The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess (USE SPOILER TAGS)

[Misto-Roboto]

Aghanim was by Ganon's own words, "his alter-ego". Which makes things really interesting... It's possibly it could be him...

EDIT: Oh, wait, interesting speculation here; when Link defeats Ganon at the end in OoT, he kills him as Adult Link which means Link defeats Ganon after all those events happen (including the war Ganon wages). So when he puts the sword back he transports back to a time before Ganon's war takes place or shortly before it escelates to something really horrid. In Majora's Mask, he goes off as a kid knowing his future self would already be ending it with Ganon and looks for his friend, the Skull Kid. If you look at Link in this newer game, he doesn't look full grown like he looks when he is an adult. Me thinks Link joined the Lon Lon Ranch or Malon Ranch, which would explain the pictures. This game could be about the events that took place while Zelda was in hiding(which might explain the robed person in the Sheikah wsymbol) and Link was in his deep sleep as Ganondorf waged an all out war against Hyrule. Remember, since Ganondorf hasn't been defeated until later in the future it's quite possible because Ganondorf doesn't jump ahead of time, just Link.

 

[Mic_128]

Originally posted by Misto-Roboto
looks for his friend, the Skull Kid.

I'm almost 100% positive his friend is NAvi, the fairy, which disapears after OoT and is why you pick up Tattl, cos Navi ain't there.

 

[Misto-Roboto]

Originally posted by mic_128
I'm almost 100% positive his friend is NAvi, the fairy, which disapears after OoT and is why you pick up Tattl, cos Navi ain't there.

You pick up Tatl temporarily for the adventure because Tatl is responsible for turning you into a Deku and then getting left behind so tatl's own guilty concious realize he should help for his prank. The end of MM made it pretty clear Link had found his friend...

 

[Mic_128]

I'm going thru MM again, so I'll check that, but why would he go looking for someone who barely showed up, if at all in the game?

EDIT: I found my N64 version, so I re-did the end. The only reference to the Skull kid being in the previous game was when it said "You smell like the fairyboy who taught me that song in the forest" That's it. So why would link go out on a "personal adventure" to find some guy who you see once as opposed to the fairy that you're with the entire game who then takes off at the end? Makes much more sence. Plus at the end, Link rides off. Would you do that if you'd been searching for the guy?

 

[Misto-Roboto]

Would I? Yes...

 

[Bedi Vegeta]

Uh, yeah Link is looking for Navi at the beginning of MM...because Navi leaves at the end of OoT...

 

[Cashed]

I just read all the new information in EGM and I have to say I'm a lot more excited for this than I previously was.

I can't wait to chicken glide again. :D They really describe the scale of things a lot in EGM, too. It's great to know we're getting a huge game... even though Wind Waker was huge, but it was water which was annoying to sail all the way across. Riding a horse is much more fun, I used to just run around with Epona in OoT.

 

[The rAt]

I have to say that I really doubt this game will be about OoT Link. Seems like anything they could do with that Link would involve heavy explinations of temporal physics (how time travel works), as well as how the situation could work without having two Links at the same time. It just seems to forced. Why bother using an old Link and try and jam this story in where it doesn't naturally fit, when you can introduce a new Link and tell a new story? OoT told a complete story, and making this a part of the OoT story would be just tacking on a sequel for more money, and it just wouldn't make any sense.
As far as this Agahnim stuff, it brings up an interesting point if you see Ganon and Gannondorf as separage entities. If you look at it that way, then in OoT, Gannondorf offered his body to be possessed by Ganon so that he could destroy Link (something about his dying breath). In that case, Aghanim would be Ganon's alter ego in the same way that Gannondorf is; a parallel evil force in the normal realm, trying to accomplish the same goals. In any case, this would be a long post indeed if I tried to explore all the ramifications of Ganon and Gannondorf being separate entities, but its interesting to think about.
This post is too long. I'm going to cut it off here. Later.

 

[pokemonmaster01]

Ganon is Ganondorf's alter ego like Sheik is Zelda's alter ego. I wouldn't read into it too much.

 

[GanNingoftheBell]

actually, that would make sense if Ganondorf was an evil entity and that why he keeps showing up. Oot, LttP, and the original legend of zelda.

it could also be that the lttp and original gannondorf are actually Ganon. I mean, he got trapped in the evil realm. perhaps in the incodent between Oot and WW, the incodent of LttP, and the first zelda there where all people that "channel" Ganon, or as he is known in his altered state, Ganon. the "Legend of Zelda" was just another case of "A link to the past" but Ganon had already come to the normal realm

 

[The rAt]

pokemonmaster01,
That's true, that's how everyone traditionally understands the Ganon/Gannondorf relationship, and I'm certainly not disputing that its probably the right understanding, but there are little things which make me suspect otherwise. Like how Gannondorf uses his "dying breath" to take down the castle in OoT before he shows up as Ganon. It would imply that after that point in time Gannondorf was dead. Which would make sense if he was allowing himself to be possesed by a pig demon by the name of Ganon, who we just thought was him in a transformed state. This combined with the fact that Gannondorf only appears in OoT and WW, and is only referenced breifly (along with the rest of the events of OoT) in LttP, while Ganon shows up all over the Legend of Zelda, makes me wonder. Of course the flaw with this is that Zelda would have no way of knowing for sure if Gannondorf was dead when he took down the tower, and maybe she was just being overdramatic when she said that, but its enough to make me wanna keep my eyes open.
In any case, we digress from the topic of the new game, and what direction it will take. Any ides as to Link's new musical device (assuming they continue that particular element)? I'd really like them to bring back the Ocarina, myself, it would really give it a Legend of Zelda feel in my opinion, but a flute could be interesting as well.
I could keep typing for hours. Really. I have. But I'm going to save you all the trouble of reading through anything else I'd have to say at the moment, by just not saying it. So... um... later.

 

[The Windwaker]

Originally posted by The rAt
pokemonmaster01,
That's true, that's how everyone traditionally understands the Ganon/Gannondorf relationship, and I'm certainly not disputing that its probably the right understanding, but there are little things which make me suspect otherwise. Like how Gannondorf uses his "dying breath" to take down the castle in OoT before he shows up as Ganon. It would imply that after that point in time Gannondorf was dead. Which would make sense if he was allowing himself to be possesed by a pig demon by the name of Ganon, who we just thought was him in a transformed state. This combined with the fact that Gannondorf only appears in OoT and WW, and is only referenced breifly (along with the rest of the events of OoT) in LttP, while Ganon shows up all over the Legend of Zelda, makes me wonder. Of course the flaw with this is that Zelda would have no way of knowing for sure if Gannondorf was dead when he took down the tower, and maybe she was just being overdramatic when she said that, but its enough to make me wanna keep my eyes open.

Well, my view is different. Alright, in for the most Zelda games, until OoT, there isn't a Ganondorf, prince of thieves. Ganon, from what he looks like is just an evil Orc, ruler of the moblins, from appereance solely. In OoT though, Ganondorf appears and has the Triforce of power, which from the looks of it gave him powers far superior that the ones he had. When he gave his dying breath, he didn't die. Zelda just assumed that he did, thus why she said it, not Ganondorf. He comes out of the rubble and shows the back of his hand with the triforce piece of power embedded and become 'Ganon'. Now, I don't think Ganondorf was "controlled" by another entity named "Ganon". Ganon was simply the name given to Ganondorf in that state and I think he was fully concious of what he was doing. I mean, for one, when he's sealed in the sacred realm, he gives his last few words and "curses" to Zelda and Link and his plan failed. Also, the triforce of power was never removed, which, I think, while he was sealed, gave him eternal life, thus his survival in the Windwaker. There in that game do we truly see the triforce become one and Ganondorf not having it.

Now, back on this game as you said I think his musical device, if any, would be his traditional flute/ocarina. Dunno, but it fits perfectly into this game.

 

[Undrdog]

The Theory of the Tetraforce:

This is not the full theory. it goes much deeper. this is only involving Ganon and Gannondorf.

Ganon is an evil entity that "protects" the Gerudo. Every 100 years a male Gerudo is born into the world. He is then posessed by Ganon. Those becoming Ganondorf.

due to this, every 100 years, the Goddess of Time resurrects the Hero of Time.

This theory of the Tetraforce states that there is not a triforce, but a Tetraforce. it is kept secret that a Goddess of Time exists. only the fairies, and the royal family knows of this. This is done to protect the Goddess of Time. in this theory Zelda is the Goddess of Time. this explains how she is always alive and even though there are Three Links, they have all met the same Zelda. This was first thought up after LttP, and has later been confirmed over and over. only then there was only two Links in this timeline. Navi mentions the Goddess of Time in OoT. and Zelda's alias in WW just happens to be Tetra...

this is actually very deep and the "Big M" himself has said that the game is much deeper then people give it credit for. I'm creating a Forum just for this topic actually. its not done but here's the link. if anyone else has any interest in this subject, I'd like to invite you to join up. ^_^

not much is up yet, but please register if you want. I'll be sure to have the site going very soon.

 

[GanNingoftheBell]

okok

less fanboytheories and more links to juicy new info

 

[The rAt]

Windwaker, your idea makes a lot of sense. In fact, I'd be willing to bet nine out of ten people would agree with it, or at least the basic ideas. And you're probably right. But something about it seems odd to me. Mainly because if Ganon and Gannondorf were the same mind that they would be interchangable, and thus would appear interchangably, but they don't. Gannondorf has only appeared twice. Why? If they were the same character, just in a different form, why would Gannondorf have chosen to take human form in WW, instead of the pig form we see in every other Zelda game (xcept OoT, when he'd obviously not achieved it yet). Another odd bit that makes me wonder is why at the end of OoT, Gannondorf is floating around in the Sacred Realm making threats to Link, when Link had just defeated him as a giant pig monster. Odd. My answer? The multiple timeline idea. That, however, is too big and too indepth to discuss here. Sufficive to say it has many holes which need to be worked out, and I'm not quite sure I agree with it, but it would give an interesting twist to the whole Gannondorf/Ganon thing. In any case, I see what your point is, and am willing to agree that you are probably right. I'm just holding out on agreeing for now.
UndrDog, no offense, but I do think the Tetraforce thing is a bit implausible. I mean, its a cool concept, but it just isn't supported by the games. The goddess of time thing, I buy, but I can't see it being Zelda, because if it were her, in WW Tetra would have known not only that she was Zelda, but that she was the goddess of time, both of which it is clear she does not. Also, if she were the Goddess of Time, the logical point in time for that to have come out would have been when it is discovered that she is the Seventh Sage in OoT. They could have just forgone the whole Seventh Sage thing altogether if she was really the Goddess of Time. Finally, the obvious age difference between Zelda from OoT and Zelda from WW. All these things just don't add up to me. Its a good idea though, and you may be onto something with this fourth Goddess thing, because they definetely make reference to a Goddess of time in Majora's Mask.
Wow, that's a lot of words. I don't blame anyone for not reading all of that. I'm going to use my last few sentances to push us back on topic...
Windmill Man (Guru Guru): should he be in the new Zelda game? I expect heavy debate on this blatantly controversial question, so please, don't tear each other appart.
Later.

 

[RichBrown]

whoa.... the tetra force is quite a stretch. cool theory no doubt, but when you make up something that hasnt even been MENTIONED in the game, it just isnt believable.

um.... yeah, how about that wolf....

 

[Aruun]

The multiple timeline theory doesn't work because Tingle is in MM but not OoT. But he's in WW. And WW is directly related to OoT.

However to be honest I think you all are looking into things a little bit too far. It's one thing to pay attention to little details and get as much out of the game as you can, but it's another to just start milking things out of it that aren't really there. Just... enjoy the game. I sometimes doubt if the game creators put as much thought into the story as all the zelda fanboys do.

 

[Mic_128]

Originally posted by JediMasterYoda98
Tingle is in MM but not OoT. But he's in WW. And WW is directly related to OoT.

True. BUT! In WindWaker, if you have the TingleTuner in one of the Dungeons, you can find pages of a story about a Fairy that helped the Hero of Time by giving him maps that he wrote when flying around. Also the Fairy was only 35 years old. So WindWaker definetly does mention Majoras Mask in a tiny way.

 

[Undrdog]

well, Shigeru Miyamoto himself said that their have been three Links so far. and he also mentioned that all of the Nintendo made Zelda games do indeed tie into one another.

and now "Tetra" shows up long after the theory does.

 

[The Windwaker]

Originally posted by The rAt
Windwaker, your idea makes a lot of sense. In fact, I'd be willing to bet nine out of ten people would agree with it, or at least the basic ideas. And you're probably right. But something about it seems odd to me. Mainly because if Ganon and Gannondorf were the same mind that they would be interchangable, and thus would appear interchangably, but they don't. Gannondorf has only appeared twice. Why? If they were the same character, just in a different form, why would Gannondorf have chosen to take human form in WW, instead of the pig form we see in every other Zelda game (xcept OoT, when he'd obviously not achieved it yet).

But he did! The first 3 forms in which you fight Ganondorf he transforms into Ganon. Due to the Cel-shading and cartoon based theme rather than making him the dual sword wielding orc or moblin he became, he just became that, but in Puppet form. His face was Ganon, cept his body was a spider, puppet, and the snake. And even then, Ganondorf then decided to fight in his human form after Link defeated his 3 Ganon forms.

And yes, Windmill guy rocked... maybe not him, but I wouldn't mind if the song was in the game.

 

[Mic_128]

Originally posted by UndrDog
well, Shigeru Miyamoto himself said that their have been three Links so far. and he also mentioned that all of the Nintendo made Zelda games do indeed tie into one another.

Sorry Underdog, but No.

1. Shiggy has been quoted many times saying each adventure brings a new hero. Meaning each Link is diferent.
2. The games have NEVER been meant to link, except for OoT, MM and WW.

 

[Aruun]

Oh my god yes bring back the song of storms. I heart that song so <3

Oh and Mic, I didn't say WW didn't relate to MM... I said it DID. Nintendo has specifically said that WW relates to OoT, yet both MM and WW have tingle. Which means the multiple timeline theory doesn't work because both OoT and MM are related to WW.

Oh dude, I just saw the intro and ending cutscenes from the Wand of Gamelon... that is seriously some of the funniest stuff I have ever seen.


Not until you've scrubbed all the floors in Hyrule! THEN we can talk about mercy! Take him away!

Ohoh, or how about: Yeah! I'm so hungry I could eat an octorok!

*sigh* good stuff.

 

[GanNingoftheBell]

that and "HAAAAAY, ExUUUUSe me Princess"

are why link will never have a voice

 

[Omnigamer]

Originally posted by GanNingoftheBell
that and "HAAAAAY, ExUUUUSe me Princess"

are why link will never have a voice

*Shudders at the mention*

If they were to give Link a catch phrase, they could at least make it something fun and likeable... ugh... so bad...

 

[The rAt]

Mic, I'm going to have to disagree here, I remember hearing something around the time of WW about there being three Links. Also, I'd like to point out that OoT and MM are essentially one adventure. So are LoZ and AoL. And LttP and AL. Why because in MM, AoL and AL, Link is already an established character. In OoT, LttP, WW and LoZ (okay, so i know little about this one), Link is introduced in some fashion as well as his relationship to Zelda (in OoT, LttP, and WW, she is formally introduced, and treated in such a way that Link is obviously not familiar with her) and Ganon/Gannondorf. However in MM, LA, and AoL, he IS familiar with Zelda before the beginning of the game. If I remember correctly the backstory of AoL mentions LoZ. In the beginning of LA, Link mistakes Malin for Zelda. In MM we see the cutscene featuring previous interactions with Zelda. Therefore, we can assume that in the case of OoT/MM, LttP/LA, LoZ/AoL, that the first game in the pair introduces Link/Zelda/Ganon and tells how that Link saves Zelda from Ganon, and every second game explains what he does afterwards. Assuming no Link actually does anything of significance after his second game, you could call the combination of the two games that Link's 'adventure' and say that each 'adventure' brings a new hero. Or you could just say that he changed his mind later. Who knows.

Kinda convoluted, and to be honest, I don't really think what Shiggy says is going to match up in any case, because I remember him saying some contradictory stuff awhile back, but this is one explination for how it could work. That's all.

 

[Bedi Vegeta]

I wonder if Link's fairy/companion/whatever will talk again...

 

[Mic_128]

Originally posted by The rAt
BIG STUFF

Good point.

 

[RichBrown]

Originally posted by mic_128



2. The games have NEVER been meant to link, except for OoT, MM and WW.

your punning ability is just another reason why i want you to be my life partner. lets lose our virginity. together.

jedimaster: wand of gamelon? whats that? sounds interesting....

 

[pokemonmaster01]

Wand of Gamelon was an excessively crappy Zelda game not made by Nintendo. To the best of my knowledge, it was one of three made by Phillips for a Nintendo disc system. (CD-i or whatever.)

 

[Mic_128]

Jeuxpo.com has acquired a magazine scan, which states that the name of the game is The Legend Of Zelda: Twilight Princess.

 

[Cashed]

Hahaha. Nice name, Nintendo. People say Xbox 360 is bad, Twilight Princess though? Jesus.

 

[Aruun]

I doubt it's real. First off, because "Twilight Princess" is totally ridiculous, and second off, look at the list of games coming out for 2006. Metroid Dread? What about FE:tSS and Donkey Konga 2? FE is coming out later this month... so I don't think that scan was real.

I sure as hell hope it wasn't anyway.

 

[Mic_128]

The names probably the Japanese name. It'll most likely change.

 

[Cashed]

Could be a magazine from outside the US, probably something from the UK. That might explain the 2006 thing. That title might be the misprint though, all those titles look like they could be Nintendo's E3 line-up this year. Pokémon XD is a real game, Donkey Konga 2 and Fire Emblem will probably be shown at E3 because at past E3s games that just came out right before E3 and games that come out right after E3 have been shown.

 

[Cashed]

Logo revealed! Double post!

 

[Revolutions]

SHUT UP

IT'S NOT TRUE

 

[The Windwaker]

Originally posted by Cashed
Hahaha. Nice name, Nintendo. People say Xbox 360 is bad, Twilight Princess though? Jesus.

I don't think "Jesus" can fully express how terrible that title is.

 

[Aruun]

Originally posted by Revolutions
SHUT UP

IT'S NOT TRUE

 

[Cashed]

Hahaha. I love you JMY and Rev.

 

[Lightsaberboy]

so it's actually confirmed that "twilight princess" will be the title?
and isnt zelda supposed to come out in winter anyways? why would it be under 2006?

meh, it's not that bad.