The Heavenly Arsenal: Pit Moveset Discussion

LancerStaff · Jul 9, 2014

JesseMcCloud said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmQq8cxKc1E
At 0:52, the shields appear to block (or at least interact with) Marth's Up-Smash.
At 1:35, Pit scores a vertical KO off of Marth at 117% (Master Chief confirmed!)
At 1:50, he lands a hit on Marth at only 7% and sends him at least halfway up the screen.
Finally, at 2:29, he lands a fresh hit after just being KO'd on Link at 50%, and quite nearly takes the stock.

To sum up:
1. The move seems to have better-than-decent vertical knockback....
2. ...until knockback degradation rears its ugly head. WHY IS THIS STILL IN THE GAME SAKURAI?!

Can't say I trust the knockback we've seen with how awkward it is. I wouldn't expect to see Pit fling Marth so far at a low percent in the final game. At 52... Hm, did the GOs push Marth when he hit the shields? The shields might offer some protection, but not alot from the looks of it. But that push... If they really can push after the shields are out, this might lead to some interesting edgeguarding. But I'm still uncertain what the stinkin' things will actually do after my experience on SSB3D. (Damage instead of pushing, low knockback. Yes, on a real character.)

The rest is probably a direct result of the crazy knockback, for better or worse. And there's no way the Upperdash was that powerful when I was playing. I don't know... The fifty-two versions of the game might just be so we can't learn anything useful from the demo, sadly.

Venks · Jul 9, 2014

LancerStaff said:
Can't say I trust the knockback we've seen with how awkward it is. I wouldn't expect to see Pit fling Marth so far at a low percent in the final game. At 52... Hm, did the GOs push Marth when he hit the shields? The shields might offer some protection, but not alot from the looks of it. But that push... If they really can push after the shields are out, this might lead to some interesting edgeguarding. But I'm still uncertain what the stinkin' things will actually do after my experience on SSB3D. (Damage instead of pushing, low knockback. Yes, on a real character.)

The rest is probably a direct result of the crazy knockback, for better or worse. And there's no way the Upperdash was that powerful when I was playing. I don't know... The fifty-two versions of the game might just be so we can't learn anything useful from the demo, sadly.

Can you show some examples of 'awkward knockback'. I've yet to see any examples that can't be explained as either:
1) Stale Move Negation
2) Small percentage differences have higher knock back then they did in previous games.

Thus far everything I have seen and experienced has been consistent.

LancerStaff · Jul 9, 2014

Venks said:
Can you show some examples of 'awkward knockback'. I've yet to see any examples that can't be explained as either:
1) Stale Move Negation
2) Small percentage differences have higher knock back then they did in previous games.

Thus far everything I have seen and experienced has been consistent.

I call it awkward in the sense it feels horribly rushed and unfinished, not necessarily random. This does not look like something the final game will have.

Venks · Jul 9, 2014

LancerStaff said:
I call it awkward in the sense it feels horribly rushed and unfinished, not necessarily random. This does not look like something the final game will have.

I can agree with that. I think the knock back scaling hasn't been finalized yet. I'm sure they are still balancing it out for each character and every attack. But it's definitely not as random as people are saying it is. Same characters with same percentages look to be consistently dealing the same knock back.

We've seen the knock back change before. Mega Man's knock back was very powerful during the Mario vs Mega Man showcase. It has been significantly reduced since that point of time.

FiXalaS · Jul 12, 2014

in videos, Seems to me that, Pit's Back-air has almost no lag, Maybe I need my eyes checked, Hope it is true because I love his bair and I use it alot.

LancerStaff · Jul 12, 2014

FiXalaS said:
in videos, Seems to me that, Pit's Back-air has almost no lag, Maybe I need my eyes checked, Hope it is true because I love his bair and I use it alot.

I don't remember it having much less lag, but I didn't pay much attention to it either.

Tsutori · Jul 15, 2014

JesseMcCloud said:
At 0:52, the shields appear to block (or at least interact with) Marth's Up-Smash.
At 1:35, Pit scores a vertical KO off of Marth at 117% (Master Chief confirmed!)
At 1:50, he lands a hit on Marth at only 7% and sends him at least halfway up the screen.
Finally, at 2:29, he lands a fresh hit after just being KO'd on Link at 50%, and quite nearly takes the stock.

To sum up:
1. The move seems to have better-than-decent vertical knockback....
2. ...until knockback degradation rears its ugly head. WHY IS THIS STILL IN THE GAME SAKURAI?!

A little late to this party, but something else I noticed in that video. When Mother Brain comes out, Pit hits one of the rings that flies around with his Side B and destroys it. We've already seen his side B deflect some more powerful projectiles. Maybe it can break through others (weaker ones)? If the rings count as projectiles...

_Darkpit_ · Jul 15, 2014

Do you think it works also against Samus' charge beam ?

I think projectiles like Falcos / Fox will not be countered by Pit like Pikachus B neutral.

relaxedexcorcist · Jul 15, 2014

Those rings can be destroyed and shot down in the Metroid games. Pit destroying them probably has nothing to do with his Upperdash arm.

_Darkpit_ · Jul 15, 2014

Maybe Pit can destroy all the projectiles which cancel each other. For example Pits arrow and Samus missle. ^^

LancerStaff · Jul 20, 2014

Tsutori said:
A little late to this party, but something else I noticed in that video. When Mother Brain comes out, Pit hits one of the rings that flies around with his Side B and destroys it. We've already seen his side B deflect some more powerful projectiles. Maybe it can break through others (weaker ones)? If the rings count as projectiles...

It's probably a property of the projectile, because the Rinkas are actually considered to be enemies in Metroid.

LancerStaff · Jul 22, 2014

According to this article, many of Pit's attacks have a tipper like Marth's. It even says his blades flash with a successful one!
http://nintendoenthusiast.com/article/competitive-smash-bros-wii-u-3ds/

And, well, I need to go through the data again for the %s and such. I had a bit typed up but then the page was erased because of a freeze. Yeah... That's kinda why I've been holding off for so long. But with this new info and the Comic con tournament coming up, I'll hold off a bit longer.

Tsutori · Jul 22, 2014

LancerStaff said:
According to this article, many of Pit's attacks have a tipper like Marth's. It even says his blades flash with a successful one!
http://nintendoenthusiast.com/article/competitive-smash-bros-wii-u-3ds/

And, well, I need to go through the data again for the %s and such. I had a bit typed up but then the page was erased because of a freeze. Yeah... That's kinda why I've been holding off for so long. But with this new info and the Comic con tournament coming up, I'll hold off a bit longer.

Aw yeaaahhh. I love the tipper on his back air in Brawl and Project M, so it looks like I'm going to have fun! It's also nice to hear that the rapid jabs have been buffed since I really like building up damage using Pit's jabs.

FiXalaS · Jul 22, 2014

Some great stuff, Happy for this Pit.

Admiral Pit · Jul 23, 2014

An improved Pit is just what I needed. And yes, F-tilt has a sweetspot at the longer ranged point of the move, indicated by a vid showing Pit's moves.

8-peacock-8 · Jul 25, 2014

FiXalaS · Jul 25, 2014

What was his Damage Percentage?

Tsutori · Jul 25, 2014

FiXalaS said:
What was his Damage Percentage?

He wasn't emitting smoke, which I believe means under 100%?

_Darkpit_ · Jul 26, 2014

I took two pictures. As you can see there is smoke. But maybe it appears earlier than in Brawl. ^^ ( For example witz 30 % / 20 % damage ) But I don't believe that. I think Pit has much damage.

relaxedexcorcist · Jul 26, 2014

He was at 42% when he got hit

http://www.twitch.tv/nintendo/b/551127009

3:46:12

FiXalaS · Jul 26, 2014

we know Pit had great recovery, this just shows.. that Zelda's mighty sweet-spotted Dair is now weakened.

Tsutori · Jul 26, 2014

_Darkpit_ said:
I took two pictures. As you can see there is smoke. But maybe it appears earlier than in Brawl. ^^ ( For example witz 30 % / 20 % damage ) But I don't believe that. I think Pit has much damage.

I think that's just a trail from getting hit by the spike.

Admiral Pit · Jul 28, 2014

I hope this also means Pit can recover from spikes better. Back then, it seemed like he was the only one that couldn't shake it off and took full hitstun in Brawl, but now it looks like he can finally resist it better, as well as possessing a Spike (that isn't that super close D-tilt) as well. Things are looking good for our little angel so far.

FiXalaS · Jul 29, 2014

Admiral Pit said:
I hope this also means Pit can recover from spikes better. Back then, it seemed like he was the only one that couldn't shake it off and took full hitstun in Brawl, but now it looks like he can finally resist it better, as well as possessing a Spike (that isn't that super close D-tilt) as well. Things are looking good for our little angel so far.

from 0 to 30%, When Zelda gave me that spike, I always had the chance to return to stage, except when Zelda comes back and then attack me again because I can't use his recovery twice

Maybe Pit now is heavier (doesn't seem to be) but I believe that's a nerf for Zelda's spike and not a buff for Pit.

Admiral Pit · Jul 29, 2014

I really hope he'll be able to use Up-B again in the final product. I'll forgive no gliding a bit if it happens, but I still think he can resist spikes a bit more as opposed to Brawl only because he doesn't suffer the full hitstun anymore, or at least that's what my theory is.

FiXalaS · Jul 29, 2014

He definitely can, Which is why I much prefer his new Up-B than the old one (I even prefer his Project M up-B, I have sad memories with Wings of Icarus)

JesseMcCloud · Jul 30, 2014

So after watching Pit's gameplay, I'm fairly confident he'll be at least A-Tier. A for Angel!
But seriously, he's one of my top three picks for main.

_Darkpit_ · Jul 31, 2014

JesseMcCloud said:
So after watching Pit's gameplay, I'm fairly confident he'll be at least A-Tier. A for Angel!
But seriously, he's one of my top three picks for main.

I hope you are right. ^^

FiXalaS · Jul 31, 2014

he does have all things, lagless bair, also almost lagless fair, very good range, projectile, very good recovery and alot of jumps, killing moves, super armor move, good damage deal and Tip on most of his moves and not just bair.

Also, lots of multihit moves for a game with hard SDI (so far)

LancerStaff · Jul 31, 2014

FiXalaS said:
he does have all things, lagless bair, also almost lagless fair, very good range, projectile, very good recovery and alot of jumps, killing moves, super armor move, good damage deal and Tip on most of his moves and not just bair.

Also, lots of multihit moves for a game with hard SDI (so far)

His Bair and Fair have about as much lag as before from what I recall.

FiXalaS · Jul 31, 2014

LancerStaff said:
His Bair and Fair have about as much lag as before from what I recall.

Shorthopping with Bair sucked in Brawl

LancerStaff · Aug 1, 2014

FiXalaS said:
Shorthopping with Bair sucked in Brawl

And it's basically the same now. His Bair definitely isn't any faster.

_Darkpit_ · Aug 1, 2014

YES! Pit can fly again even he gets damage! Power of flight is much better than Wings of Icarus! ^^

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=IVIEb9HC-fw#t=3080

LancerStaff · Aug 1, 2014

_Darkpit_ said:
YES! Pit can fly again even he gets damage! Power of flight is much better than Wings of Icarus! ^^

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=IVIEb9HC-fw#t=3080

Can you give a time for us with outdated browsers?

_Darkpit_ · Aug 2, 2014

Sure

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVIEb9HC-fw&feature=player_detailpage

51:20 - 51:30 min

Neo Zero · Aug 2, 2014

I guess Palutena upgrade Pit's wings since she's to busy to supervise his recovery herself this time.

Good luck killing us now > : D

Zwzchow · Aug 2, 2014

Neo Zero said:
I guess Palutena upgrade Pit's wings since she's to busy to supervise his recovery herself this time.

Good luck killing us now > : D

Probably Viridi doing all the work XD

Thank god we can Up B after getting damaged. I remember being gimped so bad with WoI

Admiral Pit · Aug 2, 2014

With that new Pit data, I'm looking forward to more Pit. I just hope one of his Up-B custom specials will actually do damage.

FiXalaS · Aug 2, 2014

LancerStaff said:
And it's basically the same now. His Bair definitely isn't any faster.

have you seen this?

http://youtu.be/dhXICr1VIEw?t=4m21s

and many other videos, it isn't the same.

edit: and with little search, it's a common known thing about Brawl Pit that his Bair is not easy to shorthop with

http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/Pit_(SSBB)

Smash 4 Pit is amazing

LancerStaff · Aug 2, 2014

FiXalaS said:
have you seen this?

http://youtu.be/dhXICr1VIEw?t=4m21s

and many other videos, it isn't the same.

edit: and with little search, it's a common known thing about Brawl Pit that his Bair is not easy to shorthop with

http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/Pit_(SSBB)

Smash 4 Pit is amazing

Didn't work in my demo...

Still, very interesting. I wonder how much of this will carry over to the final game.

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