The Frostbite 2017 Discussion Thread

[Hippieslayer]

Ally probs gon beat KEN, but Kirihara is the kind of matchup he's at a high risk of losing

 

[Ziodyne 21]

Salem is facing Shutton next, which I can see going either way honestly. Does anyone know if Salem has had any experience fighting Olimar?

 

[ShadowGuy1]

Ally probs gon beat KEN, but Kirihara is the kind of matchup he's at a high risk of losing

Wait, since when is any Mario against Sonic "probably gonna win

 

[Das Koopa]

so Deathorse has beaten SuperGirlKels, Myran, and Seagull Joe, in top 16

 

[TDK]

Kels has an issue with Mewtwo, but I have no clue about the other two. Deathorse is mad good though.

 

[Das Koopa]

Some is so good

 

[TDK]

Kirihara 3-1 Ned
Some 3-2 Captain Zack

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Zero calling Pierce7D for coaching?

Please tell me it's true.

 

[ARISTOS]

If Dabuz hadn't picked Olimar game 1...

 

[TDK]

I'm going to miss Dabuz's rosa. Him vs Zero sets are some of the best sets in smash 4 (unless Zero 3-0s him).

Good stuff to both players, I cannot believe Dabuz forced Zero to call Pierce7D.

Maybe if he hadn't bothered with Olimar...

 

[Hippieslayer]

Wait, since when is any Mario against Sonic "probably gonna win

and Ally won.

 

[TDK]

https://twitter.com/FS_DarkWizzy/status/835926962581422080

 

[Fenny]

well i called Salem winning but that was SUPER close

Y'know if Salem lost I would've been on suicide watch

 

[ShadowGuy1]

I'm going to miss Dabuz's rosa. Him vs Zero sets are some of the best sets in smash 4 (unless Zero 3-0s him).

Good stuff to both players, I cannot believe Dabuz forced Zero to call Pierce7D.

Maybe if he hadn't bothered with Olimar...

After that set I think it's unlikely he will throw away the Rosa entirely.

 

[Das Koopa]

really not a good tournament for DLC

Salem's the only Winners Bracket DLC left. Ned and Tweek are out, Zack's out, Deathorse and WaDi are in losers, and Aba's out. Komo's in losers too (fights Zinoto 17th).

 

[Ziodyne 21]

Ally has got something to prove now after his loss to a Kirby. He's on the warpath taking on on his characters worst MU and winning. Ally is like now way it's gonna end like this!

 

[TDK]

Bayonetta is the most underwhelming "broken" character ever

 

[Lord Dio]

really not a good tournament for DLC

Salem's the only Winners Bracket DLC left. Ned and Tweek are out, Zack's out, Deathorse and WaDi are in losers, and Aba's out. Komo's in losers too (fights Zinoto 17th).

Leo's in Losers as well.
Really rough for DLC, but also really good for Japan.

 

[Ziodyne 21]

Leo's in Losers as well.
Really rough for DLC, but also really good for Japan.

Has Leo even used Cloud once this tournament?

 

[Das Koopa]

Japan gets 5-6 people in Top 16 (depending on Komo)

Some, tsu, Kameme, Shuton, and Kirihara + maybe Komo. Never would've guessed the A squad (KEN/Aba/Ranai) would all be out before that.

 

[soniczx123]

Bayonetta is the most underwhelming "broken" character ever

What do you mean?

 

[TDK]

What do you mean?

Despite her completely massive volume of good players, she's won no majors (Unless you count KTAR Saga, which was 3/4 of a year ago). Heck, she very rarely top 16s, let alone 8s.

This isn't the makings of a broken character. She might not even be the best. Her results are really low for the metric ton of good players she has.

 

[soniczx123]

Despite her completely massive volume of good players, she's won no majors (Unless you count KTAR Saga, which was 3/4 of a year ago). Heck, she very rarely top 16s, let alone 8s.

This isn't the makings of a broken character. She might not even be the best. Her results are really low for the metric ton of good players she has.

That is true and really interesting indeed. Someone with busted tools as her should be swarming all the top spots.

What is the cause? Her players aren't just good or is the counterplay against her at higher level more potent than expected?

 

[Fenny]

So Salem's gonna be up against Shuton

The guy who 9B has literally never beaten in bracket

So zero surprise if Salem gets sent to losers before top 8

 

[Lord Dio]

Has Leo even used Cloud once this tournament?

smash.gg says he beat aba, cloud for the whole set.

 

[TDK]

That is true and really interesting indeed. Someone with busted tools as her should be swarming all the top spots.

What is the cause? Her players aren't just good or is the counterplay against her at higher level more potent than expected?

I have no idea. I wouldn't chalk it up to the players (Salem's won an APEX before, Saj took a set from ANTi with Peach, 9B was one of the best brawl players ever and the best smash 4 ryu until he dropped him, etc.), since a lot of them have history with other characters or are top Brawl vets. My best guess would be that while her tools are individually broken, they don't form a coherent kit like the rest of the top characters, as she doesn't really have a real focus as a character outside of comboing you off the top, which in itself isn't consistent anymore.

I think she's losing to characters with kits with a coherent purpose. Throwing a whole bunch of individually broken tools on a character doesn't make the character itself broken if those tools don't do anything for the rest of the kit (Outside of her ridiculous combo game until about 130.)

Just my best guess, it could be the players or the counterplay, but from what I've seen of top bayos this would be my observation.

If I'm right, this would be why she's broken on paper but underwhelming at the top level, where people have optimized their characters and gameplans more.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Kamemushi showing the world how to play against Lucario.

 

[TDK]

Zinoto 3-2 Komorikiri

 

[NotLiquid]

Zinoto 3-2 Komorikiri

Zinoto trying hard to position himself as a #TeamAlly's lynchpin

 

[Ziodyne 21]

Kameme why

Zinoto 3-2 Komorikiri

Yep definitely a bad day for DLC.

 

[TDK]

Kirihara didn't even take 20% vs Ally that game

 

[Wintermelon43]

So Salem's gonna be up against Shuton

The guy who 9B has literally never beaten in bracket

So zero surprise if Salem gets sent to losers before top 8

You sure?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Kamemushi showing the world how to play against Lucario.

In games 1 and 2, that is.

 

[Blue Banana]

Kels has an issue with Mewtwo, but I have no clue about the other two. Deathorse is mad good though.

Myran considers the Oli-M2 even and almost had the set in game 4. He could have ended it there if he wasn't knocked offstage

 

[Lord Dio]

Another One Bites the Dust. Is it just me, or has this year not been looking that well for komo?
apparently tsu pulled ryu out for kameme?????

 

[Fenny]

So Salem's gonna be up against Shuton

The guy who 9B has literally never beaten in bracket

So zero surprise if Salem gets sent to losers before top 8

OK nvm Salem ate him alive 90% of the time

Salem 3-1 Shuton

 

[ARISTOS]

Another One Bites the Dust. Is it just me, or has this year not been looking that well for komo?
apparently tsu pulled ryu out for kameme?????

He beat him pretty solidly, but then didn't want to be CP'd

EDIT: Enter Darth Void

 

[NotLiquid]

Salem is really well positioned for this Top 8. He could easily reach Winner's Finals at minimum. The only downside is if he does go out against Tsu he's likely to have an early run-in with Ally never mind, read the bracket wrong and it seems like it's most likely to be Dabuz or MKLeo.

Top 8 might not have Bayo in quantity, but....

 

[TDK]

Ally's adaptation is the scariest thing about him

went from getting 2-stocked at less than 20% to double 2-stock to winning the set

Ally 3-1 Kirihara

 

[Fenny]

You sure?

Pretty sure he's never lost to 9B and he has a winning record against ikep

I know Salem's better than them both but I figured that Shuton's MU exp. would more than make up for it

Then I remembered that Salem dealt with BRAWL Olimar and...