The future of Custom Move sets looks grim...

[FieryRebirth]

In Sm4sh/3DS/Wii U this brought variation and strategy to your mains, your secondaries. So far, we have seen little evidence that this system is going to make a return. From a development perspective, I don't blame Sakurai from killing this system off due to the straining balancing of the very fighter times 3. Palutena's new specials hints that this system may be going away.

While I do believe the custom move sets could be handed a bit better(Make some NOT too situational and otherwise useless for example), would anyone agree that it is a system that deserves a return? Why do you think so? Would you think it is appropriately balanced across most modes, including online?

Personally, I would love to have it back. My main(Robin)had stupid amounts of loadouts saved in Smash Wii U tailored for specific match-ups. A guilty pleasure of imbalance: In online tournaments, I would cheese unsuspecting FFA players that let me charge Thunder+ to Thoron+ for an easy win.

If this feature were to return, how do you think it would be re-balanced?

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Custom specials feel like they need a second chance. The way they were unlocked in Smash 3DS / Wii U was likely the biggest reason why they never really existed in competitive play.

Of course, some of the custom specials would need to be fixed up, since their mechanics were too impractical to even touch.

 

[rlwrgh]

I want to keep them and expand to rest of roster but probably not for same reason as most. I'm decidedly casual but I like them for simulating other characters. In my head for instance fast fireball on Mario reminded me of the gameboy version. I also liked the windbox versions on dk with the white skin and called him Eddie the yeti. There were others like a sudo wolf but you get the point all for my headcanon.

 

[Frizz]

Customs were fun, even if they weren't completely different moves like some people wanted. They were minor alterations of the original move that changed the characters' playstyle. Customs like Robin's Speed Thunder made him more aggressive, whereas Fire Wall made him more defensive. I'd definitely like to see the return of them. Maybe this time around people would be more open towards custom moves, since they definitely add variety to matchups.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Yeah, I am pro customs. I've talked about it a lot already, so just search for 'custom' in posts by me or something if you want.

 

[Luigifan18]

Yeah, I am pro customs. I've talked about it a lot already, so just search for 'custom' in posts by me or something if you want.

...How would one go about doing that?

(BTW, I'm pro-customs, too.)

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Actually here's just the search results:

https://smashboards.com/search/129065/?q=custom&c[users]=جین&o=relevance

 

[Crystanium]

I think it'd be better off for optimal customs to be included in the current moveset of each character. An example is Samus' Turbo Missile, which was the only good custom for her. When the Super Missile is fired, it has a delayed start-up before accelerating. This property was given to Super Missile in SSBU. Now only if the effect would be applied to Homing Missile.

 

[KatKit]

This is an insanely large roster, so I can understand if customs aren't included in this iteration to save development time for characters/other features. With that being said, IF customs don't make a return, I'll definitely miss them; they were one of my favorite things about Smash 4. I unlocked all of them, even if none of my friends care about using them. Learning which customs did what was as exciting as character reveals.

If they aren't in Smash Ultimate, hopefully they bring them back in a different title in the future. Ideally, they'd make unlocking them more fun, or at least less random.

 

[Arthur97]

If they are back and easier to unlock, then I'd be fine with them back. However, I'd like for them to be more...special. Samus' charge shots being stuff like Ice and Plasma beams. Take from the actual lore when you can.

 

[Deleted member]

I liked the idea of Custom Movesets in Smash4 but to me they just didn't serve any purpose for me.

's were honestly pretty bad and never would've been good for competitive play.

's were horrible. Zelda already is complete garbage in Smash4... but with any of the custom moves, just made her worse.

These are just a few examples...

Keep in mind, this my opinion because these were the characters I played most in Smash 4. So please dont get offended by my opinion.

In conclusion, I like the custom moves, they are a nice feature, but, I wouldn't cry if the weren't in Ultimate.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Custom moves are already confirmed in Ultimate...for Miis. We haven't seen any examples of custom moves for the other characters, leading us to wonder if Miis will have several default loadouts to choose from or even have exclusive access to customization. If you look at all of Brawler's footage and screenshots on the website you'll see two different Up Bs: Soaring Axe Kick, and a new up special seemingly meant to combine Piston Punch and Helicopter Kick into one. As well as two Down Bs: Head On Assault, and Feint Jump. There's also a new move that appears to be some sort of Countergrab. So, with five special moves total, that rules out the possibility that they've done the Palutena thing of setting each move into a particular input. The only explanation left is custom moves. However, Palutena's presentation boasting that she now has "a set move for each special" gives us reason to fear that custom moves will not be appearing for just any character.

Anyway, I love custom moves and think they've earned another shot even if the Ultimate competitive scene never takes a look at them. They're just a cool content addition. The poor economy in the previous game doesn't rule out the possibility that unlocking them may feel fun and rewarding in the next game. And if there is a dedicated single player adventure mode experience in Ultimate rather than 4's "Here's a bunch of ways to play Versus Mode" then they would make more sense now. Altogether I think the biggest reason I'd follow through on Customs is that seventy percent of the work is already finished. 51 characters already have loadouts, plus any of Ultimate's new echo fighters that want to bum movesets from the originals as Lucina and Dark Pit did before.

Yeah custom moves would need major rebalancing, but nothing stopped them from doing just that in a Smash 4 patch dedicated almost entirely to buffing and nerfing custom moves. With the resources available during full game development, they could follow through on far more tweaks including new moves entirely.

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

custom movesets create tones of imbalance. what id like to see is alternate movesets that are meaningful, curated by sakurai and team. the custom moves werent really very interesting for the most part

Custom moves are already confirmed in Ultimate...for Miis. We haven't seen any examples of custom moves for the other characters, leading us to wonder if Miis will have several default loadouts to choose from or even have exclusive access to customization. If you look at all of Brawler's footage and screenshots on the website you'll see two different Up Bs: Soaring Axe Kick, and a new up special seemingly meant to combine Piston Punch and Helicopter Kick into one. As well as two Down Bs: Head On Assault, and Feint Jump. There's also a new move that appears to be some sort of Countergrab. So, with five special moves total, that rules out the possibility that they've done the Palutena thing of setting each move into a particular input. The only explanation left is custom moves. However, Palutena's presentation boasting that she now has "a set move for each special" gives us reason to fear that custom moves will not be appearing for just any character.

Anyway, I love custom moves and think they've earned another shot even if the Ultimate competitive scene never takes a look at them. They're just a cool content addition. The poor economy in the previous game doesn't rule out the possibility that unlocking them may feel fun and rewarding in the next game. And if there is a dedicated single player adventure mode experience in Ultimate rather than 4's "Here's a bunch of ways to play Versus Mode" then they would make more sense now. Altogether I think the biggest reason I'd follow through on Customs is that seventy percent of the work is already finished. 51 characters already have loadouts, plus any of Ultimate's new echo fighters that want to bum movesets from the originals as Lucina and Dark Pit did before.

Yeah custom moves would need major rebalancing, but nothing stopped them from doing just that in a Smash 4 patch dedicated almost entirely to buffing and nerfing custom moves. With the resources available during full game development, they could follow through on far more tweaks including new moves entirely.

actually thats an interesting point to make.. and would kinda support what id like to see since miis dont have completely customizble moves any more. you have a choice from moveset a b or c right? so maybe characters will have 1-2 alts? that would be great

that said id like to see characters with changes to their movesets have alts that resemble their original movesets, and id like to see ganon and young link have their own movesets - ganon having a mage moveset with orbs, and young link having a masks moveset.

 

[Arthur97]

I don't think customs really need to be balanced competitively. They are mostly for fun. Now, useful but not broken sure, but balancing all of that would probably take too many resources.

 

[rlwrgh]

I think it'd be better off for optimal customs to be included in the current moveset of each character. An example is Samus' Turbo Missile, which was the only good custom for her. When the Super Missile is fired, it has a delayed start-up before accelerating. This property was given to Super Missile in SSBU. Now only if the effect would be applied to Homing Missile.

Some are matchup dependant and or subjective as to which is best I personally prefer options.

 

[Arthur97]

Actually, going on what I said earlier, I want customs to be like Mega Man's. He probably had my favorite as each one was an actual ability or character from his series not to mention decently different functionalities. Give us more stuff like that. And, yes, I realize that sometimes liberties need to be taken.

 

[rlwrgh]

Actually, going on what I said earlier, I want customs to be like Mega Man's. He probably had my favorite as each one was an actual ability or character from his series not to mention decently different functionalities. Give us more stuff like that. And, yes, I realize that sometimes liberties need to be taken.

Yes having Canon representation would be ideal in my opinion too so maybe for instance with Mario switch fast fireball to a ball from the gameboy version and have big fireball replaced with hammer?

 

[Arthur97]

Yes having Canon representation would be ideal in my opinion too so maybe for instance with Mario switch fast fireball to a ball from the gameboy version and have big fireball replaced with hammer?

Luigi's iceballs were a good direction. Giving him lightning would have been cool too. But, yeah, give them stuff they have in their games even when you can.

 

[Sabertooth]

The potential loss of Mega Man's alternate specials is the greatest cut in content Smash has ever undergone.

 

[hustler713]

I still think that we finally should put the dream of Custom Moves used in Competetive play to Rest.

Of course it sounds appealing to customize your favorite character to fit your Playstyle even more, or to have a Back Up Moveset for certain Matchups your struggling with.

But the Problem about the whole thing is that the game has gotten so big at this point that it is already hard to learn Matchups with our current Roster using just Standart Moves. We have 74 Characters right now. Obviously there are some Newcomers which remain to be shown. Counting in DLC we COULD even end up with a Roster of possibly 85 to 90 Characters including echoes.

How the f*** are you supposed to prepare yourself for a Tournament if you have to also take a variety of Custom Moves in various Combinations into account as well?

I don't think that custom Moves have a place in competetive Smash. And i also think the Ressources to develop those are better used for Characters, Stages or Modes.

 

[Buzzwole]

I know people like custom moves, but I never liked the idea of them and I'm honestly glad they seem to be absent here.

I feel like with a roster this big, you should always know what moves your opponent has. You already have like 70 movesets to memorize. You should always know what your opponent is capable of in fighting games.
This is the main reason I didn't like all of the stat/move variations that Miis had in Smash 4.

I'm not even talking strictly from a competitive perspective. The roster is ALREADY so big that I don't see why there's any need to complicate it more.

I'd much rather them spend development time on something else.

 

[Arthur97]

I still think that we finally should put the dream of Custom Moves used in Competetive play to Rest.

Of course it sounds appealing to customize your favorite character to fit your Playstyle even more, or to have a Back Up Moveset for certain Matchups your struggling with.

But the Problem about the whole thing is that the game has gotten so big at this point that it is already hard to learn Matchups with our current Roster using just Standart Moves. We have 74 Characters right now. Obviously there are some Newcomers which remain to be shown. Counting in DLC we COULD even end up with a Roster of possibly 85 to 90 Characters including echoes.

How the f*** are you supposed to prepare yourself for a Tournament if you have to also take a variety of Custom Moves in various Combinations into account as well?

I don't think that custom Moves have a place in competetive Smash. And i also think the Ressources to develop those are better used for Characters, Stages or Modes.

Granted, I don't think they should have to be all that balanced, but just because they aren't competitive doesn't mean they are a waste. If done properly they could be fun. I wouldn't mind seeing some that are more canon even showing up in an adventure mode as a method of unlocking some of them. Find the Plasma Beam on Zebes, copy data for Mega Man, an Ice Flower for Luigi.

 

[rlwrgh]

Granted, I don't think they should have to be all that balanced, but just because they aren't competitive doesn't mean they are a waste. If done properly they could be fun. I wouldn't mind seeing some that are more canon even showing up in an adventure mode as a method of unlocking some of them. Find the Plasma Beam on Zebes, copy data for Mega Man, an Ice Flower for Luigi.

I like this idea have a story line reason why you have new options rpgish element.

 

[Arthur97]

I like this idea have a story line reason why you have new options rpgish element.

Of course, it wouldn't work with all of them (even with just one spare set), but I do think it would be a fun and cool way of doing it. The Links could have a hayday with this system though. In fact, a dungeon like area where some of his abilities are required would cool. Of course, on freeplay, those paths would need to be open by default.

 

[rlwrgh]

Of course, it wouldn't work with all of them (even with just one spare set), but I do think it would be a fun and cool way of doing it. The Links could have a hayday with this system though. In fact, a dungeon like area where some of his abilities are required would cool. Of course, on freeplay, those paths would need to be open by default.

I'm sure if enough thought was put into it a ton could be worked this way. I'm not sure I get what you mean by free play. I think it would be worth starting another thread to hash this idea out in detail though I'm almost certain it won't become a reality.

 

[Putuk]

Shame, there were a number of good ideas there, just with quite flawed execution.
Maybe if all characters had custom moves on Mega Mans level and they didn't have to be unlocked, people would like them more.

 

[Arthur97]

I'm sure if enough thought was put into it a ton could be worked this way. I'm not sure I get what you mean by free play. I think it would be worth starting another thread to hash this idea out in detail though I'm almost certain it won't become a reality.

Part of it would also making sure they fit into the levels. If you did too many, than it might get a little clustered. As for freeplay, I meant how in Subspace you could later go back with any character. If Link's items were required though, you couldn't beat the stage. Now, of course the paths could be limited to secrets. If it's more of an adventure mode (which I would prefer) then it would just about have to be.

Maybe I should make one.

 

[staindgrey]

In terms of competitive play, I honestly feel as though custom moves would never be accepted by the general competitive community unless they were implemented as pre-balanced alternate movesets, a la Mortal Kombat X. The possibility for some custom move being borderline broken-- plus the ridiculousness of practicing against the various custom move possibilities for around 70 different characters-- just makes their implementation somewhat unfeasible. And competitive communities in general aren't very open-minded. (Like how the gems thing killed Street Fighter X Tekken before it even hit shelves.)

 

[Mogisthelioma]

EVO is just going to ban them again

 

[Arthur97]

Who cares if EVO bans them? They shouldn't be competitive anyway. Do you want to make the team balance that many moves?

 

[rlwrgh]

I agree customs are not competition viable but casuals need love too.

 

[SmashBro99]

I liked having customs even if they never got much use, it was fun to play around with.

And yeah I dont think competitive ever even considered allowing customs, they will never embrace any change

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

EVO is just going to ban them again

Literally the only national to have put customs into the main event.

 

[MeleeMario64]

Honestly not very bothered at all over the apparent removal of custom moves. Was always against the idea before it even got announced, and the only time I dabbled with them was just to beat one of the challenges on 3DS. Not to mention they just felt really lazy at times, for example just adding wind to Donkey Kong's neutral special. Real unique. And, like everyone has already said, the system to get them was just garbage, and that's to say nothing of the gargantuan amount of characters this time around. With over 70 already + more coming down the pipeline, I just cannot see them going the extra length to give each and every character custom moves. (The DLC characters in 4 not having them was also pretty telling.)

While I can understand enjoying them and do feel sorry for those who liked them, for me I'm not really losing sleep over their apparent removal.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

customs are cool, but some of them are straight bull****; like Marth’s Counter that sent opponents backwards. He would literally kill you for trying to edge gaurd him, and let’s not bring of Villagers exploding balloons and Mii Brawler’s dope looking, but broken up b; the one that looks like Chun-Li’s Tenshou Kyaku.

Ideally it would be cool to play with them, but logistically it’s too much to try and figure out what constitutes regulation or not, then there’s counter pick playing, waiting for custom players to upload them—unlocking them? Nah, I’m cool bro. Just allocate your time making custom move sets and give us characters / echo fighters.

 

[rlwrgh]

If Nintendo wanted to be neutral greedy they could have an alternative method of unlocking a given characters customs be scanning that amiibo. I can't be the only one who might be on the fence about getting more amiibo as is but would be pushed into the take my money camp if they did that. Maybe they could also have a revamp the customs competition where fans submit ideas for customs and the winners get recognized or something I'm very into the croud sourcing idea.