Social The MKGD: The rumors of my demise have been greatly exaggerated

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I lost to Ike and Dedede. The Ike is Ryuga. He's ranked and he's really good. My set was close with him. Then I lost to a Dedede. I have no idea what to do in that MU. In pools I lost to Zinoto. I played really well against him and he complimented my MK so that felt good. I think from now on I'm just gonna go back to using Wario for MUs I don't like.

Also Katakiri got 5th.

And no vids except me losing a MM to Mister Eric. And failing in dubs. *sighs*

I was originally going to the tournament tomorrow but I think I'm gonna pass. Need a mental break.

 

[Superbat]

Don't feel down man, just keep training. Being godlike takes time

 

[Ulevo]

You'll improve with time ZTD. Good job Katakiri.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I'll probably feel better after tonight. Post tournament salt is strong right now. I just hate feeling like I'm not playing to my potential. I have such awesome moments that make me super optimistic/proud to main MK. Then I have bad moments. Ugh. The consistentcy struggle is real.

 

[W.A.C.]

Could be worse. My finger joints are so lousy that I find mid jumps difficult to pull off with Diddy Kong and Meta Knight, which is hurting my neutral game so badly to where I rely too much on special moves. I dunno what to do about it. Did pretty terrible at a tournament today as a result. Didn't win a single games in doubles and only won a few games in singles.

Edit-

Worth mentioning I was doing finger stretches frequently throughout the day.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Sorry to hear that. There has to be some sort of exercise or meds that might be able to facilitate with that.

And yeah my post tournament salt is strongest immediately after a tournament so I had ***** and express my disdain for yesterday so I can move on. I am very likely going to keep the Wario sharp now as well. I originally wanted to just do 100% MK but if I'm gonna getting seeded lower, I gotta do something about it.

 

[warionumbah2]

Not everyone can solo main the bat, he's a wild beast that's hard to tame.

Edit: This avy is too good, the amount of bull**** people write when it comes to MKs kill power,MU,viability and playstyle is insane. This site is a sess pool of rubbish.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

@ warionumbah2

Oh my God.

That avatar.

*dead*

 

[W.A.C.]

Sorry to hear that. There has to be some sort of exercise or meds that might be able to facilitate with that.

Hopefully. I really have no idea what to do at this point. I wrote a more detailed explanation here.

 

[Ulevo]

So, how do the people here feel about the Villager match up. I just fought against a Villager and I feel as though there are a lot of elements to the character that make him rather strong versus Meta Knight. He's very hard to edge guard, his keep away game is consistent at a variety of ranges making it hard for Meta Knight to bait him in to unsafe moves, and he's very hard to juggle. Turnips beat our up air and down air. There are things we can do to alter our style to manage it, but I want to hear other peoples thoughts.

 

[warionumbah2]

He's not a threat that's all that matters.

He really can't keep us away that well, his landing options are predictable and punishable via Utilt. We obliterate him off stage and his bowling ball off the ledge can be avoided.

SH slingshots takes alot of commitment on a grounded MK, his Dtilt and Nair are his main ways of keeping MK out. Both which are punishable at mid range.

Western MKs > Eastern MKs. There's clearly a skill gap between the US MKs and the Japanese.

Edit: this MU is basic as hell, you can literally go auto pilot MK mode and do well, it doesn't require intense focus in mid range tbh. His keep away game isn't that strkng, ftilt isn't safe his jab and utilt won't cut it. MK should never go above the ground unless he fires lyod which you should just jumpon instinct, if MK is grounded he will struggle to snipe us at mid range.

Looking at itos MU list I can agree that its 60:40 in our favor, although MUs these days arent concrete I do believe MK beats villager. Recovery that has no hitbox and travels slow are generally easy to edgeguard, MK should be aiming to gain as much damage as possible at low percents once villager is off stage. 80% is when bair kills and 100% is when nair wrecks him. Ledge trump into bair is also a good option.

 

[Ulevo]

He's not a threat that's all that matters.

I'm not so sure about that.

Grand Finals: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXrZ0f7r-aU

 

[ItoI6]

idk i think villager is pretty easy to edgeguard, he has no hitbox so you can just go low and wait a long time for him. if he tries to go high or you miss him going down, you can just shuttle loop him and at least always get damage as he passes over you. if you wanna beat villager just dash shield a lot, and if he tries to do some setup with side b waste some time with jumps and just fastfall down and away when it passes under you. i think villager is a pretty good character though mk just does well against floaty characters

 

[Ulevo]

We don't really need to try and get around Lloid since it has a start up time before it has an active hitbox. If Villager tries to use it within a certain distance, we can run in and get a dash attack for free. The issue with the recovery though is that Meta Knight's aerial speed is not fast enough to catch Villager easily and he can get lots of height really quickly while our double jumps are rather small. Shuttle Loop covers decent distance but I find he manages to float too high, though I've caught him a couple times.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Alright now that I have had time to get the post tournament salt cleansed from my body, it's time to go back to the lab. I'm going to pick up the pace with training again. I can't let a few bad tournaments keep me down. Progress involves a lot of blood, sweat and tears. I have to remember that.

 

[ぱみゅ]

I think I need to hear again the explanation on how to angle Shuttle Loops, I keep missing the second hit so, I just want to be sure I'm doing it right because OMG, missing them and getting punished when falling is becoming annoying.

 

[LostinpinK]

Well you can angle it left or right. Suppose you're facing right, if you flick the control stick to the left, you will fly straight up for the second hit; if you flick the control stick to the right you will go further to the right with an about 30° angle.

But I must say that good DI counters it. It might need testing, but I whiff the second hit very ofter even if I angle left (still facing right with OOS shuttle loop) if the guy DIs left a lot. He ends up behind me after the first hit, so I can't hit him for the kill.

 

[ItoI6]

theres two different hitboxes for the 1st hit of shuttle loop in the air, one where mk locks them in place and is undiable for the 2nd hit, and one where he knocks them upwards into the 2nd hit that is possible to di, and if your opponents reactions are good enough they can avoid the 2nd hit. you pretty much never want the 2nd type of hitbox if youre just going for damage, but its still necessary to get some roofio kills at low %s or just helping for killing in general at higher percents.

as for going for the type of hitbox you want on purpose i cant explain because its one of the most random, precise, finickiest hitboxes in the game. you can hit with the same part of shuttle loop multiple times and get different results each time. all i know is that the base of shuttle loop on its startup and the top part of the loop where he starts curving backward tend to create the 2nd type of hitbox, whereas the middle part where he is going straight up usually locks them in place. That said you can honestly hit with any part of the move and itll be random lol. if you just practice dthrow-shuttle loop for a bit in training you can pretty consistently get the 'lock them in place hitbox' with the rare exception. also just fastfall asap onto ledges if you can.

 

[Ulevo]

It's not random. It's based on opponent DI and how close you are when the first hit connects. If you're too far away, or if you're too far away and they DI a particular way, they'll pop out of the first hit.

As for influence Shuttle Loop, you can influence both the 1st and the 2nd part of the move, although doing so on the 1st part makes it so you cannot influence the 2nd.

As an example, give this a try. Go in to training mode, put the camera to fixed, and try the following:

1) Regular Shuttle Loop, no movement.
2) Holding the stick forward in the first few frames.
3) Hold back as Meta Knight transitions in to the 2nd loop.
4) Hold back on the first few frames of Shuttle Loop, but after the frames where it would turn you around.

These will all yield different results. You will see Meta Knight will go different distances and heights on each.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Just as an update, I plan to have my blog up later this week. I am just going to use Blogger to host it since it's owned by Google and that makes it insanely easy to share any youtube videos (which there will be a lot of them). Trying to make it somewhat pretty before I buy its domain and make it live. I look forward to sharing all of my struggles and triumphs with the world lol

 

[warionumbah2]

Then I lost to a Dedede. I have no idea what to do in that MU.

What did you struggle with against d3? I think we beat him hard. Late reply I know lol.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

In the beginning, I had no idea how to react to all the Gordo jank and that was messing me up the most. As the set went on, I began to catch on but it was too late. I know what Dedede is capable of and I have done the MU a few times before with other characters but I have never tried it with a character that didn't have a buttload of range or a spammable projectile so I was thrown off a bit. The MU isn't hard, I just failed really hard and started making half-asses approaches that got me hit by really dumb ****. I started the day off playing really poorly..then in pools I was playing really well. Then by the time bracket rolled around (3 hours later...) I had lost my momentum and wasn't playing as well as I could have. It was a **** day in general.

 

[Ulevo]

It is worth noting that Meta Knight cannot reflect the Gordo's with forward or back air unless all three hits connect, so depending on whether or not Meta Knight is in the air or not, his options might be limited against certain Gordo approaches. You can use neutral air, however if you use it too low to the ground and incur the landing lag while Dedede reflects the Gordo back you might regret that decision.

Can Meta Knight Shuttle Loop through the downward descent of his Super Jump?

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Pretty sure you'll just end up in a very unfavorable trade.

EDIT: Here's a preview of what I am working on right now. Still playing around with the background images though as well as colors. So this is nowhere near done. Need to have a darker, classy feel to it.

 

[warionumbah2]

Play mindgames for gordo's, shield it 5 or 6 times(the fatass will spam it) then bust out nair randomly a well place DA can send it back but i wouldn't try it. We lose the long range game so we should be at mid where we demolish him.

 

[Oblivion129]

Was the DDD player King James? He's really good. Ryuga is also really good. One of the best Ikes.

He'll try to do retreating Gordo Throw, Ftilt, Jumps into landing Bair or B-reverse Neutral B at mid range. If you're under him he might mix up his landing with Nair or Grab as well.

Both those players make their characters look really fast and know how to read you, so try to mix-up your approaches. Retreating Pivot Grabs and Retreating Nairs are probably what Ryuga used against DA and Dash grab approaches.
@ warionumbah2 is right about staying at mid-range against DDD. You'll want to be just outside his Ftilt/Dtilt/Dsmash range. @ ItoI6 gave you great advice on mix-ups, too. You'll improve so much, especially in your competitive community!

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Yes, I lost to him. I disagree about him being really good but he is a respectable player for sure. I'll get him next time and Ryuga as well. I'm optimistic especially since I have some better ideas of what to work on.

 

[Ulevo]

Discovered something interesting. Meta Knight's Shuttle Loop is bugged. The grounded version is supposed to do 15% damage while the aerial version does 12%. However if you use either of them out of a throw, they'll both do 12%. The first hit of Shuttle Loop loses 3% (it normally does 6%) for some reason.

Hopefully this gets patched during the Lucas patch.

 

[W.A.C.]

They'll probably never fix it. We're lucky we had the down special bug fixed.

 

[warionumbah2]

Things that need fixing

-Hitboxes on Down smash + Ftilt. Not needed.
-RCO lag on shuttle loop(if you get hit after he loops for the 2nd hit he will not be able to move and suffer terrible landing lag)
-This new thing Ulevo brought up

it seems every patch is 'fixing' more than buffing, he gained alot of buffs in the wii u patch.

 

[Superbat]

Can't wait to see @ChileZeRo 's face as @Katakiri outjanks him with mii brawler at Evo. Some camping with Mk would also be nice. Zero has no soul. I was not prepared today. LOL (jk)

 

[W.A.C.]

ZeRo has plenty of familiarity with Mii Brawler. As of right now, Mii Brawler is one of M2K's tournament characters.

 

[Ulevo]

Holy damn. I figured out how @ ItoI6 is so good at Meta Knight. The way he trains is he actually dresses up as Meta Knight and performs the attacks himself to better be at one with his character.

Here he is reenacting his training regime. What a fearsome beast:

 

[Superbat]

Holy damn. I figured out how @ ItoI6 is so good at Meta Knight. The way he trains is he actually dresses up as Meta Knight and performs the attacks himself to better be at one with his character.

Here he is reenacting his training regime. What a fearsome beast:

WTF
The Mk boards are; love it.

 

[W.A.C.]

dafuq...where did that GIF come from?

 

[ItoI6]

o no my tech

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

-deaddddddd-

 

[warionumbah2]

I think its gotten to the point where footstool combo's are easy for me, like if i want i get it. I don't dtilt lock unless they land infront of me but i still haven't done it but FF bair is 100% better.

If you guys use footstool combo's regularly when do you go for it?

I tend to go for it when i have a stock lead, with rage my combo's become insufficient so i go for the footstool combo and get a nice +30%.

I think its time we all use this now imo, the setup is easier compared to other characters.

 

[LostinpinK]

Never tried it so far. Can you use it on all characters, or are some characters easier?

On another topic Zero's tier list is coming out on youtube. He only published top 8 but so far it's pretty good. I think MK will finally be were he deserved to be in a tier list, that is to say around 20th.

 

[warionumbah2]

I think MK will finally be were he deserved to be in a tier list, that is to say around 20th.

Knowing MKs luck with tier lists,he'll be put in mid tier because hur dur solid mid. I too think he's top 20(15-20 not bothered about the places but he isn't outside 20).

It doesn't work on jiggypuff because she can act out of her helpless state before touching the ground, Fox simply falls too fast. Other than those two everyone is a victim to footstool combo's.