The hero of Dragon Quest III, Erdrick, joins the battle!

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Hey all. Have we ever gotten any concrete reactions from Japanese gamers wrt a Dragon Quest rep getting in?
From what I've seen, it's typically ecstatic confusion.
Apparently a lot of Japanese fans see the roster as catering more to the West than Japan (Ridley for example, Metroid is not popular at all in Japan). Even some claims in the original 5ch leak thread that Dragon Quest games don't release in the west (which is partially true - we typically at least get mainline games but spinoffs nowadays are a crapshoot).
However, that said, Dragon Quest is nothing short of a cultural phenomenon in Japan, so I imagine the more casual end of the Japanese crowd being very excited.
 

Teeb147

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It looks like a 3DS model being directly ported to Ultimate.

Though, I do like the design. It's a good visualization for how Erdrick might look like in Smash


****. This reminds me of those stories where people would show their grandparents Cuphead and they would immediately get nostalgic from its graphics.

Bomberman 64 is a great time and it's music is nice too. All of its level music is permanently fused into my head. Probably a given because I grew up with it.
I was just wondering, one of the things I really liked about Bomberman 64, besides the multiplayer which was really fun, were all the bomb puzzles there were in the adventure. A lot of them were just optional but it was so fun trying to figure out how to reach places or find secrets and all that. I haven't really found other games that were quite like that. Do you know what im talking about, and have you found other games that had those kinds of elements?
 

NomadLuminary

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From what I've seen, it's typically ecstatic confusion.
Apparently a lot of Japanese fans see the roster as catering more to the West than Japan (Ridley for example, Metroid is not popular at all in Japan). Even some claims in the original 5ch leak thread that Dragon Quest games don't release in the west (which is partially true - we typically at least get mainline games but spinoffs nowadays are a crapshoot).
However, that said, Dragon Quest is nothing short of a cultural phenomenon in Japan, so I imagine the more casual end of the Japanese crowd being very excited.
Its that cultural phenomenon that gets underestimated.
 
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I was just wondering, one of the things I really liked about Bomberman 64, besides the multiplayer which was really fun, were all the bomb puzzles there were in the adventure. A lot of them were just optional but it was so fun trying to figure out how to reach places or find secrets and all that. I haven't really found other games that were quite like that. Do you know what im talking about, and have you found other games that had those kinds of elements?
Oh yeah. I replayed Bomberman 64 last January and it was a blast.

Bomberman 64's adventure is surprisingly exploratory for how simple it is to get to the goals. Finding the goal itself can be a challenge on the first time through. Even then, there are the gold cards scattered throughout the levels that encourage you to explore every nook and cranny, which leads into awesome power-ups like the remote bombs and red bombs. They were incredibly fun and equally the largest source for my deaths because I kept blowing myself up.

Gold cards are fun because you do things you would never do otherwise. They're seemingly meaningless and you're only motivation is Sirius telling you, "Yo. Collect them all." Despite that, finding them is the real adventure because it leads you to discovering little details about the stages, and it gives the game personality as a result.

Like did you know you could blow up certain buildings in Blue Resort with a pumped up bomb (in which you kill everybody inside)? Did you know that White Glacier Stage 1 has a small room full of plants if you hug the walls of the wind section? Apparently, there are also warp panels in Green Gardens that you would never go to on a normal playthrough. They went all out.

I think the only parts I didn't like were bomb jumping because they were mostly trial-and-error and in some cases, that error could resort in dying. Once you learned it, though, you could get away with a lot of weird skips.

Rainbow Palace as not fun. The bosses and presentation for that stage were gorgeous, but it was so foreign to what you normally do to reach a goal, which is just finding the exits and overcoming the obstacles.

Anyway, other games I feel do this structure really well are those open-world collect-a-thon games like Breath of the Wild or Mario Odyssey. You have a goal, but the appeal of the game is exploring the worlds you're in. Half of Breath of the Wild can be skipped and you would still feel it did more than most other linear Zelda games because it gives you the option to explore rather than making you explore. Part of the fun is just getting to your destinations. You could just go in sword out and yelling like a viking, but stealth and weapon conservation is also encouraged. For example, the Sheikah Towers are heavily guarded sometimes. Wizards, elemental weapons, and terrain can be against you so sometimes it's just finding the path that gets you through the obstacles. It's incredibly fun.

Mario Odyssey does this well, too, because you don't even need over 3/4ths of the power moons to beat the game. But you collect them anyways because the worlds are colorful and endearing, the controls are tight and responsive, they give you a lot of platforming challenges and games to beat, and the worlds are so massive. You'd be doing yourself a disservice if you didn't explore them. It's like going to France just to see the Eiffel Tower; you're not just doing that. You're going to every restaurant, checking out every shop, talking to people, and learning more about the world and yourself.

I'd say the Banjo series but a lot of the collectables are mandatory. It's still fun and you'll explore everything anyways, and it was the pioneer to something like Mario Odyssey , but you'll see in retrospect not everything is optional. I'd say give the games a shot because exploring is fun (unless you get lost, then god help you). It might invoke some nostalgia if you played the games back in the day, too.

Now that I think about it, don't RPGs in theory follow this practice too? You got a goal, but there are side quests that you can do too. It depends on the side quest itself. For example, collecting 5 of a specific item sucks, but exploring an optional dungeon that fleshes out the world and gives you sweet loot? Now that's epic. Bravely Default, as an example, did this well when it didn't turn to ****. You not only got an optional dungeon, but you also got more story and a new class, which means more ways to fight.

Have you ever played Terraria? That game is great. It's basically 2D Minecraft but with more focus and content. You practically make the goals in that game and stop when you lose interest or curiosity.
 
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Teeb147

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Oh yeah. I replayed Bomberman 64 last January and it was a blast.

Bomberman 64's adventure is surprisingly exploratory for how simple it is to get to the goals. Finding the goal itself can be a challenge on the first time through. Even then, there are the gold cards scattered throughout the levels that encourage you to explore every nook and cranny, which leads into awesome power-ups like the remote bombs and red bombs. They were incredibly fun and equally the largest source for my deaths because I kept blowing myself up.

Gold cards are fun because you do things you would never do otherwise. They're seemingly meaningless and you're only motivation is Sirius telling you, "Yo. Collect them all." Despite that, finding them is the real adventure because it leads you to discovering little details about the stages, and it gives the game personality as a result.

Like did you know you could blow up certain buildings in Blue Resort with a pumped up bomb (in which you kill everybody inside)? Did you know that White Glacier Stage 1 has a small room full of plants if you hug the walls of the wind section? Apparently, there are also warp panels in Green Gardens that you would never go to on a normal playthrough. They went all out.

I think the only parts I didn't like were bomb jumping because they were mostly trial-and-error and in some cases, that error could resort in dying. Once you learned it, though, you could get away with a lot of weird skips.

Like Rainbow Palace. The bosses and presentation for that stage were gorgeous, but it was so foreign to what you normally do to reach a goal, which is just finding the exits and overcoming the obstacles.

Anyway, other games I feel do this structure really well are those open-world collect-a-thon games like Breath of the Wild or Mario Odyssey. You have a goal, but the appeal of the game is exploring the worlds you're in. Half of Breath of the Wild can be skipped and you would still feel it did more than most other linear Zelda games because it gives you the option to explore rather than making you explore. Part of the fun is just getting to your destinations. You could just go in sword out and yelling like a viking, but stealth and weapon conservation is also encouraged. For example, the Sheikah Towers are heavily guarded sometimes. Wizards, elemental weapons, and terrain can be against you so sometimes it's just finding the path that gets you through the obstacles. It's incredibly fun.

Mario Odyssey does this well, too, because you don't even need over 3/4ths of the power moons to beat the game. But you collect them anyways because the worlds are colorful and endearing, the controls are tight and responsive, they give you a lot of platforming challenges and games to beat, and the worlds are so massive. You'd be doing yourself a disservice if you didn't explore them. It's like going to France just to see the Eiffel Tower; you're not just doing that. You're going to every restaurant, checking out every shop, talking to people, and learning more about the world and yourself.

I'd say the Banjo series but a lot of the collectables are mandatory. It's still fun and you'll explore everything anyways, and it was the pioneer to something like Mario Odyssey , but you'll see in retrospect not everything is optional. I'd say give the games a shot because exploring is fun (unless you get lost, then god help you).

Now that I think about it, don't RPGs in theory follow this practice too? You got a goal, but there are side quests that you can do too. It depends on the side quest itself. For example, collecting 5 of a specific item sucks, but exploring an optional dungeon that fleshes out the world and gives you sweet loot? Now that's epic. Bravely Default, as an example, did this well when it didn't turn to ****. You not only got an optional dungeon, but you also got more story and a new class, which means more ways to fight.

Have you ever played Terraria? That game is great. It's basically 2D Minecraft but with more focus and content. You practically make the goals in that game and stop when you lose interest or curiosity.
Heh, thx for the long post. There's tons of secrets in bomberman 64. I'm sure I didnt know them all. When you know all the little things that work there's always things to try and explore. There's one place in one of the first levels that i never knew how to get to until a few years back. I knew bombs could be stopped by pressing z or r after being kicked, and with remote bombs i was able to pump up a big bomb lower down and then kick and stop bombs on it in order to build a bridge. I have no idea if there was another way to do it, i never looked at walkthroughs, but when I finally managed to get to the other side I felt pretty good. And a ton of secrets gave costumes, which was cool too.
Sure sometimes I'd bounce a bomb on my head and find myself in a mess of bombs, but that was kinda funny too.

Anyway, yeah odyssey and breah of the wild are ones I had in mind for a bit of that. I may play Terraria again in the future but i got my fill of it. It's a lot of exploration but not really puzzles or anything like that. I do feel a bit of the same interest in some rpgs, but besides some western ones i dont really know a lot that have as many things to explore and try. DQ9 had a lot of side-quests but most of them had to do with skills to use in battle. Not quite as interesting. I might want to try Bravely Default sometime tho.
 
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Heh, thx for the long post. There's tons of secrets in bomberman 64. I'm sure I didnt know them all. When you know all the little things that work there's always things to try and explore. There's one place in one of the first levels that i never knew how to get to until a few years back. I knew bombs could be stopped by pressing z or r after being kicked, and with remote bombs i was able to pump up a big bomb lower down and then kick and stop bombs on it in order to build a bridge. I have no idea if there was another way to do it, i never looked at walkthroughs, but when I finally managed to get to the other side I felt pretty good. And a ton of secrets gave costumes, which was cool too.
Sure sometimes I'd bounce a bomb on my head and find myself in a mess of bombs, but that was kinda funny too.

Anyway, yeah odyssey and breah of the wild are ones I had in mind for a bit of that. I may play Terraria again in the future but i got my fill of it. It's a lot of exploration but not really puzzles or anything like that. I do feel a bit of the same interest in some rpgs, but besides some western ones i dont really know a lot that have as many things to explore and try. DQ9 had a lot of side-quests but most of them had to do with skills to use in battle. Not quite as interesting. I might want to try Bravely Default sometime tho.
Oh yeah. The bomb structures you end up making at the end of some bomb jumping puzzles are hilarious. It looks like it shouldn't have worked but it does anyways, and we take those. Bomberman 64 really tested your engineering skills, for worse or for better. I felt pretty accomplished when I got through those sections. Nothing more satisfying than finally getting the bombs in the right place.


The solution to all of your life problems will always be "just get more bombs."

And I see what you mean. Some of those examples I listed aren't puzzle or strategy oriented. I just liked the sense of growth and options I gained from stuff like Bravely Default and Terraria as I explored more of it. RPGs in general don't hold me over that well to begin with, but Bravely Default was a decent exception. I'm trying to think of more examples like BotW or Mario Odyssey, but I'm coming up short. Maybe the Batman Arkham series game because the stealth sections are less plowing your fists into people and more BotW tier stealth. It's a good time. Riddler trophies are a nightmare to complete but are fun to collect when you can spare a sec. They also give more experience so that means more chances for upgrades. Other than that :shrug emoji:.
 
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Namasura

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Come to think of it, if you look at the three that have been the most discussed, you have an 80s rep (Erdrick), a 90s rep (Geno) and a 2000s rep (Sora).
If DQ had been popular in the west back in the Dragon Warrior days, it would have been more fun to observe the generational shift between each characters' fanbase, though as it stands a lot of DQ fans come from that push on the west between DQ8 and DQ9
 

NomadLuminary

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Come to think of it, if you look at the three that have been the most discussed, you have an 80s rep (Erdrick), a 90s rep (Geno) and a 2000s rep (Sora).
If DQ had been popular in the west back in the Dragon Warrior days, it would have been more fun to observe the generational shift between each characters' fanbase, though as it stands a lot of DQ fans come from that push on the west between DQ8 and DQ9
Now joined with the DQ11 group which is what I'm a part of.
 
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Not Smash related, but something still really cool: the Dragon Quest 30th anniversary museum
That whole vid makes me
1.sad I don't live in Japan
2.wish all dragon quest games are orchestrated from this point forward after hearing it for just a little bit I can't go back to midis
3.i wish this series got the love it deserves over here man
a lot of DQ fans come from that push on the west between DQ8 and DQ9
if I'm being honest I got in during the ds of 4 5 and 6 being pushed I didn't really enjoy 9 but when I played 5 I became a fan
 
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Teeb147

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Come to think of it, if you look at the three that have been the most discussed, you have an 80s rep (Erdrick), a 90s rep (Geno) and a 2000s rep (Sora).
If DQ had been popular in the west back in the Dragon Warrior days, it would have been more fun to observe the generational shift between each characters' fanbase, though as it stands a lot of DQ fans come from that push on the west between DQ8 and DQ9
Dragon Warrior was actually really popular. Well, the nintendo power push may have had something to do with it, but it was as big in the west as in japan. It went down after that tho.
Now joined with the DQ11 group which is what I'm a part of.
So you're a new blood. I played dragon quests here and there in the past, but it's with Dragon Quest 7 on ps1 that I really got into it. The class system was great and I hadn't played ff5 yet so it was really my first exposure to its majesty :)
There were lots of great rpgs on the ps1. Mario RPG and FF6 were probably the only rpgs to keep my attention before I got a lot more into them.
 
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Dragon Warrior was actually really popular. Well, the nintendo power push may have had something to do with it, but it was as big in the west as in japan. It went down after that tho.

So you're a new blood. I played dragon quests here and there in the past, but it's with Dragon Quest 7 on ps1 that I really got into it. The class system was great and I hadn't played ff5 yet so it was really my first exposure to its majesty :)
There were lots of great rpgs on the ps1. Mario RPG and FF6 were probably the only rpgs to keep my attention before I got a lot more into them.
Yeah the downward slope of popularity in the States during the Dragon Warrior era was unbelievable. Hell, whenever I bring up that DQ4 was localized on the NES they're actually surprised.
 

NomadLuminary

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Dragon Warrior was actually really popular. Well, the nintendo power push may have had something to do with it, but it was as big in the west as in japan. It went down after that tho.

So you're a new blood. I played dragon quests here and there in the past, but it's with Dragon Quest 7 on ps1 that I really got into it. The class system was great and I hadn't played ff5 yet so it was really my first exposure to its majesty :)
There were lots of great rpgs on the ps1. Mario RPG and FF6 were probably the only rpgs to keep my attention before I got a lot more into them.
New blood and proud of it though
 
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Yatanagi

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Yeah the downward slope of popularity in the States during the Dragon Warrior era was unbelievable. Hell, whenever I bring up that DQ4 was localized on the NES they're actually surprised.
They should have did a better marketing move and did a more soft transition, maybe: Dragon Warrior's Quest(for DQ4) and then Dragon Quest V.
 
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Naoyatodo

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Hi! I've been lurking on this thread for a while, now. I came in knowing almost nothing about Erdrick or Dragon Quest, and that's only partially changed, but I grew to appreciate the character. I've seen a couple of moveset concepts from fans, and there's not a lot of consistency.

I'm not about to drop my own moveset concept in here, given my inexperience with the series, but there is one move I've seen mentioned a few times that stood out to me: Kaclang. So, I whipped up a move concept, based solely on what his Down B could be.


https://i.imgur.com/TeEsOGTh.jpg

I'd imagine there could be all sorts of reads with this move. The most obvious punish is a grab, so the Erdrick player could spot dodge or jump to punish their opponent, but if the opponent didn't grab, they could punish the Erdrick player in turn.

I figured I could use some feedback from actual DQ fans.

Also, I noticed someone linked my art in this thread earlier, which was super fun to see.
 
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Idon

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Hi! I've been lurking on this thread for a while, now. I came in knowing almost nothing about Erdrick or Dragon Quest, and that's only partially changed, but I grew to appreciate the character. I've seen a couple of moveset concepts from fans, and there's not a lot of consistency.

I'm not about to drop my own moveset concept in here, given my inexperience with the series, but there is one move I've seen mentioned a few times that stood out to me: Kaclang. So, I whipped up a move concept, based solely on what his Down B could be.


https://i.imgur.com/TeEsOGTh.jpg

I'd imagine there could be all sorts of reads with this move. The most obvious punish is a grab, so the Erdrick player could spot dodge or jump to punish their opponent, but if the opponent didn't grab, they could punish the Erdrick player in turn.

I figured I could use some feedback from actual DQ fans.

Also, I noticed someone linked my art in this thread earlier, which was super fun to see.
Unfortunately, both the link and image you posted are broken.
 
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It's still insane that DQ5 didn't come out on the SNES. The series was popular on NES, and 5 is probably the best game in the series.

I blame the fact that it didn't come out here during the era when JRPGs exploded in popularity for why the franchise isn't huge here today.
 

Yatanagi

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Good work my man.

Yeah, this is super creative and quirky. I can totally see this working in a Smash Bros Setting.
I like it too, Kirby's Stone is one of my favorite not totally offensive specials. And Kaklank as better defensive and offensive, but slower, version of Stone in Erdrick moveset I would like a lot. Although still want High Tension somewhere in his character.

Thought about putting a Rock and Metal joke, but didn't think in a good one xD

It's still insane that DQ5 didn't come out on the SNES. The series was popular on NES, and 5 is probably the best game in the series.

I blame the fact that it didn't come out here during the era when JRPGs exploded in popularity for why the franchise isn't huge here today.
I think it was the Dragon Quest/Dragon Warrior issue on DQIV, the old fans must have lost the track and the generic box art didn't help to attract the right public(it look more like a hack 'n slash/action game cover). And it could have harmed the sales of it and make Enix just focus on Japan after that.
 
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Teeb147

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Well, the Snes came out in 1991 in the west, so Dragon Warrior 4 was a bit late to the game (1992).
Not by much tho. and I think all the titles after 1 probably deserved more attention. Oh well. DQ11 seems to be doing aight now :)
 

Yatanagi

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Well, the Snes came out in 1991 in the west, so Dragon Warrior 4 was a bit late to the game (1992).
Not by much tho. and I think all the titles after 1 probably deserved more attention. Oh well. DQ11 seems to be doing aight now :)
Yes, lots of games suffers with this. Specially in countries like mine, where the NES was a bit of a niche console, the FamiClones like Phantom System and Turbogame were much more prominent, but SNES was one of the most common to have. The competition with Master System/Genesis and Mega Drive was really fierce here, it got me nostalgic.
Thanks. I was trying to get it to work last night, and I thought an imgur link would solve it.
No problem ^^
I like to interact in this forum a lot, so anything I can do to help, I will try.
 

Namasura

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Out of curiosity, where would everyone rank their DQ games.
--Great
DQV: First, by far, feels like a full Hero's Journey and is such a memorable game.
DQIII: I just love how hard the first playthrough of this is, furthermore, there are so many good design decisions. Reaching Zoma always makes me actually imagine my party fighting, even after so many replays.
DQIV: The first half of the game is amazing, the latter half has some pacing issues, but the game still feels great and has a lot of personality. Couldn't think of a better game to open up the 90's
--Good
DQVIII: Feels far more streamlined but the visual design is fantastic, its a very charming game all around.
DQVII: Controversial game, but I do love what it went for and I love how its tone is unlike other DQ games, it was also the last of the DQ I played (not counting 11 which didn't exist at the time)
DQVI: The first time I wasn't too much into it, it definitely loses some of that steam from 4 and 5, but, after replaying, I grew to like it more.
DQ: The original is... a game for sure. I do like it, but I need some of the newer versions who are more comfortable to deal with. I like it more to analyze how it crosses the frontier between the typical NES game and the JRPG genre. This game is seen as antiquated, which it kinda is, but its also kinda.. cheeky? Meta?
--Okayish
DQII: Everyone knows the issues of this game. Its charming and I do like the trio, but the pacing and the design are very weird.
DQIX: My problem is how simplistic the story elements are, I am fine with not having party members that talk (see III) but IX just lacked the punch all around and felt more like a playground than an adventure. I feel like Fantasy Life was closer to what Level 5 had gone for here, and does that better.
--Not in the west
DQX: :(
--Waiting for the Switch Version
DQXI: I got the steam version but it didn't work on my PC XD
 
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Teeb147

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Out of curiosity, where would everyone rank their DQ games.
Do you mean in terms of their favorites?
I will have to (re)play some of them, and im probably biased towards class systems and non-mainline games, so my ranking is entirely personal.
Also, i wouldn't play the nes versions at this point, I much prefer the other ones.

DQMonsters series > DQHeroes2 > 9 > 6 > 7 > 3 > 4 > 5 >11 > 8 > 1 > 2 > 10 (cant play :/)

-might seem like a weird ranking but that's just how i feel about them at the time.
 

Teeb147

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i didn't put builders, but it might be my top one if im in the mood for it.

One of the reasons im not putting the main games higher is because i haven't been drawn to more story-based games for a while. If it'd been in my rpg craze I'd probably have a pretty different listing. I like all of them though, as much as ive played and seen. There's probably just dq2 that i wouldn't play. I had the thought about playing the gameboy version tho, i 'd probably enjoy that better.
 
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Diddy Kong

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Yo so, where do I find the Sun Staff in the first game? I already got the Rain Staff, but need the Sun Staff to get to the final castle of the Dragonlord. Help me out please.
 
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