Social Swamp's Social Thread 3 - And now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...

[Swamp Sensei]

they're doing nothing to freshen up the gameplay,

Thing is....

Kirby hasn't done that since 64.

They found their perfect niche.

 

[SuperMii3D]

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!! SQQQUUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!
http://nintendoeverything.com/unive...-yen-for-nintendo-attractions-finish-by-2020/

Universal Studios Japan...

RIP everywhere else for right now while we wait a little longer T-T

 

[BluePikmin11]

In case you guys were wondering...we big time now. #SourceGaming

Does this mean you're going to E3? Or are you having a special event at E3.

 

[Aetheri]

Well, work is finally over for today...That means, it's time to get lost in Hyrule once again!!
I've been waiting for this moment!!

Also got this pamphlet that just shows a bunch of Zelda merchandise and it made me want to point out...

Spoiler

...just how gorgeous Zelda looks in the new TPHD concept art...now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to save Hyrule!!

 

[Coricus]

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!! SQQQUUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!
http://nintendoeverything.com/unive...-yen-for-nintendo-attractions-finish-by-2020/

Oh, darn. This is pretty sweet.

I am crossing my fingers SO hard that it's not just . As long as they avoid that, the whole place will absolutely ROCK.

Although what I want the most is a ride with onboard speakers, and I'm not likely to see that.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Well, work is finally over for today...That means, it's time to get lost in Hyrule once again!!
I've been waiting for this moment!!

Also got this pamphlet that just shows a bunch of Zelda merchandise and it made me want to point out...

Spoiler

...just how gorgeous Zelda looks in the new TPHD concept art...now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to save Hyrule!!

That is some beautiful artwork.

I love it.

 

[A Distant Demon]

RE: Sequels and keeping things fresh

If you have a really solid base, switching things up can be awkward. I did not like Triple Deluxe and it bored me to death. But the fan reception makes it sound like it and RtDL are two of the best games in the series since At least 64.


Why fix what ain't broke?




Of course. . .it isn't that simple.

Let's turn this into a really weird analogy like I enjoy doing.

The computer you have may not be "broken" but that doesn't mean you shouldn't replace it eventually.

Let's say you have a PC. Your options are (for simplicity's sake) a shiny new PC and a shiny new Mac. If you get a new PC, it will likely be extremely familiar and you will know everything inside and out. Same as what you had, but better and just as functional.

Or you get a Mac. Maybe it will be really cool and even better! But maybe you will miss your old system. That is where the issue lies.


PC is a plain sequel. Mac is a drastic change to the formula.

BOTH have their merits.


Let's take the first Metroid. solid experience. Let's skip Metroid 2 and head to Super Metroid. THAT would be getting a PC. Drastic improvement on something that barely changes. It's more of what's old but still a really really good sequel. Fully enjoyable. Fusion and Zero Mission would also be PCs. Fusion got much more mixed reception though. So it isn't always a perfect system.

Metroid Prime would be a Mac. A DRASTIC change to formula and ideas. In this case it wound up working phenomenally.

But Other M is another Mac. More changes to the formula but less phenomenal.
Similarly, The original paper Mario would be a mac. So would Sticker Star. Good and bad.



So you have to weigh the options. Planet Robobot is very clearly a PC. Triple Deluxe was great and it's possible that the 3DS is heading out the door. In the current environment for Nintendo, taking a simple, and likely cheaper option, of getting a PC and just adding to what they had seems like a great idea. Everyone liked the old one. Why not just do more of that?

Well continuing with the analogy. . .it's a new computer for sure. But it isn't much better than the old one. Why buy a new PC if it won't be much better. That is what some people have issues with when they make a sequel that is EXTREMELY similar to the old game. It's why the New Super Mario Bros series gets a lot of flack. You need to have enough new things to keep things fresh, but not far enough where it becomes a Mac in cases like this. For some, a few new powers and mechas (which for all as we know may not switch things up too often) simply isn't enough to keep people excited for what fels like more of the same.

And the final footnote. What if people didn't like PC in the first place? I did not like TD. No matter how much you improve the formula. . .i'm not likely too care too much because the base isn't very appealing. A Mac is MUCH more likely to bring in newcomers. It all comes down to NOT making the PC fans annoyed by being moved out of their comfort zones. That is exactly what is happening with Federation Force. One must find a balance in sequels.


This was originally a very normal and plain post. It turned into a rant and doesn't make as much sense as I hoped. Apologies

Uhhh TLDR
changing things up can be good. It can also be bad.

Not changing good things will probably be good. But it can get stale.

 

[Shadowwolflink]

My issue with the new Kirby comes less from them using the same framework and more from them not doing anything particularly interesting with it. Mechs are cool on paper but it's just the one mech and it's basically just Mega Man X ride armour in a game where it wouldn't really add much. Gives Kirby more powerful versions of 10 power-ups? He really didn't need that. And it sometimes flies I guess. Kirby can already do that too. He even has multiple copy abilities based on enhancing flight.

Galaxy 2 and Majora's Mask are not good comparisons, as their additions and elaborations were much more substantial and game changing (mainly Yoshi and the Doomsday Clock respectively), and in the latter's case, to the point where it actually turned some people off from how stressful the time management aspect could be, effectively making the game feel like an entirely different experience.

Majora's Mask was also just a really enriching experience from a narrative standpoint, much more so than OoT, so it had that going for it too. And despite being on the same engine, Majora's Mask noticeably kicked up the graphical fidelity.

You're making all these assumptions about the game after a less than 2 minute trailer, they could have left things about the mech out for us to learn about later and there could be all kinds of things that they didn't mention because it was too much for the amount of time they gave the trailer.

Also, I wasn't into speculation discussions during the Wii's lifespan, so I don't know for sure, but I bet people said the same kinds of things about Galaxy 2 when it was announced. "Oh, it adds Yoshi? Big deal, it's still probably just a glorified expansion pack, Yoshi probably won't even change the gameplay that much." And to be fair, Yoshi really didn't change the game all that much and he wasn't even used very often, so I would say the games are absolutely comparable.

 

[PushDustIn]

Does this mean you're going to E3? Or are you having a special event at E3.

It means Source Gaming will be at E3! I'm stoked that we met the requirements for it!!

Edit: even though I won't be going personally.

 

[Shadowwolflink]

Alright then, I'm sorry if I don't like the game because it's literally TD with mechas tacked on it
Whether or not it's the same engine doesn't matter, they're doing nothing to freshen up the gameplay, the mechas are just glorified animal partners

"Literally TD with mechas tacked on it."

Jeez, I'm sorry. I didn't know you were a time traveller. We've only seen a short announcement trailer with minimal detail given, but you're obviously from the future so you know everything there is to know about the game.

Stop making assumptions. I'm sure you know the old phrase about the word "assume".

 

[Solfiner]

"Oh, it adds Yoshi? Big deal, it's still probably just a glorified expansion pack, Yoshi probably won't even change the gameplay that much."

Can confirm that people still say this.

 

[SimonBarSinister]

Alright then, I'm sorry if I don't like the game because it's literally TD with mechas tacked on it
Whether or not it's the same engine doesn't matter, they're doing nothing to freshen up the gameplay, the mechas are just glorified animal partners

When it comes down how this game plays(as far as we know), has there really been any real significant changes to the main Kirby gameplay from, say, Kirby's Adventure to today(other than spinoffs, of course)? Out of all the games I've played, which were mostly mainline, they all felt pretty similar in that regard, outside of specific mechanics(animal partners, Copy ability mixing and so forth). But I don't think it's a bad thing. In some ways, I think it's good that Kirby has maintained such consistency throughout his lifetime. I'd like to believe that his success is somewhat dependent on it. I wish I could say the same for Paper Mario though......

Only 2 games out of 5 that maintained the Paper Mario formula. I can't say I'm liking those odds.

it's literally TD with mechas tacked on it

Just like TD was basically a handheld version of RTD, right? And what was RTD? Pretty much a 3D version of Super Star that was capable of 4-player gameplay(SS/SSU had 2-player gameplay, so basically an upgrade).

Not to bash anyone's opinion, though. Just offering my thoughts on the matter.

RE: Sequels and keeping things fresh

If you have a really solid base, switching things up can be awkward. I did not like Triple Deluxe and it bored me to death. But the fan reception makes it sound like it and RtDL are two of the best games in the series since At least 64.


Why fix what ain't broke?




Of course. . .it isn't that simple.

Let's turn this into a really weird analogy like I enjoy doing.

The computer you have may not be "broken" but that doesn't mean you shouldn't replace it eventually.

Let's say you have a PC. Your options are (for simplicity's sake) a shiny new PC and a shiny new Mac. If you get a new PC, it will likely be extremely familiar and you will know everything inside and out. Same as what you had, but better and just as functional.

Or you get a Mac. Maybe it will be really cool and even better! But maybe you will miss your old system. That is where the issue lies.


PC is a plain sequel. Mac is a drastic change to the formula.

BOTH have their merits.


Let's take the first Metroid. solid experience. Let's skip Metroid 2 and head to Super Metroid. THAT would be getting a PC. Drastic improvement on something that barely changes. It's more of what's old but still a really really good sequel. Fully enjoyable. Fusion and Zero Mission would also be PCs. Fusion got much more mixed reception though. So it isn't always a perfect system.

Metroid Prime would be a Mac. A DRASTIC change to formula and ideas. In this case it wound up working phenomenally.

But Other M is another Mac. More changes to the formula but less phenomenal.
Similarly, The original paper Mario would be a mac. So would Sticker Star. Good and bad.



So you have to weigh the options. Planet Robobot is very clearly a PC. Triple Deluxe was great and it's possible that the 3DS is heading out the door. In the current environment for Nintendo, taking a simple, and likely cheaper option, of getting a PC and just adding to what they had seems like a great idea. Everyone liked the old one. Why not just do more of that?

Well continuing with the analogy. . .it's a new computer for sure. But it isn't much better than the old one. Why buy a new PC if it won't be much better. That is what some people have issues with when they make a sequel that is EXTREMELY similar to the old game. It's why the New Super Mario Bros series gets a lot of flack. You need to have enough new things to keep things fresh, but not far enough where it becomes a Mac in cases like this. For some, a few new powers and mechas (which for all as we know may not switch things up too often) simply isn't enough to keep people excited for what fels like more of the same.

And the final footnote. What if people didn't like PC in the first place? I did not like TD. No matter how much you improve the formula. . .i'm not likely too care too much because the base isn't very appealing. A Mac is MUCH more likely to bring in newcomers. It all comes down to NOT making the PC fans annoyed by being moved out of their comfort zones. That is exactly what is happening with Federation Force. One must find a balance in sequels.


This was originally a very normal and plain post. It turned into a rant and doesn't make as much sense as I hoped. Apologies

Actually, it makes quite a bit of sense. Spinoffs or subseries probably exist for this very reason. Yes, some people might get bored with the bread-and-butter(which can still taste good if you're in the mood)gameplay of mainline games, and want something more flavorful, like a chocolate donut. Your example of classic Metroid and Metroid Prime works well in this case. Both sides of the series are good in their own ways, and one can offer something that the other doesn't and vice versa. I think it all boils down to how well they are handled.

.....Now I want a chocolate donut.

 

[Z25]

http://boards.4chan.org/vp/thread/25450311

I really don't understand why these are being considered legit starter leaks.

I doubt it and if they were real, I don't know what to say to the bat one.


The rhino sounds cool though.

 

[Solfiner]

At this point I'm actually starting to crave a new Mario game.

Preferably a 64/Sunshine/Galaxy type, as much as I love 3D world.

 

[Shadowwolflink]

You know what I really DON'T want? More stupid baby Pokemon added to evolutionary lines. They should spend their time working on new and interesting Pokemon, not disgusting, cutesy, chibi-fied versions of ones we already know.

I still think Pichu is the worst thing to ever happen to Pokemon. Yes, even worse than Water: The Region (AKA Hoenn) and the Digimon ripoff (AKA Blaziken).

 

[A Distant Demon]

You know what I really DON'T want? More stupid baby Pokemon added to evolutionary lines. They should spend their time working on new and interesting Pokemon, not disgusting, cutesy, chibi-fied versions of ones we already know.

I still think Pichu is the worst thing to ever happen to Pokemon. Yes, even worse than Water: The Region (AKA Hoenn) and the Digimon ripoff (AKA Blaziken).

Elekid is awesome and nothing can make me believe otherwise
I think you're the first person I have ever seen have a negative opinion on Blaziken.

 

[Zzuxon]

You know what I really DON'T want? More stupid baby Pokemon added to evolutionary lines. They should spend their time working on new and interesting Pokemon, not disgusting, cutesy, chibi-fied versions of ones we already know.

I still think Pichu is the worst thing to ever happen to Pokemon. Yes, even worse than Water: The Region (AKA Hoenn) and the Digimon ripoff (AKA Blaziken).

It's an intriguing question in this case.
I have some degree of difficulty believing someone can honestly hold this opinion.

 

[Z25]

How can you not like pichu? He's adorable( but overshadowed much like Raichu)!
Now you made him cry:

Spoiler: Large Image

And I actually like baby pokemon because it helps make a line more realistic.

Like do you honestly expect something like a tauros to hatch out of an egg in real life?

Sure pokemon isn't real life and bulls aren't in eggs, but it still adds a nice science touch imo.

 

[A Distant Demon]

And I actually like baby pokemon because it helps make a line more realistic.

>Pokemon
>realistic
plz

Like do you honestly expect something like a tauros to hatch out of an egg in real life?

Obviously all baby pokemon are created with Minimize. They forget it on birth.

 

[Strider_Bond00J]

And today I just bought myself a new MacBook Air for my University life. Quite timely discussion you guys were having, what with the comparisons to staying with what you are familiar with to having to adopt a new system.

As for Kirby - I think he's doing well in his field of platforming. Robobot's looking fine as a game, and I've seen some very positive reception to it so far. No reason to really worry if the engine is similar. I think it'll do fine. And now off for some messing around in GMod before I use my new Mac.

 

[Shadowwolflink]

It's an intriguing question in this case.
I have some degree of difficulty believing someone can honestly hold this opinion.

It's not "bait", I hate baby Pokemon, they add nothing of value to the series, and I can't stand Blaziken's horrible design.

Also, I'm sure it's obvious, but I've always been open about my disdain for Gen 3, there's almost nothing about RSE that I like.

 

[SimonBarSinister]

You know what I really DON'T want? More stupid baby Pokemon added to evolutionary lines. They should spend their time working on new and interesting Pokemon, not disgusting, cutesy, chibi-fied versions of ones we already know.

I still think Pichu is the worst thing to ever happen to Pokemon. Yes, even worse than Water: The Region (AKA Hoenn) and the Digimon ripoff (AKA Blaziken).

I hold Pichu in higher regard than Pikachu. Pikachu's just sooooo booooooring and one of the reasons I haven't watched the anime much since Johto Journeys, along with some of the movies. Seriously, he's been around too long, him and that stupid 10 year old of his. We need someone new, with a more interesting partner Pokemon. It's why I preferred the character lineup from the Legend of Thunder arc. There was a much more interesting hero with an equally interesting(and badass to boot)Pokemon at his side.

And this is totally not related to the fact that he was a part of the 2nd Gen master race.

 

[Coricus]

Hasn't there ALWAYS been super heavy backlash against baby Pokémon?

I remember GameFAQs being super miffed about it all the time, at least.

 

[Zzuxon]

It's not "bait", I hate baby Pokemon, they add nothing of value to the series, and I can't stand Blaziken's horrible design.

Also, I'm sure it's obvious, but I've always been open about my disdain for Gen 3, there's almost nothing about RSE that I like.

I'm not trying to insult you. You're opinion isn't bad, it's just... very unusual.

Like imagine if someone told you that they don't like snowglobe's because snowglobes remind them of being too cold. It isn't a bad or wrong opinion or anything, it's just strange enough to kind of catch you off guard.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I get get the point of baby pokemon. Just call them prevolutions and don't make them so stupid

They don't get normal attacks, they only evolve through friendship

Friendship is the WORST and longest way for a pokemon to evolve

 

[SimonBarSinister]

Friendship is the WORST and longest way for a pokemon to evolve

Yet some of my favorite Pokemon are obtained through this method.

 

[Aetheri]

I get get the point of baby pokemon. Just call them prevolutions and don't make them so stupid

They don't get normal attacks, they only evolve through friendship

Friendship is the WORST and longest way for a pokemon to evolve

No...Trade is the worst method of evolution, because it means that if you're on your own you basically won't get to evolve your pokemon...Friendship at least makes some kind of sense...

 

[Shadowwolflink]

I hold Pichu in higher regard than Pikachu. Pikachu's just sooooo booooooring and one of the reasons I haven't watched the anime much since Johto Journeys, along with some of the movies. Seriously, he's been around too long, him and that stupid 10 year old of his. We need someone new, with a more interesting partner Pokemon. It's why I preferred the character lineup from the Legend of Thunder arc. There was a much more interesting hero with an equally interesting(and badass to boot)Pokemon at his side.

And this is totally not related to the fact that he was a part of the 2nd Gen master race.

Pichu is literally just a cutesy Pikachu clone though, they're both incredibly boring.

People complain about there being a Pikachu "clone" in every gen, but Pichu is the most blatant example.

And the baby Pokemon are nothing but roster padding.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Trade kind of sucks too

But I've had baby pokemon for more than half a game before and they never evolved.

There was a level I was hoping they'd evolve before so they could learn a specific attack and never did.

I usually just ditch friendship evolutions for regular pokemon. Only one I really stuck with is when I wanted a crobat, which golbat at least has good attacks. Unlike baby pokemon

 

[Opossum]

So I won a contest on Reddit by accident.

Does anyone have the (free, btw) PC/Mobile version of Disney Infinity and want the code to use Spot? I was a ditz and didn't see the giveaway was for the PC version.

Also tagging @APC99 since I know he plays.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Well I think they're cute.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Well I think they're cute.

I don't mind the pokemon that ARE babies

I hate the stuff that comes with them being "Baby Pokemon"

 

[aldelaro5]

So someone shared me that vid and I liked it

At least I found interest to glitch hunt spm because I might do it for months

 

[Char Seasalina]

Yeah, so a Social Thread was closed... What is this thread about, by the way? Is it possible I talk about anything Nintendo related?

• "Do you hear the baby stars? These newborns will grow up to become galaxies someday. When stars die, they turn to stardust and scatter across the cosmos. Eventually, that stardust reforms to create a new star... And so the cycle of life continues. But the cycle never repeats itself in quite the same way.... So...you'll see."
• "Yes... All new life... Carries the essence of stars... Even all of you..."
• "I will watch over you from beyond the stars."
• "This planet... It's very dear to me. I looked forward to visiting this planet with the Lumas every one hundred years... The Luma that's been traveling with you may also grow up to become a star someday. Some Lumas become planets...some become comets...and a few become Power Stars. I'm traveling with them while they look for a place to be reborn. But I never thought all this would happen..."
• "Mario...so you were the one who collected all of the scattered stars...I want to thank you...your deeds will live on in the memory of the cosmos..."

Oops, I dropped some quotes...

 

[A Distant Demon]

Is it possible I talk about anything Nintendo related?

It's a social. . you can pretty much talk about anything. (Within Smashbaords rules of course)

So someone shared me that vid and I liked it

At least I found interest to glitch hunt spm because I might do it for months

"THE RAWK REFUSES TO SURRENDER SO EASILY"

Rawk Hawk spinoff when?

 

[aldelaro5]

It's a social. . you can pretty much talk about anything. (Within Smashbaords rules of course)

"THE RAWK REFUSES TO SURRENDER SO EASILY"

Rawk Hawk spinoff when?

Do a Paper Luigi spinoff before

....in 10 years

lol I don't really expect the series to get to its root until a long time. It might happen, but I won;t bank on it anymore.

 

[Opossum]

So someone shared me that vid and I liked it

At least I found interest to glitch hunt spm because I might do it for months

The ending killed me. I'm dead now.

 

[SimonBarSinister]

People complain about there being a Pikachu "clone" in every gen, but Pichu is the most blatant example.

More like the first example. And what about Dedenne? I think it is the worst offender. They obviously didn't have any more ideas for Pikachu clones, so they said "F**k it, let's mash them all together into one genetic abomination".

And the baby Pokemon are nothing but roster padding.

I could say the same thing about those that aren't baby Pokemon.

What was the point of Dunsparce? It was the only one of its line and was completely unremarkable in every way. Stantler was also kind of forgettable.

Was there anything spectacular about Luvdisc? I don't think so.

Was there anything useful about Chatot? I'm not seeing it.

It's not just baby Pokemon that are filler space.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

So someone shared me that vid and I liked it

At least I found interest to glitch hunt spm because I might do it for months

I was instantly dead the moment Rawk Hawk's theme started playing.

 

[Opossum]

More like the first example. And what about Dedenne? I think it is the worst offender. They obviously didn't have any more ideas for Pikachu clones, so they said "F**k it, let's mash them all together into one genetic abomination".


I could say the same thing about those that aren't baby Pokemon.

What was the point of Dunsparce? It was the only one of its line and was completely unremarkable in every way. Stantler was also kind of forgettable.

Was there anything spectacular about Luvdisc? I don't think so.

Was there anything useful about Chatot? I'm not seeing it.

It's not just baby Pokemon that are filler space.

Can't speak for Luvdisc, but Chatot and Dunsparce at least have niches as an annoyer (ParaFlinch Hax for Dunsparce) and a niche special attacker with BoomBurst (in Chatot's case, as one of only two Pokemon lines that get Boomburst stab).