Taking My Game to the Next Level (4th Edition)

[SCOTU]

Posted New vids. esp. against marth for you marth mains.
@ JWT:
No, the sound quality is pretty bad, i accidentally had the +20dB Mic boost on... when capturing from a direct source....
And the next set of vids has audio over them due to other issues, which i know how to fix.
I have a difficult time predicting his "predictable recovery", since he can always just wait more, or quick attack towards the edge, then see if i let go or not, then go for the stage. Anther's startling difficult to predict with it (for me at least) cause he can come from over 9000 different directions w/ different timings.
And yes. I do overuse the nair. Thanks for the advice. Looking forward to more!

 

[Randizzle]

wtf, that marth sucks at smash. so ****ing sloppy.

anyway, nair juggle more. you know the rest of the stuff i have to say.

 

[j00t]

I just got finished waching the second video, vs. the Falco.

Your edgeguarding/hogging needs work! It seemed that when you knocked Falco off the stage, you just seemed sluggish in getting to the edgeguarding part.

You also seemed to jump out of a lot of your shines. Thunder it up! It's the only thing that regains your shine combo advantage against those who fall to the shine, so abuse it. Also, when you drillshine and your back is turned to the fallen Falco, you can turn in your shine and still follow up with a jab.

Use more grabs, especially on FD. When you get a grab in, do some chaingrabbing into a charged upsmash. You did grab some in the match, but I just didn't feel it was enough, and you also didn't chaingrab at all. Be sure to u-throw to u-air at high percents, one time you did an u-throw to u-smash at 120 and you knocked him to the left. When you're playing against a Falco on a stage like YS and FoD, you can also do an u-throw -> reverse waveshine -> upsmash at the lower percents. It's hard to chaingrab on those stages, due to the platforms. They can also DI your uptilts to get to the platform as well. Just a thought.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Scotu is becoming quite popular and getting quite alot of advice, I'd take a break and play for while, trying to impliment what people have told you before I went after more advice.

Take a breather on critquing and play for awhile (about a week or so) then record and see if the advice has stuck and if you have steadily improved.

 

[SCOTU]

How exactly is that different from what i did? I posted vids. then 8 days later, played agian, and got more vids. And It's going to be this saturday that i play next (It'll be at a tournament). So, lately i've been only getting a chance to play once a week, so advice is getting a chance to sink in, seeing as all i do at work (besides my job) is think about how to improve my game, and thinking of new tactics.

But like i said in my first post, I'm just beginning to have consious thought throughout much of the match, and i'd like pointers on what (for someone just learning) to pay attention to, cause there's a ton of stuff to watch for, and i don't know what to begin watching for.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

lol scotu you seemed abit defensive, relax, you're making good improvement.

Yes you do know what to watch for, tech patterns, what they try at high damage kills, how their di certain moves...etc..

A good thing to learn is how someone panics/keeps their cool.

In marth vs fox, I get as close as possible to the fox and follow his movements..most foxes have a bad habit that they jump when someone is too close for comfort or something, theres always something you can exploit, when people panic, they are their most vunerable...lol really now eh?

You have habits like that too as I said on aim I believe.

 

[firexemblemxpryde]

lol scotu you seemed abit defensive, relax, you're making good improvement.

I disagree.

Yes you do know what to watch for, tech patterns, what they try at high damage kills, how their di certain moves...etc..

I disagree.

In marth vs fox, I get as close as possible to the fox and follow his movements..most foxes have a bad habit that they jump when someone is too close for comfort or something, theres always something you can exploit, when people panic, they are their most vunerable...lol really now eh?

I actually disagree this time, the rest was good stuff =] . No, most foxes (in my experience) tend to "shine" when you get to close to them. and then, if Marth gets shined, he'll get upaired. Or shine edgeguarded. If you are fox in this matchup, if marth gets too close, he should be getting owned up the butt. Unless he's got you in a combo. Otherwise, up the butt.

Or at least, I do. & I'm a Marth main.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Eh, you misunderstand, I don't mean as close as touching body like that..I didn't mean point blank per say when I was talking about getting up close, I'm just talking about getting so close that it evades his "comfort" zone and causes them to take action.

I have no intention of getting so close to fox for a shine unless I'm getting a grab in, I just said to figure out their patterns, such as that for example..I didn't mean getting up in their "grill" all the time to see how bad they own you.

Most foxes I've experienced either shield defensively and go for a grab or get very jumpy doing moments like that, but most foxes I've played have been pathetic.

 

[SCOTU]

Most of the time, fox is trying to get really close to marth. or run away lasering. but in either case, Fox's comorot zone is very close to him, and very far away. You'd have to be at medium range to be outside his comfort zone.

When watching tech patterns, what do you guys take into consideration: you position relative to them, your velocity, their proximity to walls/ edges? and just see if the tend to go away/ towards/ neutral to all of these? And try to figure out which ones take priority for that person? Or, what is it that you guys look for when predicting techs?

 

[thebluedeath1000]

I look for a valid reason for them to tech such as an effort to get away from the stage's edge, something they can put their back to, a common direction or a common standing tech habit...basicly everything you just said.

Each person is different but most players have the same feel for safety in their teching.

You can limit their options heavily though if you know how..like putting their in the grove of a corner, they either have to standing tech or tech roll towards you..forcing them to be predictable. Also platforms, platforms really help my ganon predict techs do to them only being able to go so far and do but so much.

 

[firexemblemxpryde]

I find that percent often has something to do with it. When people know that they are at high damage, and can die in 1 or 2 hits, they will try more often to tech away.

Normally, after being thrown, people don't like to tech in place.

Close to the end of the stage, few smashers who know what they are doing will risk teching in place, or teching towards the edge. Most will tech away, towards the centre of the stage.

If you quickly knock someone over, and they don't tech, try running in, and JUST before you get in their hit range, wavedash back. Lots of people just roll-get up "behind" you, but in reality, they will roll right into you as you have just wavedashed back. This works particularly well against space animals and pikachu. Lol. If they try getting up attacking, you can just run in for a grab or whatever - you'll be out of range and you can abuse their lag.

Also, if you are throwing someone (up), some people have this habit of DIing the throw one way, and teching in the opposite direction.

An example of this is the ending of Shu (Falco) vs Machdash (Falcon) 2.2 . I suggest you watch it, it's awesome.

Oh yes, teching varies from person to person, yada yada. But the above are some tricks to try to figure people out, and how to counter what most people do.

 

[SCOTU]

Yeah, thanks Manli. I tend to do the DI one way, tech another way thing a lot... i notice that i do it, and when it stops working, i try to stop doing it. But it works too **** well against some people. I have a friend who'll always (if you miss a tech, esp off a shine) will run past, and dash cancel a forward smash towards you. it's got a similar effect to the wavedash back trick, but with going past (before their getup attack hits), and fsmashing. Thoughts on that vs Wavedash back?

Just watched the vid: OMFG best tech read ever!

 

[firexemblemxpryde]

I have a friend who'll always (if you miss a tech, esp off a shine) will run past, and dash cancel a forward smash towards you. it's got a similar effect to the wavedash back trick, but with going past (before their getup attack hits), and fsmashing. Thoughts on that vs Wavedash back?

That never ever works on me. You might know "Bluntedobject10", he's a great Canadian Falco. He used to do that -all- the time, we call it the Earwick Combo cuz his name's Eric. It's sort of odd, cuz it's only one attack. oh well.

Hmm, a smart player tends to watch the opponent when one misses a tech. When that falco runs past me, I know he's going to dashcancel and fsmash. So I just roll away.

The thing about the run in, wavedash back thing is that it provokes movement from the opponent. The Earwick combo will almost always do the same thing, regardless of your reaction. It can also be dodged by just getting up at the right time (with the exception of an fsmash that lasts for a while. With fox, it does, but there is a small gap in between the hitboxes where one can shield).

I prefer the dash back last second thing. Also, I believe you can punish more heavily with it if it works. An fsmash is all nice and dandy, but you're Fox. I would prefer a nice grab or an upsmash. Or a grab to an usmash. Or a grab to uair. or usmash to usmash. etc =]

 

[SCOTU]

More vids! Selection is very limited this time, it was from a local tournament, and i only got 2 matches recorded.

SCOTU vs Jackel (ganon)
SCOTU vs Randizzle (sheik) (1st & 3rd Games only, 2nd game is my CF. Feel free to watch/ comment it, but basically, i get owned - and this is the fox boards).

 

[brawlpro]

great work...i only saw you vs jackel

lol at the end of that vid, o and scotu, i think you were you missing a few l-cancels on your shffl drillkicks???

 

[SCOTU]

I miss tons of l cancels. esp on full hops. I miss tons of techs too, unless they're off of throws, or at the edge. The one against randy is way better btw.

 

[brawlpro]

it was better since you lost right? so ppl can critique you better?? i'm about to watch it then if you say its better.

EDIT: watched it...dude i don't really care which vid is better, as long as they're better than what i can do(obviously this was better)...all i gotz ta say is dat ur fox is better...

 

[Randizzle]

no matter how many times i watch it... wtf @ the fsmash at the end?

 

[brawlpro]

i thought it was funny, randoodle...thnx for your help! lol edge needed it.

 

[Pat/Pro]

From what I saw I can say that I like your fox. Its a little slow and you dont chase techs well (in the videos I saw at least). Alot of the times you seemed to give up when you had them against the ropes so to speak. But overall pretty good alot will come with time.

 

[Oskurito]

I enjoyed the last part of the vids vs. ganon good job I wont say laser more cause both of the stages were small and you were playing pretty good at it specially with the dairs aproaches, not much else to say just don't mess up your l-cancel when dairing cause you could have killed that ganon very early(I think it was at yoshi's island? at the end). And your fine vs. sheik, just don't aproach with full jumped dair all the time throw in there something else just to mix up a little, nothing else to say... just good job and I want to see how you do against samus.

 

[brawlpro]

take your game to the 4th edition!!!

 

[SCOTU]

that involves me getting new vids, and i won't be able to until saturday or sunday. frikin work.

 

[brawlpro]

i will only if my friend accepts matches and "i'm passin math"...frikin school.

well scotu look forward to watching them!!!

 

[Micheloxx]

an error that almost everybody commits wen learning, dont respect de rival, make him respect ur space(spaceing) a lot, this game is about spacing and mindgame.

 

[Sizzle]

It seemed like whenever you missed the L-Cancel was when you turned around in a shine and then wavedashed to try another drillshine. I was wondering why didn't you just do up throw -- up air on Ganon, especially because it seemed like his DI wasn't very good.

 

[Goldkirby]

i will only if my friend accepts matches and "i'm passin math"...frikin school.

well scotu look forward to watching them!!!

lol, I first read the "i'm passin math" line as "i'm pushin meth," so I was like wtf?

Yeah, I'm tired, I should get some sleep soon.

 

[firexemblemxpryde]

I love that when you try to be humble, everyone automatically rates themselves as better than you =P.

 

[Oskurito]

lol, I first read the "i'm passin math" line as "i'm pushin meth," so I was like wtf?

Yeah, I'm tired, I should get some sleep soon.

ok now that made me lol! he is only 13 XD!!!

k, hay scotu, you gettin new vidz, i'd like to see them.

 

[SCOTU]

Yeah, I've got new vids, They'll be up today or tomorrow. (well, they are up, i just need to find good ones, and link them here). - just moved it at school.

 

[Oskurito]

ok great, i will probably go to my friend nova's house tomorrow and hopefully get new vidz up by the end of the week-end if not earlier, hopefully nothin comes up in my life that goes against me...and my vidz

k, consider em watched by me when they are up^^

 

[SCOTU]

New Vids, sorry for my laziness.

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=82707+SSBM+5th+Column+Scotu+fox

 

[Brookman]

I'm going to take this opportunity to disregard every other post. If you see anything repeated in mine that's why.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4044755301246770012&hl=en

this was pretty much what I was thinking while watching

first match: You miss a lot of l cancels in the beginning (fluke?), you always DJ as soon as possible when thrown off the stage, you approach while shl'ing (>_>?) you don't fast fall after up throw up air, you edge hop drills way too often, you aren't very careful about approaching, drill to grab is your friend (sometimes), you edge hop too high too often, try dropping down lower and double jumping later. mix **** up. stop edge hopping. When your opponent is coming back don't always run to the edge. Watch your habits, pay attention, react to things more, instead of just doing tricks like wavelands or dash dancing and then attacking impatiently. when going for the edge hog fast fall to the edge after the wavedash. You don't have to jump around shffling attacks to pressure another player. Work on your up throw up airing.


*ignores falcon*

I'll maybe add more later? Stuff to do for now.

 

[RaynEX]

Wow. Nice Critque.

Nothing to add here :S That'll actually help me alot with my game =D

 

[SCOTU]

Thanks Brookman. I do mix up my edge returns far more than i used to in addition to fixing the edge hop height. But much of that other stuff i have yet to fix, so thanks. and yes. ignore the falcon. it was pretty bad.

 

[RaynEX]

Just keep practicing. You'll get it eventually.

Habits, won't be habits anymore. Your new habit will be...trying not to have habits...

make sense?

 

[Oskurito]

Breaking the habbit...

Just something I wanted to point out because you said "ignore the falcon. it was pretty bad."(I suppose you were refering to your own falcon) is that you'll need to play with other chars sometimes if you want to win matches, it'll makes you less predictable since you'll have a completely different fighting style and way of aproaching(or at least you should!) so why not work on your falcon too? he may serve you well in the future.

 

[RaynEX]

good point. It'll evolve your mindgames and playstyle.

 

[Anther]

Dude Scotu. I have to say, yesterday was the first time I was impressed with how technical and smart you fox stuff was =P.

 

[brawlpro]

his fox is pretty technical and "flashy", just not smart...