LumpyCPU...
Smash Hero
so... scared...
will post later...
will post later...
-
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The Novel Writing Support Thread (New Format)
- Thread starter SKnickers03
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SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
Haven't written in a few days, but I have another workshop coming up in a week. Sometimes you just don't want to write, yah know? Gotta get going on this though. How is everyone else doing? Productive I hope.
My career is dead in the water. I could be writing right now, but I'm pissing about all over the Interbuttz. Because I can.
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This. I have the novel completed on my desk. I have started editing the first half (namely because I lost the copy my girlfriend edited of the second half), and yet, I cannot force myself through it. As I read other stuff, I realize how flawed my writing was/is and how badly I wrote this first draft.
I don't know if I will ever finish this revision at this rate.
I have really regretted only a few things so far in my life, but one of them really is dropping out of my 1st NaNoWriMo last year. I started for like two days and then quit.
I've been writing almost nothing lately but I've been writing down character ideas and development thingies for characters and a world, and plot happenings, and mumbo jumbo. I really want to hit NaNoWriMo hard this year so I don't lose so quickly like I did last time.
A month til it starts. :] I officially signed up a few days ago, which was something I didn't do last year.
I've been writing almost nothing lately but I've been writing down character ideas and development thingies for characters and a world, and plot happenings, and mumbo jumbo. I really want to hit NaNoWriMo hard this year so I don't lose so quickly like I did last time.
A month til it starts. :] I officially signed up a few days ago, which was something I didn't do last year.
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
NaNoWriMo is a great program, if you really want to write a novel but are terrified of the effort required to complete one I recommend that you google it and give it a try. Good luck with it, man. Let me know if you'd like to be put on THE LIST for added motivation.
As for everyone else who, like me, are guilty of not doing anything, isn't it the worst feeling in the world? You know what you have to do, but you just can't make yourself do it, so the guilt just keeps building until you feel worthless.
On the other hand, being freed from the guilt is as easy as cranking out a page or two. Why do we do it? All we have to do is write. That's it. Seriously, why in the he** do we torture ourselves?
As for everyone else who, like me, are guilty of not doing anything, isn't it the worst feeling in the world? You know what you have to do, but you just can't make yourself do it, so the guilt just keeps building until you feel worthless.
On the other hand, being freed from the guilt is as easy as cranking out a page or two. Why do we do it? All we have to do is write. That's it. Seriously, why in the he** do we torture ourselves?
LumpyCPU...
Smash Hero
i read your posts, googled NaNoWriMo, and fell in love.
it's an amazing concept.
it's an amazing concept.
MidnightAsaph
Smash Lord
It is a good feeling, but I'm suffering from something different now. I've written just over sixteen thousands words this week in my latest new, fresh draft. But I've hit a point where I'm questioning the pace I'm moving with.
First chapter, I introduce the existence of the main character. Then, I go to a city and introduce the other key characters. I then, through them, ultimately introduce the name of the main character. Amongst the introductions, I reveal the plot, that a portion of the country's people are infected, like RE. There's a small battle to sweeten things.
Second chapter, I formally introduce the thoughts and some of the past of the main character, and I pit him against the characters in a chapter that recalls his "sad past", but I leave it unanswered, for now. The chapter emphasizes that they all have interconnected history.
Third chapter, I reveal that one character has a tie to another, and that he "knows far more than he lets on". But I also reveal a shocking truth in chapter three and an assload of mysteries.
I feel like I'm going too fast. Ideas?
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I may sign up for this one. Are you going for a legit story/focusing on all that, or just writing a story until you hit a block, then adding filler/telling another story?
@Asaph: No way to really know. Depending how long your chapters are, that could be REALLY fast, but if the whole book is only 9 chapters, then you are doing fine. Can you possibly break your chapters down more into further scenes?
I have a legit story that I want to write, and a handful of characters that I like, and some plot. But I know that for a lot of it, I am just going to be writing until Im lost and continuing to write. I'm just going to keep writing until I get back on the track I have in my head. I really don't have a conclusive anything idea right now, so I'm sure I'm going to be writing filler and developing the plot wherever it takes me. xD
NaNoWriMo is right around the corner. Are any of you planning on participating?
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
All I can say is if the "shocking truth" is a major twist in the story that would be better suited as a part of the climax, then yes, you may be going too fast. If you think, and think, and think, only to realize you have nothing left to build up to, then I'm guessing that's the case. However, if there are other key elements to the plot that haven't been revealed, then maybe you're doing okay.
How long of a novel were you aiming for? Were you hoping for a full-blown 300+ or more of a novella?
MidnightAsaph
Smash Lord
Chapters range 15-20 pages, prologue being only two pages, 1.5 spacing 12pt times new roman. Overall, with roughly two chapters and a prologue, I have 14,493 words (around 6500 a chapter). The book is going to be pretty big. I'm thinking it will be around 30-35 chapters.
Break down a single chapter into further scenes? I could. Since I started writing again, I've tried the "write what you need to" bit and finish the chapter.
I feel that I've started the book off and jumped into the big, serious picture too soon. I think it would have made more sense to start off light and casual and move into the actual plot around chapter four-five. Is starting somewhat heavy a bad thing?
For seven years, my fantasy country, Ayen, has had its inhabitants infected by something called soldis. My book starts at the end of the seven years. Third chapter, a character reveals to the other that the infection was actually "planned, and by the person you and I know so well, _______." I think I've created TOO much of a mystery TOO early in the book.
The whole "planned infection" is a truth that engages the reader to find out what exactly it was, and through to the end, they are slowly given bits and pieces. I already have a big twist for the end, so.
EDIT: Thanks guys.
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
Looks like you have an idea of where you'd like to go next, but keep in mind that making it longer for the sake of just prolonging a particular revelation could also be detrimental to your pacing. So add-on with caution.
If the 'other stuff' you're looking at is published works, keep in mind that that stuff was also once a crappy first draft.
And Asaph, start your story where the story starts, don't mess around only introducing characters and setting with minor conflicts for too long. If anything, I'd say put the revelation as early as you can, if that's what gets things going. Think of murder mysteries. Most of them start with the murder having already been committed, or open with it happening. Of course you don't always have to start with some major event and the revelation in your story might already be ion the right place. But you can introduce characters and setting along with the plot, instead of having to do that beforehand.
MidnightAsaph
Smash Lord
Hm...
The first chapter is my introduction to everything. The basic premise of the last seven years. The key characters.
Basically, I'm trying to decide between 1) presenting the big revelation now (where I'm finding difficulty in executing), and 2) moving through the plot slowly, let it gradually get darker and more confusing, until boom, there's this HUGE revelation, all the rules have changed. (it would only be three chapters, so nothing too long)
I did this with my last revision... Would anyone like me to explain how I did this for a better idea?
Thanks, tmw. I think I've got a different perspective.
LumpyCPU...
Smash Hero
i think i have to sign up on nanowrimo...
shadow-gate
Smash Cadet
not to sound like an old man, but some of you hopefuls really should be going to school for lessons or tips.
i dated a girl who wanted to be a writer, and even tho she didn't even major in writing, college helped her figure out the basics as an undergrad. that being said, it takes time to develop a good book. a lot of you have the time and potential to do great stuff
i've started up a few novels myself, but it ain't easy. it takes discipline to finish something big.
i dated a girl who wanted to be a writer, and even tho she didn't even major in writing, college helped her figure out the basics as an undergrad. that being said, it takes time to develop a good book. a lot of you have the time and potential to do great stuff
i've started up a few novels myself, but it ain't easy. it takes discipline to finish something big.
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Signed up for NaNoWriMo.
LumpyCPU...
Smash Hero
i would trust your experience... but it says "smash rookie" above your head.
shadow-gate
Smash Cadet
hahaha, ouuuch. i was a third strike guy for most of my gaming career. i've played melee for a while and just started up brawl. but i'm 24, so i'm a little older than most smashers. i'm also working on my master's degree for journalism 
LumpyCPU...
Smash Hero
post count > master's degree
i'm obviously kidding.
that's cool about going for your master's.
that's cool about going for your master's.
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Nice on Journalism master's. I am hoping to go to graduate school next fall for Creative Writing.
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
24...you are an old guy, just like me--it's okay.
The goal of this thread is to help motivate aspiring novelists muscle through the novel writing process. We've had a lot of discussion regarding the difficulty of the craft, particularly elements such as motivation, fear, and insecurity. Having felt the pressure of these elements myself for nearly 4 years, I started this thread so that people could present their fears and be encouraged by the community before doubt ultimately caused them to quit.
They say novel writing is a lonely craft, and it is for the most part. I had hoped to ease that isolated feeling just a bit by having a place where wavering writers/smashers could come and discover they weren't alone.
I'm sure that most know that this is by no means a legitimate substitute for formal training. But what can one do with excellent training if they psych themselves out of even trying?
I mean, who is more likely to do better in a Smash tourney: a player who shows up alone and knows no one? Or, someone who comes with an entourage to support them? MK or not, going to a tourney alone is more stressful than the actual matches.
Bottomline: we'll try to help each other keep that cursor going any way we can. But where one sentence or paragraph goes from one place opposed to another, I agree, should be decided through formal training and education.
Man, 24, you guys are ancient 
LumpyCPU...
Smash Hero
yup.
they should be in a museum somewhere.
they should be in a museum somewhere.
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
If I ever finish this manuscript, maybe someday I will be.
And hey, I've been writing these last three days. I don't feel like crap that much anymore.
And hey, I've been writing these last three days. I don't feel like crap that much anymore.
shadow-gate
Smash Cadet
sknickers, what do you want your total word count to be? how far are you so far?
also, another suggestion would be to read as much as possible. especially books that are similar in genre
also, another suggestion would be to read as much as possible. especially books that are similar in genre
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
I gave up on trying to predict the total word/page count a long time ago. I'm currently 410 pages (w/ 1-inch margins) in, which is 110 pages longer than the original prediction I made when I started it back in 2007... and I'm only halfway through. The story grew more complex the more I progressed, which changed it from a simple piece of fiction to something much, much bigger.
I'm just going to keep writing--when it's over it's over. After the first year I finally understood what people meant by "organic" when referring to writing.
I also concur with your reading suggestion. However, whether it is wise or not to read while writing your own piece of work is up for debate. Any thoughts?
I'm just going to keep writing--when it's over it's over. After the first year I finally understood what people meant by "organic" when referring to writing.
I also concur with your reading suggestion. However, whether it is wise or not to read while writing your own piece of work is up for debate. Any thoughts?
shadow-gate
Smash Cadet
wow, 410 is quite a bit. that's halfway? is this an entire series?
i think 75,000 words is my personal fav word count. it ends up being almost always 300 "book" pages.
by the way, if anyone is trying to get people to read their work and they're not 100% sure if the person is trustworthy, i recommend saving it as a pdf and put copyright on the beginning and end. when i wrote some short stories in undergrad, i almost always preferred classmates as opposed to family to reading them, but that means you have to be safer.
when it comes to reading, my ex gf used to practice re-writing other books to practice her writing skills. she would simultaneously read and write published works to sharpen her skills. ugh, it's early/late/****. i'm tired/sleeping
i think 75,000 words is my personal fav word count. it ends up being almost always 300 "book" pages.
by the way, if anyone is trying to get people to read their work and they're not 100% sure if the person is trustworthy, i recommend saving it as a pdf and put copyright on the beginning and end. when i wrote some short stories in undergrad, i almost always preferred classmates as opposed to family to reading them, but that means you have to be safer.
when it comes to reading, my ex gf used to practice re-writing other books to practice her writing skills. she would simultaneously read and write published works to sharpen her skills. ugh, it's early/late/****. i'm tired/sleeping
That's good advice, Shadow-gate, but I'd like to point out that as literary works go, putting "copyright" on there only serves as a reminder. It's saying, "hey, you, don't forget, this is mine; don't steal it."
The cool thing about copyright is, once you've written it, you automatically have copyright over it. So long as you can prove that you wrote it (old drafts, witnesses, etc), then that's all you need to make a copyright claim.
The cool thing about copyright is, once you've written it, you automatically have copyright over it. So long as you can prove that you wrote it (old drafts, witnesses, etc), then that's all you need to make a copyright claim.
MidnightAsaph
Smash Lord
Yeah, but there are farther steps to take make a more solid copyright, correct? Like writing to the government for an official thing-o-mah-bobber. I'm not done writing anything of mine yet, so the whole publishing and copyright business, I still don't understand.
You are correct, but those official steps involve registration:
For our purposes as amateur writers, though, it's unnecessary. Putting "By [Your Name]" automatically earns you the same legal rights and provability as "© Your Name".
On a related note, don't put "© Your Name" when submitting to agents. They'll still read your work, but it looks amateurish and insecure.
In a way, it's like having something notarized. When you register copyright, the government is saying "Yes, we hereby declare that this person did indeed write this piece of eloquent prose."Wikipedia said:
For our purposes as amateur writers, though, it's unnecessary. Putting "By [Your Name]" automatically earns you the same legal rights and provability as "© Your Name".
On a related note, don't put "© Your Name" when submitting to agents. They'll still read your work, but it looks amateurish and insecure.
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
LOL, the word "series" has been thrown around when friends have discussed my manuscript, but no, the story itself wouldn't benefit from being split into different parts. It's just going to be long--really, really, long. I'll, of course, make significant cuts when I finish the first set of drafts, but I'm looking at something of pretty substantial size regardless.
This is great advice you guys. All my research and reading on the business of getting an agent and publication speak along these lines. Copyrights for unpublished manuscripts are generally frowned upon by all the people that matter.
Although it really isn't necessary, if this is a matter you are concerned about, upon completion of the manuscript, mail a copy of it to yourself and NEVER OPEN IT. A USPS postage date on sealed content is considered official and won't be questioned.
shadow-gate
Smash Cadet
interesting. long stories are tough. a lot of micromanagement.
on the topic of keeping stuff safe, i would recommend using online storage too. www.box.net is pretty good, up to a gig of free storage.
i also use primoPDF to convert stuff from/to pdf files. such a good program.
i'm new to the boards, but anyone willing to post stuff they write, i'll probably always find time to read it. even tho ppl are hesitant for whatever reason, i'll probably have time to read. keep writing, and i'll keep reading
on the topic of keeping stuff safe, i would recommend using online storage too. www.box.net is pretty good, up to a gig of free storage.
i also use primoPDF to convert stuff from/to pdf files. such a good program.
i'm new to the boards, but anyone willing to post stuff they write, i'll probably always find time to read it. even tho ppl are hesitant for whatever reason, i'll probably have time to read. keep writing, and i'll keep reading
So, Nanowrimo people! If you want to dive into it, share your name here and we'll give eachother support and such.
I'm "Scav" on Nanowrimo.org. Pretty easy to remember.
We should also start an SWF group there, so we can track how many total words we write. Perhaps set a mutual goal? SWFers are horrible slackers, but with me, Tom, CK, and others all together, maybe we can break... uh... all together... 50,000... maybe?
Screw that. Let's make the goal 150,000 total words for our group. So, we need more people to join, so that Tom, CK and I can occasionally sleep :D
I'm "Scav" on Nanowrimo.org. Pretty easy to remember.
We should also start an SWF group there, so we can track how many total words we write. Perhaps set a mutual goal? SWFers are horrible slackers, but with me, Tom, CK, and others all together, maybe we can break... uh... all together... 50,000... maybe?
Screw that. Let's make the goal 150,000 total words for our group. So, we need more people to join, so that Tom, CK and I can occasionally sleep :D
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I'm definitely down for that. My goal is to finish the story, and if I hit 50k, cool.
SKnickers03
Smash Journeyman
I'm in.
If you guys would like, for the month of November I could put the names down of the Nanowrimo participants on the original post along with their goal word count and current word count. Maybe even include the group goal if you wanted. You would all just have to email me your progress on a weekly basis, or as often as you'd prefer.
Just give me the word and we'll get it done. This sounds like a good idea.
Edit: My goal is to hit the 50,000 word count for my current manuscript. But I honestly don't think 50,000 words is enough to actually complete the story in its entirety. So I'm bending the rules a little bit. Just an FYI.
If you guys would like, for the month of November I could put the names down of the Nanowrimo participants on the original post along with their goal word count and current word count. Maybe even include the group goal if you wanted. You would all just have to email me your progress on a weekly basis, or as often as you'd prefer.
Just give me the word and we'll get it done. This sounds like a good idea.
Edit: My goal is to hit the 50,000 word count for my current manuscript. But I honestly don't think 50,000 words is enough to actually complete the story in its entirety. So I'm bending the rules a little bit. Just an FYI.
Hell, I'll join, although I can't promise much in the way of production.
shadow-gate
Smash Cadet
intereessssttttttting