The fastest desync ever.

[Wobbles]

Basically, if you're wavedashing on a platform and you fire ice-blocks, your ice-block animation can be cancelled by sliding off the platform. If you slide off too early, the ice-blocks won't go, but if you time it right, you can have four ice-blocks cruising on the ground very close to one another. This is assuming you have Nana with you, of course. If you want to, you can also fake shooting ice-blocks like this, but I don't know what purpose that would serve.

 

[chu12ch]

its like having 3 nanas!!!

 

[cemo]

The fake shooting is kinda pointless, but it has major style points. 4 ice blocks is pretty neato, too.

I wanna know exactly what's not working for Lixivium, though.
Can't waveland off? Just doesn't desynch? something something?

 

[Lixivium]

Well, I tried it some more and I can get it both ways, it's just kinda sketchy. Sometimes Popo stops at the edge of the platform, other times he drops off the platform but doesn't shoot an ice block.

 

[Wobbles]

Yeah... it's really hard. The more important question is about the iceblock lag and where you have to be on the stage to pull off this maneuver.

Let's say you want to retreat and fire iceblocks; you don't have much room on any stage but Pokemon Stadium for sliding towards the outside of the stage. But if your opponent isn't off the stage when you do this (in which case, why bother) then it's very unsafe to try it going INTO the stage. That's the problem we're facing in its application.

At the moment, I'm seeing the first ice-blocks as being useful to cancel into moves that aren't other iceblocks. However, now it's a question of what would you bother using, since you don't want to iceblock when they're close to you!

So, it's really cool looking, but I'm trying to figure out how to make it applicable against a decent opponent.

 

[Return_to_Sender]

yeah the 4 ics blocks is a cool trick but i can't get it everytime but can do it a majority now.

i can't really see though a way to use all 4 effectivley. unless you knock your opponent from one side to the other and on your way to edge guard take a second to use a the top platform to try to make your opponent stall of go around them.
but there is something probably you can do that would be better than another pair or ice blocks

the first 2 could easily lead to an open grab if the opponent is in between the platforms and get hit just grabbed them from the stun or while they block them and can get the wobbles infinite or someother desynched grab out.

 

[Wobbles]

Actually, I think where the iceblock trick will shine is when you're stuck with your solo IC. By cancelling the lag, you can perform the time honored ice-block chaser when you're by yourself. That might be useful if your opponent is on the opposite side of the level, for whatever reason.

 

[chu12ch]

interesting, fire it, waveland into the chaser... Wobbles... you've done it again...

 

[Wobbles]

I have another one for you guys to chew on. I'm not sure how this one works, but here's pretty much how you do it:

1) Stand on a platform.

2) Drop through.

3) Jump and wavedash straight down onto the platform.

There's a peculiar timing to it, but if you do it right Nana won't do the wavedash onto the platform with you, but she'll just fall to the ground.

This is where it gets a bit weird, and I'm still trying to work out the kinks, but sometimes Nana just sits there, and sometimes she goes dashing forward. I don't know exactly how to make her do what I want... at the moment I'm just falling through the platform to land next to her and iceblock before I hit the ground; she doesn't respond to any inputs until after I land, so this might be useful? I dunno. Like I said, it's a bit weird. I'll let you know as I work with this more.

Edit:

Oh, and I have a variation on the platform iceblock cancel. If you just do a jumping iceblock with the right spacing, you can ledge cancel it from the air. This is a much easier way to do it, and it offers a bit of variation since you don't have to waveland (you also don't risk desyncing Nana on the landing).

Actually, this is a neat way to set up for the OTHER one I found.

Here's how ya do it.

1) On a platform, wavedash forwards.

2) Reach the end of the platform.

Tadahh! Nana gets caught in the "oh noes I'm falling" animation and starts undulating wildly. You are free to do as you wish. If you want to have control over her again really quickly, you just walk off the edge. She'll fall without doing anything, and you can de-sync her from there.

So if you want to get three iceblocks and a de-sync'ed Nana, just ledge cancel an iceblock from the air and then walk off and fire a third. Then when you land, Nana will be de-sync'ed.

Discoveries galore.

 

[chu12ch]

information overload... give me a couple of hours to get this through my head...

 

[Wobbles]

Just a heads up... I managed to record some footage of me doing the de-syncs I've mentioned in training mode. It's not high quality, but I did my best. I'll have a short vid of them up sometime tomorrow, I think. Can't do it tonight, because I have to use my school's computer lab to do it.

 

[Delphiki]

The quad Ice Block sounds hella cool. Then there's the Solo Squall aus shield. Two new discoveries, fookin sweet. Btw guys I'm working on a C-vid so soon you all may be able to see what I'm capable of. I also may make a thread in the next couple days of a few matches between me and Tyderium. If I do I'd love some comments on my vids.

 

[Mr. Derp]

I have another one for you guys to chew on. I'm not sure how this one works, but here's pretty much how you do it:

1) Stand on a platform.

2) Drop through.

3) Jump and wavedash straight down onto the platform.

I'm still having trouble seeing the practicality of this but I do really like platform ice block cnacel. i've always noticed if you slide off a platform or the stage doing an ice block it cnacel the lag, but I've never tried to do anything productive with it. I like the solo ice block chaser, cant wait for the vid.

 

[Delphiki]

Wow the quad Ice Block is hard. I've got three (2 Nana, 1 Popo) but I can't get the timing for Popo's first Ice Block. I think it will be very useful though.

Oh and if you guys don't know: When you WD backwards off the platform and fire an Ice Block, they will go in the same direction as the wavedash.

 

[Wobbles]

To keep that from having negative results, Delphiki, you can just use the same strategy that you would with a reverse laser or pill or something, which is quickly tap the other direction in a way that doesn't influence your movement. When you fire the ice-blocks you won't turn a direction you don't want.

 

[marthsword]

Wobbles is too awesome. Really though, Desynching turned me off from IC's. This sounds insanely hard, but fun and possibly useful.

 

[cemo]

I hear Wobbles desynchs in real life.
Even though there's one of him.

 

[Mr. Derp]

lol at Marthsword's join date/post count. anyway, I forget if wobbles mentioned this but you cna do the same thing falling off of the stage while wding backwards. I suppose ou could ice blcok, go back on stage and wave land for ice blcok chaser. peace.

 

[Wobbles]

I did not mention that because it has a lot of drawbacks. You are fading away from your own iceblock so the chase is very slow, it's really hard to time, and you run a strong risk of airdodging off the stage and killing yourself for a shaky, momentary advantage. I really don't like it, but if you can find a way to make it useful, all the cookies to you.

On another note... I noticed that if you try and waveland on a platform too early, you can have Nana do a waveland while you air dodge.

Something like... dash forward, jump, air dodge backwards and down, and hold down+b. If you do it right, Nana will waveland onto the platform and fall off of it doing a blizzard. You hit the ground almost immediately afterwards. Plus there's the momentary invincibility, and it looks like you screwed up so you might get an enemy to try and punish you.

 

[KevinM]

Can i ask whats the easiest desynch to pull off, i just want to see what it looks like if i do it correctly you know.

 

[cemo]

The easiest desynchs are the roll, spotdodge, or grab.
Do either, and hold down b. voila!

also head on to youtube and check out double vision.

 

[kamikaze falco]

Hey does this pivot work in the same way as ganons where you dash and you can instantly do a move?

 

[KevinM]

The easiest desynchs are the roll, spotdodge, or grab.
Do either, and hold down b. voila!

also head on to youtube and check out double vision.

Thank-you very much man

 

[comoesa]

hey where's the video wobbles...

IC are useless j/k

they pwned my pikachu today......):

 

[wuthefwasthat]

Hey does this pivot work in the same way as ganons where you dash and you can instantly do a move?

works the same as every character's cept since nana can't do it, we use it to desynch

also ^ someone forgot to mention taunt desynch lol...

btw... has anyone tried to figure out how to desynch off of a quick crouch? cause... that would be godly.

 

[Wobbles]

Well, I came up with another interesting way to use the pivot to de-sync.

If you pivot into a smash with the c-stick, Nana won't attack. This is neat because you can do stuff like:

Run away into a pivoted forward, down, or up-smash, then have Nana blizzard or fire an iceblock. It's fast and confusing.
Run TOWARDS somebody, maybe even behind them. Pivot and c-stick a smash, then have Nana activate one of her numerous superpowers.

I see this as handy because f-smash is a threatening move with a lot lag; if you combine the f-smash and blizzard into one maneuver, however, you get a lot of space control right in front of your face. You can basically sucker people into attacking you, cause them to stumble onto a blizzard, and then land a dash attack, smash, or grab.

So, you can run towards people, pivot the other way, and c-stick towards them. You get a small bit of motion, followed by an f-smash and then Nana is desynced. You could have her start smashing as well and alternate running forward smashes.

Just messing around and such.

 

[chu12ch]

****, i lost the hang of pivoting... time to relearn it...
this one sounds so useful... make urself look sooo weak, then bam! grabbed...

 

[Delphiki]

Actually (to the person above Wobbles), Nana CAN pivot. Simply press your attack six frames after a standard pivot.

 

[cemo]

Pivoting with the c-stick is sexy, it's how I usually do it. I like to follow it with a nanapult.

 

[Wobbles]

For me it depends on my intentions. Offensively the nanapult is the better option, defensively I prefer to blizzard. If there currently isn't an aggressor, I usually fire iceblocks to get the opponent to move or at least leave the ground. This lets me fire Nanapults with a bit more safety.

 

[Shai Hulud]

I can easily make Nana jump out of pivot but when I try to follow up with an ice block or blizzard it doesn't do anything. I have been able to get her to do aerials with limited success, though. Advice?

I've been able to do blizzards and ice blocks out of dash dance pretty easily. Generally, at some point during the dash dance, I dash one direction => dash opposite => quickly press down on control stick => desynched attack. The problem is that Nana tends to blizzard on the spot, whereas Popo slides forward, kinda the opposite of what I want. I can immediately dash back or wavedash back with Popo and it's not as much of a problem, but it seems a pretty indirect solution. This isn't as problematic with Ice Blocks if you're at a decent distance, as you're already ahead of the ice block you don't have to "chase" it. In fact you can wavesmash or whatever and if your opponent blocks it the ice block might still hit him. Kinda a "reverse ice block chaser."

Another technique I haven't been able to try out yet against humans but which seems effective is a "wavedodge" desynch. Waveshield => immediately hold C-stick down. This will cause the ICs to spot-dodge on the first available frame, and if your wavedash is sufficiently long, the dodge should end approximately at the end of your wavedash. Works kinda like the roll desynch, but with less lag and more unpredictable.

A general question about desynching--how effective is it to desynch to Nana blizzard while Popo immediately shields? It's just a lot of the time when I do a roll => desynch blizzard or something like that, they just hit Popo. I'm thinking if they don't shield and the blizzard hits, grab. If they try to attack, they may hit Nana but Popo can shield-grab. If your opponent is spaced too far to shield-grab (for instance, a Marth fsmashes you), wavedash from shield => grab.

Hoping some of you more experienced ICs can enlighten me. I'm trying to prepare for INNsomnia this Saturday. Think I'm going to main ICs even though I'm much more experienced with Marth and CF.

 

[Binx]

This needs a bump. Try pivoting an fsmash with popo using the c stick and nana wont dash attack, then I like to have her blizzard or charge a fsmash, if you predict them jumping in, release nanas smash if not then run at them, most people fear that charging nana, you are relatively safe for 70 frames or something sexy like that.

 

[Xephalon]

im not quite sure how to do this..can like somone explain in-depth?

 

[Kyu Puff]

You pivot, and jump. You know if you did it right because only Nana will jump. Once you can do that, make sure she short-hops, then work on shooting a solo Ice Block/Blizzard before they re-synch.

 

[Binx]

dash dance in training mode on 1/4 speed with Marth or Sheik, see that spot where they stand strait, in that spot they really are STANDING and can do ANY MOVE. All characters can do this, its easy to see on those ones, you have 1/60th of a second (1 Frame) to time it correctly, its basically just learning how you personally time the movement and "A" button / C-stick to get the pivotted smash, or in the case the pivotted jump.

 

[Speedsk8er]

I can pivot JAbs, tilts and smashes but I can'r seem to pivot an Ice clock. Is it possible?

Also, I can pivot from left to right but my Right to left pivots SUCK. >_<

 

[Kyu Puff]

I can pivot JAbs, tilts and smashes but I can'r seem to pivot an Ice clock. Is it possible?

Also, I can pivot from left to right but my Right to left pivots SUCK. >_<

Yeah, it's the same as pivoting c-stick smashes. Make sure you don't move at all after pivoting.

And that happens to me too; a lot of the time when I try to pivot right to left I end up just starting a dash animation and then doing nothing. :S