Social The Charizard Social: Merry Switchmas!

[DrRiceBoy]

I wub dis dragon so much

But sweet jesus why is Fair so hard to autocancel x_x

This, this, this!!! I get punished so much for it... and I only successfully autocancel it every 10 fairs... >_<

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

AC'ed SH Fairs is pretty much just like Wolf's in Brawl. The timing is somewhat strict as it requires you to input just as you begin jumping. That in itself, is actually not that difficult with practice. The issue is that the 3DS's control stick is not tailor made for subtle inputs so it appears more difficult. Just practice it a lot until you get it down. You can do it.

 

[Thatsa]

I find myself spamming Nair more than Fair for spacing lol. Am I doing it wrong?

 

[KT]

i find myself spamming flare blitz.

but no, nair definitely not. the range...

 

[Thatsa]

i find myself spamming flare blitz.

but no, nair definitely not. the range...

But it stays out for so long! and i'm free to use any attack after the landing cancel. I think it's perfect for spacing.

 

[Paw]

did this to a friend recently, thought it was pretty neat http://gfycat.com/UnsungSneakyChinchilla

 

[Thatsa]

did this to a friend recently, thought it was pretty neat http://gfycat.com/UnsungSneakyChinchilla

The Nairs set everything up!

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I don't have a capture card yet but:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktubM9EBTmc&feature=youtu.be

 

[Toastythunder]

The Nairs set everything up!

Nair is such a godly move!

Also, Tech_chase, that's an awesome find and awesome to see another MI player maining charizard!:D

 

[DrRiceBoy]

I've noticed that the new up-throw combos into fair at very very low percents (at like 0%~10%). Pretty neat; deals 20% guaranteed.

 

[-LzR-]

Does it work even if they DI away?

 

[iVoltage]

So its official, at the moment zard is the only character i can win matches reliably with haha. I just wanted to let people know how I play him and see if i need to do anything different. Nair and neutral b are my spacing tools of choice though. The flamethrower is so good for tacking on free damage and I can sometimes sneak in a grab if they shield it. The dair spike makes little mac games like 90/10 in charizards favor (an exaggeration of course but it makes them alot easier to kill) Down smash I have been using to edge guard and punishing rolls. Also about that early combo DrRiceBoy said is pretty sick for early damage. In all I REALLY love playing zard. He is satisfying to win with and cool as ****. My only gripe is I have no clue how to beat rosaluma so I could use some help here.

 

[Rafitak]

I don't have a capture card yet but:

Really cool! Do you mind going into detail about how you did that?

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Really cool! Do you mind going into detail about how you did that?

What specifically do you want to know? I explained it in the video but I have no problem explaining it here too. Just let me know specifically, what information you are looking for here?

 

[Rafitak]

Since i am new I don't really understand the concept of cancelling. What button combination did you do to cancel upon landing?

 

[Soul Train]

He didn't press anything, for either the Flare Blitz cancel, or the Nair cancel. The first is just using the landing animation on the upper platform to cancel, and the latter...just autocancels when you hit the ground with the right timing.

 

[Toastythunder]

Nair and neutral b are my spacing tools of choice though. The flamethrower is so good for tacking on free damage and I can sometimes sneak in a grab if they shield it. The dair spike makes little mac games like 90/10 in charizards favor (an exaggeration of course but it makes them alot easier to kill) Down smash I have been using to edge guard and punishing rolls. . My only gripe is I have no clue how to beat rosaluma so I could use some help here.

This pretty much exactly what I've been doing, not that I'm the best player ever, but it's nice to see similarities between charizard play xD Also, I don't know why I didn't think to abuse dair against little mac, that just makes too much sense lol.

The only charizard specific rosaluma tip I know is that while the luma is "attached" to rosalina the luma will not block flare blitz so you can punish landings/whatever accordingly. I say this because I've seen luma take the hit for a little mac ko punch.

Since it's still a new game and certain things may not be common knowledge some general rosaluma tips I've found are:
-The luma is stopped by any projectile if at anything less then full charge, I'm not sure if it holds true at full charge. You could translate this to charizard by using flamethrower when she attempts to move luma around.
-There's a certain "dead zone" I like to call it, where if you can separate rosalina and luma enough the luma just drops dead, giving you the opportunity to attack rosalina. Most of the KO power comes from the luma so most of the threat of death is eliminated if the luma is gone.

some of that might be kinda obvious, but I figure the game is new so may as well get it out there. Hope it helps!

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I'm starting to get followers here XD

It feels good to help develop the metagame of another character I really enjoy though. I hope you guys are benefiting from all my research and whatnot. There's definitely more on the way too. I'm testing new stuff and looking for possible discoveries. <3

 

[iVoltage]

This pretty much exactly what I've been doing, not that I'm the best player ever, but it's nice to see similarities between charizard play xD Also, I don't know why I didn't think to abuse dair against little mac, that just makes too much sense lol.

The only charizard specific rosaluma tip I know is that while the luma is "attached" to rosalina the luma will not block flare blitz so you can punish landings/whatever accordingly. I say this because I've seen luma take the hit for a little mac ko punch.

Since it's still a new game and certain things may not be common knowledge some general rosaluma tips I've found are:
-The luma is stopped by any projectile if at anything less then full charge, I'm not sure if it holds true at full charge. You could translate this to charizard by using flamethrower when she attempts to move luma around.
-There's a certain "dead zone" I like to call it, where if you can separate rosalina and luma enough the luma just drops dead, giving you the opportunity to attack rosalina. Most of the KO power comes from the luma so most of the threat of death is eliminated if the luma is gone.

some of that might be kinda obvious, but I figure the game is new so may as well get it out there. Hope it helps!

Yeah this helps alot actually. My main problem was luma blocking all of my aproaches. You cant just focus on luma because rosalina is there too so its not the easiest thing to do.

 

[murasakiame]

I'm having a considerable amount of trouble with projectile based characters who can camp, e.g. Ness, Lucario, etc. The matchups are definitely different from Brawl for a number of reasons, but the most complicating are the change to airdodging>landing lag (more general) and Zard's reduced grab range (character-specific). Of course, Zard v Ness in Brawl was 90-10, and I don't necessarily want to go back to that. But PK Fire/Thunder/Aura Sphere spam is devastatingly effective on a big character like Zard who has to approach. Flare Blitz has some efficacy here, but it's limited as it's not a move you really want to spam.

 

[iVoltage]

I'm having a considerable amount of trouble with projectile based characters who can camp, e.g. Ness, Lucario, etc. The matchups are definitely different from Brawl for a number of reasons, but the most complicating are the change to airdodging>landing lag (more general) and Zard's reduced grab range (character-specific). Of course, Zard v Ness in Brawl was 90-10, and I don't necessarily want to go back to that. But PK Fire/Thunder/Aura Sphere spam is devastatingly effective on a big character like Zard who has to approach. Flare Blitz has some efficacy here, but it's limited as it's not a move you really want to spam.

I've found that you either get good at doging or flare blitz anyway. I honestly don't think the recoil is that big of a deal if you are actually getting in their face and hitting them.

 

[jinwhite]

I've found that you either get good at doging or flare blitz anyway. I honestly don't think the recoil is that big of a deal if you are actually getting in their face and hitting them.

that sounds right. to quote bwett from one of the recent tour commentaries:

whenever you've got a character w/ range options versus a character who doesn't (charizard), the character w/o range options is virtually spending HP or "buying" an approach to get in and start attacking. if you don't capitalize on your approach you're going to have to spend currency again in the form of damage. flare blitz is a perfect example of this... but i really hesitate on using it as an approach, since it's easiest to punish that way. i kind of think zard has to rely on his bulk & tankiness to stay close and keep the pressure on campy / range opps. correct me if i'm wrong but the grab game seems really, really important to me as a newbie zard player, since his throws lead to edge guarding nicely w/ options like flamethrower (for poor recovery opps like lil mac lol) and especially dair which zard also has going for him.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

So I decided to play some For Glory matches just for the lulz and this is a summary of what happened after playing for a while:

- Opponent picks campy character with heavy projectile spam.

- Opponent starts camping like its Brawl.

- I get bored and start letting everything hit me.

- I eventually lose my 1st stock. Opponent taunts shortly after.

- I decide to start trying.

- I rip through their 1st stock.

- I come back and win in some ridiculous fashion.

This was pretty much every match I played. I'm going back to just playing with my friends list. If I wanted to deal with all the camping I'd still be playing Brawl lol.

 

[Jmacz]

So I've just started playing with Charizard in For Glory after some practice with him, well anyways I ran into a Kirby who spammed his down B so much it became an annoyance so I did nothing but Flare Blitz and beat him 10 games in a row before he quit. I know he sucked and this is no accomplishment, I just find it hilarious that I could do that.

Also as a new player who sucks at teching his falls I love Rock Smashing as I land, I assume it's not a very good thing to rely on but it's so fun letting the super armor just eat through stuff.

 

[lcampoy8]

Funny thing happened to me while i was playing against a Megaman. The Megaman ends up placing a bomb on me and then shortly after i grab him, pummel him a bit and preform his Seismic Toss. The bomb Megaman placed on me ends up exploding when we were both at the very top and we both instantly lose a stock. I thought it was pretty hilarious. Who know perhaps we can use this strategy if we have the stock lead.

 

[Hidden Arwing]

Count me in the Charizard Club~ He's actually going to be my 3rd main next to Fox and Lucario. Howdy~

 

[JJBro1]

Charizard main checking in, I'll post some videos later.

 

[Kayeka]

I'm considering maining Charizard. I like characters with powerful knock-out blows, because winning without swag isn't winning at all. His air game and super-armoured moves are also quite interesting.

It's a bit of a shame how much difficulty he has punishing on reaction, though. at least in my experience.

 

[Kmon]

Hello guys. I am pretty new here. Both on the forums as well as in the competetive scene. I played 64, melee and brawl only casually but i want to go hard into smash4 and i think charizard should be my main. Just feels right to fight with him. Unfortunately i have zero experience in competetive play so basically i am here to watch and learn from the better players.
I plan to have a fast and a slower/tankier main so charizard is a high candidate for the latter job. I look forward to learn/fight/find out with you guys.

 

[Kayeka]

Hello guys. I am pretty new here. Both on the forums as well as in the competetive scene. I played 64, melee and brawl only casually but i want to go hard into smash4 and i think charizard should be my main. Just feels right to fight with him. Unfortunately i have zero experience in competetive play so basically i am here to watch and learn from the better players.
I plan to have a fast and a slower/tankier main so charizard is a high candidate for the latter job. I look forward to learn/fight/find out with you guys.

Oh, hey, another new guy! Welcome to the club!

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I see @ Trela has been lurking around here. I'd love to hear some of your opinions on Zard sometime ;D

 

[Trela]

IVE BEEN CAUGHT

But yeah, trying to learn more about Charizard around these parts. It's clear to everyone that he's a very underrated character, but there's just these little things about him that make him so much more than he looks.

I feel very conflicted at the moment with him, and if I should consider bring him out in-tournament or not. Guess I'll just have to wait and see what my future holds for ya boi.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Well stay tuned sir, I've been working round the clock to find things that's gonna help elevate his standing. Right now what we need most is frame data and tournament results. We're hella under-repped right now so I hope you decide to give him a shot.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Well stay tuned sir, I've been working round the clock to find things that's gonna help elevate his standing. Right now what we need most is frame data and tournament results. We're hella under-repped right now so I hope you decide to give him a shot.

What is his standing?

 

[Kmon]

Hello it's me again. Jus played about 5 hours straight with a friend. I just exclusively picker zard while he tried out different chars but picked greninja and his sword mii a lot. Characters he didnt know very well were easily stomped by my charizard but after the 5 hours I came to the conclusion that i personally have a big big weakness when playing as zard: projectile spam/camping. Especially the sword miis tornado and to a somewhat lesser extend the water shuriken that the ninjafrog uses. I just end up eating all the attacks. When i try to roll he punishes with tilt/smash and i have to close the gap again get hit here and there and when i roll into reach he sends me away again, ofc increasing the distance i have to cover each time. If i miss even one move, he gets into that (for him favorable) position. I just dont know how to handle this... also the ending lags of most of charizards attacks just make it worse.

When im up against another close combat char i do pretty good but i just dont know how to solve long range combat...
help;_;

 

[Kayeka]

Hello it's me again. Jus played about 5 hours straight with a friend. I just exclusively picker zard while he tried out different chars but picked greninja and his sword mii a lot. Characters he didnt know very well were easily stomped by my charizard but after the 5 hours I came to the conclusion that i personally have a big big weakness when playing as zard: projectile spam/camping. Especially the sword miis tornado and to a somewhat lesser extend the water shuriken that the ninjafrog uses. I just end up eating all the attacks. When i try to roll he punishes with tilt/smash and i have to close the gap again get hit here and there and when i roll into reach he sends me away again, ofc increasing the distance i have to cover each time. If i miss even one move, he gets into that (for him favorable) position. I just dont know how to handle this... also the ending lags of most of charizards attacks just make it worse.

When im up against another close combat char i do pretty good but i just dont know how to solve long range combat...
help;_;

The best I managed is to shorthop over the projectile, and, depending on the distance and chance of getting hit by a different attack, either approach with nair or Rock Smash, or just shut them down for a second with flamethrower. These three options, when timed well, are fairly safe, and can be followed upon with a little creativity and misjudgement on your opponent's part.

Other than that, I found it very easy to use Flare Blitz against some projectiles, particularly Link's arrows. As soon as he draws his bow, just use Flare Blitz and the totally-not-an-elf won't have enough time to both fire and shield before impact.

 

[Remzi]

If anyone wants to see some Zard play, I'm about to play Chillin on his stream (online). I'll be going Zard, Marth, and maybe Robin.

http://www.azubu.tv/chillindude

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

What is his standing?

Eventhubs has him at like 3rd from bottom on the tier list. But their tier list is a public voted one. Its not a "traditional" one. But it still means the majority of the community thinks our character is absolute ***. Which is not true.

 

[Kayeka]

Eventhubs has him at like 3rd from bottom on the tier list. But their tier list is a public voted one. Its not a "traditional" one. But it still means the majority of the community thinks our character is absolute ***. Which is not true.

Well, being complete combo-bait in a community that favours speedy combo characters really doesn't help much. I just had a match against a Fox, and I have no idea what Charizard could have done to prevent my humiliating defeat.

 

[Sapphire Dragon]

Well, being complete combo-bait in a community that favours speedy combo characters really doesn't help much. I just had a match against a Fox, and I have no idea what Charizard could have done to prevent my humiliating defeat.

Grabs, jabs, spotdodges and fair. If he tries to laser or space then chase and dodge him and tilt or dash attack, or if necessary and he's at kill%, then flare blitz. Flamethrower or Nair wall him when he's offstage. The hardest part is probably the approach but once you can hit him out of whatever he's doing and combo him, chances are he'll be offstage at that point where you can wall him for free.