Social The Dog Opens a Can of Whoopass: Duck Hunt Social Thread

[Baby_Sneak]

DHD needs buffs.

You guys gotta scream like people did with bayo. Don't even listen to reason, just shout out all your issues with the character and be loud as you possibly can be.

 

[C0rvus]

I want to believe the current patch is the final one, and I would be fine with it.

Complaints about Duck Hunt's weaknesses would never reach the fever pitch of cries over Bayonetta, and there is no evidence to suggest that balance changes are affected by players' complaints. Look at Dedede, they organized videos formally asking for changes, showed what's wrong with him, just like Samus players did. But he never changed. Bayo was legitimately broken. Complaints only made it more pressing if anything.

Duck Hunt would love better recovery, but to my knowledge, patches have never done such a thing. It is what it is.

 

[Arcadenik]

I have been thinking about changing the thread title for a while now. I think I will do that when 1) SSB5 is announced so we can rally for Duck Hunt to come back or when 2) Duck Hunt gets buffs in a future patch, if there's one.

 

[Baby_Sneak]

I want to believe the current patch is the final one, and I would be fine with it.

Complaints about Duck Hunt's weaknesses would never reach the fever pitch of cries over Bayonetta, and there is no evidence to suggest that balance changes are affected by players' complaints. Look at Dedede, they organized videos formally asking for changes, showed what's wrong with him, just like Samus players did. But he never changed. Bayo was legitimately broken. Complaints only made it more pressing if anything.

Duck Hunt would love better recovery, but to my knowledge, patches have never done such a thing. It is what it is.

Samus got buffed after they made that vid, the mewtwo mains made a vid and they got buffed, people complained about the top tiers and every one got toned down heavily. They could've seen some problematic designs, but results can't all be a coincidence.

 

[Gadiel_VaStar]

I'm thinking about picking DH back up as a backup secondary. He'll be more of a trump card. I main Bayo right now so I might not even need him rn, but the more I'm playing MUs & stuff I might use him for Sheiks & Diddys one day lol.

 

[chaos11011]

Labbing out short hop DAir [no tech] conversions. While none are true combos, I'm finding neat situations where I can throw out a NAir/BAir or UAir right after if they don't suspect it. It might be the dog's best option to put the opponent in the air to set up a UAir kill, bar up throw or forcing a jump with projectiles. I'll try implementing it in my game and see if it has a use against actual players. I'll report back soon.

 

[chaos11011]

Not 100% sure about the rules about double posting here, so my appologies if this is out of line. I was watching some sets with Yousan so I could learn from him, and 6:00 from this set is my favorite thing I've ever seen DH do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftKw_colgJA

He gets his shield broken, but because a can was near, he puts the can right next to Duck Hunt. This causes a psuedo-stalemate where the Samus cannot go for a punish that will result in a KO due to the fact that the explosion from the can will prevent it.

 

[Cardboardtubeknight]

While I agree they need to stop giving my dude Dog Chow, and instead give him Blue Buffalo I actually enjoy the challenge. It's why I main him.

 

[(Buddha)]

////////////////////////////////////m picking DH again. So I could use some help.

 

[Sean²]

Does anyone actually think DHD is bottom 5 in the game? ESAM put out his tier list video and put DHD in bottom 3, now I see him get so much hate on youtube/reddit. Then I go watch You3 play and think to myself...

 

[C0rvus]

He's not. ESAM has always thought very lowly of Duck Hunt, and so does MVD. Ignore their opinions of the character, there's clearly some kind of bias there. Duck Hunt has better results than that.

 

[WispBae]

Absolutely not. Not even remotely close. His issue of killing isn't at large as people make it out to be. It is an issue, yes, but it is not as polarizing as others make it to be.

 

[Sean²]

I think it's funny that right after I post this, a new tier list is released.

 

[(Buddha)]

Nah, I always though DH was middle or high tier when the game came out, and still do. But wen ever someone remotely good at the game says a character is low tier, everyone agrees with them without knowing why. For instance, I always thought Mewtwo was not near the worst in Melee, but more like middle tier. Since top players don use him an point out many of his weaknesses, everyone thought he was bad. Know that Leffen seems to be picking him up everyone is now saying he has had potential for a long time.
Point is, opinions vary, but few of them actually mean anything.

 

[chaos11011]

You3 got 13th at Sumabato 12 yesterday. We still in this. Puppy power!

Also, ZeRo has faced him a lot and says that Duck Hunt has potential to be higher than 40th (his tier list ranking)

 

[Zenithia]

Duck Hunt can have trouble killing, yes, but if you utilize defense well enough the opponent should have trouble killing you. It balances out. I've had matches with DH that ended up stretching on to 150% for both me and the opposition.

 

[chaos11011]

I've actually never had trouble killing with Duck Hunt, but it might be because my opposition tends to overextend their combos, so I sneak in a sweetspot NAir or a BAir after they whiff. BAiring the can gives a lot of pressure too if it hits since your UAir confirm will kill.

My current problem as of late is fighting zoners. I don't zone as well as them and I just end up losing. I guess I gotta amp up my camp game.

 

[Zenithia]

Oh do I know what you mean when it comes to the zoning. I lost my 3DS for a good 7 months or so and now and I have no idea how to time my side and down specials anymore...Hoo boi.

 

[Kenith]

I started playing Duck Hunt because I wanted to play someone really annoying/trollish.
I have no idea what I'm doing and I love it.

Duck Hunt's standard moves turned me off from them initially (hard to kill) but after legitimately trying them I really love all their special moves.
Really not a fan of the Up B tho...

 

[Scarlet Jile]

Hey folks, I'm in the process of developing a balance patch, and I'm working with mains from each of the characters to refine their characters to a point where they feel comfortably upper-mid tier, somewhere in the realms of Yoshi, DK, Luigi.

I know especially little about Duck Hunt Dog, so I'm really curious to hear about his major problems (killing is my guess), and how they can be worked on without changing how the character was meant to be played.

 

[Cardboardtubeknight]

Hey folks, I'm in the process of developing a balance patch, and I'm working with mains from each of the characters to refine their characters to a point where they feel comfortably upper-mid tier, somewhere in the realms of Yoshi, DK, Luigi.

I know especially little about Duck Hunt Dog, so I'm really curious to hear about his major problems (killing is my guess), and how they can be worked on without changing how the character was meant to be played.

I don't want any change myself, but yeah your spot on about killing. Its heavily lagged, but I rather like it myself however. There's other ways to utilized taking out someone, and Duck Hunt make it unique. A completely different formula is involved when Duck Hunt is involved.

 

[ぱみゅ]

Duckhunt is difficult to rebalance.
I feel he is fine not having kill options as a design weakness, but then he'd need changes somewhere else, and imo, the duo has pretty good data on almost everywhere else.
Maybe a +1% on the can (as long as in doesn't get too powerful), or on the Gunmen (I like this idea actually), and a throw that consistently kills at something like 170.
People claim that it is necessary to fix his Smashes, but other than making Usmash to autolink, I am not sure how any other Smash Attack can be improved.

 

[Duck Hunted]

same here guys i havent been on in a while but I am coming back my dudes!! If you do know me my main changes like every week so now i am currently maining Villager, Duck Hunt, and Bowser :D

 

[Arcadenik]

Anyone who knows me long enough knows Duck Hunt is still my favorite character to play as. I always pick up Duck Hunt every time I play Smash. Just to give myself some variety, I do play as other characters... but sooner or later, I will go back and play as Duck Hunt.

 

[TheWorstMuppet]

I can't seem to really play anyone else but Duck Hunt so theres that

 

[Zenithia]

I can't pick between like 5 mains. It's times like this when I gotta just chill tbh

 

[Cardboardtubeknight]

I can't get enough of these *******

Speaking literally... Dunk Hunt

and derogatorily... Peach

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I know this thread hasn't seen much life, but I took the time to buff Duck Hunt's Wild Gunman special move last night.

What I basically did was increase the damage and knockback that the gunmen can deliver. Originally they struggled to KO even Zero Suit Samus, but their shots have been buffed up enough so that they're able to KO someone as heavy as Mario sooner than before. I did some thorough tests with the buffs to see how quickly Mario gets KO'd on an Omega Form stage, and the results were as follows...

Gunman | KO% on Mario with Wild Gunman | KO% on Mario with Quick Draw Aces | KO% on Mario with Mega Gunman

| 277% | 331% | 72%

| 231% | 276% | 63%

| 215% | 261% | 63%

| 122% | 140% | 35%

| 167% | 199% | 49%

And yes, Mega Gunman received a significant buff in that the gunmen deal greater damage and knockback than the default Wild Gunman special move. Because the gunmen are very slow to attack, their shots have been buffed up to a point where they're almost comparable to Little Mac's KO Uppercut; they can't 1-hit KO, but the shots can still pack a punch with their knockback. However, the shots are still blockable, so if you can't defeat the giant gunmen quickly enough, you can just shield off the shots. Still, the buffs make Mega Gunman far more rewarding to use, as it's normally quite useless to use on offense.

Basically, the buffs go as follows...

Wild Gunman
Increased damage and knockback. Sombrero gunman now has KO potential.

Quick Draw Aces
The gunmen deal 5% more damage with their shots, but the shots have less knockback to compensate for their fast speed. Sombrero gunman can still make KOs, but KOs later, due to the decreased knockback.

Mega Gunman
The gunmen deal 10% more damage, and their knockback is drastically buffed as well. The buffs are made to compensate for how sluggish the gunmen are with their attacks. Sombrero gunman is the most dangerous, being able to KO even Bowser before his current damage reaches 50%.

 

[smashkirby]

I know this thread hasn't seen much life, but I took the time to buff Duck Hunt's Wild Gunman special move last night.

What I basically did was increase the damage and knockback that the gunmen can deliver. Originally they struggled to KO even Zero Suit Samus, but their shots have been buffed up enough so that they're able to KO someone as heavy as Mario sooner than before. I did some thorough tests with the buffs to see how quickly Mario gets KO'd on an Omega Form stage, and the results were as follows...

Gunman | KO% on Mario with Wild Gunman | KO% on Mario with Quick Draw Aces | KO% on Mario with Mega Gunman

| 277% | 331% | 72%

| 231% | 276% | 63%

| 215% | 261% | 63%

| 122% | 140% | 35%

| 167% | 199% | 49%

And yes, Mega Gunman received a significant buff in that the gunmen deal greater damage and knockback than the default Wild Gunman special move. Because the gunmen are very slow to attack, their shots have been buffed up to a point where they're almost comparable to Little Mac's KO Uppercut; they can't 1-hit KO, but the shots can still pack a punch with their knockback. However, the shots are still blockable, so if you can't defeat the giant gunmen quickly enough, you can just shield off the shots. Still, the buffs make Mega Gunman far more rewarding to use, as it's normally quite useless to use on offense.

Basically, the buffs go as follows...

Wild Gunman
Increased damage and knockback. Sombrero gunman now has KO potential.

Quick Draw Aces
The gunmen deal 5% more damage with their shots, but the shots have less knockback to compensate for their fast speed. Sombrero gunman can still make KOs, but KOs later, due to the decreased knockback.

Mega Gunman
The gunmen deal 10% more damage, and their knockback is drastically buffed as well. The buffs are made to compensate for how sluggish the gunmen are with their attacks. Sombrero gunman is the most dangerous, being able to KO even Bowser before his current damage reaches 50%.

If only the Wild Gunmen had THESE kinds of buffs in the official game. Seriously, the best they're used for is being meat shields for D.H., and even then...

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

If only the Wild Gunmen had THESE kinds of buffs in the official game. Seriously, the best they're used for is being meat shields for D.H., and even then...

The funny thing is, someone did mention to me that Wild Gunman doesn't need any damage and/or knockback buffs. He instead thinks that the move should have less ending lag, and that the gunmen should withstand more damage.

I would beg to differ, since Duck Hunt doesn't exactly have the best KO options out there.

 

[lady_sky skipper]

Anyone who knows me long enough knows Duck Hunt is still my favorite character to play as. I always pick up Duck Hunt every time I play Smash. Just to give myself some variety, I do play as other characters... but sooner or later, I will go back and play as Duck Hunt.

Can't blame you, there's something pretty appealing about playing as a character who used to be hated. (Although someone who I worked with at a job says he still doesn't like him but loves to beat him up.)

 

[Dawangthang]

Dead thread revival here but just an FYI for anyone who still goes on here, this weekend at CEO Dreamland we will have 7 Duck Hunts in attendance. Raito, Stay, Dandy Penguin, Duckfro, MrPikPiks, Perris, and myself. I'll also be on the mic as well so if he is on stream, people will be informed correctly

 

[Arcadenik]

I was thinking that maybe Wild Gunman should be ordered and not random in Smash 5. Olimar's Pikmin were random in Brawl but are now ordered in Smash 4.

And yes, they need to be fixed... so they shoot faster like Quick Draw Aces and take more damage like Mega Gunman. Sometimes I feel that the existence of custom moves were detrimental to Duck Hunt's default special moves in Smash 4.

 

[Arcadenik]

Smash 5 announced.

Dalmatian Duck Hunt Dog when?