ignored for the most part if one tries. That's good for self-imposed challenges.

I really liked Pikmin 3, but every time I hear about the changes they made in 4... it makes me not want to play it.

And considering I'm also really nervous about trying 1 and 2 because they're older and therefor don't have things the later ones do (the other pikmin types, yellow's functionality as a whole, and the rush ability)... man I might only ever play 3 and that sucks.

Trust me, Pikmin 1 is worth it for the challenge, history of the series and the game's story. Gathering ship parts goes a bit differently from gathering treasures and fruits later in the series, and Olimar's story is one of the most compelling that Nintendo has ever told, more so if you take the time to read his Captain's Log entries.

2 is worth it for all the new content and the fact that, with few exceptions, the caves are semi-randomly generated and rarely ever have the exact same layout even twice, giving the game extremely high replayability value. Also...Purple and White Pikmin both got hard nerfed in 3, don't appear in the main storyline or it's gameplay at all, and barely serve a purpose beyond carrying or finding items. They're still brand new in 2, are grown differently from other Pikmin, have many more abilities that make them extremely effective in battles and puzzle-solving in both 2 and 4, and there's also a 3rd new type of Pikmin that can be used exclusively in caves and is entirely unique to 2, so you'll still get an experience and gameplay with your troops in 2 that you won't get in any of the other titles.

4 is still really good. I've just got some constructive criticism for some of the changes it has. It's still a lot of fun and has tons of content. Just don't expect surface locations to be quite as challenging as with the other games, outside of your first few visits to them.

 

[Shroob]

Personally, I don't mind it so much given things like Dandori Challenges where there's a lot going on with a time limit and it can be difficult to keep track of.

That said, yeah, it does limit how much skill you need, or even can use if you use it too much. At least it can technically be ignored for the most part if one tries. That's good for self-imposed challenges.



Trust me, Pikmin 1 is worth it for the challenge, history of the series and the game's story. Gathering ship parts goes a bit differently from gathering treasures and fruits later in the series, and Olimar's story is one of the most compelling that Nintendo has ever told, more so if you take the time to read his Captain's Log entries.

2 is worth it for all the new content and the fact that, with few exceptions, the caves are semi-randomly generated and rarely ever have the exact same layout even twice, giving the game extremely high replayability value. Also...Purple and White Pikmin both got hard nerfed in 3, don't appear in the main storyline or it's gameplay at all, and barely serve a purpose beyond carrying or finding items. They're still brand new in 2, are grown differently from other Pikmin, have many more abilities that make them extremely effective in battles and puzzle-solving in both 2 and 4, and there's also a 3rd new type of Pikmin that can be used exclusively in caves and is entirely unique to 2, so you'll still get an experience and gameplay with your troops in 2 that you won't get in any of the other titles.

4 is still really good. I've just got some constructive criticism for some of the changes it has. It's still a lot of fun and has tons of content. Just don't expect surface locations to be quite as challenging as with the other games, outside of your first few visits to them.

Will warn that 2 is NOTICEABLY more difficult than 1 though, even with Purples being as overpowered as they are.

The amount of bull**** enemies like Volatile Dweevils, Gatling Groinks, Spotty Bulbears and Electricity as a whole make Pikmin 1's enemy roster look like chumps.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Geez what's next? A strike involving comics, mangas and novels?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

WHAT DO YOU MEAN SPIDER-MAN AND ULTRAMAN CROSSOVER???

I know this is a manga but it's kinda funny to me you're surprised about this crossover when, you know

These are coming out soon

Honestly, the more I play Pikmin 4, the more I kinda.... don't like it?


Maybe it's just because I'm a boomer who loves Pikmin 1+2, but, this game feels soo painfully easy.



It's not a bad game by any metrics, no it's great, but it feels.... REALLY simple compared to the first 2 installments. Like, Pikmin 2 could be some bull**** at times, but like.... am I too jaded?

I get it, one of the biggest Pikmin fans i know found it really underwhelming and having seen a lets play, I understand why. No time limit which some people don't like as 1 and 3 helped make you feel like every day you spent mattered, Oatchi being able to do everything for you removing a lot of the strategy while also being incredibly powerful on account of him being a Nintendo Gimmick and the ability to just reset days entirely or go back to a specific time means the consequences to your mistakes won't matter

 

[cashregister9]

I know this is a manga but it's kinda funny to me you're surprised about this crossover when, you know

Low key, completely forgot those were already announced. I remembered like a few seconds after I posted lmao.

 

[Shroob]

I know this is a manga but it's kinda funny to me you're surprised about this crossover when, you know
View attachment 392841View attachment 392842View attachment 392843
These are coming out soon
I get it, one of the biggest Pikmin fans i know found it really underwhelming and having seen a lets play, I understand why. No time limit which some people don't like as 1 and 3 helped make you feel like every day you spent mattered, Oatchi being able to do everything for you removing a lot of the strategy while also being incredibly powerful on account of him being a Nintendo Gimmick and the ability to just reset days entirely or go back to a specific time means the consequences to your mistakes won't matter

Right.


Oatchi is.... soo unbelievably overpowered I completely forgot about him somehow lol.


The fact you can just charge into an enemy and have ALL your Pikmin swarm them which is basically a OHKO is silly lol.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

Will warn that 2 is NOTICEABLY more difficult than 1 though, even with Purples being as overpowered as they are.

The amount of bull**** enemies like Volatile Dweevils, Gatling Groinks, Spotty Bulbears and Electricity as a whole make Pikmin 1's enemy roster look like chumps.

Would have been nice if they added easy modes in the switch ports.

 

[Shroob]

Would have been nice if they added easy modes in the switch ports.

Most of the difficulty is just kinda baked into 2's mechanics as a whole, something that an easy mode wouldn't really fix.


2 different kinds of enemies that use Bomb Rocks as a form of attack, electricity being insta death, and just generally strong enemies

 

[SnakeFighter64]

Most of the difficulty is just kinda baked into 2's mechanics as a whole, something that an easy mode wouldn't really fix.


2 different kinds of enemies that use Bomb Rocks as a form of attack, electricity being insta death, and just generally strong enemies

I mean, idk about the bomb rocks but making electricity not insta death and making the strong enemies weaker could probably be done with action replay codes. So Nintendo could probably tweak those values themselves for an easy mode since, you know, they have the master source code and can add or change anything they want.

 

[Shroob]

I mean, idk about the bomb rocks but making electricity not insta death and making the strong enemies weaker could probably be done with action replay codes. So Nintendo could probably tweak those values themselves for an easy mode since, you know, they have the master source code and can add or change anything they want.

I mean, sure, but I feel like if you're going to have hazards, they should actually be a bit... hazardous, you know?

Drowning, Poison and Fire can already be whistled to save your Pikmin to the point that they're really not a big issue(Aside from the Mung Beetle randomly farting on your squad).


Electricity being the only certain death mechanic(Unless you use Yellows) makes Yellows have actual merit.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Will warn that 2 is NOTICEABLY more difficult than 1 though, even with Purples being as overpowered as they are.

The amount of bull**** enemies like Volatile Dweevils, Gatling Groinks, Spotty Bulbears and Electricity as a whole make Pikmin 1's enemy roster look like chumps.

Don't forget Careening Dirigibugs and Decorated Cannon Beetles (which oddly aren't called larva).

The latter at least can be tricked into attacking itself, but that doesn't always work based on the level's layout or how many other enemies are present. And Dirigibugs can be a nightmare if they aren't defeated quickly.

 

[Shroob]

In terms of Pikmin 2, honestly, the fact that the game is soo unbalanced is kinda what gives it its charm. It's hard, but it's not.... toooooo hard.


Poor Reds though. Fire is such a non-issue and Purples eclipse their damage output.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

I mean, sure, but I feel like if you're going to have hazards, they should actually be a bit... hazardous, you know?

Drowning, Poison and Fire can already be whistled to save your Pikmin to the point that they're really not a big issue(Aside from the Mung Beetle randomly farting on your squad).


Electricity being the only certain death mechanic(Unless you use Yellows) makes Yellows have actual merit.

Look I had no trouble with 3 and didn’t find anything other than the final boss hard. I did play in the easiest difficulty but people were already saying it was the easiest game in the series.

Look I just.. like easy games. It makes me feel good like I’m smarter and stronger and just better at life than I actually am. Crash 4 is the only hard game I’ve ever enjoyed. I mean I did also play the 2D Metroid games but I don’t know how hard those are generally considered to be. And I loved the classic mega man games but I never would have beat them without rewind… sorry that was a massive tangent.

Bottom line, I just want to feel good when I play video games and constantly failing doesn’t make me feel good.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Right.


Oatchi is.... soo unbelievably overpowered I completely forgot about him somehow lol.


The fact you can just charge into an enemy and have ALL your Pikmin swarm them which is basically a OHKO is silly lol.

I get the idea Nintendo was going for as the lets play I saw was of someone who very much enjoyed the game, you grow very attached to Oatchi because of how useful he is, how you get him from the start and how much stronger he gets over the course of the game, but it also has the effect of him feeling real intrusive like other Nintendo Gimmicks can be, why bring out a specific colour Pikmin when Oatchi can do their job? Why bother dividing tasks like you could with the 3 captains in the last game when Oatchi can just be sent on his merry way and be completely fine left alone or better yet, kill everything for you? You could decide not to use him or just not upgrade him unless absolutely needed, but you'd be severely handicapped as the game is made with the intention of using him constantly. The game's certainly not bad but I get why it seems divisive

 

[TheMightyP]

I enjoyed Pikmin 2 more than I did with Pikmin 3. I really like the dungeon system and treasure hunting, truly never know what you're gonna get.

But also 2 is a much harder game. 3 was relatively simple but I did make my entire population of Pikmin extinct or outright have Olimar or Louie die a quite a bit 2. Also since I went from 3->2, imagine my shock when electricity just disintegrated Pikmin instantly.

Oh also I had trauma going into this one cave located in a bathtub and well...

the Pikmin died. A lot.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Look I had no trouble with 3 and didn’t find anything other than the final boss hard. I did play in the easiest difficulty but people were already saying it was the easiest game in the series.

Look I just.. like easy games. It makes me feel good like I’m smarter and stronger and just better at life than I actually am. Crash 4 is the only hard game I’ve ever enjoyed. I mean I did also play the 2D Metroid games but I don’t know how hard those are generally considered to be. And I loved the classic mega man games but I never would have beat them without rewind… sorry that was a massive tangent.

Bottom line, I just want to feel good when I play video games and constantly failing doesn’t make me feel good.

The 2D Metroid games are actually generally considered pretty difficult, as far as I'm aware.

As a veteran Pikmin 2 player, I also thought several later locations in 3 and the late game bosses, especially the Scornet Maestro and especially the Quaggled Mireclops, were extremely difficult.

You might not be as averse to difficult games as you think, Snake.

I enjoyed Pikmin 2 more than I did with Pikmin 3. I really like the dungeon system and treasure hunting, truly never know what you're gonna get.

But also 2 is a much harder game. 3 was relatively simple but I did make my entire population of Pikmin extinct or outright have Olimar or Louie die a quite a bit 2. Also since I went from 3->2, imagine my shock when electricity just disintegrated Pikmin instantly.

Oh also I had trauma going into this one cave located in a bathtub and well...

the Pikmin died. A lot.

I think I know which level you're talking about but I'm not 100% positive since there are a few different levels that qualify as a "bathtub".

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

GoTY

 

[TheMightyP]

I think I know which level you're talking about but I'm not 100% positive since there are a few different levels that qualify as a "bathtub".

It's probably that level you're thinking of.

I can still remember it. Just killed all of them instantly.

I didn't even make it past the first floor

 

[KingofPhantoms]

It's probably that level you're thinking of.

I can still remember it. Just killed all of them instantly.

Then it's almost definitely that level I'm thinking of it. That level gave everyone who played it as a kid nightmares, myself included.

One shudders to imagine what inhuman thoughts lie behind that faceless water.

What dreams of chronic and sustained cruelty?

 

[Shroob]

Yeah the Waterwraith's cool



But the Segmented Crawbster when the boulders come in is a whole different kind of evil.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

The 2D Metroid games are actually generally considered pretty difficult, as far as I'm aware.

As a veteran Pikmin 2 player, I also thought several later locations in 3 and the late game bosses, especially the Scornet Maestro and especially the Quaggled Mireclops, were extremely difficult.

You might not be as averse to difficult games as you think, Snake.



I think I know which level you're talking about but I'm not 100% positive since there are a few different levels that qualify as a "bathtub".

I did forget about the Scornet Maestro. That thing took me two days to do. The mireclops was more anxiety inducing than hard though (cause it was just so big).

I guess I’m mostly just scared of failing and wasting my time so if people talk up how hard a game is I’m less likely to play it. Unless it’s a retro game and the emulator has a rewind. I beat lost levels thanks to that NSO rewind feature. Couldn’t beat nes Battletoads though, the weird bike handle chase thing was too hard to figure out.

 

[Shroob]

I did forget about the Scornet Maestro. That thing took me two days to do. The mireclops was more anxiety inducing than hard though (cause it was just so big).

I guess I’m mostly just scared of failing and wasting my time so if people talk up how hard a game is I’m less likely to play it. Unless it’s a retro game and the emulator has a rewind. I beat lost levels thanks to that NSO rewind feature. Couldn’t beat nes Battletoads though, the weird bike handle chase thing was too hard to figure out.

Pikmin 1 and 2 have a "Reset the day" function on the Wii/Switch ports.

 

[TheMightyP]

Tbh Pikmin as a whole isn't really hard at all if you're going for the bare minimum just to beat it. The difficulty spikes happen when you decide to go above and beyond

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I did forget about the Scornet Maestro. That thing took me two days to do. The mireclops was more anxiety inducing than hard though (cause it was just so big).

I guess I’m mostly just scared of failing and wasting my time so if people talk up how hard a game is I’m less likely to play it. Unless it’s a retro game and the emulator has a rewind. I beat lost levels thanks to that NSO rewind feature. Couldn’t beat nes Battletoads though, the weird bike handle chase thing was too hard to figure out.

Pikmin 1 and 2 have a "Reset the day" function on the Wii/Switch ports.

That, and like Shroob also said earlier, 2 is very much a difficult game, but not to an utterly insane degree.

If you're curious about the series, give 2 a shot. You can also reset while exploring caves if something goes wrong and you don't have time to spare to grow a lot more Pikmin or reenter the cave.

2 is challenging, but generally a fun kind of challenging.

Tbh Pikmin as a whole isn't really hard at all if you're going for the bare minimum just to beat it. The difficulty spikes happen when you decide to go above and beyond

I largely agree, but there are definitely some enemies and levels throughout the whole series that are challenging even for veteran players.

Forest Navel, Distant Spring, Wistful Wild, Frontier Cavern, Subterranean Complex, Shower Room, Submerged Castle,, all of Wistful Wild's Caves, Twilight River, and from what I can recall, at least, the second half of the Garden of Hope, to name a few. I haven't gotten far enough into 4 to name any challenging locations it might have yet.

 

[ZephyrZ]

View attachment 392845
GoTY

Chairem text

 

[cashregister9]

Chairem text

You'll never believe who was cast in this game...

x.com

x.com

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Also, speaking of the Scornet Maestro...

Please tell me I'm not the only one who immediately thought of Heffalumps and Woozles when I first saw it:

 

[Cutie Gwen]

The 2D Metroid games are actually generally considered pretty difficult, as far as I'm aware.

Idk, I've been playing these games for over a decade so that clouds my judgement, but Fusion's only particularly hard early on, Super's got a standard difficulty curve, Zero Mission is just easy, only the MercurySteam games are particularly hard

Look I just.. like easy games. It makes me feel good like I’m smarter and stronger and just better at life than I actually am. Crash 4 is the only hard game I’ve ever enjoyed. I mean I did also play the 2D Metroid games but I don’t know how hard those are generally considered to be. And I loved the classic mega man games but I never would have beat them without rewind… sorry that was a massive tangent

Absolutely fine, you choose what games to play and nothing wrong with that

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Another retro FOP character cameo

Spoiler: and welp…

Vicky is ****ing dead I guess

WHAT DO YOU MEAN SPIDER-MAN AND ULTRAMAN CROSSOVER???

it’ll be great simply cause no Paul

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Another retro FOP character cameo

Spoiler: and welp…

View attachment 392850
Vicky is ****ing dead I guess

And thus nothing of value was loss that day.

 

[cashregister9]

I wasn't expecting Hawkeye to be a guest character in City Of The Wolves but it kinda fits