SWF Brawl Ladder Rankings (updated algorithms on first post)

[nealdt]

Look, guys. It's simple.

You run your tournament using the amazingly awesome tio tournament organizer. You then upload the results to the equally amazing tia tournament archive, an entire social networking site built around tournament results Your full results are then hosted online, and players can add their performances to their own profiles, automatically creating "rivals", earning medals for placing well, and more. It's pretty amazing.

I bring this up because Brawl's WiFi doesn't really seem well-suited to maintaining an accurate ladder. Random matches are anonymous, so there's no way to report those. And matches with friends don't count for much because you'll always be playing against the same group of people. Sure, you may have 1000 wins, but so what? You've only been playing against 10 different opponents! Why does that make you a better player than me?

IMO tournaments will remain the best/only way to make your skill known. We in the SSBM tournament community need to reach out to Brawl newcomers to get them into the scene, and using the above-mentioned tools will help do that .

 

[Dynamism]

Look, guys. It's simple.

You run your tournament using the amazingly awesome tio tournament organizer. You then upload the results to the equally amazing tia tournament archive, an entire social networking site built around tournament results Your full results are then hosted online, and players can add their performances to their own profiles, automatically creating "rivals", earning medals for placing well, and more. It's pretty amazing.

I bring this up because Brawl's WiFi doesn't really seem well-suited to maintaining an accurate ladder. Random matches are anonymous, so there's no way to report those. And matches with friends don't count for much because you'll always be playing against the same group of people. Sure, you may have 1000 wins, but so what? You've only been playing against 10 different opponents! Why does that make you a better player than me?

IMO tournaments will remain the best/only way to make your skill known. We in the SSBM tournament community need to reach out to Brawl newcomers to get them into the scene, and using the above-mentioned tools will help do that .

I'm glad people like you are around. Supportive tourney organizing and tracking vets who know what they're doing. I hope to see you online in short time.

Anther - Yes, Smash Clips that stored videos of your battles and you can post them on an online SW database, That's a must!

 

[Eight Sage]

Reporting of losses will be based on the honor code of SWF.

I like your idea, but this is Internet, where everyone sees your ranking. So, It must be difficult to think that someone will admit a loss.

My idea: Honor Points

What's this? If the rivals state the same, one honor point to them, if not, one less. That way we'll see how's lying and ho isn't. (liers will decrease the honor points, etc.)

BUT, there'll be always the problem of who has the truth.

 

[Jihnsius]

I like your idea, but this is Internet, where everyone sees your ranking. So, It must be difficult to think that someone will admit a loss.

My idea: Honor Points

What's this? If the rivals state the same, one honor point to them, if not, one less. That way we'll see how's lying and ho isn't. (liers will decrease the honor points, etc.)

BUT, there'll be always the problem of who has the truth.

Didn't I already integrate that in the first post?

And this has nothing to do with tournaments, guys, this has purely to do with friendly matches that'll allow you to compare yourself to others on the ladder.

Here's how it'd work: You request a match with someone on SWF. If they accept, both players have their friend IDs revealed and set up a time to play. The algorithms can be set up to implement honor points and balance out seeding based on who plays whom (think Google Page Rank, Wiki it [thanks, Buzz.])

As for all the support and brainstorming: Thanks, you're all awesome.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

Yeah, tournaments will be the #1 focus as always. However, for those who do not have the luxury of traveling to dozens of tournaments, this is the next best thing. Whether you are a young minor of restrictive parents or an old married man with more responsibilities (that's me), this is an ideal alternative.

 

[Jihnsius]

old married man with more responsibilities (that's me).

Such as getting to the post office and sending out that package.

 

[Banks]

they will end up doing this on MLG gamebattles most likely

 

[raphtmarqui]

I wonder if thell consider making the rankings held directly on SWF

 

[Johnknight1]

Look, guys. It's simple.

You run your tournament using the amazingly awesome tio tournament organizer. You then upload the results to the equally amazing tia tournament archive, an entire social networking site built around tournament results Your full results are then hosted online, and players can add their performances to their own profiles, automatically creating "rivals", earning medals for placing well, and more. It's pretty amazing.

I bring this up because Brawl's WiFi doesn't really seem well-suited to maintaining an accurate ladder. Random matches are anonymous, so there's no way to report those. And matches with friends don't count for much because you'll always be playing against the same group of people. Sure, you may have 1000 wins, but so what? You've only been playing against 10 different opponents! Why does that make you a better player than me?

IMO tournaments will remain the best/only way to make your skill known. We in the SSBM tournament community need to reach out to Brawl newcomers to get them into the scene, and using the above-mentioned tools will help do that .

^ I agree. A tournament portfolio would be neat. Also, ranking should be based like this IMO:

-Wins get you against a oppoent you never beat before, yo get 2 honor points, or watever per se.
-Everytime you beat a opponent you've beaten, you get 1 honor point.
-For every extra stock you have while beating your opponent, you get 1 extra point [unless it's just one stock]. For time, it's based on point lead. 10 points max. After facing a opponent 10 times in a row, it only counts as half. Half points are rounded to the nearest whole number.
-Loses do not take away points, other then my next point.
-Winning percent is basically 40% of wat you're ranked on.
-Wins is 40% of wat you're ranked on.
-Matches played [and not dropped] is 2% of wat you're ranked on.
-Tournament results is 8% of wat you're ranked on. That's assuming if real life tournament results are implemeted in the game. For the online tournament results and how it's run, idk about it. XD
-Bonus and points game...well idk about them! XD

So ya, wonder how that would work.

Yeah, tournaments will be the #1 focus as always. However, for those who do not have the luxury of traveling to dozens of tournaments, this is the next best thing. Whether you are a young minor of restrictive parents or an old married man with more responsibilities (that's me), this is an ideal alternative.

^ Agreed, 100%. If tournament results are implemented in this "ranking system", even just online, it should be part of it! XD

And if SWF and the best smashers in the world ran the ranking system, that'd be awsome! Especially since the Nsider forums are a closed=we're the biggest smash community left [that I know of], and by a wide margin as far as I know. IDK about us running it though=I kinda doubt it. >_<

Edit: Hopefully Brawl goes on the MLG circuit. w00t!

 

[Red Exodus]

You should make the numbers smaller, instead of 100 points for a victory it should be 10, that way people can work with smaller numbers. Not that I'll use it anyway =/

 

[Twintail]

I wonder if thell consider making the rankings held directly on SWF

Sounds like a good idea, and I hope that the boards could find some way to do this. It would help a lot to find out how good you really are (or suck for that matter). I wonder if in fact we could have tournaments set up here (although time zones might set back that idea) but it'd still be good with a simple ranking system

 

[Bajef8]

im all for this, but i'll have to build up my post count.

 

[Jihnsius]

im all for this, but i'll have to build up my post count.

I doubt it'd be restricted to post count, it'd more than likely be open to anyone.

 

[Bajef8]

I doubt it'd be restricted to post count, it'd more than likely be open to anyone.

hopefully not so i can try to show the SWFs my peach skills.

 

[GrindinD]

im hoping Nintendo, makes there own site so we don't have to worry about it, they cant be that dumb... like come on there talking about smash bros here...

 

[Eight Sage]

Didn't I already integrate that in the first post?

Yes you did, but when I was making the post it didn't say the honor point thing. Don't take the time of my post in reference, 'cause I went away, came back, complete it, and then I pushed "submit"

im hoping Nintendo, makes there own site so we don't have to worry about it, they cant be that dumb... like come on there talking about smash bros here...

Yes, maybe... maybe in a new Smash Brawl site with a ranking, forum, etc.

Time will tell, but sure Nintendo won't miss the opportunity of sharing Brawl's results and statistics worldwide.

 

[Spellman]

A Nice Idea

Yeah, this all looks good. Like people say though, there are easy ways to exploit it currently, however, I'm sure you and a team of super genius's will work it out. And yeah, it's gonna be tough taking care of all that stat keeping action, but I'm sure you'll find a way to do it efficiently. I approve!

 

[Jihnsius]

Time will tell, but sure Nintendo won't miss the opportunity of sharing Brawl's results and statistics worldwide.

They already announced that matches will not have any sort of statistics or rankings.

 

[Subster]

"With the SWF ladder, you'd only be able to play semi-respected members of the forum (100+ posts or so?) that have been approved." mm i dunno if thats fair in my case... I'm not real active on the boards when it comes to posting but I dont think that should affect who and isn't approved :/

 

[Jihnsius]

"With the SWF ladder, you'd only be able to play semi-respected members of the forum (100+ posts or so?) that have been approved." mm i dunno if thats fair in my case... I'm not real active on the boards when it comes to posting but I dont think that should affect who and isn't approved :/

Already decided that it wouldn't be a good idea. Lemme modify the first post.

 

[Eight Sage]

They already announced that matches will not have any sort of statistics or rankings.

Rethink:

There will also be no battle records kept for this mode, so whether you win or lose, it doesn’t matter. Just sit back and play.

He said IN THIS MODE (free play).... and it clearly talks about winning or losing, why they talk about that if there isn't some kind of ranking?

There will be, I don't know if Friend play will have it, but sure Brawls official page will do something about this.

 

[Jihnsius]

Friendly play still only constitutes exactly what it's title implies: friends. This isn't friends, it's a global ranking system, although it will be done through the friend system in Brawl.

Updated the first post. I'll be getting to work on an algorithm fairly soon and then we can get the coding started.

 

[Dynamism]

The first post makes things clearer, 24 hours is a little short though. To be completely banned anyway.
How will tourneys work? Points for each battle AND place in top..whatever?

 

[Jihnsius]

The first post makes things clearer, 24 hours is a little short though. To be completely banned anyway.
How will tourneys work? Points for each battle AND place in top..whatever?

24 hours seems short, but think of it like this: If you're at home (or even at a friend's) playing Wii online, there's no reason you wouldn't be able to report a loss.

As for ladder tournaments: We won't worry about that until after this is all set up.

EDIT: Currently working out a suitable algorithm.

 

[Jihnsius]

Moved to first post.

 

[Genuine]

so are you still going to rely on the whole honesty thing

 

[Jihnsius]

so are you still going to rely on the whole honesty thing

I'll work out a function for honor points after getting seeding working nicely.

EDIT: First post updated with algorithms.

 

[Bajef8]

yeah this is confusing so props for you doing it. and i'm glad i'm not trying to figure this out. can't wait till you finish this.

 

[SirroMinus1]

this is gonna to take place when the game comes out?

 

[Jihnsius]

this is gonna to take place when the game comes out?

It will be launched around that time, yes.

I need to do some modifications to the variable K, disregard the bugs in it if you're looking into it.

 

[Jihnsius]

Programming stages begin shortly.

 

[Chi's Finest]

We already have a solution to the ladder system. Gamebattles and MLG picked up Brawl for the 2008 Winter Season, so there ya go. Gamebattles will have 100000x more competition than the whole SWF anyway.

 

[Jihnsius]

Completely different communities. This project continues.

 

[Chi's Finest]

Actually, a lot of pro's DO go on this forum. MLG is the Pro's, so if it's not the same, its an even better community. Plus they already have all the systems worked out for it.

 

[Jihnsius]

Yes, but there's a few problems. First and foremost is that this site is specifically for Smash, GameBattles is not. They have a large amount of systems, and thus they won't be able to pay as much attention to the Brawl ladder as we would.

 

[lengeta]

I didn't know MLG did online ladders. The more the merrier anyway, and it will be good to have the Smashboards community in charge of a ladder as well.

 

[Chi's Finest]

Yes, but there's a few problems. First and foremost is that this site is specifically for Smash, GameBattles is not. They have a large amount of systems, and thus they won't be able to pay as much attention to the Brawl ladder as we would.

They have a dozen refs and people in charge of each ladder. It's a huge site with hundreds of thousands of competitive and pro gamers, there. It's not like it's a couple of kids with a smash ladder that are paying attention to Halo 3 only.

 

[Titan05]

Good job man! It looks like you put a lot of thought and effort into this post.
Any chances for major abuse?

 

[Jihnsius]

Good job man! It looks like you put a lot of thought and effort into this post.
Any chances for major abuse?

There are a few areas that are being focused on, but currently it doesn't look very abusable. All abuse would be found nearly immediately and punished.

 

[Zink]

Is this mod-sanctioned, ie will it be an official part of SWF or informal? I just have time to read the first post so sorry if this was answered