The Legendary Heroes of Galar - Zacian and Zamazenta for Smash

Which would you rather see get in Smash as a newcomer?

  • Zacian

  • Zamazenta


Results are only viewable after voting.

LukeRNG

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Finally done with the colors. I really couldn't think of what to do with the fifth alt but i'm happy with them overall. Not a pro, but it gets the idea across.
Let's see if you can spot the theme.

View attachment 264900
The one i did was on page 23.
(Huh, it's post #890. So it's blessed by Eternatus...)
 
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Cosmic77

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Here's a cool 8-bit rendition of Battle: Eternatus V3. I like the 8-bit wolf cries.

I just realized I shared a video with Zamazenta in the thumbnail on post #889.

Speaking of Zamazenta, we really do need to discuss him more often. Sometimes this feels like the Zacian support thread.
 

zacian

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I just thought of a really dumb ability for Zamazenta in smash, you can’t break his shield at all
 

Cosmic77

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Happy Mother's Day! Seems like Zacian and Zamazenta have their gifts ready. Who has the better idea for a good gift?

EQtElKiUYAAOSB9.jpeg.jpg


I just thought of a really dumb ability for Zamazenta in smash, you can’t break his shield at all
If Zamazenta did get in Smash, I'd imagine he'd have the most/best defensive options in the game. The kind of character who shrugs off any attack.
 

fogbadge

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Happy Mother's Day! Seems like Zacian and Zamazenta have their gifts ready. Who has the better idea for a good gift?

View attachment 271356



If Zamazenta did get in Smash, I'd imagine he'd have the most/best defensive options in the game. The kind of character who shrugs off any attack.
surely those two would celebrate mother's day when the uk does?
 

LukeRNG

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I just realized I shared a video with Zamazenta in the thumbnail on post #889.

Speaking of Zamazenta, we really do need to discuss him more often. Sometimes this feels like the Zacian support thread.
I've been struggling with Zamazenta's colors. Some basically share colors with Zamazenta or don't have a main color (or have 2-3 main colors).
I'd moved on to Dragapult for a while. And now that's finished i think i can continue with Zamazenta's colors. Same theme that my Zacian colors have.
 

fogbadge

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I've been struggling with Zamazenta's colors. Some basically share colors with Zamazenta or don't have a main color (or have 2-3 main colors).
I'd moved on to Dragapult for a while. And now that's finished i think i can continue with Zamazenta's colors. Same theme that my Zacian colors have.
well if you want an idea for something different might i suggest basing them on other legendaries with high defence?
 

LukeRNG

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well if you want an idea for something different might i suggest basing them on other legendaries with high defence?
Once i finish with the ones i'll look into it. And maybe also Zacian with the pokemon with high attack.
 
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Delzethin

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Speaking of Zamazenta, we really do need to discuss him more often. Sometimes this feels like the Zacian support thread.
I've been messing around with a few ideas for a tag team concept--not sure how plausible it is since it'd basically require twice the work and the DLC team is smaller, but it's one potential angle and it'd make for a unique moveset if the focus was on two characters with similar builds but different attacks and strengths/weaknesses.

Zamazenta's strong points could be:
- Very difficult to KO, through high weight, good recovery, or other means
- Notably good disadvantage state, able to break out of unfavorable situations well with smart use of his kit (especially compared to other big bodies)
- Fighting style would focus on baiting and punishing, playing defensively while trying to force opponents to leave themselves open
- Very good out-of-shield options, including a standing grab with a big hitbox and quick startup by heavy standards
- Frame data is a mixed bag, with some surprisingly quick defensive tools along with stronger, laggier stuff
- Advantage state isn't the greatest--conversions aren't much to write home about, and would rely on mindgames to keep his advantages going
- Strong KO options, albeit not always the easiest to hit with
- Super armor (if not outright invincibility) on a few moves, encouraging using them to block enemy attacks and plow right through them
- Okay mobility overall, like his canon statline--just significantly worse than Zacian's
- Possibly less end lag than Zacian has, making him harder to punish?

While Zacian's could be:
- Great damage per hit combined with an amazing combo game, giving her some of the highest damage output in the game
- Excellent mobility on all fronts, including Top 10 run speed
- Notably quick startup by swordfighter standards on most of her moves, giving her the best overall frame data of any big body
- Aggressive fighting style built to hammer opposing shields, and pressure them into responding
- Multiple zone breaking tools that allow her to disrupt opponents' attempts to wall her out
- Slow grabs (has to toss her sword first), but with good reward when she gets them, which helps since her shield pressure encourages grab mixups
- Still pretty heavy, just not as heavy as Zamazenta
- Out-of-shield and pressure breaker tools are flawed, making her vulnerable to getting comboed right back when she loses the upper hand
- KO power is actually average at best, and completely lacks means to cheese stocks at early %s, making her the worst at ending stocks of any heavy

'Course, then there'd need to be a way to swap between them. You could just have one special be tied to that, but that'd be simple and boring. Hm...

Happy Mother's Day! Seems like Zacian and Zamazenta have their gifts ready. Who has the better idea for a good gift?

View attachment 271356
Pretty sure that was originally for Valentine's Day, but it's still cute.

...Hey, wait. Who are their parents, anyway?
 
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Cosmic77

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I've been messing around with a few ideas for a tag team concept--not sure how plausible it is since it'd basically require twice the work and the DLC team is smaller, but it's one potential angle and it'd make for a unique moveset if the focus was on two characters with similar builds but different attacks and strengths/weaknesses.

Zamazenta's strong points could be:
- Very difficult to KO, through high weight, good recovery, or other means
- Notably good disadvantage state, able to break out of unfavorable situations well with smart use of his kit (especially compared to other big bodies)
- Fighting style would focus on baiting and punishing, playing defensively while trying to force opponents to leave themselves open
- Very good out-of-shield options, including a standing grab with a big hitbox and quick startup by heavy standards
- Frame data is a mixed bag, with some surprisingly quick defensive tools along with stronger, laggier stuff
- Advantage state isn't the greatest--conversions aren't much to write home about, and would rely on mindgames to keep his advantages going
- Strong KO options, albeit not always the easiest to hit with
- Super armor (if not outright invincibility) on a few moves, encouraging using them to block enemy attacks and plow right through them
- Okay mobility overall, like his canon statline--just significantly worse than Zacian's
- Possibly less end lag than Zacian has, making him harder to punish?

While Zacian's could be:
- Great damage per hit combined with an amazing combo game, giving her some of the highest damage output in the game
- Excellent mobility on all fronts, including Top 10 run speed
- Notably quick startup by swordfighter standards on most of her moves, giving her the best overall frame data of any big body
- Aggressive fighting style built to hammer opposing shields, and pressure them into responding
- Multiple zone breaking tools that allow her to disrupt opponents' attempts to wall her out
- Slow grabs (has to toss her sword first), but with good reward when she gets them, which helps since her shield pressure encourages grab mixups
- Still pretty heavy, just not as heavy as Zamazenta
- Out-of-shield and pressure breaker tools are flawed, making her vulnerable to getting comboed right back when she loses the upper hand
- KO power is actually average at best, and completely lacks means to cheese stocks at early %s, making her the worst at ending stocks of any heavy
I think they'd work well the same way people use Squirtle/Ivysaur and Charizard. Start out with Zacian to rack up some damage. If your own damage gets too high, switch to Zamazenta and try toughing it out for as long as you can.

Pretty sure that was originally for Valentine's Day, but it's still cute.

...Hey, wait. Who are their parents, anyway?
It was, but I forgot to share it. Didn't feel like waiting another year.

Anyway, unless there's some kind of lore that suggests they were born from an inanimate sword and shield, I guess they've always existed since Arceus.
 
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zacian

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Has anyone here ever pronounced Zacian like zah-key-in instead of zah-shee-in? Asking cuz that’s how I was prouncing Zacian until someone corrected me.
 

Cosmic77

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Finally, some relevant and meaningful news.


Has anyone here ever pronounced Zacian like zah-key-in instead of zah-shee-in? Asking cuz that’s how I was prouncing Zacian until someone corrected me.
No, but I thought it was pronounced zay-shee-in at first. Zacian has a name that's mispronounced all the time.

I guess that's a minor victory for Zamazenta. I don't think I've ever heard someone mispronounce its name.
 

Staarih

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Has anyone here ever pronounced Zacian like zah-key-in instead of zah-shee-in? Asking cuz that’s how I was prouncing Zacian until someone corrected me.
Pokémon name pronunciations can be weird, at least until we hear it officially in the anime or whatnot (”Ar-kee-us” instead of ”Ar-see-us” still baffles me tho). I guess ”Za-shee-in” is the accepted pronunciation but I still find myself pronouncing it almost as ”Za-see-in” because of ”cyan” (to Zamazenta’s ”magenta”). I dunno.

Finally, some relevant and meaningful news.

Morpeko for a main character was a given seeing as they haven’t passed a Pika-clone in the main cast for the last how many seasons of the anime. Kinda weird not seeing it with Marnie though. And Galarian Farfetch’d seems like a fun addition, especially with Goh thinking that Farfetch’d doesn’t evolve when he caught the Kanto-variant. With Sobble still being a mystery, I’d assume he goes with Ash but we’ll see.
 

Delzethin

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Finally, some relevant and meaningful news.

Worth noting that it seems like the text part of the tweet is speculation. Far as I can tell, all the image actually implies is that Morpeko, Galarian Farfetch'd, and the Sobble from the trailer are set to appear in the anime soon. It remains to be seen if they'll end up on the teams of the main cast, supporting cast, or be one-offs featured in single episodes.

Though I'll be shocked if the Morpeko isn't associated with Marnie since it's her signature mon in the games, and I still think Goh ends up with the Sobble.

I think they'd work well the same way people use Squirtle/Ivysaur and Charizard. Start out with Zacian to rack up some damage. If your own damage gets too high, switch to Zamazenta and try toughing it out for as long as you can.
To be honest, I'm not sure having them swap out in exactly the same way as the Pokémon Trainer's team members would be...ideal. If each new fighter is supposed to bring new ideas with them, wouldn't we want something that isn't a direct ripoff of a character (or characters) we already have?

Maybe if there was some kind of condition that let them tag out. What if you had to land certain attacks to induce it, with whichever of the two wasn't in to start jumping in to follow it up and then taking point while the other disappears? If the attacks that were capable of it were spread out enough in the moveset to still be doable as long as you aren't fishing for it, it'd allow for more dynamic take on the tag team concept while also feeling distinct.
 

Cosmic77

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If Go (Or "Goh" as the dub seems to call him) does end up catching Galarian Farfetch'd, then I consider Sirfetch'd to be a little less likely for Smash. The screentime for any of Goh's Pokemon who aren't Raboot has been almost nonexistent.

If Sobble ends up joining Ash, which at this point seems to be happening, then I'd say Inteleon would be more likely. Be it coincidence or intentional, most of the Pokemon in Smash have been fairly important in the anime. The only exception is Ivysaur, but PT and Ash are both based off the same character.
 

LukeRNG

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Pokémon name pronunciations can be weird, at least until we hear it officially in the anime or whatnot (”Ar-kee-us” instead of ”Ar-see-us” still baffles me tho). I guess ”Za-shee-in” is the accepted pronunciation but I still find myself pronouncing it almost as ”Za-see-in” because of ”cyan” (to Zamazenta’s ”magenta”). I dunno.
I believe they said it's because Ar-see-us sounds like arse. And i don't think they'd want people laughing at the name of creator of the pokemon universe.

If Go (Or "Goh" as the dub seems to call him) does end up catching Galarian Farfetch'd, then I consider Sirfetch'd to be a little less likely for Smash. The screentime for any of Goh's Pokemon who aren't Raboot has been almost nonexistent.

If Sobble ends up joining Ash, which at this point seems to be happening, then I'd say Inteleon would be more likely. Be it coincidence or intentional, most of the Pokemon in Smash have been fairly important in the anime. The only exception is Ivysaur, but PT and Ash are both based off the same character.
I do wonder if they know what pokemon they'll include at this point in time or not yet.

And even if you don't care about competitive smash; i think it's very telling that smash ultimate won't be on EVO 2020. The online is so bad that neither EVO or Nintendo would want the backlash of a terrible mess.
 
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Pokelego999

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I believe they said it's because Ar-see-us sounds like arse. And i don't think they'd want people laughing at the name of creator of the pokemon universe.



I do wonder if they know what pokemon they'll include at this point in time or not yet.

And even if you don't care about competitive smash; i think it's very telling that smash ultimate won't be on EVO 2020. The online is so bad that neither EVO or Nintendo would want the backlash of a terrible mess.
I'm pretty sure they pronounced it as ar-kee-us in the movies
 

Trevenant

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I have looked far and wide all over the internet for a zamazenta moveset and there really is next to nothing discussing them specifically for smash. Most I can see is in this thread. Like others have said, we probably could discuss them a bit more. I imagine it being quite unique as it'd probably be one of the first characters in smash to be an actual tank. I had an idea for a down special where it was essentially a literal shield which nullifies all attacks from the front and doesn't have any limit to how you use it unlike other down specials like Pit and Joker's. It would function however long you you hold the button down for and would end once you let go.
 
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Hex Maniac

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I would really like both of them in, maybe as a tag-team or dual character similar to Ice Climber.
 

LukeRNG

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I'm pretty sure they pronounced it as ar-kee-us in the movies
I meant that the dub translaters were going over how to pronounce Arceus for the Movie. Which is where the argument against Ar-see-us came up.
 
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Cosmic77

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I have looked far and wide all over the internet and there really is next to nothing discussing them specifically for smash. Most I can see is in this thread. Like others have said, we probably could discuss them a bit more. I imagine it being quite unique as it'd probably be one of the first characters in smash to be an actual tank. I had an idea for a down special where it was essentially a literal shield which nullifies all attacks from the front and doesn't have any limit to how you use it unlike other down specials like Pit and Joker's. It would function however long you you hold the button down for and would end once you let go.
I'd imagine a large part of the reason why they rarely get brought up is because of the Spirits. Actually, Gen 8 in general is rarely brought up, and whenever it is people seem to treat the starters, Toxtricity, and Urshifu as the only options.

Anyways, while I do think a shield like that would need a lot of balancing to prevent it from being completely OP, it's fitting for Zamazenta of all characters. Imagine blocking Ridley or K. Rool's Final Smash and following up with a counterattack.

I would really like both of them in, maybe as a tag-team or dual character similar to Ice Climber.
Welcome. Glad to have you.
 

Trevenant

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I'd imagine a large part of the reason why they rarely get brought up is because of the Spirits. Actually, Gen 8 in general is rarely brought up, and whenever it is people seem to treat the starters, Toxtricity, and Urshifu as the only options.

Anyways, while I do think a shield like that would need a lot of balancing to prevent it from being completely OP, it's fitting for Zamazenta of all characters. Imagine blocking Ridley or K. Rool's Final Smash and following up with a counterattack.
Yeah I probably should have pointed It out but it would need a lot more balancing but it would be unique and fun if done right. Maybe they could make it called Iron Defence or something

I would say gen 8 isn't really brought up for long as the smash community usually just hone in on one mon and then call it a day but generally id argue gen 8 is brought up quite a bit. It's a fairly common prediction as well. At least from what I've seen. The spirits probably do help it to be brought up by person at least but probably not in a good way, as it pretty much confirms people will discuss it maybe once or twice until they say that the spirit event kills the chances and calls it a day but that's probably beside the point.

Just a few other spitball's could be behemoth bash as an armoured forward dash which is done in a similar vain to Jigglypuffs Rollout but without the ability to change direction and generally less...wacky than Rollout. Zamazenta should definitely be one of the first literal tank characters so any attacks it has should embody that. The only real options you have for a attacks are bites, paw swipes, head butts and body rams so they'd need to be evenly distributed across several attacks to not have another Sonic situation and we could easily have a very unique fighter. They could maybe incorporate it's ability and maybe it's first form but that would probably run the risk of being incohesive and too complex for a fighter who it may not make much sense to be used for

Zacian obviously has a much better shot unless they do a duo (which admittedly is probably quite unlikely) as it's already combat ready but it would be a fun character nonetheless. The literal tank aspect is what intrigues me.
 
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Hex Maniac

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Also just because Zacian has a sword doesn't mean he's better for a moveset - there are a ton of sword characters already and Zamazenta's body type still qallows for a creative moveset!
 

Trevenant

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Also just because Zacian has a sword doesn't mean he's better for a moveset - there are a ton of sword characters already and Zamazenta's body type still qallows for a creative moveset!
Depends what you mean. Zamazenta could probably have the more creative moveset but Zacian would probably be easier to make one for. I guess if one thing stands true I think it's that I hope someone makes some kind of concept for Zenta in smash even if it's something as little as skins.
 

Hex Maniac

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That's true.... it's only a matter of dedication to the 'Mon whether or not they will take the hard route and make Zenta or easy route and Zacian.
 

Trevenant

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That's true.... it's only a matter of dedication to the 'Mon whether or not they will take the hard route and make Zenta or easy route and Zacian.
I guess it depends on if Nintendo asked for a Pokemon and let Samurai have creative freedom with it too. Then it'll edge on if Sakurai went unpredictable as usual and chose a important mon that no one was expecting. I could definitely see them going the extra mile with it when Hero has three different gimmicks in one character, Terry having all the stuff that he has and the Pokemon Trainer.
 

Hex Maniac

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Creative freedom + dedication. I think every character needs to have one person dedicated to that character to make it the best it can be for the health of the game.
 
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