The last word from XYRO77.

[Xyro77]

This is the last thing ill say concerning the ICG and this whole event.



1. Ive banned it(or reduced it). Face it.GG the end.

2. Hylian has said and shown ways to still do AMAZING amounts of damage without ICG. Now what does this show? CREATIVITY! And that my friends will expand the ICs.

3. 07-08 members...........I AM SORRY for degrading and making fun of your ******** posts. I also want to apologize in every way possible to Hylian. i didnt want this to go as far as it did. i thought it was gonna be a simple thing and then we move on but it turned into a IC board vs xyro event. Im sorry and i hope we can still be pretty good pals.

4. I have no doubt next time me and hylian play(june 7th) he will try out some of the new things he has learned. and trust me......you guys will have vids so you can make fun. Fair?

5. I will admit i didnt argue as well as some of you. i just didnt feel the need to DEEPLY argue something that is easy as 1+1, you know? And as a result of that, lots of things were taken the wrong way, said things out of anger.....ect. So again, for me not explaining EVERY little detail, i apologize. that cause alot fo trouble.

6. Im the best samus in texas.

 

[Hylian]

I am the best samus in texas.


Enough said.


<3.


XD.


$50 Samus ditto MM 3/5 gogogo.

 

[Xyro77]

If you mained samus and placed in tournie going ALL samus. i would accept.

 

[DMG]

TGM: My Wario vs your Samus or Marth
$100 MM 3/5
No Final Destination (haha I already scratched it off for ya)
I'll try to be there at HOBO 5 (or whatever number it is for the June 7th tournament)

 

[KRDsonic]

Both Hylian's and Xyro's samuses looked good to me. I fought Xyro's, and only saw Hylian's in a video.

Well, at least I can always say that I'm the best Ice Climber user in Houston :D Because I'm basically the only one xD.

 

[Elliot Gale]

lol get froed

 

[Alou]

3. 07-08 members...........I AM SORRY for degrading and making fun of your ******** posts. I also want to apologize in every way possible to Hylian. i didnt want this to go as far as it did. i thought it was gonna be a simple thing and then we move on but it turned into a IC board vs xyro event. Im sorry and i hope we can still be pretty good pals.

When you apologize it's kind of a good idea to not insult us?

Personally I forgive you for now, but you still gotta prove yourself again to get me to go to your tournaments.

 

[megamanexev3]

Man, you are just so zetta slow.

 

[Straylit]

3. 07-08 members...........I AM SORRY for degrading and making fun of your ******** posts. I also want to apologize in every way possible to Hylian. i didnt want this to go as far as it did. i thought it was gonna be a simple thing and then we move on but it turned into a IC board vs xyro event. Im sorry and i hope we can still be pretty good pals.

No, you're just a douche and your in no way sorry. Many of the 07-08 Members, including myself, have been playing smash religiously since 64. Just because we had no interest in joining smashboards shows 'nothing' regarding our skill level nor our ability to hold a valid argument against your dumb rule. Dont flatter yourself nor think your a revolutionary individual for enforcing such a pathetic rule. We all know if you had beaten Hylian this whole thing never would have happened. Your just a sore loser whos word unfortunately has weight to it due to being a tournament host.

 

[Ark22]

Xyro77 I'm not going to debate you about the ICG, but I do have a quick question about one of your tournament rules. I don't want to start a big debate over it, so do you mind if I message you about it?

 

[AlphaZealot]

Ice Climber CG should not be banned, your stagnating the development of the metagame by doing that, not to mention dropping a character several tiers for no reason, Ice Climbers have won how many tournaments? Why don't we ban dash canceling with Snake, because Snake has actually WON tournaments.

 

[nealdt]

Poor Texas players are going to travel OOS and lose to Ice Climbers in other states with more reasonable tournament hosts.

 

[Taylor]

Well, I was pretty much against the "ban" until now. The metagame might actually evolve faster for IC users because they'd develop new techniques within the limitations they're given. Once they leave Texas, the gloves are off. If the current metagame evolves to the point where alt throws can be escaped from, oh, look! Texas players are ok with it!

As for the rest of the smashers in Texas, the metagame won't change at all, because getting grabbed is really what sets things off. The general vs. IC strategy is, and will still be, "don't get grabbed."

End result of the CG limit? Ice Climbers in Texas get better than in other places. All other characters stay exactly the same.

 

[Nintendude]

Who cares about cg substitutes when cgs are more efficient versions of the same thing? It's not expanding the IC metagame, it is just making it overly complicated.

 

[Binx]

Xyro is just making a bad decision, but it is his decision to make, so oh well.

 

[Finch]

Yeah Ice Climbers players in other states are just trying to get grabs. Who cares about desyncs or spacing with blizzard or anything that actually make icys good and able to get grabs when we can just do grab combos all day? Texas IC players will be so much better than everyone else.

 

[Binx]

Uhh... except that ICs in other states will know when they can land grabs better, and if they are good they wont ONLY be trying to get grabs because that would be suicide. This stunts the Texas metagame unless other states ban it in which case Texas ICs had more time to practice non infinite tactics and they will be ahead, with the level of scrub brawl has I'm sure that is whats gonna happen anyways.

 

[Hylian]

It won't really matter for me. I can still 0 - death from a grab lol.

 

[Sonic XD]

Xyro sucks

 

[pure_awesome]

No, you're just a douche and your in no way sorry. Many of the 07-08 Members, including myself, have been playing smash religiously since 64. Just because we had no interest in joining smashboards shows 'nothing' regarding our skill level nor our ability to hold a valid argument against your dumb rule.

You know what though? He's right. Look around the boards. The average 07-08 member is an idiot, or a kid. If they're kids, then fine, it's not like you can blame them for their age, it's just a case that they don't know any better. But you know what, it gets a little tiring around the Falco boards when people say "Noo u nub, falco cant CG wolf, my frend plays him and gets out easy" That's an exaggeration, but hell, there's been worse than that, everywhere.

On average, we (07-08 members) are ignorant, and arguments like "don't get grabbed" are evidence of that. People are going to get grabbed. And when they do, they may as well put their controller down, because there's nothing they can do.

I understand that banning this looks like it's going to hinder the metagame of the ICs. But you know what, it's not even banned, it's just limited. Like Hylian said, there's still badass things you can do with ICs grab. Popo Downthrow > Nana Fair > Popo Fthrow > Nana Bthrow to Popo Fully charged UpSmash is still pretty **** badass (And I don't even play ICs, so what the hell do I know?). Even with it limited, I sure as hell wouldn't change how I played the ICs. IC grabs are scary things. And when (if) it does get limited everywhere, Houston players will have a slight advantage for a while.

Fact of the matter is, we could just as easily say that banning wallshining in Melee was hindering the metagame. But that sounds ******** now, because we can look back and see that it was the right thing to do. Xyro thinks that this will end up the same way, and frankly, I agree with him.

Why don't we ban dash canceling with Snake, because Snake has actually WON tournaments.

...because if I get hit with a Dash Cancel, I haven't automatically lost a stock? I get your point that it's not a character-breaking thing, but come on, they aren't the same concept at all.

 

[KRDsonic]

I can still do a 0% death with the grabs being reduced to 3, Hylian saw me do it against his Toon Link on wifi and wifi is harder to chain grab on so...

I personally don't think Texas Ice Climber players will get worse because of their infinites banned, but rather, non Ice Climber players will not know how to fight Ice Climbers correctly because of it. I can still chain grab all I want when I'm not in that tournament, however, other people will have more trouble finding someone who can chain grab them to learn to avoid it.

 

[Ark22]

On average, we (07-08 members) are ignorant, and arguments like "don't get grabbed" are evidence of that. People are going to get grabbed. And when they do, they may as well put their controller down, because there's nothing they can do.

It is not a valid argument to dismiss people just because they are newer members. You dismiss people if they don't know what they are talking about; not because they are new.

Pro players such as Overswarm also make the argument, don't get grabbed. The thing is, thats a legitimate argument for characters like Marth and MK. A good marth or MK can separate the Ice Climbers using aerials with no lag, then pressure them to get the kill. Just keep the ICs separated and you can avoid 0-death combos.

I understand that banning this looks like it's going to hinder the metagame of the ICs. But you know what, it's not even banned, it's just limited. Like Hylian said, there's still badass things you can do with ICs grab. Popo Downthrow > Nana Fair > Popo Fthrow > Nana Bthrow to Popo Fully charged UpSmash is still pretty **** badass (And I don't even play ICs, so what the hell do I know?). Even with it limited, I sure as hell wouldn't change how I played the ICs. IC grabs are scary things.

It does hinder the meta game of the ICs. Yes, they have other fancy things that you can do to get 0-death combos. These take a lot more time and space though.

For instance, I can still 0-death with only 3 infinite grabs in a row, but it takes half of final destination, and ends with a spike. If this 3 throw limit was not in place, I could pull of nearly 15 throws in 10 seconds and get a vertical kill while standing in place.

People shouldn't have to use flashy moves if there are more effective moves that they can use. Flashy moves don't win tournaments. You don't get points for "looking cool" or doing "hard techniques". You only get credit for winning.

And when (if) it does get limited everywhere, Houston players will have a slight advantage for a while.

It won't get limited everywhere. The overwhelming backlash by TOs and respected smashers members against the ban is proof that this probably won't catch on. The SBR proved in melee that infinite grabs did not change tournament results. If that is the case, then there is no reason to ban it.

 

[Imp]

Unfortunately, its not as if SWF's opinion has played a major role in Brawl, regarding the EVO rule set anyways.

 

[Mentok the Mind Taker]

Just curious Hylian, of those 5 matches you played ICs (assuming you did do the alternating grabs) how many of them did you win? Did you enjoy more success as ICs than with the other characters?

 

[Hylian]

Just curious Hylian, of those 5 matches you played ICs (assuming you did do the alternating grabs) how many of them did you win? Did you enjoy more success as ICs than with the other characters?

I have never lost with Ice Climbers in tournament.

 

[Finch]

I was being sarcastic btw

 

[Ace83]

Xyro sucks

true dat