I was in a bit of a rush this morning when I posted, so a few more things now:
1) Thanks guys =)
2) In my big post earlier, I said that I think horizontal momentum degeneration is done according to a square root curve. It would probably be more accurate to model it as an inverse square root curve. Of course this is just from eyeballing it, and there's a strong likelihood that the game does it differently. I think I'll have a way to accurately determine this sometime in the near future.
3) I'm still far from done. I think I've figured out how to crack the game's units from this, which I'll elaborate on after answering a few other posts.
Ph00tbag said:
So they literally came to a stop after hitstun ended? That's not how I understood your first post.
Yeah. Sorry if it wasn't clear. What would you suggest I change to improve the clarity?
scotu said:
you know, i'm no expert on brawl hacking at all, but how do you guys get your codes? is it one of those run checks for changes in memory sort of deals? I'm just curious, cause it seems like it could be very easy to mess something up and edit a wrong value that could look like the right value when testing, but actually turn out to fundamentally affect the physics in an undesirable way for testing. Again, i'm not criticizing the way ppl hack, i'm just questioning to further my understanding of it.
I'm not a hacker, myself, so I'm a little fuzzy on the details, but from my understanding... pretty much, yeah. Experienced hackers probably have other methods, but something simple like the gravity hack I was using could probably be done just by going into heavy and light brawls and comparing what changed from regular brawl.
ph1lny3 said:
So obviously, we know that Brawl gravity is much different from our gravity, seeing how moves will do a host of different things, knockback affects, and there's no natural acceleration (except from fastfall, etc.). Also, if gravity is involved in any horizontal knockback, then there is no way it is like real gravity.
Question: Would this explain some things like snake grenade manipulation? All this time, I thought that was the result of bad programming (giving events to the same variable, like maybe gren_1, as opposed to 2 different ones). But would altered physics affect the sudden change from that? Judging by this, I would say it wouldn't much, but I wouldn't know. Also, Snakes recovery has "inertia" when starting after falling motion. If there is no brawl gravity... I can see what would happen, nevermind.
You didn't have to quote my whole post lol
Anyway, I have no idea what the snake grenade manipulation thing you're talking about is, so I can't really answer that. Your fast fall comment is actually wrong - I'm pretty sure that your character starts to fall at the higher rate immediately, with no actual acceleration involved. Furthermore,
gravity is not involved in horizontal knockback. If I gave this impression, then I'm sorry, but what I'm saying is that horizontal momentum (maybe including knockback and maybe not) does have
some method of degeneration that is
not related to gravity. When horizontal knockback (or any other force, such as you pressing left/right in the air) wears off, the character continues drifting to the side until their momentum eventually tapers off.
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Now that that's out of the way, I have good news. I just saved a bunch of money on my car insurance by switching to geiko.
No, not really, but I think I did figure out how to crack the game's units. I'm gonna need a move that sends characters perfectly vertical (not zelda's usmash since it lifts you before launching you, but snake's utilt might work; edit: lugi's upB vs 0% jiggs works perfectly!), and also a character and percent to use it against that sends that character at a launch speed of exactly 4000.
See, after finding out that knockback disappears the moment hitstun ends, and also that knockback sends you the same number of units vertically each frame in the absence of gravity, I can use the knowledge I collected from finding the hitstun calculation in order to figure out exactly how many units an attack will launch a character vertically. This requires me to make one (somewhat big) assumption, however, that being that the launch speed the game reads is the number of units that the game sends you on the first frame of knockback. I think this is a fairly valid assumption, considering that the launch speed varies appropriately depending on the game speed; on regular brawl snake's utilt sends a 0% pit at 2794 upf (units per frame - which is a whole lot more accurate than saying mph), and at half speed it sends pit at 1397 upf.
So,
if my assumption is correct, then the number of units the game sends you from any attack can be represented by:
u =
l * math.ceiling (
l / 165 )
u is of course the number of units you travel due to knockback
l is the launch speed
math.ceiling, for those not familiar with the notation, is simply saying to round the value in the parenthesis up to the nearest whole number
Now, for why I need the launch speed to be exactly 4000:
u = 4000 * math.ceiling ( 4000 / 165 )
u = 4000 * math.ceiling ( 24.2 )
u = 4000 * 25
u = 100,000
Using the stage builder blocks as a reference, I'll be able to easily see what the game defines as 100,000 units in a zero gravity environment (I'm
really hoping that a stage builder block is 25,000 or 10,000 units, here). After defining what 100 ku (kilounits (and yes this is now metric)) looks like, I'll be able to generate exact values for the effect of gravity on characters when they fall in a regular environment, by seeing how many frames it takes them to travel some 500-1000 ku distance - whatever I need to give me an accurate measure.
After defining the unit and figuring out the fall rate of characters, it will become possible to find the exact effect of gravity on knockback, and even find the force applied to characters when they jump.
Yeah. I wasn't kidding when I said I wanted to crack the game's units.