Data The Complete Samus Combo and String List

[DungeonMaster]

@E-Sly At the very end of the OP there are a list of zero-death strings - dash -> n-air -> d-air is listed but do you mean something else?

I've been working on an update to the OP for a little over a month now, the community gripe video taking up the majority of my free time.
Several new combos that register on the (horrible) combo counter include an entire chain of d-air -> FJ -> d-air -> J -> CS (55%) and d-air -> FJ -> d-air -> Up-B variants.
As well as up-air (sour) -> jab 1 -> dash attack (kills) as a variant of the f-smash versions.

 

[Jonny Westside]

Can someone direct me to a grounded charge shot post or something? Like, is it possible to hit someone with a shot while they hang on the ledge? Looking into punishing the 1 frame with a CS.

 

[Xygonn]

Can someone direct me to a grounded charge shot post or something? Like, is it possible to hit someone with a shot while they hang on the ledge? Looking into punishing the 1 frame with a CS.

It doesn't go low enough. You can only punish people that overstay invulnerability.

 

[Jonny Westside]

It doesn't go low enough. You can only punish people that overstay invulnerability.

Let's hope an update increases her CS range :3

 

[Afro Smash]

Let's hope an update increases her CS range :3

http://smashboards.com/threads/various-samus-tech-update-jab-1-op.394735/page-3#post-19802749

 

[Scream]

Did a lot of experimenting with Sour(9%) Bair.
I found the following true Combos:
- Sour Bair > Strong Bair
- Sour Bair > Weak Bair
- Sour Bair > UpB

Getting the Sourspot consitently takes some practice but i think it'll be well worth it.
I found it very applicable after a Dair/Uptilt spike onstage.
If requested i can of course provide video evidence(.zip) :D

 

[DungeonMaster]

Thanks @ Scream I trust you without video evidence of course, but if you have some recorded it'll go into the vidoes section.
I've actually un-intentionally done a bunch out of up-tilt, was never sure if it was my input was a true combo or opponent's lack of air-dodge.
Can you put together % ranges on R.O.B to add to the giant main list?
I promise this thread gets the proper update it needs this week. First the things-that-need-fixing video, then this thread.

 

[Afro Smash]

Consistently getting the sourspot is really difficult since I'm pretty sure you can only get it on the 2nd active frame of the move (its active 2 frames) so sapcing timing it so you get that i imagine would be very difficult, still the combos are good to know regardless

 

[Scream]

Consistently getting the sourspot is really difficult since I'm pretty sure you can only get it on the 2nd active frame of the move (its active 2 frames) so sapcing timing it so you get that i imagine would be very difficult, still the combos are good to know regardless

The Sourspot has 4 active frame so it's not super difficult.
Getting down the spacing was the hard part for me. If you get the hit on accident you can at least react and combo accordingly.

@ DungeonMaster I'll compile the percents as soon as i have some free time on my hands

 

[Afro Smash]

The Sourspot has 4 active frame so it's not super difficult.
Getting down the spacing was the hard part for me. If you get the hit on accident you can at least react and combo accordingly.

@ DungeonMaster I'll compile the percents as soon as i have some free time on my hands

Oh yeah my b, alright thats a lot more practical then

 

[Scream]

So i sat down to get the percents and i discovered a whole lot more O.O
Man i love Samus so much <3

So here is the Breakdown:

1. Weak Bair(12%) to Strong Bair. Percents on ROB: ~44%-59%
So yeah at low percents the weak hit already combos into the strong hit. I mean we allready suspected it but it's nice to have it confirmed i think.

2. Sour Bair to Screw Attack. Percents on ROB: Basicly there are no percents here. As long as i could get the sourspot and ROB was in range i was able to combo into UpB. Tested from 0%-100%ish.

3. Sour Bair to UpAir to Screw Attack
This is just beatiful, LOOK AT IT :D. So yeah here are the percents on ROB: ~55%-65%
The Range to get the Upair is a lot bigger, but why get the Upair when you could get a Bair instead?

4. Sour Bair to Strong Bair
Finally we come to the combo i originally tested. Percents on ROB: ~68%-Range
Basicly as long as you are in Range it is possible from 68% onwards. Depends a lot on their DI as well but it works well into killing ranges.

BONUS: Yeah Samus has not only Dthrow as a combo throw. BEHOLD the CHEESE.

Works on the faster falling half of the cast and its only use is pretty much shown in the video above.

 

[DungeonMaster]

Very nice!
Yeah the up-throw -> up-B is in there as a combo, but you've definitely found a REAL application to it!

 

[Shadó Chimera / シャドーキメラ]

Shoutouts to Delfino.

 

[Scream]

Hey guys i'm back with more weird ****.

I am currently exploring frame advantage and disatvantage and how they are affected by various circumstances.
In my search i have come upon some extremely stupid design stuff that i will go further into in a seperate thread in the future.

Have a look at this:

To keep it short: Frame Advantage is heavily charachter dependant because of different levels of liftoff and landing into the ground while in hitstun i think.
In this particular case that makes jab 1 have +17 frame advantage on hit, which for the uninitiated is pretty ****ing stupid.
CS startup is 16 frames so that makes it a true combo.

@ DungeonMaster As stuff like in the gfycat above is very charachter specific i'd understand if you didnt want to add it to the combo list. It's mad cool tho

 

[Shadó Chimera / シャドーキメラ]

But how far away would he be from jab 1? If cs takes more than 1 frame to reach him than it wont be a true combo anymore. :<

 

[Scream]

But how far away would he be from jab 1? If cs takes more than 1 frame to reach him than it wont be a true combo anymore. :<

Yeah, as i was already saying this particular case is not very practical. It is moreso meant as a teaser, a fun little quirk if you want.
This just seemed to be the best place to post, as it IS a combo.

 

[DungeonMaster]

@ Scream Definitely I will highlight them in the video section and we can have a separate section detailing some. My guess is the list would be huge, as you can probably get in any move off of jab, f-tilt (considering all the hit boxes), n-air.
I play a fair amount of "for-fun", particularly when I'm tired, and I'm sure there are other people who would be interested.
In my opinion it's a pity competitive stages have no walls at all, specifically to avoid jank but I find looking at the most popular videos online people actually *enjoy* the jank as kind of a perverse pleasure.

 

[S.P.A.D.]

Casual is great fun. If If u break that barrier of tourney boy you might get the other to go casual for some games.


Now for what I came here for, is there a list for characters we can dtilt while on a battlefield platform? Tiys a sort of small hitbox but it sets up some nice strings.

 

[Wald0]

Does Samus slide when she does her d-tilt while doing a U-Turn? I know down smash works but I hope there's a better alt.

 

[Tonetta]

Yes, but not far

 

[DungeonMaster]

Am I crazy? Super missile -> dash attack registers as a true combo. I was in the process of cleaning up this thread's loose ends and fiddling in training mode.
Something happened to super missile in the patches. This is a legitimate low % combo starter, you get the whole dash tree out of it now.
Super missile -> grab is likely true on a bunch of the cast as well.

.... How was this missed?

 

[DungeonMaster]

Looking back, I'm not sure what happened. It could be a change to hitstun. The data miners might be interested in this.

Add super-missile -> dash-attack -> up-air -> n-air -> fast fall d-air to the sexy strings list, works like a charm.

Super missile -> dash-attack -> up-air -> CS is very cute.

 

[Hark17ball]

Am I crazy? Super missile -> dash attack registers as a true combo. I was in the process of cleaning up this thread's loose ends and fiddling in training mode.
Something happened to super missile in the patches. This is a legitimate low % combo starter, you get the whole dash tree out of it now.
Super missile -> grab is likely true on a bunch of the cast as well.

.... How was this missed?

You've been slacking!! /cry

Side note....means some serious starting damage for us!

 

[DungeonMaster]

Clearly I have...

Yeah this is fairly significant, 51 damage is nothing to scoff at from basic dash combo. It's trivial to do max damage on fast fallers.

 

[Hark17ball]

Clearly I have...

Yeah this is fairly significant, 51 damage is nothing to scoff at from basic dash combo. It's trivial to do max damage on fast fallers.

2 friends and a rival at my monthly play The Spacies so if I can do 51% they will be incredibly nervous to approach and hopefully will bait out more reflects for grabs/attacks

 

[KayJay]

Super Missile to Charge Shot also true combos again without jumping forward for the CS. SM definately got more hitstun. :O

So spacing Z-Air into SM into grab may be a viable mixup in the neutral.

 

[Afro Smash]

Supre Missile always true combo'd in to grab and dash attack at low percents, SM > Dash Attack combos are prolly the best punish for low% shield breaks

 

[Tonetta]

Not to put a damper on things but if you fire a sm and run directly at them theyre probably going to shield or jump

 

[DungeonMaster]

Agreed Tonetta but it's still a combo option. Also if they reach for shield you grab. Far from perfect as a setup as we all know.
I do it here, in fact it's looking at my own intuitive play that made me wonder if it was a true combo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Er3eVCqVu80#t=49

Incidentally, last evening I had THE epiphany. The one. The one where it all makes sense. I was working on the combo trees again, trying to figure out the structure without needing to use numbers or memorize anything and then it hit me.
It may sound cryptic, I'm still getting everything into presentable form but damn Samus can combo like a demon.
I've jumped from a reflexive feel of the dash and grab trees with a decent understanding of the up-tilt tree and a so-so feel of the other options - to now I KNOW exactly where, when and how to apply the narrow range true combos.
No more guesswork, no more "well I sorta know there's a follow up here but I'm not entirely sure of the options, er... what percent am I, what percent is he... err. maybe...". No. None of that. I KNOW where and what do to, PRECISELY.
Opponent wriggles out of combo? No sweat, these X Y and Z are the options that opened up.
No math, or at the most completely trivial counting 1, 2, 3.
I finally made the "it all makes sense" leap, and if you give me a bit longer you'll all leap with me and we'll start to murder people like no tomorrow. I may want to show it off in video form.

 

[Hark17ball]

Agreed Tonetta but it's still a combo option. Also if they reach for shield you grab. Far from perfect as a setup as we all know.
I do it here, in fact it's looking at my own intuitive play that made me wonder if it was a true combo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Er3eVCqVu80#t=49

Incidentally, last evening I had THE epiphany. The one. The one where it all makes sense. I was working on the combo trees again, trying to figure out the structure without needing to use numbers or memorize anything and then it hit me.
It may sound cryptic, I'm still getting everything into presentable form but damn Samus can combo like a demon.
I've jumped from a reflexive feel of the dash and grab trees with a decent understanding of the up-tilt tree and a so-so feel of the other options - to now I KNOW exactly where, when and how to apply the narrow range true combos.
No more guesswork, no more "well I sorta know there's a follow up here but I'm not entirely sure of the options, er... what percent am I, what percent is he... err. maybe...". No. None of that. I KNOW where and what do to, PRECISELY.
Opponent wriggles out of combo? No sweat, these X Y and Z are the options that opened up.
No math, or at the most completely trivial counting 1, 2, 3.
I finally made the "it all makes sense" leap, and if you give me a bit longer you'll all leap with me and we'll start to murder people like no tomorrow. I may want to show it off in video form.

Teach me master!

 

[Afro Smash]

I'm getting Zair to true combo in to dash attack from around 25-90 on ROB, towards the latter end you can get zair > late DA > Fair true combo for a kill near ledges

 

[DungeonMaster]

Yep!
I was putting together some video on "what is a combo in smash 4" and how some things may not register on the counter but still are true combos and I discovered this as well. I think we have been doing this since day 1 and I don't know if/how the engine changed or did we just get better? It's easier to get it to register if the target is wide, like ROB, Bowser, etc... and the tip hits them on the far side.
I'll give you credit in the OP regardless.

 

[Xygonn]

So I just combo'd (or nearly combo'd) late dash attack into front/back of nair into bair in a match. Anyone want to lab the back hit of nair before I get home to work on it tonight?

 

[Scream]

I labbed the back hit of Nair extensively but couldnt find anything useful.
Applications of back hit nair combos would also be very rare.

Landing backhit Nair:
> Ftilt
> Fsmash
> Jab > Dtilt
> Dashattack > etc
> Dtilt

I dont have time on my hands to get the exact combo percent but its pretty lenient.
All of these are gegistered true Combos in training mode.

 

[Xygonn]

I labbed the back hit of Nair extensively but couldnt find anything useful.
Applications of back hit nair combos would also be very rare.

Landing backhit Nair:
> Ftilt
> Fsmash
> Jab > Dtilt
> Dashattack > etc
> Dtilt

I dont have time on my hands to get the exact combo percent but its pretty lenient.
All of these are gegistered true Combos in training mode.

Eh, If I can get DA double hit nair to bair (10 or 6 + 15 + 14=39 or 35 damage), I'll be a happy man. I want to reproduce what I did in the match (which I stupidly didn't save).

Edit, can only get a string. Can't get it to combo.

 

[Wald0]

I've been getting uair to get a lot of confirms when falling from the ground (usually into up-b) thoughts on it?

 

[Scream]

I've been getting uair to get a lot of confirms when falling from the ground (usually into up-b) thoughts on it?

We have known this for ages. Read the thread before posting.

 

[DungeonMaster]

@Waldo, yes as Scream pointed out it's one of the combos that works at any range - but does not register on training mode combo counter, unless we misunderstand your post.

The one I've tried to replicate but I can't seem to do in training mode is the soft hits of up-air into up-tilt when the target is right above your head and the first hitbox of up-tilt comes out.
At times I could swear there is some kind of cancel operating because it feels overly fast and like a true combo.
This here linked is not exactly what I'm referencing but you can feel it's almost like there's a cancel. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3KGQEYaUt4#t=405
I think I have video of the specific situation where the opponent is directly above and Samus is falling faster than them with soft-up-air -> up-tilt (into kills) but I would have to dig to get it.
One of those things I've been subconsciously doing like super-missile -> dash attack but not realizing the potential (maybe).

 

[Wald0]

@Waldo, yes as Scream pointed out it's one of the combos that works at any range - but does not register on training mode combo counter, unless we misunderstand your post.

The one I've tried to replicate but I can't seem to do in training mode is the soft hits of up-air into up-tilt when the target is right above your head and the first hitbox of up-tilt comes out.
At times I could swear there is some kind of cancel operating because it feels overly fast and like a true combo.
This here linked is not exactly what I'm referencing but you can feel it's almost like there's a cancel. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3KGQEYaUt4#t=405
I think I have video of the specific situation where the opponent is directly above and Samus is falling faster than them with soft-up-air -> up-tilt (into kills) but I would have to dig to get it.
One of those things I've been subconsciously doing like super-missile -> dash attack but not realizing the potential (maybe).

I actually meant the first few hits of uair, not the last one. I cross it up on shield and bait out a shield grab and I up-b. Also sometimes I can get the reverse jab and side smash.

 

[Wald0]

I've also been using RAR nair to get the two hits to combo into each then since I can act straight out of it I usually go for an up-b or something else super fast