Q&A "The Clinic"- Dr. Mario Q&A Thread

[DJSKRELP]

I have a question posted here about Doc's down throw to fair:
http://smashboards.com/threads/question-about-down-throw-to-f-air.434824/

 

[Eight_SixtyFour]

I have a question posted here about Doc's down throw to fair:
http://smashboards.com/threads/question-about-down-throw-to-f-air.434824/

Please stop creating threads for the same question.

The timing varies for each character (you should ignore the percents for heavies in that video) since Doc's (Mario's) down throw has weight dependent endlag. The heavier the opponent, the more lag we have. It kinda sucks, but I think the idea behind it was to make sure that Mario/Doc don't crush heavies off of throws.

As for whether it combos or not, it does. But as I said earlier, it's not as reliable on the heavy characters because of the throw lag.

The combo works best on light-medium fastfallers since they don't go too far for Doc to follow up and Doc can act quicker out of his Down Throw.. Pikachu is an odd case, but it works.

As far as timing the fair, you have to do a fulhop rising fair and the fair has to be done almost immediately after jumping.

 

[Coolwhip]

Do anyone knows how to b-reverse Doc's cape in midair like Tsumusuto? It's like the sickish thing I've seen yet!

 

[Capt. Tin]

I've never been consistent with it but I've been able to perform it unintentionally.

I think you can start with a Down-left or Down-right angle on the control stick and move it to the other side.

 

[Coolwhip]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6ekz-VQYio

He does it so beautifully at 1:02 & 1:03

My mind was blown into pieces. Now I gotta put the pieces back in place. lol

 

[Eight_SixtyFour]

Do anyone knows how to b-reverse Doc's cape in midair like Tsumusuto? It's like the sickish thing I've seen yet!

I'm not sure how to do it on the Gamecube controller since I haven't used it in ages, but on the 3DS, it's pretty easy provided you get the forward input to register.

B-reverse: Hold down the analog stick in the direction that you are facing, then press special, and then immediately flick the stick in the other direction. You have to make sure that the analog is held down long enough so that it registers. Otherwise you might get a B-reverse pill.

 

[Capt. Tin]

Can someone confirm that it's possible to Up B out of Diddy's Down-Tilt combos? I think I've been able to do it a few times.

 

[Eight_SixtyFour]

Can someone confirm that it's possible to Up B out of Diddy's Down-Tilt combos? I think I've been able to do it a few times.

At lower percents, yes. But keep in mind that against a more competent Diddy, they can just bait the Up-B and punish you. Not a bad option if you think they aren't trying to bait you.

 

[Ark of Silence101]

I am trying my hand on Doc and seems I have the hang of him more than Mario, could you help me with some tips with recovery mix ups? Yes, I am aware he has very limited options in this area but any insight is useful.

 

[Eight_SixtyFour]

I am trying my hand on Doc and seems I have the hang of him more than Mario, could you help me with some tips with recovery mix ups? Yes, I am aware he has very limited options in this area but any insight is useful.

Optimal way to recover if you're quite far from the stage is Down-B->Double Jump-> Up-B. If the stage has walls and you get close enough to walljump, use that too. It's also worth remembering that unlike characters like Little Mac, Roy, Cloud or Ganondorf, you don't have high fall speed, you have two recovery options, you have moves that snap to the ledge, and you don't have terrible air speed. You have the choice of varying the timing for each recovery option. For example, you don't always have to Down-B immediately UNLESS you get hit by moves like Falcon's D-Tilt, which not only sends you far but sends you at a low angle. You can delay it to a certain extent. Same thing applies to your double jump (the most important recovery option that you have).

The other way to recover is Double Jump->Down-B-> Up-B. This is not recommended because you lose all of your resources, and any mistake will cost you the stock.

If you are close to the stage, you don't even have to use up all of your resources. If the stage has walls, you can go low and walljump + Up-B or walljump + Sheet will be fine. Sheet snaps to the ledge very quickly and will still reflect or turn things around as you are grabbing the ledge. You can use U-air to defend yourself while recovering if you think an opponent will try to attack you.

Lastly, note that while Doc has options to vary his recovery, knowing which one to use depends on what your opponent is doing as well as your location. For example, I would be wary about using Down-B immediately against characters like Ike, Yoshi or Shulk because they can just punish it with Fair. But if I predict that they will try to use Fair, I can airdodge and then try to recover.

 

[Ark of Silence101]

Optimal way to recover if you're quite far from the stage is Down-B->Double Jump-> Up-B. If the stage has walls and you get close enough to walljump, use that too. It's also worth remembering that unlike characters like Little Mac, Roy, Cloud or Ganondorf, you don't have high fall speed, you have two recovery options, you have moves that snap to the ledge, and you don't have terrible air speed. You have the choice of varying the timing for each recovery option. For example, you don't always have to Down-B immediately UNLESS you get hit by moves like Falcon's D-Tilt, which not only sends you far but sends you at a low angle. You can delay it to a certain extent. Same thing applies to your double jump (the most important recovery option that you have).

The other way to recover is Double Jump->Down-B-> Up-B. This is not recommended because you lose all of your resources, and any mistake will cost you the stock.

If you are close to the stage, you don't even have to use up all of your resources. If the stage has walls, you can go low and walljump + Up-B or walljump + Sheet will be fine. Sheet snaps to the ledge very quickly and will still reflect or turn things around as you are grabbing the ledge. You can use U-air to defend yourself while recovering if you think an opponent will try to attack you.

Lastly, note that while Doc has options to vary his recovery, knowing which one to use depends on what your opponent is doing as well as your location. For example, I would be wary about using immediately Down-B raw against characters like Ike, Yoshi or Shulk because they can just punish it with Fair. But if I predict that they will try to use Fair, I can airdodge and then try to recover.

How to I wall jump exactly? I know it has something to do with inputting the opposite direction when in front of a wall but I can't exactly get it right.

 

[Eight_SixtyFour]

How to I wall jump exactly? I know it has something to do with inputting the opposite direction when in front of a wall but I can't exactly get it right.

Mostly correct. Move towards the wall that you want to jump off from, then press the opposite direction when you are touching the wall.

EDIT: Also do some research on which stages you can wall jump from.

 

[Ark of Silence101]

Mostly correct. Move towards the wall that you want to jump off from, then press the opposite direction when you are touching the wall.

EDIT: Also do some research on which stages you can wall jump from.

Thank you.

 

[luke_atyeo]

hey dudes, I'm trying to collect a bunch of quick easy info graphics on essential character knowledge to make a quick reference guide for commentators (we all hate it when a commentator says something that is wrong)
This shulk thing here is an example of the kinda stuff I am looking for

I'm going around to all the character boards and it'll be a little messy for me to try and check them all, so if you have any cool things like that, or just some useful info that I could turn into a similar picture, please send me a message. Cheers lads.

 

[Fliflob]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6ekz-VQYio

He does it so beautifully at 1:02 & 1:03

My mind was blown into pieces. Now I gotta put the pieces back in place. lol

I know that this reply is really late, but to do the b reverse just like in the video, you need to jump forward, then do a cape backwards, then flick the stick forwards to do the b reverse (a bit like a wavebounce, in fact it might technically be a wavebounce). So do what Eight_SixtyFour said (his reply is a lot better than mine!), but in the opposite direction to the one you jumped in. Just spotted this and wanted to help, although you may know this already (and sorry if I'm missing something, I'm really bad at this game!).

 

[Eight_SixtyFour]

hey dudes, I'm trying to collect a bunch of quick easy info graphics on essential character knowledge to make a quick reference guide for commentators (we all hate it when a commentator says something that is wrong)
This shulk thing here is an example of the kinda stuff I am looking for

I'm going around to all the character boards and it'll be a little messy for me to try and check them all, so if you have any cool things like that, or just some useful info that I could turn into a similar picture, please send me a message. Cheers lads.

It's a bit difficult to specify errors, because a lot of the stuff that people say about Doc are mostly misconceptions or exaggerations. But a few things that come to mind include:

Down-throw to Up-Smash: I've heard some commentators talk about this as if it's not a combo at all. It works on certain characters (fast fallers, light characters) at low percents.

Doc's weight: Some people think that Doc is heavier. He weighs the same as Mario. His jumps are just much lower than Mario's so he FEELS heavier.

D-throw to Fair: This works on certain characters, regardless of how they DI. Some people think that it only works without DI or that DI'ing away from Doc makes it harder to connect. It's actually harder for Doc to land this if they DI behind him.

Doc's recovery: It's sub par, we get it. But many people still think that it's on the level of Little Mac. This is blatantly untrue. Doc does not have high fall speed, his air speed isn't that bad, his moves snap to the ledge (notably Side-B and Up-B), and he has two recovery options to work with (Down-B and Up-B). He is actually more flexible than characters like Little Mac, Ganondorf, Roy and Cloud at varying the timing of his options.

Edgeguarding: People consider Doc to be worse than Mario at edgeguarding (he's actually better at this). Doc has a few solid options for edgeguarding. Down-B is a very good option that covers a lot of space, and beats out other attacks, whilst being able to kill on the sides. Reverse Up-B is also very powerful. Dair is a somewhat niche option; it's more useful against characters like Mario, as it will probably trade with his Up-B and cause a semi-spike.


There are probably more, but these types of comments bug me (and just about every Doc player) the most.

I know that this reply is really late, but to do the b reverse just like in the video, you need to jump forward, then do a cape backwards, then flick the stick forwards to do the b reverse (a bit like a wavebounce, in fact it might technically be a wavebounce). So do what Eight_SixtyFour said (his reply is a lot better than mine!), but in the opposite direction to the one you jumped in. Just spotted this and wanted to help, although you may know this already (and sorry if I'm missing something, I'm really bad at this game!).

A wavebounce is a turnaround b-reverse. You turn around and then B-reverse in one quick motion. More info can be found at the link below, but if you want to know if someone is B-reversing or wavebouncing, here's a quick visual guide.

• B-reverse: The character changes momentum and changes the direction that they are facing
• Wavebounce: The character changes momentum, but still faces the same direction.

https://smashboards.com/threads/turnaround-bs-b-reverses-and-wavebounces-know-the-difference.368536/

 

[Fliflob]

It's a bit difficult to specify errors, because a lot of the stuff that people say about Doc are mostly misconceptions or exaggerations. But a few things that come to mind include:

Down-throw to Up-Smash: I've heard some commentators talk about this as if it's not a combo at all. It works on certain characters (fast fallers, light characters) at low percents.

Doc's weight: Some people think that Doc is heavier. He weighs the same as Mario. His jumps are just much lower than Mario's so he FEELS heavier.

D-throw to Fair: This works on certain characters, regardless of how they DI. Some people think that it only works without DI or that DI'ing away from Doc makes it harder to connect. It's actually harder for Doc to land this if they DI behind him.

Doc's recovery: It's sub par, we get it. But many people still think that it's on the level of Little Mac. This is blatantly untrue. Doc does not have high fall speed, his air speed isn't that bad, his moves snap to the ledge (notably Side-B and Up-B), and he has two recovery options to work with (Down-B and Up-B). He is actually more flexible than characters like Little Mac, Ganondorf, Roy and Cloud at varying the timing of his options.

Edgeguarding: People consider Doc to be worse than Mario at edgeguarding (he's actually better at this). Doc has a few solid options for edgeguarding. Down-B is a very good option that covers a lot of space, and beats out other attacks, whilst being able to kill on the sides. Reverse Up-B is also very powerful. Dair is a somewhat niche option; it's more useful against characters like Mario, as it will probably trade with his Up-B and cause a semi-spike.


There are probably more, but these types of comments bug me (and just about every Doc player) the most.





A wavebounce is a turnaround b-reverse. You turn around and then B-reverse in one quick motion. More info can be found at the link below, but if you want to know if someone is B-reversing or wavebouncing, here's a quick visual guide.

• B-reverse: The character changes momentum and changes the direction that they are facing
• Wavebounce: The character changes momentum, but still faces the same direction.

https://smashboards.com/threads/turnaround-bs-b-reverses-and-wavebounces-know-the-difference.368536/

Thanks for the reply! Having replicated it in training mode, I'm pretty sure it's a wavebounce (wasn't sure if it counted as having the turnaround component since you essentially jump forwards then b reverse a side b done in the opposite direction to that you are facing, but the fact that the side b is in the opposite direction to that you are facing it counts as the turnaround I guess - sorry that this bit in the brackets is so convoluted to anyone reading this. Anyway, the link says it's a wavebounce). Anyway, thanks for the info and the useful link.

 

[MegaTerrabyte]

Does anyone have any good dr. mario mains that I could watch footage of for research? I know of very little in the competitive scene >.<

 

[Heracr055]

I recommend that you check out 2ManyCooks. I also suggest you check out the set between Esam and Nairo at MLG 2015; though he's not a Doc main, it's inspiring stuff

 

[Eight_SixtyFour]

Does anyone have any good dr. mario mains that I could watch footage of for research? I know of very little in the competitive scene >.<

Check the video thread in the Doc forum. I and a bunch of other members post footage there. You'll find some good Doc play.

For specific players, 2ManyCooks is the most active Doc player currently. Follow him on Twitter (TEG_2ManyCooks). You can also look for Koolaid (even though he's known for Pac Man, he plays Doc from time to time and is pretty good with him), and Tsumusuto (a Japanese Doc player. Incorporates b-reverse/wavebounce sheets as landing options, good movement from him overall).

Koolaid - https://twitter.com/KooIaid

Tsumusuto - https://twitter.com/4D_Killer_Combi